Rules of Passing?

[cletus 669]

tony1311, if you ever were to bump me off my line like you did that other guy, I would put your a$$ in the wall! you were out of line to do what you did!Man, the nerve of some people!👎 -1000

 

[Jack]

Maybe you should read what i have mentioned in my earlier posts before expressing yourself. 👎 After all, you are a Gtp moderator.

I did read it

My problem was not that i couldn't pass him.

but couldn't find a way to pass him in the first lap

Sounds to me like you couldnt get passed him.

My problem was that if i waited a whole lap longer behind him,waiting to pass him on the straight, i would have lost the oportunity to race the gtlm in p1 which was my best bet for a good race that evening.

Punting to get passed someone is not an opition.

 

[MJH]

I did read it





Sounds to me like you couldnt get passed him.



Punting to get passed someone is not an opition.

Sounds to me like Tony is a mediocre racer with less skills than I-plume if he can only get past him by cheating.

 

[Peter]

Why did you move into his way?

I don't know about you, but I'm not going to let a win just drive by me nad lose the win by a few thousandths. It was kinda like the Le Mans GT2 finish at Laguna Seca.

 

[The Outlaw]

-WE ALL PLAY GRAN TURISMO TO HAVE FUN.

Where is the FUN when all you do is try to hold a much faster player back?

-WE ARE NOT FIGHTING FOR CHAMPIONSHIPS,CONTRACTS,MONEY.

Any comparisons with REAL LIFE RACING are irrelevant.

-WE ALL HAVE PRIDE AND EGOS

Are you protecting your pride when you hold back a player ,when he is much faster than you,not necessarily because he is a faster driver,but because he has a faster car?

..

Tony, although I don't think bumping someone out of the way is ever justifiable, unless they did the same to your or are purposely trying to hold you up by excessively blocking, brake checking or what have you...you do have a point IMO, which I brought up in a thread a long time ago.

To me, it all comes down to how lucky the drivers are when it comes to their starting positions...as drivers of drastically different paces and skill levels are stacked all over the grid, making the racing quality far from ideal in most cases. I'm of the opinion that if you are much slower (and know it) than the driver behind you, and there is a much faster driver in front, it is a nice gesture to let them pass. And let me emphasize it is a nice, sportsmanship gesture...not necessary or to be demanded by the faster driver though! I'm not saying pull over on the side of the road either, but rather leave them a small door to get by cleanly. I think it is a nice and considerate gesture, when considering that the driver behind, like me, is also racing to have a good time, in what might be a limited amount of time they get to play GT5P...and by holding them up for just long enough to where the car in 1st can get away for the remaining 8-9 laps , I'm am basically robbing him of his enjoyment thanks to my selfishness to defend my position, which I received only in part due to the starting grid lottery.

This is moreso the case if you are making a lot random and unpredictable mistakes which give the much faster driver behind a hard time trying to judge and predict a clean and safe overtake. And in some cases you might be able to lap a lot quicker than the car in front, but cannot get around due to a large differential in acceleration and top speed which keep you stuck behind.

Now if the slower drivers manages to get around the faster driver due to the faster driver making a mistake, then the slower guy has all the right to defend his position.

Again, this is only what I would do...not saying anyone should or has to do this! Maybe I'm just too kind when I take the starting grid lottery into account and am too considerate of other drivers enjoyment and not just mine 👍

 

[Jack]

I don't know about you, but I'm not going to let a win just drive by me nad lose the win by a few thousandths. It was kinda like the Le Mans GT2 finish at Laguna Seca.

So you are referring your driving style to something which caused a big crash... Hmm 💡

I'm of the opinion that if you are much slower (and know it) than the driver behind you, and there is a much faster driver in front, it is a nice gesture to let them pass. And let me emphasize it is a nice, sportsmanship gesture...not necessary or to be demanded by the faster driver though! I'm not saying pull over on the side of the road either, but rather leave them a small door to get by cleanly. I think it is a nice and considerate gesture, when considering that the driver behind, like me, is also racing to have a good time, in what might be a limited amount of time they get to play GT5P...and by holding them up for just long enough to where the car in 1st can get away for the remaining 8-9 laps , I'm am basically robbing him of his enjoyment thanks to my selfishness to defend my position, which I received only in part due to the starting grid lottery.

Cut the rest of the post...

If youre really that much faster then why cant you pass? Where do these slower drivers improve if they cant battle with the quick guys like you? And if that faster guy out infront was really bothered about having a good race, he would slow down and enjoy the battle too. In no situation should a driver be forced to give up his position on track because you might be able to catch the leader. Enjoy the races for what they are worth and who they are with.

 

[Stotty]

Enjoy the races for what they are worth and who they are with.

Hear, hear 👍

There are some attitudes in this thread that are really disappointing.

But I guess once private rooms are finally available in GT5 the 'win at all cost' crowd won't be an issue anymore as they'll not get invited in.

 

[crazytortise]

Good example on this was last night in the 512. The grid had the likes of myself, Hugo_Boss, Imalexi, Drandad, GTP_Phil and Sinibomb. A grid of differently skilled drivers. There were some other cars in the grid aswell. When some one did go off the track the front runners would slow down so the pack can regroup and it made the racing so much more enjoyable. The passing was clean and sometimes there was the odd unintentional bump but we kept it clean and fair which just improved the whole outcome of the racing. If the front runner just wants to run away and get the winning credits that's his choice. But for me I rather let the pack bunch up and keep it exciting. That's just me...

I would rather finish last and know I had a great battle and close, exciting racing then run away in the lead and get bored after lap 2

 

[tony1311]

If youre really that much faster then why cant you pass?

It seems you don't get it. The much faster driver can pass but only on the straight. He can't pass anywhere else because the slower driver is unpredictable in his movements and unstable and it is quite possible any attempt of passing would result to a crash.

Timeattack puts it very clear and i agree with him. But in the heat of the moment a harmless touch (and not punt as Jack says) was the only thing i could think of in order to enjoy the race.

A slight touch is part of the race.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kl2tIFxSEGA&feature=related

 

[dranddad]

My question, as I'm no real racer. Is there racing etiquette to let someone pass?

Expert races are the shiznick.

racing etiquette game etiquette call it what you will


I find I’m a little like Jekyll and Hyde, Public race no mercy, racing with forum members then.


I for one am guilty of moving over as can be verified by members who race with me on a regular basis, if it’s in a place where its not possible like the esses at Suzuka then the quicker guys just have to be a little patient.

Most know I want stop them passing me, or I may move over off the racing line.

I then try to hook into their draft and follow their racing line in a hope of improving my own driving style.

As most of our fun comes from racing in these fun events like the 512bb have fun keep it close, competitions are a different ball game, I stick to OLR where they earn the pass.

But thats just me dont have an ego just an old

Phillip.

 

[Jack]

It seems you don't get it. The much faster driver can pass but only on the straight. He can't pass anywhere else because the slower driver is unpredictable in his movements and unstable and it is quite possible any attempt of passing would result to a crash.

Then thats down to driver skill. There are passes that can be made on any track that force the racer offline, to lose time and a pass can be made easily. If the racer is unstable then making a move down the inside at the chicane on Fuji and forcing them wide will make them lose 1 second or so. This is enough to stretch a lead big enough through T3 so they cant use your draft on the main straight. Espically in a GTLM vs GT situation. The GTLM is by far quicker and has alot of more downforce. In 99% of situations on Fuji the GTLM has an advantage. If you were really that much faster you could have made a pass.

Timeattack puts it very clear and i agree with him. But in the heat of the moment a harmless touch (and not punt as Jack says) was the only thing i could think of in order to enjoy the race.

A slight touch is part of the race.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kl2tIFxSEGA&feature=related

Yes touching is part of racing but not in the matter you have shown. You forced your car down the inside of another racer to push him offline. Why should he be forced offline so you can try and get after another racer. Have some respect for others on track no matter what car.

 

[The Outlaw]

If youre really that much faster then why cant you pass? Where do these slower drivers improve if they cant battle with the quick guys like you? And if that faster guy out infront was really bothered about having a good race, he would slow down and enjoy the battle too. In no situation should a driver be forced to give up his position on track because you might be able to catch the leader. Enjoy the races for what they are worth and who they are with.

Well I NEVER said the slower driver should be FORCED to give up his position. It's just something I would do in that particular scenario, where I'm in the middle of two much faster drivers and got there due to my luck when it came to starting grid position. If I was the much slower driver I would take into account that in a real race with qualifying I would have not been at the front of the grid to begin with. The key point being, this is what I would do...I clearly said this is not to be demanded by faster drivers, so all you're doing is making it sound as if I'm spreading my personal etiquette around like gospel...which I'm not at all trying to do! Just some people are overly defensive and touchy when it comes to this subject...and hold their way of doing things to a higher degree than another.

And I don't know why you automatically labeled me the fast guy in such a situation, when I had put myself in the shoes of the slower driver. Makes me sound a bit selfish really, as I'm always the faster driver expecting people to pull over for me?

And lastly getting past a slower driver isn't always as easy as one might think. When they are running unpredictable lines and making unpredictable mistakes, like I said, it can make it difficult to time and pull off a clean move without incident. Then you also have the situation where the slower driver/car (in terms of laps times) has a large acceleration and top speed advantage that can make it much more difficult to find a way through as well.

This is only what I what do. As I've said, I'm not at all trying to force this etiquette or politeness upon anyone else. So take it for what it is worth! Your entitled to your opinion and I'm entitled to mine...so lets leave it at that 👍 Now if I went bumping people off the road to get passed or DEMANDED that slower drivers make way for the faster drivers...then there would be issues. But that's clearly not what I'm trying to do.

Edit: In response to this comment: "Where do these slower drivers improve if they cant battle with the quick guys like you?"

Isn't there more to be learned by following a quicker driver and studying his lines and technique rather than over driving and trying to keep him at bay?

 

[Jack]

Well I NEVER said the slower driver should be FORCED to give up his position. It's just something I would do in that particular scenario, where I'm in the middle of two much faster drivers and got there due to my luck when it came to starting grid position. If I was the much slower driver I would take into account that in a real race with qualifying I would have not been at the front of the grid to begin with. The key point being, this is what I would do...I clearly said this is not to be demanded by faster drivers, so all you're doing is making it sound as if I'm spreading my personal etiquette around like gospel...which I'm not at all trying to do! Just some people are overly defensive and touchy when it comes to this subject...and hold their way of doing things to a higher degree than another.

At not point was I suggesting that you demand drivers to empty your path so you can have a clear run. I was addressing the point of no driver should be forced to move out of another drivers way. As you say, thats up to each individual racer. But at no point should a driver be pushed to one side as Tony did to i-Plume. Your post was just the one I quoted in response to the issue.

And I don't know why you automatically labeled me the fast guy in such a situation, when I had put myself in the shoes of the slower driver. Makes me sound a bit selfish really, as I'm always the faster driver expecting people to pull over for me?

Not really. You are a fast guy. You rarley have to expirence the guy behind you being alot quicker than you and having to worry about pulling to one side.

And lastly getting past a slower driver isn't always as easy as one might think. When they are running unpredictable lines and making unpredictable mistakes, like I said, it can make it difficult to time and pull off a clean move without incident. Then you also have the situation where the slower driver/car (in terms of laps times) has a large acceleration and top speed advantage that can make it much more difficult to find a way through as well.

There is never a straight forward overtake. Some are easier than others but they are all difficult and require a certian amount of skill. Drivers will always have a weak spot on track that can be use to your advantage. If a driver is fast on the straights then they will proberly be slower in the corners. Use this the your advantage and pass them heading into the tight sections of the track to pull out the lead. Patience is key.

Isn't there more to be learned by following a quicker driver and studying his lines and technique rather than over driving and trying to keep him at bay?

Yes following a driver and following his lines can benefit. But also learning how to race quickly is also a skill required. To battle with a fast racer increases a driver skill immensely. To see what they do in tight situations, to see how they keep the speed around the outside of the corner when you brake for the inside, to see where they position the car to keep an advantage and to gain back the place, etc. Battling has just as much benefit, if not more than following,