Standard cars in GT6?
- Thread starter MOTORTRENDmitch
- 519 comments
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- 11,223
- Sweden
- eran0004
Premium cars are obviously nicer, but it would be a shame to lose the huge library of cars that comes with the standards. I'm almost exclusively driving standard cars nowadays, partly because a lot of them belong to "my generation" (i.e. cars that were popular when I grew up) and partly because the variety is greater than in the premium range.
The fact that they're lower quality models does not bother me very much, but I do miss some functional aspects, like photo travel, reverse lights and high/low beams. As for the cockpit view, I often find the standard cockpits more functional than the premium cockpits, because you can clearly see the mirrors in the standard cockpits, while most of the premium cars have the mirrors partly obscured.
The fact that they're lower quality models does not bother me very much, but I do miss some functional aspects, like photo travel, reverse lights and high/low beams. As for the cockpit view, I often find the standard cockpits more functional than the premium cockpits, because you can clearly see the mirrors in the standard cockpits, while most of the premium cars have the mirrors partly obscured.
One of the many problems in GT5 is the lack of graphical consistency and overall quality. Quality should always come before quantity.
As much as I personally dislike seeing certain cars not making an appearance in the sequel, I won't be disappointed if only one fifth of the 800 standards were to be remodeled into premium quality. Especially if that were to mean that the game was consistent and the overall quality of the car models were to be on-par with current games.
As much as I personally dislike seeing certain cars not making an appearance in the sequel, I won't be disappointed if only one fifth of the 800 standards were to be remodeled into premium quality. Especially if that were to mean that the game was consistent and the overall quality of the car models were to be on-par with current games.
- 11,223
- Sweden
- eran0004
I don't see the lack of consistency as a problem. The quality of the standard cars does not make the quality of the premium cars worse, so I can't see how the quality issue makes much sense either. Sure it would if quality would be an average value of all models, but it isn't. If you don't want to drive standard cars, you don't have to. Sure, there are some events that you can't enter without them, but on the other hand, those events wouldn't be in the game if there weren't standard cars, so you're not really missing out on anything.
I never once said that it does.
I meant with my statement that the quality of models must be at a certain level of quality that is comparable to other current games. And also that quality of the models should not be separated between "standard" & "premium". They should all be of equal quality. Hence the consistency part. I'm not quite sure how to make more sense of my comment without causing more confusion.
You do make a point there, but I am sadly a completist, and so collecting all of the standard quality cars and completing all of the events is one thing I do intend to achieve someday.
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- 11,223
- Sweden
- eran0004
But then, why is lack of quality an issue then? The quality is there, in the premium models.
I meant with my statement that the quality of models must be at a certain overall medium. The quality of the models should not be separated between "standard & "premium". They should all be of equal quality. Hence the consistency part. I'm not quite sure how to make more sense of my comment without causing more confusion.
If the differences were too obvious, seeing both premiums and standards on track at the same time would possibly break the illusion, but from my point of view I think that the standards do have a high enough quality to make them look real during races. Even on replays, the quality differences are only noticeable in the close-up shots, and then it's usually the textures that stands out while the actual 3D models does a pretty good impression, definitely on par with other games of the current generation.
- 8,715
It did, that's why there are only 200 Premiums. The separation into tiers is sensible; you know what you're getting.
What you mean is that they shouldn't have carried over the older cars, because of aesthetic OCD? I would argue that consistency is important, and whilst the Premiums could be said to be internally consistent, and the Standards are also (arguably to a lesser degree), consistency is not to be taken at the detriment of other factors.
The alternative for you would presumably to have only had the Premiums, but that's not good enough for a lot of people who are attached to certain cars (this is a car game, after all). So including the Standards was supposed to be a way of ensuring that cars weren't missed, whilst those who didn't care for them could ignore them, as they are (/ were meant to be) clearly segregated.
PD could have implemented the Standards in a better way, and made it easier to separate them from people's games (a toggle switch, say), but this idea of quality over quantity being a way of dismissing the Standards is ludicrous - the Standards are there precisely because PD chose quality, not quantity. Back to consistency: too many people take "polish" as the sign of a good game, rather than the gameplay itself. Granted, GT5 is lacking in both areas, but I'd take a rough diamond over a polished turd any day, and wouldn't mind Standards returning (although I doubt they will) if the game (not it's visual sheen) was that much better. Appearances aren't everything.
Those specific events wouldn't but others would have been in their place. You said "so you're not really missing out on anything." as if whether you refuse to drive a standard car or if they didn't exist at all the GT Mode would be the same experience. It wouldn't be, if the standards didn't exist there would be other races to cater to the premium cars.
Polishing them is pointless and a waste of time, you know the old saying that you can't polish a turd and that's very true for standard cars. You can give them better textures, you can give them an interior, they're still basic, one piece models that need completely replacing sooner or later. Trying to polish them is just time wasted, time that a modeller could be spending on creating a premium model.
I expect them to have around 500 premium cars by the time GT6 launches but diversity is more important than pure numbers to me.
- 11,223
- Sweden
- eran0004
Those events would be just like any other event. With a limited selection of cars there's only a certain number of different events you can make. It would probably be something like a "Schwarzwald League A, B, C, D" etc. with different tuning levels, or more one-make races like the Gallardo cup. It's all cars that has been driven before, nothing new under the sun.
The FGT cup, the classic car races and the pick-up truck races are all different from the other events, that kind of unique events would not be possible to do if there weren't any standard cars. The only unique classes in the premium range in GT5 that hasn't got any special dedicated events are the electrics and the hybrids.
What if they had decided at an early stage to scrap the standards and therefore put more time into making some of the more unique standards in premium, such as the FGT? Obviously they did not and therefore decided that many cars would be fine as standard but that may not be how things would have gone in a current gen only game like GT3.
Also like I said GT3 only had 180 cars but 85 events, I'm sure push come to shove they could have thought of more unique events if they only had the premium cars.
Also like I said GT3 only had 180 cars but 85 events, I'm sure push come to shove they could have thought of more unique events if they only had the premium cars.
- 11,223
- Sweden
- eran0004
One unique car wouldn't be enough though. In order to have good events you need at least a handful of different cars (unless you want to do one-make races). And it's hard to take away the other cars, because if you lose too many of those there will be too few cars for other events.
In GT3, as far as I understand it, there were a lot of one-make events, a lot of events that were repeated between different leagues (like FF, FR, MR, 4WD events), I'm not so sure that would have been a very good strategy. There's no point in adding more events if they are similar to or the same as events that you have already done.
In GT3, as far as I understand it, there were a lot of one-make events, a lot of events that were repeated between different leagues (like FF, FR, MR, 4WD events), I'm not so sure that would have been a very good strategy. There's no point in adding more events if they are similar to or the same as events that you have already done.
All I'm saying is that in a hypothetical world where PD decided at an early stage they wouldn't include standards it's highly likely a lot of the standards that are required to complete certain events in GT5 would have been made in a premium model.
We'll never know of course.
We'll never know of course.
- 422
- Eastern MA
- Odin_Wednesday
Upscaled from 1280x1080.
- 422
- Eastern MA
- Odin_Wednesday
Got it. Better than 720p, but not full resolution.
Scaff
Moderator
- 29,462
- He/Him
- ScaffUK
I disagree, I personally found GT3 to be more enjoyable than GT5 in regards of the events, and a good mix of events has never been an issue in just about any other racing/driving game, all of which have a much lower car count than GT5.
GT5 (and to a degree the entire series) has an issue with balance on the car list and for me if the continue to lean on the crutch of standard cars its unlikely to be addressed in the next title.
I for one do not want to see a split between standard and premium cars in the next title (which in all honesty is going to have to fix a lot to see me buying it - particularly if its on the PS4).
- 5,761
- USA
- TPC_Raccooon23
- CRaccoon23
I agree. GT3's career was very addicting to me and runs circles around GT5's.
GT3 has more endurance races and way more championship events. And in GT3 the races got longer as you moved up. 3 lap races in Beginner league, 5 in Amateur, and 10 in Professional, where pit strategy got involved. GT5 on the other hand is just stagnant. It just frustrates me how PD refused to take advantage of the 1000+ cars in this game to give us huge A-spec/B-spec modes.
- 8,715
It's a nice thought, but I don't think it holds any water. The idea was that the Standards were not to be relied upon, as a crutch, as Scaff put it, so the lack of variety should have nothing to do with the Standards, purely going by what Kaz / PD has said.
To clarify: the fact that we were not meant to have to touch the Standards to get through the game means that PD should have treated the game as though it only contained the Premiums, and therefore this variety you speak of should have been present anyway.
However, as it turned out, you still needed (well, actually you didn't, but gamer OCD) to use Standards, but the variety inherent in the Standard roster isn't fully exploited in the game, either. It's as if they started out ignoring the Standards, and then ran out of ideas, or something. It just seems that the game structure wasn't really planned in advance; it's so poor in comparison to previous games, that it must have been thrown together at the last minute, for whatever reason (maybe the backlash of the unveiling of the Standards' inclusion, telegraphed though it was, caused them to remove most of the related events they'd already made?).
It's not like an "event" takes anywhere near the time to prepare for the game that a car does, so I'd suspect that they were never likely to be fitting the car list to the event list, rather the other way around. The inclusion of an event generator, whilst generic, would have helped; that could have been periodically evolved and updated after the game had been released, but hindsight...
Of course you can continue to use the Standards as your scapegoat; I still blame the Premiums (they just took too long to make), as much as I like both classes.
- 2,012
Of course you can continue to use the Standards as your scapegoat; I still blame the Premiums (they just took too long to make), as much as I like both classes.
Premiums are nowadays' standards. Focus had to be there.
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