Pushrod Supercar...I love it.

[Dave A]

To expect that an extra 100 Horsepower, a hundred or so less pounds, and all sorts of other technical Gee-Whiz bits they've stuffed into that car couldn't shave any more than 10 seconds off the lap time, in the hands of a Nurburgring Expert, is, frankly, ridiculous.

So, a Blue Devil, speculated at anywhere from 600-650 Hp, likely having 500+ Lb Ft of Torque, and weighing in at a rumored 2900 lbs can ONLY get within 10 seconds of the CGT?

First off, we don't know abnything abouty the ring time, it may have been a stock Z06, it may not have. It may have been the Blue Devil, it may not have. It may seem slow for the Blue Devil if it is that, but we have to remember the track is public and you can't always go full speed around it all.

Secondly, the Blue Devil will more than likely not worry a CGT on a track, I refer you to a conversation on CoG, track, wheelbase, chassis construction ect.

 

[Young_Warrior]

Yeah we have to remebr that the CGT is a no comprimise ultimate road legal racer.

 

[Dave A]

Exactley, theres a difference when cost stops being an issue. However thats not to say the Blue Devil won't be frighteningly fast, but there will still be a gap between that, and the Enzo's and CGT's of the world.

 

[Joey D]

First off the Blue Devil is real, there is in fact a Blue Devil car, whether it will be ever ran is the question. I mean I'm sure they have done testing on it just to see what it would do, but its just a cool concept as of right now...or so I'm told. They may just release it because of all the hype.

I'm going to say the car in Germany was the Z06 and it ran somewhere in the low 7:50's.

 

[Onikaze]

http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Features/articleId=105876

Nice.

Low 7'50's would be lamer than all hell if the C5 Z06 was able to run a 7'56, and the C6 Z51 Package did a sub 8 run too.

I mean, that would just be incredibly freaking lame unless there was traffic on the road, and last I checked, GM had the track for about an hour to itself when it had "that blue car" out there.

 

[Onikaze]

Idle and Rev...it gets loud.

vroom vroom!

Anyone read German?

Not to mention.. apparently a few people have been told by Dave Hill that it was in fact a C6 Z06, running a 7'43.

Either way, we win, right?

 

[Young_Warrior]

I read german and that doesnt provide much evidence for your cause.

 

[Dave A]

No it doesn't. It's still very much we shall wait and see.

And ther other stuff is just forums and more speculation.

Onkaze, why not listen to a GM employee who worked on the car ie Blazin who has a far better idea than you, me or any of the other people on that other forum and just wait and see.

 

[McLaren'sAngel]

Hiya! Meow! (='.'=)

Darn! All of this hype about the Blue Devil is so dramatic!

I can imagine a large crowd of Corvette lovers whispering and debating to one another about the Blue Devil while GM representatives don't know how to answer the questions!

 

[Onikaze]

I'm not the one hyping the Blue Devil.

I'm saying the C6 Z06 is worth the hype, and getting lots of "nah, that had to be the blue devil...the Z06 couldn't be that fast."

Blazin has said he doesn't know, he provided a guess...

His guess of low 7'50's is kind of ridiculous when you think about the fact that the last gen C5 Z06 did a 7'56...this is not in question...and the new C6 has been sighted doing sub 8 minute laps...

Yet supposedly it is easier to believe that it was a 600+ Hp Vette that is at best in the prototype/hush hush stage ran a ridiculously slow time, than it is to believe a 500 Hp Vette that just got in the hands of test drivers ran a very good time...

I don't get it.

 

[Dave A]

His guess is better than yours or mine. Stop wording specualtion as if it's fact, thats all I'm saying. We don't know the Z06 lapped the ring in 7'42, how do you know that wan't a Z06 on sports tyres eh, you don't, we don't know what spec that car was and the fact is, GM hasn'tsaid it was a stock Z06.

 

[Driftster]

it's not like the last C5 z06 lap time was driven by an amature.......So.....yeah..driver accounts for something..but not 10 seconds if it's good driver vs good driver

 

[Onikaze]

Dave Hill said it was a stock Z06 to one of those guys on the Corvette Boards who, guess what, works at GM and attends meetings and whatnot.

Another guy at a GM function asked Dave too...Dave Hill if you don't know is THE guy in charge of the Vette...if Blazin is involved with the Vette in any way, Dave is his Boss.

I will take Daves word for it, plus the math agrees with him.

Drifster, the C5 Z06 lap was a 7'56, right?

So assuming that Jan Magnussen should be able to duplicate that lap in a C5 Z06 (he might have set the record, I don't know for sure) then why wouldn't the car make the difference?


Everyone who has driven the C6 Z06 says it is smoother in transitions, easier to drive, more stable and controllable at the limit, and on top of THAT which would make it faster...it's got 100 more Hp, and better technology in the suspension, brakes, and tires.

If THAT isn't worth 10 seconds, then I'll be a monkeys uncle.

GM doesn't want to come out and say "It was the C6 Z06" or "It wasn't" because we will sit around chatting about the car, it will keep the buzz and ooh ahh factor longer, and sales will be higher.

Whats the term...Viral Marketing?

 

[Joey D]

Dave is one of the guys in the office, but he isn't my boss, he's like a bosses bosses boss. He probably doesn't even know me.

 

[Driftster]

Everyone who has driven the C6 Z06 says it is smoother in transitions, easier to drive, more stable and controllable at the limit, and on top of THAT which would make it faster...it's got 100 more Hp, and better technology in the suspension, brakes, and tires.

If THAT isn't worth 10 seconds, then I'll be a monkeys uncle.

Well control/stability at the limit shouldn't really matter at the hands of a professional driver who knows the ring....

100 more HP..ok AND it's lighter..and it has better brakes suspension and tires......

however....

The GT3-RS has the same HP..
same brakes as the GT3 in question..
better tires, better suspension
and is very slightly lighter....

And...that accounted for 11 seconds..

So......
that 100HP and weight difference can only earn it an additional 2.1 seconds from 11?


Nothing on this car adds up At all...

 

[Dave A]

No ones submitted anofficial time, no one heres saying it can't run mid-low 7'40's but at the same time theres no time use for the car. Wait for an official time before you start jumping on the band wagon, then when you have one, jump on the bandwagon.

 

[skicrush]

I can't believe this. All the major car magazines in the US have pubished the story. GM TOOK THEM TO EUROPE TO DRIVE THE THING IN PERSON! That's why there are 2 PEOPLE in the photos of the "supposed" blue devil. IT ISN'T THE BLUE DEVIL!! Multiple sources on the corvette forums have confirmed that the blue car was a normal Z06. Multiple sources have confirmed what Dave Hill said--7:42.99, including guys that work for Pratt & Miller (where, incidentally, I got the C6.R hp number. No offense, but that dude is gonna know more about it than Blazin). BONE STOCK, INCLUDING RUNFLATS! Lets see the Porsche try it on runcraps! All three major US car mags have confirmed the time, again BONE STOCK. No use bragging if it's a special setup. Dave Hill has announced it at corvette events, and the things he's said have been WIDELY reported in the corvette forums. Again, BONE STOCK. You can plug our ears and shout LALALALA all day long, but it isn't going to change the facts.

It HAS been announced by GM. You guys are complaining because YOU WEREN'T THERE! Or because you collectively disbelieve the entire corvette community--you know, the people that have heard Dave Hill announce these things with their own ears. So, there was no press release--it was released to the collective automotive press!. I just don't see why some of you are being so obtuse. Grow up.

 

[Dave A]

The lap in question was before GM launched the car and took the press round Europe. It hasn't been announced, and it's not been officially recognised. GM employee's are saying this. It HASN'T been announced, once again I refer you to the person in this thread who know the most about the subject, Blazin. Funny how everyonelistens to him when the subject is on Vette's and regards his opinion as the best on the forum, until they don't like what they hear. Find a direct quote from Dave Hill where he says a stock Z06 ran the ring in 7'42 and it's a start. Whether the Z06 can run the ring in that time is not in question as far I'm concerned, it wouldn't suprise me.

 

[skicrush]

Sorry, but Blazin isn't on the forums. Apparently, he hasn't even read the magazines. It is SO CLEAR, I can't believe we're even having this conversation.
http://www.autoweek.com/article.cms?articleId=103066

Chevy pulled out the obligatory Nürburgring Nordschleife lap times to make the point: With Jan Magnussen, winner of the 2004 and 2005 Le Mans 24 Hour, at the helm, the Z06 clocked a seven-minute, 42.99-second lap of the 13-mile Green Hell, 16 seconds faster than a Z51-equipped C6. Porsche’s $440,000, 604-hp Carrera GT, with a seven-minute, 32.44-second lap, is the only production car to have gone quicker. For perspective, Lamborghini’s $283,000, 580-hp Murciélago clocked in at seven minutes, 50 seconds, and the $452,000, 671-hp McLaren-Mercedes SLR at seven minutes, 52 seconds.

Stop being idiots about this, PLEASE!

And no crap about the "production car" quote. As far as the US market goes, the CGT is the only production car on that list that's faster than the Z06.

 

[Dave A]

No he jsut worked on the project and sudden;y journalists know more, yeah right. How come it's not on any official ring sites or in any non-American magazines. Don't take this the wrong way, but as good as some US cars are, the US mags always over hype them just like Japanese mags do Japanese cars and European mags do European cars, and I think thats all thats happening here. I think that could be to the detriment of the Z06, suppose it can "only" run 7'44 really, how does that look that all of a sudden this non official info thats being regarded as official was wrong. If you can't get me that direct quote from a GM's Dave Hill then it's pointless taking this argument any further.

As for that article, the 7'42 time was recorded before the press were there, so which is it, press just tinkering with the facts again or an identical laptime. Also theres no quote in there frm Dave Hill. Lets just leave it as I keep saying until theres something OFFICIAL that's recognised.

As for production crap, theres plenty of PRODUCTION cars that are faster including the SLR, youre very own Mosler MT900 and others.

 

[skicrush]

Sorry, but Blazin isn't on the forums. Apparently, he hasn't even read the magazines. It is SO CLEAR, I can't believe we're even having this conversation.
http://www.autoweek.com/article.cms?articleId=103066


Stop being idiots about this, PLEASE!

And no crap about the "production car" quote. As far as the US market goes, the CGT is the only production car on that list that's faster than the Z06.

Chevy pulled out the obligatory Nürburgring Nordschleife lap times to make the point: With Jan Magnussen, winner of the 2004 and 2005 Le Mans 24 Hour, at the helm, the Z06 clocked a seven-minute, 42.99-second lap of the 13-mile Green Hell, 16 seconds faster than a Z51-equipped C6. Porsche’s $440,000, 604-hp Carrera GT, with a seven-minute, 32.44-second lap, is the only production car to have gone quicker. For perspective, Lamborghini’s $283,000, 580-hp Murciélago clocked in at seven minutes, 50 seconds, and the $452,000, 671-hp McLaren-Mercedes SLR at seven minutes, 52 seconds.

What part of "Chevy pulled out..." do you not understand??

 

[Dave A]

Updated my post, I started it before yours was updated. GM did go to the ring with the media but the 7'42time was recorded earlier than they did.

 

[skicrush]

And GM presented that time as an official time to THE COLLECTIVE AUTOMOTIVE PRESS. Incidentally, the MT900 is not on sale yet, and besides conflicting times for the SLR, I don' tthink it's on sale here yet either.

 

[Dave A]

The SLR's times arn't conflicting, just with different drivers. As for the MT900,, it's a US car and I'm pretty sure it's on sale here, but not in the US. , I don't doubt you, but I do find that odd, unless the test drive I read a few months back had the wrong on sale date in it. I'll have to check that. The thing with the ring time is this collective press doesn't seemto include non US magazines. Auto car in the UK doesn't say theres an official time, Evo doesn't, TopGear doesn't. I hope to god they arn't just late printing it because then I will look a fool. As it stands here, theresnothing topoint out thats true, alsowhy doesn't Blazin know about it, if it is officail? Maybe your right, maybe not, for now I'm keeping with my wait and see attitude. Like I've said before I have no problems with the Z06 runnin that time, it should be capable of it, but theres been plenty of ring tests that havn't beeen official where the cars been modified in some way. Look at the 7'40 911 GT3 time, completely stock exept for it had different tyres on, but the lap doesn't count when stock cars are concerned.

 

[skicrush]

Wait and see then, that's fine. I think it's pretty clear what you'll find. This is America's car--you're just now getting the stock vette, and the Z06 next year. If I was Auto Car or Evo, I wouldn't be in a hurry.

As for bragging rights, there is no reason for a manufacturer to post times for a modded car before a non-modded car. I can see the poin tin posting times with different tires--we all play Gran Turismo, and we all know what a huge difference tires make. That just dempnstrates the car's true potential. Tires are a huge compromise most of the time--that's why Porsche ran their car with the Michelin Pilot sport Cup tires. Tyres. They're awesome, and they better show the car's true performance. But they're pretty impractical for everyday use--that's why they have both times posted.

The Z06 got it's time with RUNFLATS.

 

[Young_Warrior]

Doesnt the slr have run flats?

 

[Onikaze]

The Issues of Evo and Top Gear that are out here are still old, they just now have MX-5 road tests in them.

I haven't seen Dave Hill say online that it was the C6 Z06 yet.

I have seen people who were sitting there talking to the guy, I'm pretty sure one of them has a picture of him with Dave Hill, over on the Corvette Forums, and they were told by Dave in Person what the time was, and then told their boards.

Seperate people, posting at different times, and didn't know about the others post until one of the other members popped up and told them they were scooped a few minutes earlier.

Dave Hill also reportedly confirmed it again at a later event.

Daves Word > Blazins Word...just how it works.

 

[Joey D]

You realize that most people at GM say they are more important then they are. I've heard Dave's name before, but I'm going to run him through the people finder to find out who he really is.

 

[skicrush]

Which Dave? Dave Hill, corvette chief Engineer, or the dave guy you know? And I think some of the guys think you're on the Z06 project itself.

 

[Dave A]

I don't think anyone has any missconceptions about Blazin's job at GM, he's stated it a few times before.