So......what are Sony and Yamauchi waiting for?

[Nattefrost]

You do realise that up until GT5 the GT series never featured any races with more than 6 cars on the track don't you?

But those were games on much less powerful hardware. Both Forza 2 and 3 are developed on a very powerful platform and still don't feature more than 8 cars. That's inexcusable. Meanwhile, the first GT game on similarly powerful hardware has up to 16 cars on a track.

While I wouldn't say it ruins the game, it's definately extremely disappointing Forza 3 doesn't have more cars on the track. It's more than possible on the system, that's the worst thing about it.

 

[m00ndancer]

Having racing with 25-35 cars on a regular basis (GRCC in rFactor) as Race control its a LOT more fun and complex to race a lot of cars. I even raced offline with 50 cars @ Spa in GTR2. So 8 cars is anemic, 16 is okish.

Eyecandy is nice but more cars makes the immersion factor even higher when racing. That said, both the 360 and PS3 probably don't have enough RAM and when I race in rFactor the game uses up to 1.3 GB of RAM to host all the textures and polygons before sending them to my graphics card with 512 MB RAM.

The thought about GT5 with 6 cars is a non issue since we already have 16 in GT5P.

 

[Earth]

Car count in race doesn't matter if there is a rabbit car followed by 14 drones and you

How many racing series in the world have more then 10 cars per race that have a chance to win? Not many

That's why I think car count is overrated. Yes, I have rFactor, GTR2, and NASCAR 2003 which allowed me to race up to 42 other drivers online, but in the end it was always you vs a handful of competitive cars

16 cars is just as good as 40 cars if all 16 cars are competitive. For example, in the Le Mans III endurance race in GT4 at times you would get a Ford GT40 in the race that couldn't complete a lap without crashing at least once! Sometimes you would even get a GT1 car which would be 30, 40 seconds off the pace

16 I can live with, but 8 is laughable this day and age. They could not increase the number onscreen because if they did they couldn't even sniff the graphics quality of GT5P.

Sad that the 360 has maxed out some time ago and is holding developers back

 

[JAGUAR1977]

REAL GT fans, like myself, can and will wait because we know it's going to be a HUGE game and will blow anything else out of the water. I've waited before, I'm waiting now, and I can wait some more.

'REAL GT fans' will also be excited for FORZA 3 and NFS Shift, if as a result GT5's sales drop below expectations, GT6 could receive budget cuts.

GT once had the market to itself, not anymore.

Nobody doubts the quality of GT5, same goes for the PS3, but just as the Xbox brand has slowly caught and now overtaken the PS brand this generation, there's an underestimation of the strides the Forza series is making.

IMO Sony and PD are damaging the GT brand and potential sales with their poor PR and marketing, yet I doubt this will really hit home until GT5 sales figures start coming in.

 

[Zer0]

IMO Sony and PD are damaging the GT brand and potential sales with their poor PR and marketing, yet I doubt this will really hit home until GT5 sales figures start coming in.

Gran Turismo 5 Prologue (North America) 760 2008/04/15
Gran Turismo 5 Prologue (Europe) 2,160 2008/03/28
Gran Turismo 5 Prologue (Asia) 100 2008/02/15
Gran Turismo 5 Prologue (Japan) 650 2007/12/13
*as of March 2009

= 3,670 and growing...

I don't get that alternative reality of Forza fans.

 

[Sureboss]

3.6 million sales of Prologue? That's pretty good going.

 

[Jay]

Apparently that doesn't include PSN store sales and those figures are over a year old. So clearly there is a demand.

 

[WolfRacer543]

REAL GT fans, like myself, can and will wait because we know it's going to be a HUGE game and will blow anything else out of the water. I've waited before, I'm waiting now, and I can wait some more.

That guy is going to cry when gt5 is comes and he sees how cool(hopefully) it is.

Hehe, he'll learn his lesson.

Unfortunately most of a games sales aren't the REAL GT fans They come from the casual fans who like the game and would buy it if it was actually out. Waiting may be fine for you, but for many people waiting that long isn't acceptable. They want to play a game and want to play it now, or at the very least have a date to look forward to.

To be honest, I know barely anyone with a PS3. Most people I know either have gaming PCs or Xbox360s or both, very few have PS3s, and none of my "close" friends have one.

 

[Hugo Boss]

Unfortunately most of a games sales aren't the REAL GT fans They come from the casual fans who like the game and would buy it if it was actually out. Waiting may be fine for you, but for many people waiting that long isn't acceptable. They want to play a game and want to play it now, or at the very least have a date to look forward to.

To be honest, I know barely anyone with a PS3. Most people I know either have gaming PCs or Xbox360s or both, very few have PS3s, and none of my "close" friends have one.

Can't imagine that the delay of GT5 is going to influence the sales figures significantly. Casual gamers will buy it anyway, since it will be one of the must haves for the PS3. They already got bored with GT4 in 2007 or so and moved on to play other games. They aren't waiting especially for GT5. The only players you might lose now are the less hardcore GT fans, who don't care about FM3 most likely being more arcade and will get hooked on all what FM3 has to offer. Don't think that will be a huge amount of players, though.

Also, you seem to associate with the wrong people

 

[CodeRedR51]

IMO Sony and PD are damaging the GT brand and potential sales with their poor PR and marketing, yet I doubt this will really hit home until GT5 sales figures start coming in.

Waiting may be fine for you, but for many people waiting that long isn't acceptable. They want to play a game and want to play it now, or at the very least have a date to look forward to.

Neither of you know what it takes to put together a game of this magnitude. You're used to the EA "game every year" schedule and if waiting the normal 3-4 years for a GT game is not ok with you, then go play your Forza. I will be renting NFS:Shift and maybe purchasing if I like it, but I will not be shelling out the cash for a 360 and Forza when I already know I will not like it. (I hated the first two)

To be honest, I know barely anyone with a PS3. Most people I know either have gaming PCs or Xbox360s or both, very few have PS3s, and none of my "close" friends have one.

Good for you, and that is relevant to this topic how?

 

[Tenacious D]

Just to bolster what Zer0 posted about Prologue sales, you can bet that the percentage of casual gamers who bought it are fairly low. And I would add, those figures are close to what FM2 sold in half the time. With all the hype and attention every little tidbit of GT5 news causes across the net, I'd say any "damage" Gran Turismo's reputation is suffering is very little, if any.

Just imagine the hits certain threads are going to get this next weekend.

Edit: also, this.

I figured with all the development time put into Forza 3 and all the hype surronding it, I thought for sure they would have upped the drivers per race. I was wrong! What kind of "next-gen" game can honestly be boasted about when it has less drivers online then Mario Kart Wii? They couldn't even manage to put more than 8 cars on the track offline. As a matter of fact, I do believe the Forza series has the dubious title of having the least number of cars per race for ANY next-gen licensed racing game.

This shocked me as well. I kidded the Froza fans that maybe in FM3 they could have nine cars per race finally, as I was sure they could finally have 12 car races as was promised in FM2. Evidently all the work T10 put into FM3 are in the car models - which this time had better look accurate - and tons of textured rocks on the trackside. FM3 is gonna look really thin compared to just about every other racer out there, except possibly ModNation Racers. I'm also wondering how many of these "100 tracks!" - thank God they quit calling them ribbons - are variations of the above ground sewer known as the Turn 10 Test Track. It's a decent track and all, but like SUfan I got sick of it in FM2 because they just couldn't get any more content in that 360 DVD7, and they used that damn thing WAY too much.

Another thing is their logo. It looks much more like FW3. Maybe they really were thinking of dropping car racing for the new game since the car count was looking so skimpy, and were gonna call it Froza Watersports 3.

 

[SUfan21]

I gotta say I agree with the dude who was saying he raced rFactor with 25-35 cars per race. You guys have no idea how exciting and immersive it is to be in a race with 22+ cars until you've tried it, especially Online. It is simply amazing. I've raced NASCAR games most throughout my gaming career, and I don't even bother with a game nowadays with less than maybe 14 cars. FM2's gameplay was absolutely horrendously boring with only 7 other cars to race, especially in longer races. If you raced on the Nurb, you may not see another car for the rest of the race. 16 is passable by my standards (its better than the 14 car Online races in NASCAR 09 that I'm used to) but I would much rather see them bump up the car count maybe 8-10 cars, even if graphics need to be toned down a bit. I sincerely hope they find a way to throw a few more cars on track for GT5, especially for Online! Cause lets face it, not to many legit racing series out there have 16 (or god forbid 8) car grids.

 

[WolfRacer543]

I gotta say I agree with the dude who was saying he raced rFactor with 25-35 cars per race. You guys have no idea how exciting and immersive it is to be in a race with 22+ cars until you've tried it, especially Online. It is simply amazing. I've raced NASCAR games most throughout my gaming career, and I don't even bother with a game nowadays with less than maybe 14 cars. FM2's gameplay was absolutely horrendously boring with only 7 other cars to race, especially in longer races. If you raced on the Nurb, you may not see another car for the rest of the race. 16 is passable by my standards (its better than the 14 car Online races in NASCAR 09 that I'm used to) but I would much rather see them bump up the car count maybe 8-10 cars, even if graphics need to be toned down a bit. I sincerely hope they find a way to throw a few more cars on track for GT5, especially for Online! Cause lets face it, not to many legit racing series out there have 16 (or god forbid 8) car grids.

I'd love to see 25+ cars in a race, but I think the current gen consoles would crap their pants trying to do it. In Live for Speed and also Simbin titles (GTR evo, RACE, GTR1/2) adding extra cars was one of the biggest performance hits.

 

[SUfan21]

I love GT5, and from my experiences with the game I think it could definitely handle 4 more cars. I think with the added development time since GT5, its not crazy to think that GT5 could have 20 cars, no more than that though. You're absolutely right though, these consoles most likely couldn't handle 25+ cars with GT's graphics

 

[Northstar]

I really don't see the need for 16, 8 or even 6 cars offline if they don't fix the A.I. All I remember is doing a 24hour race and having the field be separated by at least 2 laps each 7 hours into the thing. It seemed like all it was, was you 1-2 other good cars and the rest couldn't keep pace for the life of them.👎

However online they should have as many cars as you can get as the field is way more even and is competitive the whole field through.

 

[thesuperfunk]

I'd love to see 25+ cars in a race, but I think the current gen consoles would crap their pants trying to do it.

F1:CE did a pretty good job with 22 cars ... the extra pack numbers really do boost the thrill factor too!

 

[paskowitz]

I gotta say I agree with the dude who was saying he raced rFactor with 25-35 cars per race. You guys have no idea how exciting and immersive it is to be in a race with 22+ cars until you've tried it, especially Online. It is simply amazing. I've raced NASCAR games most throughout my gaming career, and I don't even bother with a game nowadays with less than maybe 14 cars. FM2's gameplay was absolutely horrendously boring with only 7 other cars to race, especially in longer races. If you raced on the Nurb, you may not see another car for the rest of the race. 16 is passable by my standards (its better than the 14 car Online races in NASCAR 09 that I'm used to) but I would much rather see them bump up the car count maybe 8-10 cars, even if graphics need to be toned down a bit. I sincerely hope they find a way to throw a few more cars on track for GT5, especially for Online! Cause lets face it, not to many legit racing series out there have 16 (or god forbid 8) car grids.

At one of my buds houses I played GTR2 with 49 other Ai cars at Le Mans (at 100fps). It was INSANE! Even at a huge track like Le Mans there were never less than 10 cars on screen at once. I really hate how boring GT4 and FM2 can get when you are going around the larger circuits and you do not see another car for like 6 laps. Thats not racing, its just a time trial mode.

 

[Tenacious D]

I really don't see the need for 16, 8 or even 6 cars offline if they don't fix the A.I.

They fixed the A.I.

It may not be as aggressive as some might want, but after the crashtards got bored, the people I raced online in the American servers drove remarkably like the bots in Prologue. And making the bots a bit more clever shouldn't be nearly the work needed to get them where they are now.

FM1 showed what happens when you make cars aggressive and leave the A.I. code too open ended. They can go crazy, rather like the bashers who get banned online.

 

[spike_eddy]

I played Forza 2 extensively & while 8 cars offline is a bit lacking it only really bothered me on the endurance races.
Online I often found that rooms that were full always seemed to contain an idiot or 2 so most often raced in a a room against another 4 or 5 decent players & that was far more enjoyable. Unfortunately the world is full of morons & more cars on track usually means more idiots. So I don't think 16 player online racing is a massive thing most racing games don't get full grids anyway.

 

[spike_eddy]

I played Forza 2 extensively & while 8 cars offline is a bit lacking it only really bothered me on the endurance races.
Online I often found that rooms that were full always seemed to contain an idiot or 2 so most often raced in a a room against another 4 or 5 decent players & that was far more enjoyable. Unfortunately the world is full of morons & more cars on track usually means more idiots. So I don't think 16 player online racing is a massive thing most racing games don't get full grids anyway.

That said, it just occurred to me maybe that's just the high percentage of 360 owners that are mouthy children. Looking to mess up everyone else's fun!
Perhaps there should actually be a PS3 price increase to keep down number of 10 year olds.

 

[BrainGow=Bairn]

That said, it just occurred to me maybe that's just the high percentage of 360 owners that are mouthy children. Looking to mess up everyone else's fun!
Perhaps there should actually be a PS3 price increase to keep down number of 10 year olds.

I've had plenty of races in both GT5P and forza 2.. both had a lot of crashers (some do it on purpose sadly) and idiots.
But the biggest difference was that i could actually hear the idiots on FM2, and no one in GT5P online.. so that might be it.

Anyway, im not racing a damned race online anymore without friends in it.. and/or a kick system but im 99% done with online racing now.
It will never work, it never did work.. you ALWAYS get idiots, crashers and people talking trash just to piss others off.
I'll stick to my time trials and career mode for now, thank you very much.

 

[spike_eddy]

I agree, I only play online now with friends. I'll take an overly aggressive AI to people 9 times out of 10. I do find it easier to make friends over xbox live though as a headset is bundled with the console whereby hardly anyone speaks on psn. I bought a headset when I bought World at War but it was pretty much a waste of money. Its a bit late now but I think Sony should start chucking a cheap one in.

 

[FoolKiller]

I'll take an overly aggressive AI to people 9 times out of 10.

Define overly aggressive AI. Ferrari Challenge and I are at odds at the moment.

 

[joebreeze]

RELEASE DATE 25 SEPT 2009?????

http://uk.gamespot.com/ps3/driving/granturismo52/index.html?tag=result;title;3

 

[Northstar]

We've covered that like 1,000,000 times, it's just a date they put there to get pre-orders.

 

[Jay]

just a date they put there to get pre-orders.

Gamespot sell games now?

 

[Mark T]

RELEASE DATE 25 SEPT 2009?????

http://uk.gamespot.com/ps3/driving/granturismo52/index.html?tag=result;title;3

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