- 86,676
- Rule 12
- GTP_Famine
This is the discussion thread for an article on GTPlanet:
Polyphony Digital Shows Gran Turismo 7 Circuit Scanning and Creation Methods at CEDEC 2022
- Thread starter Famine
- 29 comments
- 5,530 views
- 2,950
- United Kingdom
The tunnel tidbit is a really cool piece of information - I think they went into how they also use tunnels in fictional circuits because it gave them an excuse to show off different lighting and reflections that real world circuits didn't contain.
When you think about it, it's totally obvious. Trial Mountain, Grand Valley, High Speed Ring, Deep Forest, SSR5 - and more, all staples of the GT franchise in its early days, and they all have tunnels in. You can definitely tell they were wanting to showcase their capabilities.
When you think about it, it's totally obvious. Trial Mountain, Grand Valley, High Speed Ring, Deep Forest, SSR5 - and more, all staples of the GT franchise in its early days, and they all have tunnels in. You can definitely tell they were wanting to showcase their capabilities.
- 3,528
- London, ON
- A_Mindful_Place
Monkdapunk
(Banned)
- 193
- Canada
A picture of Stedman throwing a hotdog down a hallway.
- 269
- Canada
Interesting to note just how large the data grabbed from Spa was.
One thing I notice about Original Circuits however is too much reliance on guardrails. The original circuits could use a bit more landscaping to bring them more in line with Real World Circuits, i.e. more grassy run-offs, gravel pits etc. Other than that they're good examples of a fictional circuit.
One thing I notice about Original Circuits however is too much reliance on guardrails. The original circuits could use a bit more landscaping to bring them more in line with Real World Circuits, i.e. more grassy run-offs, gravel pits etc. Other than that they're good examples of a fictional circuit.
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- 3,528
- London, ON
- A_Mindful_Place
The updated section on Deep Forest Raceway is widened with grassy areas and run offs, but I understand your point. Much of these courses are "guardrailed" whether by actual guardrails or other environmental stuff.
FerrariF40
(Banned)
- 404
- Australia
Interesting.
- 1,701
- Sydney
- snakebacon97
MonoTonouS
(Banned)
- 656
- United States
This is a recent trend, Older games DID have ample runoff and sand traps. **** trail mountain had a whole mini infield before the last turn and Deep forest had a deep sand trap t turn one that's just gone now .
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- Australia
- SpacedustDaddy
Missed opportunity to make pit lane open, like past real world classic tracks.
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- Australia
- daniel_gokssj3
I think this is a really cool article. A great way to get some insight as to how PD create their circuits in game. Pretty amazing stuff and you soon realise it’s a slow and long process. Appreciate the tracks PD bring even though I want more it’s obvious it takes time, recourses and money. 🤙
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- 2,596
- Brazil
I wonder how the team feels when the tracks get changed a little bit over the years,i wonder if it bothers them the little changes made on SPA
"In order to break up the landscape, the team decided to put in some more buildings but, in order to retain realism, opted to do so according to local planning regulations. That resulted in the “museum of contemporary arts and crafts” that you’ll find at Kyoto Miyabi and the combined track — which wasn’t present in GT Sport.
This building was chosen and designed to fit into the local regulations, with its own back-story in which it contributes to culture — by providing a place to display artworks not available nearby — and attracts tourism."
That's really funny and something i never thought about,great lore tidbit.
"In order to break up the landscape, the team decided to put in some more buildings but, in order to retain realism, opted to do so according to local planning regulations. That resulted in the “museum of contemporary arts and crafts” that you’ll find at Kyoto Miyabi and the combined track — which wasn’t present in GT Sport.
This building was chosen and designed to fit into the local regulations, with its own back-story in which it contributes to culture — by providing a place to display artworks not available nearby — and attracts tourism."
That's really funny and something i never thought about,great lore tidbit.
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- 4,538
- Australia
Tunnels were in every PS1 game with fictional tracks, it was less about showing off capabilities and more trying to make good looking tracks even if it looked very arcade.
Unfortunately tunnels look terrible in GT7 in 2022, they wanted the contrast but unfortunately the lighting is non existent.
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- 2,950
- United Kingdom
I'm literally going off of the presentation, where they said
"For example, tunnels rarely exist in the real circuit, but they often appear in the original circuit. This is because the lighting changes dramatically, so the change in the sequence can be strongly impressed on the player."
Is trying to look good and showing off what you can do not ultimately the same thing?
- 603
- TonyLomas
This is a great article and an interesting insight.
I find it ironic that they are boast about tunnels in the original circuits when I think historically tunnels were often in racing games to reduce the distance in the field of view and limit how much rendering was required.
It also seems that real world circuits are easier to make than fictional ones. I wonder if that is actually the case in terms of time and cost.
I find it ironic that they are boast about tunnels in the original circuits when I think historically tunnels were often in racing games to reduce the distance in the field of view and limit how much rendering was required.
It also seems that real world circuits are easier to make than fictional ones. I wonder if that is actually the case in terms of time and cost.
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- Spain
- Freeman_Cruz
Sometimes the track design team take inusual decisions
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- 2,150
- Germany
Propably one creator put the pillar there and a different one - without looking - draw a long straigh line for "track texture on the ground" ;D
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- Paint booth
- FMecha_EXE
Some say that (and something about tunnels), for me my personal pet peeve is the lack of SAFER barriers at HSR.
- 13,850
- Adelaide
- Neomone
Not really.
The PS1 had a (by modern standards) very short draw distance, which you can see on tracks with longer straights. Tunnels, especially curved tunnels as are in most of the original tracks, are a great way to mask that while still feeling natural. They're a very clever technique, but the reason for using them on something like the PS1 likely differs significantly from the reason for using them on a PS4/5 where graphical limitations are much less prominent.
Also, remember that when those original circuits in GT1 were designed they weren't being compared to real circuits. There were no real circuits in the game, so there would be no reason for the track designers to think "we want tunnels because our real tracks don't have any and that's a cool experience for the player". Real tracks wouldn't seriously become a thing until the PS2 era, GT2 had Laguna Seca and that was it.
I think what you're seeing in their statements is a combination of their mindset towards making tracks now in the modern day along with a bit of (probably unintentional) historical revisionism. It's cool to know how they feel about designing new tracks, but it almost certainly doesn't apply to why the classic tracks were designed the way they were.
- 11
- Canada
Actually GTS tracks looked better on my PS4,must be a bad port ...😆Huh? And there I was thinking GT7 courses were simply ported over from GTS with some added pop in and vegetation clipping through geometry.
The more you know.
At this point I gave up chasing it and I'm waiting on the slim/pro whenever they decide to show up.Sony doesn't give a 💩 about its customers in Canada and left us at the mercy of scalpers.Amazon recently started taking names on lists but you gotta be more then lucky to be picked up since you don't even have to be a member to sign up so it's guaranteed to be filled to the brim with scalpers and theyr bots...
Remember recently when the PD/GT folks were at the Nordschleife? I remember seeing pictures of them someone posted on here....official post I think.
I wonder what that was for? 🤔
Hopefully this track scanning tech stuff, because the Nordschleife seems to be scanned/an older version.
There is a couple of 'newer' up to date features in game - The Sabine Schmitz Kurve sign, and the AstroTurf strip approaching Hohe Acht.
However there is a lot of missing stuff too, surprising since it says they scan trackside buildings and drive at a snails pace.
Nordschleife missing stuff off the top of my head:
The Cross at Schwedenkreuz.
Building on the outside of Bergwerk.
Flags painted on the outside barrier at the Carousel, and in other areas.
Cut back trees approaching Kesselchen allowing a view around the bend.
And at Brünnchen there is a lot less trees than in game....at 'YouTube Corner' just before Eiskurve, almost all of the trees on the right hand side of the track are gone.
Brünnchen IRL:
I wonder what that was for? 🤔
Hopefully this track scanning tech stuff, because the Nordschleife seems to be scanned/an older version.
There is a couple of 'newer' up to date features in game - The Sabine Schmitz Kurve sign, and the AstroTurf strip approaching Hohe Acht.
However there is a lot of missing stuff too, surprising since it says they scan trackside buildings and drive at a snails pace.
Nordschleife missing stuff off the top of my head:
The Cross at Schwedenkreuz.
Building on the outside of Bergwerk.
Flags painted on the outside barrier at the Carousel, and in other areas.
Cut back trees approaching Kesselchen allowing a view around the bend.
And at Brünnchen there is a lot less trees than in game....at 'YouTube Corner' just before Eiskurve, almost all of the trees on the right hand side of the track are gone.
Brünnchen IRL:
- 1,336
- Brazil
I was surprised by PD dedication to producing fictional sets. I was surprised because I identify some inconsistencies that should not exist for both aesthetic and practical reasons.
1. I am uncomfortable with the aesthetic and practical decision of Trial Mountain. The middle section of the route makes my aesthetic sense uncomfortable. I get annoyed when I see curves without run-off, with that little walls and those dangerous rocks. At medium speed, those tiny walls would cause the cars to rollover immediately. A Bathurst-like look would be the ideal solution, adding a little run-off, but leaving the rocks and trees further away, keeping the scenery looking beautiful.
2. I am also annoyed by Sardegna's decision - Road Track - A. The public road part is horrible and impractical in real life, mixing walls and guardrails in a high speed circuit. In my opinion, it should be similar to Bathurst, or rather La Sarthe. In an attempt to create a fictional track similar to La Sarthe, they created a track without the slightest aesthetic sense and immersion in reality. The same reasoning goes for St. Croix and Alsace, two generic tracks, of bad idealization.
3. I didn't like the junction of Kyoto's grand layout. The two curves next to each other, with no escape area, would cause fatal accidents. The second junction could be anticipated.
4. I also found the modification of the High Speed Ring second turn to be completely narrow and impractical in the real world. A lot of people would die there. They should have left the curve as it was the original.
Just a personal opinion.
1. I am uncomfortable with the aesthetic and practical decision of Trial Mountain. The middle section of the route makes my aesthetic sense uncomfortable. I get annoyed when I see curves without run-off, with that little walls and those dangerous rocks. At medium speed, those tiny walls would cause the cars to rollover immediately. A Bathurst-like look would be the ideal solution, adding a little run-off, but leaving the rocks and trees further away, keeping the scenery looking beautiful.
2. I am also annoyed by Sardegna's decision - Road Track - A. The public road part is horrible and impractical in real life, mixing walls and guardrails in a high speed circuit. In my opinion, it should be similar to Bathurst, or rather La Sarthe. In an attempt to create a fictional track similar to La Sarthe, they created a track without the slightest aesthetic sense and immersion in reality. The same reasoning goes for St. Croix and Alsace, two generic tracks, of bad idealization.
3. I didn't like the junction of Kyoto's grand layout. The two curves next to each other, with no escape area, would cause fatal accidents. The second junction could be anticipated.
4. I also found the modification of the High Speed Ring second turn to be completely narrow and impractical in the real world. A lot of people would die there. They should have left the curve as it was the original.
Just a personal opinion.
- 603
- TonyLomas
I agree with what you've said there regarding the tracks, some of the decisions seem unusual.
I think that PD are trying to do different types of circuit though. Adding large run offs to some tracks would make them more like Formula 1 tracks, which although safe (relatively) are, to my eyes at least, boring. Also, if they're not careful they would make many tracks perfect for F1 cars and GT3 cars but then too wide and easy for a race of 10 classic mini's or other small slow cars.
I think there needs to be a variety of tracks to cover the variety of cars and types of motorsport.
Hill climbs often have no barriers or run off areas. (And I wish they would bring back the Goodwood Hill climb)
The Isle of Man TT race (which I know is bikes but...) is on public roads with almost no barriers at all.
I think the solution is to stick with multiple layouts at a location. Then there can be a layout for faster cars and for slower ones.
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- United States
- carsoftheworld7
I wish they would scan the I-95 Delaware Expressway in Philadelphia from the Airport to Rivers Casino. That would make a very fast competitive wheel-to-wheel Point A-to-Point B race
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