"Standards" the good, the bad and the ugly

[TokoTurismo]

Still can't believe they put these low quality cars in GT5 and 6.So you telling me that the team looked at this and was like "yea this looks good and nobody won't notice, also we can put these low quality cars on the ps4 as well even though the competition is taking the quality over quantity approach." I hope Kaz change his mind about putting standards in GT7 which is going to be on PS4.

Standard cars from ps2 on ps4 would be madness

Even the casuals will be disgusted. They'll want GT7's graphics similar to Driveclub's, but quality is more/just as important when it comes to racing games, thus PD HAS to scrap all those PS2 ports if they want to prevent from getting themselves shot down and ripped apart by angry fans.

It be crazy for some to say they wouldn't want quality similar to these examples in my box of goodies.

Spoiler

Wouldn't you agree that these are the most beautiful looking models you want GT7's cars to look as well, even if that means cutting the car list down to gain this kind of quality?

 

[Andefir]

Mercedes-Benz CLK Touring Car '00
GT5 standard /GT6 simi-premium
Monza
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Fuji
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Links to all comparison shots in this thread >>>

This is my favourite touring car in GT. So glad they improved it.

 

[GTPVenomZombie]

Even the casuals will be disgusted. They'll want GT7's graphics similar to Driveclub's, but quality is more/just as important when it comes to racing games, thus PD HAS to scrap all those PS2 ports if they want to prevent from getting themselves shot down and ripped apart by angry fans.

It be crazy for some to say they wouldn't want quality similar to these examples in my box of goodies.

Spoiler

Wouldn't you agree that these are the most beautiful looking models you want GT7's cars to look as well, even if that means cutting the car list down to gain this kind of quality?

Maybe that is the reason GT7 wont be out for another couple of years. Or maybe more, and people are complaining about it. The thing that gets me is, the sooner we get GT7, the more rushed it will feel. Just like how GT6 was released, it had half the stuff that it has in now. If you know what I mean.

 

[TokoTurismo]

Maybe that is the reason GT7 wont be out for another couple of years. Or maybe more, and people are complaining about it. The thing that gets me is, the sooner we get GT7, the more rushed it will feel. Just like how GT6 was released, it had half the stuff that it has in now. If you know what I mean.

You are indeed right about that Vemon. Although, the longer GT7 takes to develop, it may end up with the same result like GT5 had with its 5 year development. I think the problem just lies in PD. :\

 

[dr_slump]

The thing that gets me is, the sooner we get GT7, the more rushed it will feel. Just like how GT6 was released, it had half the stuff that it has in now.

At this point, you can't possibly know wether GT7 will be a rushed product or not and you also can't know if the situation with GT6 and all its promised additional content will repeat itself.

 

[HDT Commodore]

WHAT do PD DO with their TIME!? Since GT4, they make a game that's fresh and has heaps of brand new content, it takes them years, they make a game in a short time period, it's EXACTLY the same as the LAST!

Is this an average day at PD HQ?

 

[GTPVenomZombie]

At this point, you can't possibly know wether GT7 will be a rushed product or not and you also can't know if the situation with GT6 and all its promised additional content will repeat itself.

I never said I did know. All I said was, if it was released any sooner it could have a rushed feeling to it just like how GT6 felt when it was released. It didn't feel like a full game. I know it had promised content, but it doesn't change the way I feel about the game when it was first released. But I`m not thinking negative towards GT7 being released soon. (If it was). I`m just saying the possibilities being released soon.

 

[Griffith500]

Laughable really.....

Well, no. Not really. It's pretty clever, in actuality.

The ends of the exhausts have large polygons attached to them that well overlap the "diameter" of the exhaust. Mapped to that is a texture that, with clever use of transparency, gives the impression of a round tip, as opposed to the hexagonal cross-section that the pipe actually has in the model - so it looks more detailed than it actually is.

Most of the so-called "jaggies" on Standards are really the result of these low-res, 1-bit (opaque or transparent, no shades in between) alpha-mapped textures, which weren't as much of an issue on the earlier consoles because of the lower screen resolution. (The Premium cars have similar issues with texture resolution that need to be addressed, if it isn't already in hand, for the PS4).



The problem is that the models were never designed with the dynamic dirt mapping in mind. To go through them all and make these specific, tiny changes instead of expending all effort making new models is a waste of time - as would developing a new shader just for them be. Since PD had evidently elected to model other cars to Premium standard "first", the only option was to remove that car outright, or keep it in as-is, flaws and all.

A little understanding goes a long way. And I don't think I need to tell you how much I want that particular car in Premium form.

 

[GTPorsche]

Driving the Toyota 7 just now I noticed there is no animation for shifting. I don't know if it's just that car that has no shift animation but that seems like something that shouldn't have been forgotten.

 

[Prenny]

Driving the Toyota 7 just now I noticed there is no animation for shifting. I don't know if it's just that car that has no shift animation but that seems like something that shouldn't have been forgotten.

Every standard car don't have shifting animations, even the ones with interior, Vision Gran Turismo Cars don't have interior but you can see the driver's hands pushing the paddle shifters, it is a proof that VGT cars are Premium cars.

 

[UnkaD]

Every standard car don't have shifting animations, even the ones with interior, Vision Gran Turismo Cars don't have interior but you can see the driver's hands pushing the paddle shifters, it is a proof that VGT cars are Premium cars.

Sorry for the quick off-topic, but that is a magnificent profile image you have.
Anyway, something something standards... If they just do the semi-premium treatment on the outsides like they have for the RUFs and some other cars, I'll be happy enough and won't mind the missing interiors.

 

[AleksandarSRB]

Sorry for the quick off-topic, but that is a magnificent profile image you have.
Anyway, something something standards... If they just do the semi-premium treatment on the outsides like they have for the RUFs and some other cars, I'll be happy enough and won't mind the missing interiors.

That's am talking here more than year... For GT7 that would be enough and than for GT8 make interiors...

 

[nocturnalgrey]

Even the casuals will be disgusted. They'll want GT7's graphics similar to Driveclub's, but quality is more/just as important when it comes to racing games, thus PD HAS to scrap all those PS2 ports if they want to prevent from getting themselves shot down and ripped apart by angry fans.

You do make an interesting point. I do not know what GT6's sales are exactly, but the sixth version of the series is by far the worst selling entry of the franchise. I have to believe that part of the reason is due to the Standard Cars.

 

[GTPorsche]

You do make an interesting point. I do not know what GT6's sales are exactly, but the sixth version of the series is by far the worst selling entry of the franchise. I have to believe that part of the reason is due to the Standard Cars.

Most of the reason is it releasing after the PS4 had hit the market.

 

[MidFieldMaven]

I highly doubt standards will port directly over to GT7 without at LEAST looking as good as GT6 premiums on the exterior.

 

[GTPorsche]

Yeah, if they remain standards, they need to be heavily cleaned up and improved if they don't get the full treatment. I'm ok with not having fully modeled interiors. I'm not ok with the low-res details.

 

[Prenny]

No way low quality models will appear in a next-gen game, i agree, just give the Standards a high quality exterior, disable the interior camera again and don't separate Standards and Premiums, i think most people here won't mind having cars without interior.

Sorry for the quick off-topic, but that is a magnificent profile image you have.

Thanks


(Edit: It would be an nice idea if they ''premiumize'' the standards with interior like the Pescarolo, Prowler, Chaparral 2J, Jay Leno's Tank Car, BMW V12 and ect)

 

[MidFieldMaven]

I only use the cockpit view when recording replays using Premium cars. Very rarely do I cruise on a track in cockpit view with the HUD disabled. I could do without interiors entirely.

 

[Lubeify100]

If it meant making more cars exteriors look better with the sacrifice of having black interiors still then im all for it

 

[SVX]

You could do without interiors. It's rather selfish to say that interiors aren't needed in GT7 if you don't use them. I for one do use them, along with many others, so they are a needed thing.

 

[SlipZtrEm]

You could do without interiors. It's rather selfish to say that interiors aren't needed in GT7 if you don't use them. I for one do use them, along with many others, so they are a needed thing.

In addition to this, I'm fine saying it: Photomode is supremely popular. If PD wants to peddle the "We Love Cars" schtick - and they should, because cultivating a new generation of open-minded auto enthusiasts is hardly a bad thing - then simply driving around a track is only one aspect. Exploring the car in detail is another.

 

[Cowboy]

Looked through the dealerships today and I noticed that the '69 Bluebird looks somewhat semi-premium.

 

[TonyJZX]

Yeh the 510 looks great but why did they slack off on the number plates?

 

[HDT Commodore]

In many places texture seem to let cars down. I think a lot of models wouldn't look anywhere near as bad if textures were redone. The thing about that which annoys me is that fans could do it. I could even do it. Even if they're not premium quality, anyone could do a better job than the rot hanging off some of the standard models. GT is another thing that I wish was open source; or even just more modifiability. Minecraft for example is still successful as a paid game, but also incorporates a huge amount of malleability on the end-user's part.

 

[05XR8]

I had a look at the Mitsubishi GTO Twin Turbos this evening and those look Semi-Premium as well.

 

[Andefir]

Mitsubishi FTO GPX '94
GT5 Standard /GT6 updated Standard

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Links to all comparison shots in this thread >>>

I found out the FTO also has a carbon bonnet available. Something most detailed standards don't have very often.

 

[Cowboy]

I found out the FTO also has a carbon bonnet available. Something most detailed standards don't have very often.

The 106 has the carbon hood option too.

 

[Andefir]

The 106 has the carbon hood option too.

nice. had one but never checked to see if it did. mainly because it hasn't really been updated. atleast it doesn't look like it was.

 

[Griffith500]

Yeh the 510 looks great but why did they slack off on the number plates?

My guess is it's because they got parts of it remodeled in time to make the cut, but didn't get around to the textures before then. Most of the "semi-premiums" are incomplete in this manner, one way or the other.

In many places texture seem to let cars down. I think a lot of models wouldn't look anywhere near as bad if textures were redone. The thing about that which annoys me is that fans could do it. I could even do it. Even if they're not premium quality, anyone could do a better job than the rot hanging off some of the standard models. GT is another thing that I wish was open source; or even just more modifiability. Minecraft for example is still successful as a paid game, but also incorporates a huge amount of malleability on the end-user's part.

The texturing isn't your usual single-canvas type affair, it's all very bitty and mapped using lots of transparency tricks, and on the Premium cars there are materials shaders to worry about, too.

Opening it up to the community would lead to demands to make the textures more like those editable from PC sims, but that just isn't compatible with the overall asset design paradigm PD has been using since the PS2. So half of the results will be terrible, and most people will complain about PD making life difficult, or about the lack of flexibility on which parts of the car are editable. Not worth it.

On the other hand, the bitty nature of the mapping means things like logos and number plates and headlights and so on might be more easily "fixed" in isolation. That's assuming the mapping holds up with the changes, because re-mapping effectively means editing the model, and that ain't gonna happen.

But, further, since these semi premiums appear to be works in progress, and any texture changes will be broken by model changes (unless the map is redone to be backwards compatible, which may obstruct any planned improvements in the texture coverage etc.), it just seems like a total waste of effort because none of that is circumventable without the community effectively being included in PD's internal communication, support etc. And PD may as well just hire people in that case; which they have done.

 

[HDT Commodore]

Really? I though that PS2 GT textures were single sheets plus an alpha layer. Because in GT3 we were able to edit the textures and reapply them to vehicles. In GT4, I remember we ripped them, and I thought that the main layer was just a single sheet image file. (Of course, I expected premiums to be different.)