Real Guns

[Michael88]

The G19 would also be a good option. I would second the G45 or G48. There is a MOS version of the G48. It has only recently been released. Shield Arms makes magazines for the G48 that hold 15 rounds in the same space as the factory magazines;.

G19 is of course a great nobrainer option as well, but with the 15 round G48 mags, wow, that's a really nice package.

Shot my G17 some more, I cannot rave enough about the compensator I installed, its absolutely amazing, it allows such fast controlled shooting I can really recommend it to everyone who expects to having to shoot multiple shots in rapid succession, be it for home defense or competition shooting. I'd say I can shoot it 50% faster than my stock G17 (aimed and accurate shots).

 

[phillgt2002]

Why does it have to be concealable if you only want to plink with it, and only for a few months?

I'd recommend the obvious choice, a Glock 45 MOS for ~ 500, and invest the rest in magazines, a good holster and ammunition. Small enough for concealed carry, big enough to be fun at the range, dead reliable, time proven, lightweight, big magazine capacity, red dot mountable, great right out of the box.

If the G45 still proves to be too fat for your concealed carry needs, go with the Glock 48. It has a 10 shot magazine which makes it a lot slimmer and lighter, but at the same time its still big enough and the sight line is long enough not to be frustrating at the shooting range. Not sure if there is a MOS version of it though.

Mainly because I live in a city.

I honestly don't feel comfortable having a rifle because I'd easily be seen loading and unloading it from the car - it makes me a target. It may seem paranoid, but my city is pretty damn unsafe and I've heard a lot of instances where people have had their firearms stolen or have been targeted for carjacking.

That said, a pistol would be fine for me.

@Brett - I was looking at Glock but also a few other alternatives.

I've been shopping around for a while, looking at Sig Sauer and S&W - there's a ton out there. I love Glocks, but man.. there's so many out there

@Xavier2342 - I've never heard of Arex, but that thing looks really damn good.

I'm pretty intimidated by the gun ranges in the area and discrimination. I'm a black guy, and knowing my area, most gun owners here are white and often have racist beliefs. I would have gone to the range a long time ago if it weren't for that, it makes me pretty avoidant of shooting, something I've enjoyed from the small amount I've done.

Anyways, besides that, where do you all suggest I purchase from first? There's a ton of mom & pop places here, there's Cabela's and a few other places. I'm leaning towards Cabela's, I've also been looking at Gun Broker, but I'm curious to see what you all suggest. @Michael88 just remembered you're not in the US lol - does a place like Gunbroker exist in Austria?

After purchasing, I'm going to do a class at a local range that has good ratings.

 

[Brett]

Mainly because I live in a city.

I honestly don't feel comfortable having a rifle because I'd easily be seen loading and unloading it from the car - it makes me a target. It may seem paranoid, but my city is pretty damn unsafe and I've heard a lot of instances where people have had their firearms stolen or have been targeted for carjacking.

That said, a pistol would be fine for me.

@Brett - I was looking at Glock but also a few other alternatives.

I've been shopping around for a while, looking at Sig Sauer and S&W - there's a ton out there. I love Glocks, but man.. there's so many out there

@Xavier2342 - I've never heard of Arex, but that thing looks really damn good.

I'm pretty intimidated by the gun ranges in the area and discrimination. I'm a black guy, and knowing my area, most gun owners here are white and often have racist beliefs. I would have gone to the range a long time ago if it weren't for that, it makes me pretty avoidant of shooting, something I've enjoyed from the small amount I've done.

Anyways, besides that, where do you all suggest I purchase from first? There's a ton of mom & pop places here, there's Cabela's and a few other places. I'm leaning towards Cabela's, I've also been looking at Gun Broker, but I'm curious to see what you all suggest. @Michael88 just remembered you're not in the US lol - does a place like Gunbroker exist in Austria?

After purchasing, I'm going to do a class at a local range that has good ratings.

My comments on range experiences are not going to mean much because I am a white guy and do not have that discomfort of people knowingly/unknowingly judging me based on my skin color. My experiences at the range have been good; many have been happy to let me shoot a few rounds through their guns. But again, white guy and my experience is not relevant to the situation. Unfortunately, there is a group of gun people that are doing the rest of us a huge disservice, really making us easy targets for ridicule, and pushing away a bunch of people that might otherwise be gun owners.

If you were in the area, then I would be happy to take you to the range I am a member at and let you shoot all of my stuff. Do you happen to know anyone that is a gun owner and if they would be willing to go with you to the range? I have only introduced one person to shooting, but it was an awesome experience.

When it comes to purchasing, I have bought about half online and the other half locally. My only preference is pretty much price. If locally can get pretty close, then I buy local. If not, then I buy online and have it sent to a local FFL. With an online purchase, factor in the shipping cost (known via the website) and the FFL transfer fee; some FFLs charge way too much to do a transfer.

Would you happen to qualify under a blue label program? At least with Glock, that opens up some possibilities and better prices. The GSSF is also another way to get a Glock for blue label price. Other manufacturers may offer something similar.

Right now, availability of pistols can be very hit or miss. Everything is seemingly out of stock online. I have no idea about local purchases because I have not been into a gun store since probably before the pandemic; I would also include a place like Academy into the mix and not visiting. The other bad part is ammo availability. That might vary locally some, especially if you can find out when places restock. I have looked a bit here and there online and it has been rough.

 

[a6m5]

After much delay due to the pandemic, I finally got my U.S. citizenship to go through + got my first Sig(new-to-me P226). Making @David proud.

After trying for weeks to go shoot the darn thing, I finally had nice weather last Wednesday & went for it. Long story short, it turned into hours of driving & barely making out of the woods.

Spoiler

It was bad.... and I'm used to driving on snow & ice.

After fleeing the snow, I ended up at a shooting range across town. I barely shot one box(50rds). P226 is "Extreme" model I think it's called? Didn't come with original G10 grip, but with Hogue rubber one instead. Didn't like it. In the pic is the stock Sig plastic grips, which I've always been fond of. Eventually I'd like to get the factory Sig Sauer rosewood one which were discontinued, but they are too expensive for me at the moment.

If you would like to see more pictures(mostly snow), it's on my blog. I hope I get to shoot more soon. Between ammo shortage & Covid, none of us have shot a whole lot in last year or so. I hope you guys are all doing okay.

I honestly don't feel comfortable having a rifle because I'd easily be seen loading and unloading it from the car - it makes me a target. It may seem paranoid, but my city is pretty damn unsafe and I've heard a lot of instances where people have had their firearms stolen or have been targeted for carjacking.

• I talk guns with my friends & coworkers, NEVER with my apartment neighbors. I don't want somebody getting ideas about my guns, and if someone should break in when I'm home, I don't want that person to know I'd be armed. I like stickers. I like guns. I have never put NRA/GOA, or any gun related stickers/decals on my car.
• Unfortunately, it's the worst time to be buying guns/ammo right now. Gun prices are high & ammo prices are impossible.... if you can find them. Because of this, I would recommend taking ammo pricing/availability into account when shopping for handgun.
• I know you aren't looking for a rifle right now, but for future reference; AR-15 can fit inside bags shorter than your regular rifle cases/bags, if you separate the upper & lower(no tools needed).

I wish you luck with your search & have fun! 👍

 

[Michael88]

I'm pretty intimidated by the gun ranges in the area and discrimination. I'm a black guy, and knowing my area, most gun owners here are white and often have racist beliefs. I would have gone to the range a long time ago if it weren't for that, it makes me pretty avoidant of shooting, something I've enjoyed from the small amount I've done.

Sucks that this is still a thing in the year 2021. Can't pretend to know what its like to be on the receiving end of racism, but I think if I were victim of racism I would give everyone the finger and would not be hesitant to do the stuff I want to do, out of spite. But as I said, no experience, talking out of my arse here.

I'm leaning towards Cabela's, I've also been looking at Gun Broker, but I'm curious to see what you all suggest. @Michael88 just remembered you're not in the US lol - does a place like Gunbroker exist in Austria?

Yeah, we do have several platforms for selling / buying private and new guns from shops. Its not very well known that Austria has a ton of gun owners and shooting is pretty big here. Media just pretends that community does not exist and our politicians like to sweep it all under the rug, for obvious reasons, like they are ashamed of us or something, lol. (But that feeling is mutual.) Like: NOTHING TO SEE HERE, MOVE ALONG!

• I know you aren't looking for a rifle right now, but for future reference; AR-15 can fit inside bags shorter than your regular rifle cases/bags, if you separate the upper & lower(no tools needed).

Coincidentally I'm currently investigating a 10'' AR-15. Maybe you could apply for a SBR stamp and a get a 14 or 12'' AR? They should fit in a tennis bag or a guitar case, and if you want to go even shorter with an SBR, there are short barrel AK's with folding stocks that fit in a sports bag. Or get a short AR pistol and put a brace on it.

Also I'm totally with a6m5, keep it quiet with the neighbors. Mine don't know either. A friend of mine uses a fishing rod bag to transport his long guns to the range, his neighbors always ask him where he goes fishing and he always has a nice chat about fishes etc. with them. That sly bastard.

Anyway, talking about SBR's, I'm thinking about getting a new AR chambered in 9mm, I've already investigated a lower that takes Glock magazines.

 

[Blood Eagle]

After much delay due to the pandemic, I finally got my U.S. citizenship to go through

Congrats man. I was up in Oregon in November and thought about you and how everything was going. Glad to hear.

OT but a pic I took in Oregon.

 

[coryclifford]

Just buy a BB gun and get good. Right now is not the time for a firearm purchase.

Everything will calm down, then etc.Or at the very least, the BB action will keep you practicing for pennies compared to dollars per round.

 

[a6m5]

Sucks that this is still a thing in the year 2021. Can't pretend to know what its like to be on the receiving end of racism, but I think if I were victim of racism I would give everyone the finger and would not be hesitant to do the stuff I want to do, out of spite. But as I said, no experience, talking out of my arse here.

I'm that way, too. They are the idiots. Just stay out of my way. Unfortunately, it doesn't work in restaurants, because they you know, handle your food.....

Congrats man. I was up in Oregon in November and thought about you and how everything was going. Glad to hear.

Thanks man! 👍 2020 was..... 2020. It sucked, but looks like we both survived it. I heard California was one of the hardest hit states. I hope you guys are doing okay. Hopefully this year will be better.

 

[Michael88]

I'm that way, too. They are the idiots. Just stay out of my way. Unfortunately, it doesn't work in restaurants, because they you know, handle your food.....

Oh yeah, that.... That's why I'm generally extra polite to the restaurant staff when ordering food! I went to a restaurant once with an acquaintance who was incredibly rude to the waiter and the owner of that place, I don't want to know what they did to his food.

Thanks man! 👍 2020 was..... 2020. It sucked, but looks like we both survived it. I heard California was one of the hardest hit states. I hope you guys are doing okay. Hopefully this year will be better.

Oh yeah, almost forgot - congrats a6m5!! Finally!
Austria has been hit super hard too, opening the shooting ranges has been basically unthinkable for over 8 months now. But that's the least of my worries now.

 

[Brett]

After much delay due to the pandemic, I finally got my U.S. citizenship to go through

Hell yeah brother!

 

[a6m5]

Hell yeah brother!

Oh yeah, almost forgot - congrats a6m5!! Finally!
Austria has been hit super hard too, opening the shooting ranges has been basically unthinkable for over 8 months now. But that's the least of my worries now.

Thank you guys. Glad to see you guys still on here. I haven't heard about any range closures in my area, but I'd imagine they must've gone through some shutdown in early 2020. Even then, we have the ammo situation, which you guys know all about. Even reloading supplie's disappeared according to the posters in the local gun forum(Federal explained that they were reserved for increased ammo production).

I don't like how you ended your reply there Michael. I hope it's not anything you can't handle.

 

[Brett]

Thank you guys. Glad to see you guys still on here. I haven't heard about any range closures in my area, but I'd imagine they must've gone through some shutdown in early 2020. Even then, we have the ammo situation, which you guys know all about. Even reloading supplie's disappeared according to the posters in the local gun forum(Federal explained that they were reserved for increased ammo production).

I don't like how you ended your reply there Michael. I hope it's not anything you can't handle.

I just finished up a round with COVID, but I am still here. I was wondering if you were still around. I had not seen any posts from you in some time.

 

[Michael88]

I don't like how you ended your reply there Michael. I hope it's not anything you can't handle.

My health took a severe dangerous hit, which is especially fun when there is a big pandemic going on at the same time - I feel like crap - but on the bright side I got lots of time to distract myself with fun future gun projects.

Thinking about building a dedicated 9mm AR, I have lots of 32 round Glock mags from back when I was playing around with the RONI Glock chassis. Too bad the 9mm components are SUPER expensive, found a lower that takes Glock mags - 500 bucks, a 10'' upper - 1500 bucks. Add another 500+ bucks for optics,....ouch.

I've also been pondering about building a 10.5'' AR (We don't have any SBR regulations here in Austria) but I'm not sure if I can live with the velocity drop from the short barrel. My 20'' AR has a measured muzzle velocity of 3250 fps with 55's, the 10.5'' launches them at 2600 fps. That's an energy loss of almost 50%.
Then again short rifles are compact, lightweight and just plain cool. And the local shop has a complete 10.5'' upper for 700 bucks (special discount).
Can't decide...

 

[Brett]

My health took a severe dangerous hit, which is especially fun when there is a big pandemic going on at the same time - I feel like crap - but on the bright side I got lots of time to distract myself with fun future gun projects.

Thinking about building a dedicated 9mm AR, I have lots of 32 round Glock mags from back when I was playing around with the RONI Glock chassis. Too bad the 9mm components are SUPER expensive, found a lower that takes Glock mags - 500 bucks, a 10'' upper - 1500 bucks. Add another 500+ bucks for optics,....ouch.

I've also been pondering about building a 10.5'' AR (We don't have any SBR regulations here in Austria) but I'm not sure if I can live with the velocity drop from the short barrel. My 20'' AR has a measured muzzle velocity of 3250 fps with 55's, the 10.5'' launches them at 2600 fps. That's an energy loss of almost 50%.
Then again short rifles are compact, lightweight and just plain cool. And the local shop has a complete 10.5'' upper for 700 bucks (special discount).
Can't decide...

What about a 11.5", 12.5", or 13.7"?

 

[Michael88]

What about a 11.5", 12.5", or 13.7"?

I was thinking about those as well, unfortunately uppers (and barrels) in those barrel lengths are just not available around here, all we have is 20's, 14.5 and 10.5's. 14.5 would be a very nice compromise in size and velocity but I handled one and IMO its still too close to the 20. The 10.5'' is perfect in every way, except the brutal loss in velocity of course.

I just finished up a round with COVID, but I am still here. I was wondering if you were still around. I had not seen any posts from you in some time.

I wasn't worried - I got a few likes from him some time ago, so I knew he was at least breathing and capable of operating buttons, lol.

 

[Brett]

I was thinking about those as well, unfortunately uppers (and barrels) in those barrel lengths are just not available around here, all we have is 20's, 14.5 and 10.5's. 14.5 would be a very nice compromise in size and velocity but I handled one and IMO its still too close to the 20. The 10.5'' is perfect in every way, except the brutal loss in velocity of course.

I have both a 14.5" and 16". I like the 14.5" more. I did not expect 1.5" less would feel quite a bit better, but it does. I guess the shorter barrel and rail makes a difference.

I wasn't worried - I got a few likes from him some time ago, so I knew he was at least breathing and capable of operating buttons, lol.

I had not in a while.

 

[Xavier2342]

@phillkillv2 like you I am a black male and I live in a predominately white neighborhood. More often than I can count, I am usually the only black person at the range. With all of this being said, my range experience has always been positive. Sometimes people approach me in a non-malicious way and we talk about firearms (either theirs or mine). The point I am trying to make is don't stereotype an entire demographic of people based upon the actions of a small few.

@a6m5 Congratulations

@coryclifford

 

[a6m5]

I just finished up a round with COVID, but I am still here. I was wondering if you were still around. I had not seen any posts from you in some time.

Holy crap man. I hope it was just cold/flu like symptoms for you & nothing serious. My 2020 problems were work related. Some people lost jobs, I was just being enslaved at work(record sales numbers, heavy workload, pretty much no pay increase). Plus, I started posting sometimes on the local gun forums when I did message boards. I'm glad no one around me have gotten Covid yet, but this pandemic's far from over.

My health took a severe dangerous hit, which is especially fun when there is a big pandemic going on at the same time - I feel like crap - but on the bright side I got lots of time to distract myself with fun future gun projects.

I'm very sorry to hear that man. I know what you mean about health/medical care during the pandemic. I haven't been to dentists or optometrists in about a year. Really hoping you get better soon.

Thinking about building a dedicated 9mm AR, I have lots of 32 round Glock mags from back when I was playing around with the RONI Glock chassis. Too bad the 9mm components are SUPER expensive, found a lower that takes Glock mags - 500 bucks, a 10'' upper - 1500 bucks. Add another 500+ bucks for optics,....ouch.

I've also been pondering about building a 10.5'' AR (We don't have any SBR regulations here in Austria) but I'm not sure if I can live with the velocity drop from the short barrel. My 20'' AR has a measured muzzle velocity of 3250 fps with 55's, the 10.5'' launches them at 2600 fps. That's an energy loss of almost 50%.
Then again short rifles are compact, lightweight and just plain cool. And the local shop has a complete 10.5'' upper for 700 bucks (special discount).
Can't decide...

I'm not feeling it, but 9mm seems to be very popular AR/Carbine option right now. I do think SBR/AR Pistols are cool. I don't even agree with the American(ATF?) restrictions on them. If it was like Austria here too, I'd be looking into SBR for sure. 👍

As far as AR's go, I'd be interested in longer barrel or complete upper w/long barrel for my Bushmaster 308. I hear you on the 20" barrel velocity. 👍

I wasn't worried - I got a few likes from him some time ago, so I knew he was at least breathing and capable of operating buttons, lol.

I did visit the thread at least couple of times, that's right.

I had not in a while.

Two likes today, making up for the lost time or something...

@a6m5 Congratulations

Thanks man. I just don't want jury duty. I can't check that "Not U.S. Citizen" box anymore....

 

[Brett]

Holy crap man. I hope it was just cold/flu like symptoms for you & nothing serious. My 2020 problems were work related. Some people lost jobs, I was just being enslaved at work(record sales numbers, heavy workload, pretty much no pay increase). Plus, I started posting sometimes on the local gun forums when I did message boards. I'm glad no one around me have gotten Covid yet, but this pandemic's far from over.

I had about eight days of what I thought was a head cold/really bad allergies or sinus issues. Since I have asthma, it is hard to tell if I had breathing issues. Any time I had any breathing issues, it was no worse than when I have elevated asthma. I did not run a fever or have any chills. I did not lose taste or smell. Fortunately, it seems I had a mostly mild case. Hopefully, I have experienced the worst of it and have no lasting issues.

 

[phillgt2002]

Hmm, I'm going to sort out any information I need, contact the ranges/FFL holders and pick up my first handgun, likely this month, if possible. I have cashflow, so I was thinking eh, go all out and get one I always wanted, or settle with a Glock 45 or something of the likes. I have $1,250 to mess with. Considering extra mags, a holster, ammo (!), gun safe, classes and range time, I'm thinking I'll go over budget into $1,750 for everything I need.

@Xavier2342 I'm really, looking at the Arex.

 

[wfooshee]

@a6m5 I see that S&W in your picture and would ask what you think of it. I have one, and it's my first personally owned DA-only pistol, and I'm not sure I like the extra trigger effort. I've shot a Glock but it was a long time ago and I can't make a realistic comparison, and everything other semi-auto I've owned was single-action, external hammer. How does it compare to the Sig? Which do you prefer?

Also, I absolutely hate the teardown on that gun; those slide release tabs are next to impossible to use!

 

[a6m5]

@a6m5 I see that S&W in your picture and would ask what you think of it. I have one, and it's my first personally owned DA-only pistol, and I'm not sure I like the extra trigger effort. I've shot a Glock but it was a long time ago and I can't make a realistic comparison, and everything other semi-auto I've owned was single-action, external hammer. How does it compare to the Sig? Which do you prefer?

Also, I absolutely hate the teardown on that gun; those slide release tabs are next to impossible to use!

Which picture? My pic has just Glock 19 & Sig P226!

 

[wfooshee]

Well dang. That's what I get for looking at it on my phone! My S&W SD VE very much resembles the Glock, and I mistook it for that on my phone. Oops!

 

[Michael88]

Thats one reason why I like the 1860, 1866 and 1873 lever actions so much:

 

[Michael88]

Just got my Speer .375 game Point projectiles for my .375 H&H, those are awesome.-

Left to right PPU 55 grain .223 FMJBT, PPU.308 150 grain FMJFB, .375 300 grain Sierra GP, 9mm BP 124 grain FMJ

Also, those really pointy 9mm are new as well, I bought them because they look so neat. I'm gonna have to try if they feed better or what other benefits (if any) those really pointy bullets offer.

 

[Barney Da Dog]

My first job after leaving school was working in a gun shop (UK). Spent much of the day cleaning guns, melting lead and making bullets for use on the range.

Big perk was getting to test a lot of the full auto guns before they were exported. Firing an MG42 from the hip was awesome!! Also had full auto AK47, UZI, Bren and a FAL. Got to shoot a Desert Eagle and a 454 Casull too - that thing was a beast!

Before the UK handgun ban, I owned a .45 Sig P220 and a .22 Beretta 76. Good old days.

 

[Michael88]

My first job after leaving school was working in a gun shop (UK). Spent much of the day cleaning guns, melting lead and making bullets for use on the range.

reminds me - I always wanted to cast my own projectiles, since I do a lot of muzzleloader shooting it would be of great benefit to me to create them myself. Unfortunately right when I wanted to get a melting oven and casting dies a friend of mine, who was big in the bullet casting hobby, was diagnosed with tonsil cancer, of which he died soon after.
The cancer was most likely caused by prolonged exposure to lead fumes.

I thought about wearing a proper industrial mask etc. but that all would get very complicated and expensive (not to mention uncomfortable) quickly and it would basically nullify the cost savings. I tried casting lead in the open with fresh air blowing the fumes away, but I could still taste the sweetish flavor of lead in the air.

 

[Barney Da Dog]

reminds me - I always wanted to cast my own projectiles, since I do a lot of muzzleloader shooting it would be of great benefit to me to create them myself. Unfortunately right when I wanted to get a melting oven and casting dies a friend of mine, who was big in the bullet casting hobby, was diagnosed with tonsil cancer, of which he died soon after.
The cancer was most likely caused by prolonged exposure to lead fumes.

I thought about wearing a proper industrial mask etc. but that all would get very complicated and expensive (not to mention uncomfortable) quickly and it would basically nullify the cost savings. I tried casting lead in the open with fresh air blowing the fumes away, but I could still taste the sweetish flavor of lead in the air.

Oh man, I'm sorry to hear about your friend :-( I did have a mask, but only did the job for a few months, so hopefully nothing bad happening.

A couple of guys at the gun club had old Colt Peacemaker style revolvers - had to hope for a windy day, otherwise the targets were obscured after a couple of shots!

 

[Michael88]

Oh man, I'm sorry to hear about your friend :-( I did have a mask, but only did the job for a few months, so hopefully nothing bad happening.

A couple of guys at the gun club had old Colt Peacemaker style revolvers - had to hope for a windy day, otherwise the targets were obscured after a couple of shots!

I have three black powder revolvers, two Colts and one Remington, .36 and .44, they sure make a lot of smoke! I love shooting black powder though, the smell is incredible and if I have a cough or a sore throat black powder fumes cure it better than any any medication, true story!

Oh, BTW, today a friend of mine bought a precision rifle chambered in .408CT for 7000 bucks and a scope for 3000. That makes me feel like an amateur, LOL.

 

[Xavier2342]

I have three black powder revolvers, two Colts and one Remington, .36 and .44, they sure make a lot of smoke! I love shooting black powder though, the smell is incredible and if I have a cough or a sore throat black powder fumes cure it better than any any medication, true story!

Oh, BTW, today a friend of mine bought a precision rifle chambered in .408CT for 7000 bucks and a scope for 3000. That makes me feel like an amateur, LOL.

How far does he plan in shooting that thing?