So now we can "bribe our way to victory"? (PRICES REVEALED, SEE OP)

[Chad Daddy]

Vision GT: "I'm Lovin' it"

Well... someone's gotta eat it before it gets cold.

 

[machschnel]

The more expensive way or the regular game priced way.

Isn't the regular way when I go to the shop, hand over my money and get GT6 in return?

 

[eran0004]

Isn't the regular way when I go to the shop, hand over my money and get GT6 in return?

No it isn't, because you still have to work in order to obtain the car.

 

[robbyf]

Also another arguement can made for having to pay for credits when you should just have an option to have access to everything anyway, I was going to get the pre order thus i would of had a million credits but would not use it as i like to play career modes, If i buy GT6 and A-spec is the same as it always has been or worse the same as GT5 im going to be bored very quick like within an hour or 2 so i'll have 2 options, buy credits with real money to race cars i enjoy online, Or put GT6 aside and waste my £40+ i just spent on it.

So if theres an arguement to be made for people with no time to grind so buying credits is a good option then theres an arguement to be made on why i cant play the whole game i just spent £40 without having to grind if i dont have time and without having to further splash out any more money, After i just spent 40 quid so i should be able to play it how i want[/quote

This is a really good point. When I buy GT6, what am actually buying? The privilege to traverse the rigors of A-Spec? Or the privilege to use what's on the disc?

Adding micro transactions really muddies the waters on this issue. Time was when you had to "earn" your cars through A-Spec, but if I can now go out and spend (say) 5 real world dollars on a Ferrari (avoiding the unlock game mechanic), doesn't it beg the obvious question - didn't I already buy it?

and this is the aspect that really hurts my brain to think about. Codemasters has been doing this for years with the rally games. "ok so I need to pay more money to unlock content that I already paid for that's already in the code or I can play for hours and get it for free" it gets weird because some people use GT differently than others. I personally prefer just hot lapping and testing cars. I would prefer, like a real simulator just to have everything unlocked and free from the start and just have an ultimate car sandbox. Free tuning, free cars I wouldn't get bored with that. What I do get bored with is running circles around Indy to farm a bunch of Cr to do whatever testing I want to do that day. I still enjoy career mode and those first few hours building a Miata or Silvia to win more races easily is fun..but after that it just gets boring.
*cheat codes cost money now.

 

[invetedevo]

All the money in the world can't make you a better racer so I don't see what the problem is to be honest.

 

[machschnel]

No it isn't, because you still have to work in order to obtain the car.

No, I can pay a nominal (real money) fee to obtain the car. Polyphony have now put a real money figure on every car in the game. Being that I will spend real money to obtain said game, I'd love to know what that real money is purchasing, if not cars that are in the game.

The work you speak of no longer exists. The integrity, if you will, of A-Spec is gone. Every player used to have to go through it (some enjoyed it) so we accepted it as part of the game, part of Kaz's grand vision of how he wanted Gran Turismo to be played.

But if that idea has been sold out, and we can now (for a nominal fee) circumvent Gran Turismo tradition, I ask again, didn't I already pay for every car in the game?

 

[robbyf]

No, I can pay a nominal (real money) fee to obtain the car. Polyphony have now put a real money figure on every car in the game. Being that I will spend real money to obtain said game, I'd love to know what that real money is purchasing, if not cars that are in the game.

The work you speak of no longer exists. The integrity, if you will, of A-Spec is gone. Every player used to have to go through it (some enjoyed it) so we accepted it as part of the game, part of Kaz's grand vision of how he wanted Gran Turismo to be played.

But if that idea has been sold out, and we can now (for a nominal fee) circumvent Gran Turismo tradition, I ask again, didn't I already pay for every car in the game?

I think you nailed it.

 

[Tornado]

And it's no different to purchasing a DLC car.

You keep saying this. I'd like to see you actually justify it from the player's perspective rather than saying where the money goes or what PD spends it on shows that they are the same.


What new content are you acquiring when you pay to get in game credits, which you obviously get when you buy DLC? Because it seems to me that the only thing you're getting is an ability to partially bypass (individually) poor game design (since why would you buy it otherwise); with the added bonus that there is now less incentive to actually fix the problems related to it or provide new ideas akin to the ones made by Exorcet or whatever.

Fat chance seeing a free mode akin to PC simulators now where people can just drive what they want, because why implement it if they can instead get people to pay a little extra to sorta get the same thing functionally? Earlier in the thread you even asked directly how it's a ripoff to pay to get around grinding; so here's a counter question: Why would PD bother to correct the problems with grinding if you're willing to pay them to not fix it but just give you stuff to not have to do it?

 

[trustjab]

You've played GT6 to know it's design is poor? Thats the goto argument for the bash PD crowd. As if you know the payouts are inadequate thus forcing you to buy in game credits irl.

 

[SyzygyDarklock]

After reading your comment twice, I still have no idea how you got Street Fighter and Tekken at the end.

sorry, guess you didn't catch the reference... basically I don't want this in any way to resemble a "freemium" game where special parts such as ceramic brakes and other parts not normally available become practically a necessity to compete online pp/hp limits aside...

 

[TheeFrogmanlego]

I honestly don't see the problem with playing to gain cash.. I seldom play video games now because some dumb ass decided all content is best enjoyed from the get go.It ruins the fun in a game because there's fun in earning things. But in this Society were every ones a winner and were all equal things are becoming dull. Many people just don't have time and they will gladly pay that..

 

[SyzygyDarklock]

I don't mind engine swaps, as long as it becomes available to everyone... after all you can drop a Porsche 911 engine into a Kharmann Ghia in real life... Still don't ever want Gran Turismo to become a Forza clone and lose it's own personal touch... just keep the game balanced!!!

 

[GTboyz]

first GTA Online, now this. uggh

 

[Lawndart]

I just hope this is an afterthought and not baked into the design leading to credits being pinched i.e. earnings being halved to force use of this like a social game.

Alternately, this might mean dlc is free, forcing purchases in game, but again earnings would need to be painfully reduced to support this monitization strategy.

But I don't see this as a cheat at all as racing games are skill based anyway...

 

[TB]

Anyone want to continue with the off topic posts or can we discuss the topic at hand?

 

[trustjab]

The payouts can be seen on GT's website. Cofee break's also give credits. And can be played repeatedly per the site. So, there shouldn't be much issue with earning more credits in the game.

 

[Crumpet]

I quite like this cash for credit model, a lot of games have it today. Nothing better than being able to annihilate everybody at the start of the game simply by opening your wallet. And with purchasable money at hand, payouts we be reduced, meaning there may actually be some sense of accomplishment when playing through the career mode.

 

[CorvetteConquer]

I quite like this cash for credit model, a lot of games have it today. Nothing better than being able to annihilate everybody at the start of the game simply by opening your wallet. And with purchasable money at hand, payouts we be reduced, meaning there may actually be some sense of accomplishment when playing through the career mode.

My eyes. What have I read?!

 

[Tornado]

You've played GT6 to know it's design is poor?

Considering the hypothetical eran started the discussion with also assumed poor game design (specifically, either being forced to grind to advance through the game or paying extra money to get out of having to do so), and I was responding to him, yes.

Thats the goto argument for the bash PD crowd

The go-to argument to ignore the main point of any critical discussion regarding GT6 around here seems to be "So you've played GT6", so fair dos. Would you like to answer the question I asked of him regarding how paying for new content and paying to bypass restrictions of questionable good faith on existing content are the same thing just because the money goes the same place? Or the questions I posed regarding what incentive there is to make the game better by correcting potential flaws when there are people ready and willing to pay extra to ignore them?

As if you know the payouts are inadequate thus forcing you to buy in game credits irl.

I know that the car prices are the same, and I know what PD ultimately did in GT5 to make those prices easier to swallow rather than really fixing anything, and I used that knowledge to theorize the situations outlined above regarding what it could result in. Hence the edit of "(individually) poor game design" for clarification over the original "poor game design". I know, assuming assumptions and blah blah blah, but pointing out that I don't know how things will be doesn't amount to much when I was posing hypothetical questions in the first place.

 

[Dooblewasur]

To add my two pence, I am a bit disappointed by the fact that PD is doing this, however, they are free to do this and they certainly could be pouring this money into the game itself. If they did just that with the credit-cash, it'd be like a Kickstarter for improving the game...

 

[Intronium]

I guess PD learned from Drake
"Bu'ness is bu'ness it's strictly financial"

 

[eran0004]

No, I can pay a nominal (real money) fee to obtain the car.

Only if you don't want to work for it.

Polyphony have now put a real money figure on every car in the game.

Only if you don't want to work for it.

Being that I will spend real money to obtain said game, I'd love to know what that real money is purchasing, if not cars that are in the game.

You're purchasing credits without having to work for them.

The work you speak of no longer exists.

If you pay.

The integrity, if you will, of A-Spec is gone. Every player used to have to go through it (some enjoyed it) so we accepted it as part of the game, part of Kaz's grand vision of how he wanted Gran Turismo to be played.

But if that idea has been sold out, and we can now (for a nominal fee) circumvent Gran Turismo tradition, I ask again, didn't I already pay for every car in the game?

Buying credits will not get you cars, it will give you credits, without having to work for them.

 

[red ice]

i wish they would bring back credits earned in qualifying, like in GT1

 

[invetedevo]

Considering the hypothetical eran started the discussion with also assumed poor game design (specifically, either being forced to grind to advance through the game or paying extra money to get out of having to do so), and I was responding to him, yes.

The go-to argument to ignore the main point of any critical discussion regarding GT6 around here seems to be "So you've played GT6", so fair dos. Would you like to answer the question I asked of him regarding how paying for new content and paying to bypass restrictions of questionable good faith on existing content are the same thing just because the money goes the same place? Or the questions I posed regarding what incentive there is to make the game better by correcting potential flaws when there are people ready and willing to pay extra to ignore them?

I know that the car prices are the same, and I know what PD ultimately did in GT5 to make those prices easier to swallow rather than really fixing anything, and I used that knowledge to theorize the situations outlined above regarding what it could mean. Hence the edit of "(individually) poor game design" for clarification. I know, assuming assumptions and blah blah blah, but pointing out that I don't know how things will be doesn't amount to much when I was posing hypothetical questions in the first place.

I don't think it would be productive to jump to conclusions regarding the quality of GT6 and the A-Spec mode. You say that this might be a way for PD to bypass a potentially borked A-Spec mode but who honestly knows? I think you will have a valid point if all of this turns out to be true but until that day comes, why make such a big deal about it?

 

[eran0004]

You keep saying this. I'd like to see you actually justify it from the player's perspective rather than saying where the money goes or what PD spends it on shows that they are the same.

Justifying it is a no-brainer because it adds an option to obtain credits without having to spend a lot of time.

What new content are you acquiring when you pay to get in game credits, which you obviously get when you buy DLC? Because it seems to me that the only thing you're getting is an ability to partially bypass (individually) poor game design (since why would you buy it otherwise)

If you want new content, go buy DLC containing new content. No one is forcing you to buy credits against your own will. If the customer finds this deal attractive, he/she will get it.

; with the added bonus that there is now less incentive to actually fix the problems related to it or provide new ideas akin to the ones made by Exorcet or whatever.

I don't agree, because no matter how the career mode is constructed, there will always be a desire for credits. Either that, or there'll be no point having a credits system at all.

Fat chance seeing a free mode akin to PC simulators now where people can just drive what they want, because why implement it if they can instead get people to pay a little extra to sorta get the same thing functionally? Earlier in the thread you even asked directly how it's a ripoff to pay to get around grinding; so here's a counter question: Why would PD bother to correct the problems with grinding if you're willing to pay them to not fix it but just give you stuff to not have to do it?

So you don't want a credits system at all. You want everything for free. Fine. I don't see how this announcement changed anything in respect to that. There are still plenty of opportunities for PD to remove the credit system - when they so desire - and add other ways of raising funds, such as charging you for updates or requiring a subscription to play.

 

[slayer91]

I hope they're really expensive.

 

[Tornado]

Justifying it is a no-brainer because it adds an option to obtain credits without having to spend a lot of time.

A better game economy and progression system would do that too. Then everyone would benefit rather than the people who pay not to put up with the problems of the one there.

If you want new content, go buy DLC containing new content. No one is forcing you to buy credits against your own will. If the customer finds this deal attractive, he/she will get it.

I like how you didn't even pay lip service towards backing up your original assertion that I was specifically questioning.





I'm going to take that as meaning that you can't actually do so, so thanks for the clarification in any case.

I don't agree, because no matter how the career mode is constructed, there will always be a desire for credits. Either that, or there'll be no point having a credits system at all.

I see now it's boiled down to an all or nothing approach. Interesting.

So you don't want a credits system at all. You want everything for free. Fine.

Nope. I just want a balanced game economy without a bunch of random restrictions and poor design choices making it such a chore, as seen in the first four games; but can also see the reasoning given for others wanting such a mode even the meat and potatoes GT mode was done far better than GT5's was.

I don't see how this announcement changed anything in respect to that. There are still plenty of opportunities for PD to remove the credit system - when they so desire - and add other ways of raising funds, such as charging you for updates or requiring a subscription to play.

And I would have thought that the hundreds of millions of dollars in sales each GT game makes as the best selling Sony franchise by far (as well as the income from the actual DLC, which at least initially sold very well) would go pretty well towards funding the series. Silly me. Charging for updates would go over even better, I'm sure; particularly with PD's recent propensity to bite off far more than they can chew in terms of advertised features and then (usually) putting it in afterwards. Though GT7 is going to require a subscription by default as a PS7 game, so yay?

 

[Johnnypenso]

EDIT: Tree'd by @Tornado

 

[eran0004]

I just want a balanced game economy without a bunch of random restrictions and design choices making it such a chore, as seen in the first four games; but can also see the reasoning given for others wanting such a mode even if it was done far better than GT5's.

Assuming that there is a negative correlation between a balanced economy (whatever that is) and the ability to purchase credits.

 

[Tornado]

Who was the one who brought up the point that paying to get around credit grinding wasn't a ripoff, thus establishing the negative correlation in the first place that has defined this argument?

How is it ripping off to provide an option to grinding for cash?

Oh, right.