(Spin) Problem Handling Cars list

[Stotty]

I don't know of course how PD are implementing their tyre physics but if I was to hazard a guess, I would say that the load sensitivity is a little too high, which is why there is a disproportionately large effect with MR cars that have a large rear weight bias.

I have exactly the same thought 👍

Once a tyre turns red, grip disappears very quickly and is not recoverable for all but the most skilled players - the grip drop off is very sudden, and there's little you can do to keep the car from spinning (or snapping back). That loss could be caused by weigh transfer induced oversteer in MR/RR cars or traction induced oversteer in any RWD car, but the tyre physics would seem to be the most likely culprit.

Personally, I prefer a well defined grip threshold as in GT5P, for example, vs the permanently sliding to some extent feeling in GT5, as I think it’s more realistic. Some of the techniques used to set the fastest laps in the various GT5 seasonal TT’s weren't in anyway realistic – you shouldn't be able to drift a MR car on the brakes at well over 100mph unless your very, very skilled, nor should you be able to ‘back’ a car on slicks in to a corner without losing some time.

But IMO, a little more progression once you’re over the grip threshold wouldn’t be a bad thing for the vast majority of players (including myself!) from an enjoyment point of view.

 

[mu22stang]

Increasing the grip of the tires, e.g. switching from a comfort to racing tires, can often make a car's nasty habits (lift-off oversteer, snap oversteer) more pronounced. It's also known that the GT series as of late fits "stock" tires that are definitely stickier than "realistic" tires. If we are going to complain about "broken" physics that don't represent the actual car's handling characteristics, perhaps we should begin by fitting the tires that more closely represent realistic levels of grip. A nasty lift-off oversteer MR/RR may begin to understeer more readily and oversteer more predictably...

 

[Ridox2JZGTE]

I posted this on another thread :

My take on GT6 tire compared to real life : comfort hard is similar to factory all season road tires ( AVID Ascend and Touring S ), comfort medium is similar to high performance road tires ( Yokohama Grand Prix M7, AVID Envigor ), comfort soft is similar to extreme performance summer tire that can be used on track day - very close to semi slick ( S Drive, Advan Sport V103 as factory fitted on 370Z -OEM , up to Advan Sport V105). Sports Hard, Medium and Soft tires will be similar to road legal track approved semi slick - sports soft similar to Advan Neova A048 DOT R, sports hard similar to Advan Neova LTS AD05/06, sports medium similar to Advan Neova AD08R.

I made a replica of Kei Office Zenki S14 Sivia - mild power bump at 260PS, I used comfort medium as it has YH GP M7, and it drives like a dream at Willow Springs.

With FF road cars - stock, I would go for comfort hard or medium for newer hot hatch. If the FF car has more power - mild tune, comfort soft is the 1st choice. Above 300HP for FF cars, I would recommend sports hard/medium.

The Toyota GT86, BRZ and FRS would have comfort hard when stock

I tend to use comfort tire on most non race cars up to 600PP or around 700HP. The MR cars with sports and racing tires would need better throttle and brake modulation.

 

[raduz77]

Worst handling car is lambo chrome(stock) cant stay on the road ,Aventador is ok.reventon terible too.Lambo GT 00 is ok.(all stock)1.01.

 

[iLex]

Or just say that the ones who complain about "broken" physics don't have skills to control those virtual cars.

Please read again.

 

[LVracerGT]

I can't believe this thread is still going. There are no broken cars people. Here's a guide for everyone who's having a problem driving any of the cars.

1. Stop complaining that cars are broken and take action to improve your own driving.
2. Buy a quality FFB steering wheel (already have one? go to step 3)
3. Research driving techniques. There are plenty of books and videos that teach you how to go fast.
4. PRACTICE. No one is Aryton Senna overnight.

Also, people need to stop comparing GT5 to GT6. They will not be comparable in lap times or driving feel. Is it really that hard to figure out?

 

[Stotty]

I posted this on another thread :

I don't know Advan as a brand - personally, I always considered the split between comfort softs and sports hards benchmarks as being the Michelin Pilot Super Sport and Super Sport Cup.

I do tend to like comfort tyres on untuned road cars as I find them nicer to drive on - more of a challenge, more emphasis on your throttle and brake control etc. However, I see no issue in people fitting SH tyres to any road car in tha game as it's one of the 1st upgrades you would naturally do if you were serious about tracking your car.

People fitting better tyres than Sports Hards however, and particularly soft slicks... I'd best not comment on that

 

[Vagabond]

I can't believe this thread is still going. There are no broken cars people. Here's a guide for everyone who's having a problem driving any of the cars....

Totally unnecessary and unhelpful attitude. I am prepared to acknowledge there is an issue with tyre/load behaviour and I don't think its my driving ; its because the behaviour of MR cars in particular is too knife edge. In many cases, the way you have to nurse a fast MR car results in its lap times ending up significantly slower than an FR car that in reality would have trouble keeping up.

 

[LVracerGT]

I don't nurse any of the MR cars and have no trouble keeping up with FR cars in them. I guess Mitch and I will have to start blowing this thread up with videos to prove to people there's nothing wrong with the cars.

The way the MR cars drive in this game is how they drive in real life. Just because you have to drive them differently than FR cars doesn't mean they're broken.

 

[Gerarghini]

I don't nurse any of the MR cars and have no trouble keeping up with FR cars in them. I guess Mitch and I will have to start blowing this thread up with videos to prove to people there's nothing wrong with the cars.

The way the MR cars drive in this game is how they drive in real life. Just because you have to drive them differently than FR cars doesn't mean they're broken.

So I guess spinning out at 1mph at a 6 degree corner is how they act in real life. (Over exaggerated I know)

Regardless I tried both the NOMAD Diable and R390 GT1 Race and they were pretty tame, spins out if you push it too hard, but tame nonetheless. So why these cars from the late '90s handle better than the R8 LMS from 2012 is not normal.

 

[LVracerGT]

So I guess spinning out at 1mph at a 6 degree corner is how they act in real life. (Over exaggerated I know)

Regardless I tried both the NOMAD Diable and R390 GT1 Race and they were pretty tame, spins out if you push it too hard, but tame nonetheless. So why these cars from the late '90s handle better than the R8 LMS from 2012 is not normal.

So it's impossible for a late 90's car to handle better than a new car?

I stated earlier that the R8 LMS was plagued by handling issues IRL that didn't get sorted until last year. When PD did the R8 LMS, Audi was still struggling with that car. It had the same handling flaw in GT5 unless you put a setup on the car that got rid of it.

 

[Sander 001]

Just for the record I'm not saying the physics are always busted. I'm saying that when unknown conditions are met, the physics simulation becomes defective, inconsistent.

I have no trouble with any McLarens I've tried, Ferrari 458, Enzo[well some understeer], Elise, NSX, Rocket, Dino, X-Bow, most of the Ford MR's, XJR13, Zonda R, Toyota 7 and probably more. The list of MR I have no issue with is much longer than the ones I do.

So if anybody's going to begin uploading youtube clips, make sure to begin with the Diablo GT2 with no upgrades other than Race Hard tires and try to complete some laps at High Speed Ring. I'd be very impressed with that.

 

[Ridox2JZGTE]

I don't know Advan as a brand - personally, I always considered the split between comfort softs and sports hards benchmarks as being the Michelin Pilot Super Sport and Super Sport Cup.

I do tend to like comfort tyres on untuned road cars as I find them nicer to drive on - more of a challenge, more emphasis on your throttle and brake control etc. However, I see no issue in people fitting SH tyres to any road car in tha game as it's one of the 1st upgrades you would naturally do if you were serious about tracking your car.

People fitting better tyres than Sports Hards however, and particularly soft slicks... I'd best not comment on that

Sports tire and racing tire are fine with me too, depends on the occasion and purpose I tuned my cars on comfort tires, and they always work with sports tire and higher. I made a replica tune Zeek MR2 GTS on comfort medium and soft, it needs precise throttle and braking, tested at Willows Spring - the long curves are perfect for testing MR cars, and heavy braking needs delicate modulation. I always blip the throttle on downshift, it may help with rear stability.

 

[Vagabond]

I don't nurse any of the MR cars and have no trouble keeping up with FR cars in them. I guess Mitch and I will have to start blowing this thread up with videos to prove to people there's nothing wrong with the cars.

The way the MR cars drive in this game is how they drive in real life. Just because you have to drive them differently than FR cars doesn't mean they're broken.

Did I say they were broken? When you're done parading your ego, I'd be interested to see a video of one of the named MR cars in your hands... and I mean totally stock, not tuned or with added parts or adjusted ballast or chassis improvement... or driver aids, although I suspect that you don't use them anyway. I can manage the problem myself, you know, I'm not a novice but that doesn't mean it isn't currently too extreme.

 

[LVracerGT]

Just for the record I'm not saying the physics are always busted. I'm saying that when unknown conditions are met, the physics simulation becomes defective, inconsistent.

I have no trouble with any McLarens I've tried, Ferrari 458, Enzo[well some understeer], Elise, NSX, Rocket, Dino, X-Bow, most of the Ford MR's, XJR13, Zonda R, Toyota 7 and probably more. The list of MR I have no issue with is much longer than the ones I do.

So if anybody's going to begin uploading youtube clips, make sure to begin with the Diablo GT2 with no upgrades other than Race Hard tires and try to complete some laps at High Speed Ring. I'd be very impressed with that.

I just talked to Mitch about getting some video's done if he has time today, if we can I'll get that combo done.

Did I say they were broken? When you're done parading your ego, I'd be interested to see a video of one of the named MR cars in your hands. I can manage the problem myself, you know, I'm not a novice but that doesn't mean it isn't currently too extreme.

Which car/track combo would you recommend? I'll try anything, and if I find something isn't quite right I'll be glad to come forward and say so. But I haven't had any issues thus far so I'm not expecting to.

Also, my ego has nothing to do with this discussion. I'm not the only person who isn't having any problems driving any of the cars. It's annoying when people come on this forum screaming XY and Z cars are broken who are only saying so because its different and hard to drive. Cars are hard to drive, it shouldn't be easy.

 

[Vagabond]

Which car/track combo would you recommend?

High speed tracks with high speed changes of direction, like Trial Mountain, Deep Forest Raceway and Apricot Hill are good testing grounds. And in real world tracks, Spa Francorchamps, Suzuka, La Sarthe. Use stock tyres too, then compare the difference with 2 grades higher.

 

[LVracerGT]

If you look back in the thread I did a 7:10.074 around the Nords in a completely stock Diablo GT street version with a couple mistakes pushing. I haven't tried it with SS tires (2 up from stock) But I don't see how it would make any difference besides more grip and a lower time.

I'll try a bunch of MR cars on some other tracks tonight.

 

[MOTORTRENDmitch]

We don't upgrade tires, we only drive stock everything for the most part.

Did I say they were broken? When you're done parading your ego, I'd be interested to see a video of one of the named MR cars in your hands... and I mean totally stock, not tuned or with added parts or adjusted ballast or chassis improvement... or driver aids, although I suspect that you don't use them anyway. I can manage the problem myself, you know, I'm not a novice buuut tihat doesn't mean it isn't currently too extreme.

I don't see anyone parading an ego, I see someone who actually knows how to drive, losing patience with someone that pretends they know. same thing happened on the GTR being nerfed thread - people said it wasn't as fast or grippy as it should be, LV has driven one on a track recently in real life and can assure that car is as good as it should be as well. None of these cars are broken, if you are spinning out at a low speed with hardly any input - that's on you.

 

[MrUnknown]

Please read again.

No one likes direct arguments...

 

[Vagabond]

I don't see anyone parading an ego, I see someone who actually knows how to drive, losing patience with someone that pretends they know.

I sincerely hope that comment wasn't aimed at me? If it was, you should pick your fights better. I've driven on many race tracks in real life, thank you, although admittedly not regularly for about 15 years... and in both Caterham 7s, Minis and a Honda NC30 bike. I'm no slouch in Gran Turismo either. I might be rusty in the real world but I know what's what behind the wheel... and driving ability is no subsitute for manners.

But I don't see how it would make any difference besides more grip and a lower time.

People have commented that stickier tyres compound the balance issue. I can't speak to that, I've only run stock so far.

 

[MOTORTRENDmitch]

I don't see anyone parading an ego, I see someone who actually knows how to drive, losing patience with someone that pretends they know. same thing happened on the GTR being nerfed thread - people said it wasn't as fast or grippy as it should be, LV has driven one on a track recently in real life and can assure that car is as good as it should be as well. None of these cars are broken, if you are spinning out at a low speed with hardly any input - that's on you.

I sincerely hope that comment wasn't aimed at me? If it was, you should pick your fights better. I've driven on many race tracks in real life, thank you, although admittedly not regularly for about 15 years... and in both Caterham 7s, Minis and a Honda NC30 bike. I'm no slouch in Gran Turismo either. I might be rusty in the real world but I know what's what behind the wheel... and driving ability is no subsitute for manners.

People have commented that stickier tyres compound the balance issue. I can't speak to that, I've only run stock so far.

It was aimed at anyone unable to drive, that are blaming it on "This broken game"

 

[ITCC_Andrew]

Unable to drive is a little harsh, Mitch. Don't attack them as being completely hopeless - they are able to drive, just not quickly or consistently as you.

 

[MOTORTRENDmitch]

Unable to drive is a little harsh, Mitch. Don't attack them as being completely hopeless - they are able to drive, just not quickly or consistently as you.

That isn't what I'm saying. I don't think he's slow. I'm saying it's not the game. I've driven all of these Satanic cars people are mentioning, none of which I've had any problem with. We aren't the CoD community. PD isn't going make cars easier to drive, because their fan base isn't ready for more intense physics. These cars all drive great. Yellow bird is the hardest thing I've driven on GT6, and rather than complaining about the tail happy characteristics - I was having a hell of a good time getting used to it and learning to be fast with it.

 

[ITCC_Andrew]

As far as shooters go, I enjoy playing Sniper Elite V2. The bullet physics are awesome. I like the challenge - same goes in GT6.


I understand your point, and agree with it, but please don't attack the players who are complaining about specific cars being difficult to drive... Don't say that they're incapable of driving.

 

[SavageEvil]

In real life we are required by law to get a license and take a test to ensure you are capable to drive a vehicle. You are required to pass tests and acquire licenses to drive specific types of race cars. Also when you walk into a Ferrari dealership you aren't just given the keys to test drive one of these cars unless you have money to cover any damage you may incur. Why is it in a game that aims to realistically reproduce how many of these cars handle people who can't control them immediately assume the game is somehow broken? Simply based on their experience in a past game, as if they forgot that the game itself evolves with each iteration and each succeeding effort aims to bring simulation closer to reality.

Try driving these cars by keeping the speed of the car below 100mph, use modulation of brakes and throttle to carefully turn corners all without flooring the throttle at any time. If you can discipline yourself enough to control the car at relatively normal speeds(real life speeds you'd actually go), then in the game you should be able to pick up the nuances of the cars at low speed. Gradually you'll come to understand each cars' personality and increase how fast you go and learn how to keep the car in line. Start out with something easy to control NSX '91 is an easy to control MR car and stock it's very controllable and low power. Learn to control your urge to go full blast, try to mimic how you would drive a real car since you won't need to worry about pushing the car.

Simulators are meant to teach you, it becomes useless if you expect the simulator to your whims. GT6 may not be the best Simulator but it's striving to be a good one, so if it makes all cars easy to drive how is that a good thing? There are odd things like Stock Cars being unable to tune left and right side suspension independently and no way to change the steering ratio yourself. Hopefully it will get there, but it's going in the right direction of showing that not all cars are for everyone. Super cars are the most dangerous vehicles on the road and it's bad when someone is given one and it has so much tech controlling the cars it fools the driver into thinking he is more capable than he actually is. Practice is the key to controlling the cars, learn the cars. I'm pretty sure if something is really wrong we'll together come across it but for now MR cars are definitely not broken in anyway. Some are just more finicky than others and a few have really fast steering lock speed.

 

[Youngun]

It is simple but people push to hard to fast spinout and blame the game, physics, car, tyres etc. i may be young but go on track days (driven R8, 430 and a few caterham) still never get probems with stock cars. If anything, i prefer the MRs because they track faster. Snap back and spinning is lack of control, and loss of grip is to much throttle on a high angle causing spin, dont cut power or it will snap, just drop it (i do the same with drifting - feather it) and if you go flat out round corner, you will spin eventually.

 

[iLex]

No one likes direct arguments...

You twisted my words or at the very best took them out of context. Since explaining myself would amount to pretty much the same post as the one you reacted to I decided to react in the way I did.
I have to admit the frustration of people generally not reading posts correctly played a part in my reaction.
If I was wrong about that with you I am sorry.

 

[Sander 001]

In real life we are required by law to get a license and take a test to ensure you are capable to drive a vehicle.

GT6 has license tests too, they're called license tests. So there goes that argument.
I'm up to International A and have golded every single one. Goodwood too, up to the Red Bull x1 and all coffee challenges and mission races. All gold.

 

[Vagabond]

OK... let's do a real comparison. F40, stock, S1 tyres @ Deep Forest Raceway, no aids except ABS 1. Lap times.... from as many people as want to give it a bash no matter their perceived skill level or what controller they're using.

I just did a 1'26.063 after 5 warm up laps. There is a lot more time there but it will take me considerably more laps to find the limit and have the confidence to push it. This isn't a competition as such, I am just intrigued as to how far the F40, which is about the hardest to manage I've come across so far, can be pushed with the current physics model.

By way of comparison, I did a 1'27.501 with a stock Aston Martin V8 Vantage (the huge tank like one) on the same tyres, also after 5 warm up laps.

 

[mistersafeway]

GT6 has license tests too, they're called license tests. So there goes that argument.
I'm up to International A and have golded every single one. Goodwood too, up to the Red Bull x1 and all coffee challenges and mission races. All gold.

They're all designed for beginners to complete, especially because most of what you mentioned has SRF forced on. It doesn't really mean much to get gold in an event now.