Six students dead after NIU shooting.

[Max Powers]

People are ****ed up, I'm sick of these nuts taking the lives of others because of their own psychological problems. These random shootings just disgust me, especially when the gunmen take their lives like cowards. If somebody is that miserable and angry that they want to die, then they should just do it and not take other innocent lives with them.

RIP to the dead, besides the gunman, and a full recovery to the injured.

Story.

 

[Mark T]

It's sad to think that this will continue to happen as long as they have access to guns.

 

[DQuaN]

What really bugs me is that the guys always manage to top themselves. They are taking the easy way out and escaping punishment.

They really need to be caught, not least to see what makes them tick, and help prevent things like this happening in the first place.

 

[Jim Prower]

It's sad to think that this will continue to happen as long as they have access to guns.

And they always will. Black market.

It's just sickening.

 

[Touring Mars]

Some early reports are suggesting that the shooter, Stephen Kazmierczak, had been acting erratically in the days prior to the shooting and had stopped taking some sort of medication. He also served as vice president of NIU's Academic Criminal Justice Association chapter...

And from the Chicago Tribune:

Just two years ago, Northern Illinois University honored Steve Kazmierczak, whom authorities identified as the gunman in Thursday's classroom shooting, with a dean's award for his sociology work.

Kazmierczak had established himself as an authority on prison systems, having co-authored a manuscript on self-injury in prison and the role of religion in the formation of early prisons in the United States. Both papers were written under the guidance of Jim Thomas, a professor emeritus at NIU and a nationally renowned criminal-justice expert.

NIU President John G. Peters said Kazmierczak, who was accused of killing five people before taking his own life, had "a very good academic record, no record of trouble," while studying at the university.

 

[Solid Lifters]

These people are enormously selfish. Killing yourself, in most occasions, is nothing but a selfish act. They often kill themselves with the thought, "If I kill myself, then they'll all be sorry."

But, these selfish people now know most people don't feel guilty or anything but condemnation. So, they arrange to kill themselves after killing others.

 

[Duke]

It's sad to think that this will continue to happen as long as they have access to guns.

A) Black market. "When guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns."

Assuming all guns are outlawed, picked up, and destroyed:

B) Two feet of 3" steel pipe, a handful of drywall screws, and some black powder dumped out of a bunch of fireworks, all bought legally.

 

[Mark T]

A) Black market. "When guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns."

Assuming all guns are outlawed, picked up, and destroyed:

B) Two feet of 3" steel pipe, a handful of drywall screws, and some black powder dumped out of a bunch of fireworks, all bought legally.

True. Although it seems that all of these killings have happened with guns. There are always going to be ways of killing people and creating home made weapons with devastating consequences.

It's a problem that seems to have no real solution. There are services available to people with mental health problems but it seems they choose not to use it.

This isn't something that happens often in other countries (to my knowledge). We have had machete wielding maniacs but not as often as the shootings that happen in the US.

 

[Duke]

I don't know the facts of this case - nobody does - but I do always wonder about "medications" and why people who need them always seem to quit taking them.

I assume this guy was on some kind of psychotropic drug, such as is used for schizophrenia. I always hear about schizophrenics who quit taking their medications and consequently freak out again. I can't speak with authority, but it seems to me that if I had a choice between feeling decent but medicated and feeling completely off-track, I'd be taking those pills when they told me to.

 

[Mark T]

I don't know the facts of this case - nobody does - but I do always wonder about "medications" and why people who need them always seem to quit taking them.

I assume this guy was on some kind of psychotropic drug, such as is used for schizophrenia. I always hear about schizophrenics who quit taking their medications and consequently freak out again. I can't speak with authority, but it seems to me that if I had a choice between feeling decent but medicated and feeling completely off-track, I'd be taking those pills when they told me to.

I think the medications actually cause more harm than good. I've read about anti depressants causing users to self harm.

 

[Duke]

Well, this person was apparently acting erratically for a week or two, after stopping his medication. I've heard many similar stories, though they do not always end in murder.

 

[V1P3R]

Getting old and lame...

Condolences to the families.

 

[Mark T]

Well, this person was apparently acting erratically for a week or two, after stopping his medication. I've heard many similar stories, though they do not always end in murder.

I think Doctors act too quickly in dishing out these drugs. My girlfriends Dad recently got divorced and they started prescribing him all sorts of drugs for depression. Whatever happened to just taking time to getting over an issue? Drugs surely only increase the potency of the come down once they come off the tablets.

Something seriously needs to be done and I think I'll have a read up on how many of these killers were actually using drugs to treat mental problems.

 

[Josh]

Yet another prime example of how gun control doesn't work, and another reason why myself, and thousands of other students, across the nation carry concealed firearms to school on a day-to-day basis. I have my CWP, and I absolutely refuse to be a victim. I'm coming home at the end of the day to my wife and kids. Period.

Did you hear the report from the girl who survived the shooting? She said she had to crawl on her belly and HOPE she didn't get shot dead. Had to hope? **** that. Give the unarmed a means to protect themselves, you fools. 911 doesn't work until you are dead. Period.

 

[Sage]

And I’m so happy that people like you carry guns with them. When an armed robber comes into a building I’m in, I want people to be able to take him out – I want you in the room. I want everybody in the world to be armed, except me (I don’t like to carry anything on me except chapstick and my wallet ).

 

[ROAD_DOGG33J]

And I’m so happy that people like you carry guns with them. When an armed robber comes into a building I’m in, I want people to be able to take him out – I want you in the room. I want everybody in the world to be armed, except me (I don’t like to carry anything on me except chapstick and my wallet ).

It would feel pretty uncomfortable to carry it around, but I guess I could store it in my backpack.


Is it legal for students to carry concealed weapons on campus?

 

[Josh]

It would feel pretty uncomfortable to carry it around, but I guess I could store it in my backpack.


Is it legal for students to carry concealed weapons on campus?

In a lot of places it's legal, but I'm pretty sure it's against school policy pretty much everywhere.

Also, with the proper gun/holster combination most handguns can be carried concealed with little-to-no hassle/discomfort to eh person carrying. I've carried S&W j-frame revolvers in pocket holsters slid into my front pocket on numerous occasions, and almost completely forgot they were even there.

 

[Sureboss]

I've carried S&W j-frame revolvers in pocket holsters slid into my front pocket on numerous occasions, and almost completely forgot they were even there.

Proving them pointless

 

[Josh]

Key word being almost. I've never completely forgotten that I'm armed. It's something that you never forget, and you're always aware of. I'm just trying to get across just how unbelievably comfortable some setups can be.

And trust me... even if someone was to somehow forget they were armed, I'm pretty sure the moment some guy walked into their classroom with a shotgun, and started shooting people, he/she'd remember that 'pointless' pistol on their person pretty quickly.

 

[Loon]

Proving them pointless

I'm sure that when the poo hits the proverbial fan he'll remember he has it on him.

EDIT:Tree'd

 

[CraftyLandShark]

Back to the medication issue for a moment, the reasons why people stop taking these medications are fairly uncomplicated, if a bit strange to the casual observer, in cases like schizophrenia.

The medications work. They return the subject from a state of hysteria/delusion to a state of almost complete normalcy. After long enough, the subject is in such a clear state of mind that he believes he is cured. This notion becomes so overwhelming, that to dispense with some of the negative side effects of such medication (i.e. impotency, a common side-effect in male subjects), they take themselves off of it. Let's take "Bob" for example. Bob is a real person, a former 'regular' at a coffee shop I often go to. Bob is a Yale-educated man who is capable of extremely intelligent conversation and productive social interaction, who is also a paranoid schizophrenic. Despite being VERY smart, and knowing exactly the possible consequences of going off his medication, he does so from time to time. The erratic behavior comes on very quickly. During his most recent break, I had a quick but reasoned and quite sane conversation regarding the presidential election with him. Two days later, he came up to me, sweating and experiencing tremors, claiming he had a sniper sitting on top of the Krispy Kreme across the street waiting for his order to take out anyone he so chose. Needless to say he's now banned from said coffee shop

Point is, people like this go off their meds frequently. Anyone intimately associated with the NIU shooter should have been able to recognize the signs. Are they to blame for what happened? Of course not. Should they probably have called the student's doctor? Yes.

 

[Sureboss]

Key word being almost. I've never completely forgotten that I'm armed. It's something that you never forget, and you're always aware of. I'm just trying to get across just how unbelievably comfortable some setups can be.

And trust me... even if someone was to somehow forget they were armed, I'm pretty sure the moment some guy walked into their classroom with a shotgun, and started shooting people, he/she'd remember that 'pointless' pistol on their person pretty quickly.

I'll just use my dashing British charm.

 

[Duke]

I'll just use by dashing British charm.

Add your apparendy duffy nothe.

 

[Sureboss]

You know what would be really funny?

Someone singing "Always look on the brightside of life" whilst a bank raid is going on.

 

[Sphinx]

Yet another prime example of how gun control doesn't work, and another reason why myself, and thousands of other students, across the nation carry concealed firearms to school on a day-to-day basis.

If I lived anywhere that placed myself into a situation that forced me to arm myself or even worse force my children to arm themselves, then I would seriously question the very society that I live in. I mean, what sort of society allows its children to go to school armed with a firearm? As a parent I simply wouldn’t live there, unless I’ve become so conditioned into thinking it’s the norm, then I suppose I would just carry on thinking nothing is wrong and live there.

Until the next time. 👎

 

[Sureboss]

It would never ever work, if our average bobbies don't want it, then no one else can have it.

 

[Josh]

If I lived anywhere that placed myself into a situation that forced me to arm myself or even worse force my children to arm themselves, then I would seriously question the very society that I live in. I mean, what sort of society allows its children to go to school armed with a firearm? As a parent I simply wouldn’t live there, unless I’ve become so conditioned into thinking it’s the norm, then I suppose I would just carry on thinking nothing is wrong and live there.

Until the next time. 👎

Children? What college-aged student do you know who's still a child? I'm not a child. Hell, I have children of my own. The "students" I'm referring to are all legally permitted to carry firearms concealed in the states we live in.

Until I get my "nothing-bad-is-going-to-happen-to-me-at-this-place-today" radar installed in my head, I'll continue to carry until the day I die. You simply never know where crime can, or will, happen. I started carrying daily when I got into a wreck on my way home one day(while in my Air Force flightsuit, no less), and the other guy tried pulling my rear doors open after telling me he was going to kill my 5 month old daughter who was in the back seat in her carseat. Could I have seen that coming? Hell no. Was it in a "bad" area? Nope.

Do you think the kids at Virginia Tech, Columbine, IU, that Church a few months ago, etc. ever thought for one second that they'd be subject to the situations they were put through? Absolutely not, and it's a damn shame - because look how many of them are dead because they were unprepared.

If you'd be so kind as to give me a map of all the places where one could live where crime simply does not ever happen, and will not ever happen, I'd love to see it... Until then, I'm hoping for the best, but prepared for the worst.

 

[Year.Zero]

I don't know the facts of this case - nobody does - but I do always wonder about "medications" and why people who need them always seem to quit taking them.

I assume this guy was on some kind of psychotropic drug, such as is used for schizophrenia. I always hear about schizophrenics who quit taking their medications and consequently freak out again. I can't speak with authority, but it seems to me that if I had a choice between feeling decent but medicated and feeling completely off-track, I'd be taking those pills when they told me to.

Not quite. Knowing a couple of kids diagnosed with Schizophrenia, the situation most often is that they start to feel in control again, and don't think they need the drugs. Then they get off them, and it starts all over again—often coming back with a vengeance.

A rare case I've heard of, though, is more similar to your hypothesis: he wasn't schizophrenic, but he was suffering from some kind of depression. The drug made him so different that he had to . . .

-Have 2 shots of rum
-Smoke a joint
-drink coffee all day

...some other ridiculous methods of coping with it. He never got violent though.

 

[Vasco]

It's seeming to become more and more common in America these days...I was really hoping to go to America on foreign exchange in 2 years but I'm now seriously considering Canada or somewhere in Europe. I'd definitely feel a lot safer in a country where citizens don't have such ready access to guns.

 

[Duke]

It's seeming to become more and more common in America these days...I was really hoping to go to America on foreign exchange in 2 years but I'm now seriously considering Canada or somewhere in Europe. I'd definitely feel a lot safer in a country where citizens don't have such ready access to guns.

1) There are more than 300 million of us. Remember that when you're comparing these incidents to, say, any other country in the world (except China).

2) It gets big media attention because it's America - which makes it seem worse than it is, and (conversely) encourages other whackjobs to try it.

3) I've lived for 43 years in this country, some of that time in bad neighborhoods, and I have only ever heard gunshots fired in anger ONCE in my entire life (when I lived in the worst neighborhood I've ever lived in).