Super GT Thread ArchiveTouring Cars

[Bo]

You take the chance when it crops up mate. Moving in response to another cars move is against the FIA rules. This my not apply to a national series.

You can move the line of your car to a defensive line but you can't move a second time and you must leave at least one cars width no matter what. Again, this might be F1 only, but it won't take long before it becomes de-facto in every series.

The Lexus didn't do anything wrong. The ARTA car made a block & didn't leave enough space on the inside.

Anyone suggesting that the lexus could somehow magically change its line at that point has probably been playing NFS Shift. You can't do this when you are that close to another car.

The Lexus got a drive through penalty so clearly GTA thought they did something wrong but not much because if they thought the Lexus was solely responsible for the incident that made another car crash like that the punishment would have been much worse.

It was a bad move in two key ways for me:
Firstly, it was clear that Bandoh was drafting. If you are drafting and following a car that closely, you need to be ready for any movement from the car in front. Secondly, trying up the inside is asking for trouble in that situation. Ralph made one move, so it was clear he would hold the inside into turn one. If the Bandoh car were to try the inside there, he would be half on the grass and would have caused quite the accident at turn 1. There was well enough space on the outside, so that would have been the right line to take.

 

[Tired Tyres]

He could not go anywhere else. He was too close to change his line. What part of this don't you understand. That is why the ARTA car is partially responsible for its own fate.

 

[Bo]

He could not go anywhere else. He was too close to change his line. What part of this don't you understand. That is why the ARTA car is partially responsible for its own fate.

Please calm down a bit. I understand everything, and the Bandoh car made two fatal errors. What was he going to do up the inside on turn 1 apart from catch the grass and cause a crash? As a racing driver, you need to make the best choice for an overtake. He should have known that pushing it up the inside was only going to cause trouble, it's completely unnecessarily risky.

At this point, the Bandoh car could see Ralph moving over to line up for turn 1. It was perfectly legal. The Bandoh car should have flicked to the outside, because the only way it would ever end up by pushing it up the inside of a corner is a crash. Racing cars have quick steering, so he could have flicked it to the outside very easily. It's been done a million times very safely. He forgot that a) he doesn't have the right to stay on full throttle as he touches another car, and b) he has the option of steering and brakes.

 

[Tired Tyres]

If he had somehow been able to turn left, and he couldn't, (this isn't a video game with impossible tyre grip) he would have put the ARTA car into the wall on the right.

We are NEVER going to agree about this.

In my opinion Firman breaks rule 20.4.

Here. http://argent.fia.com/web/fia-public.nsf/FE4C9612DB18AD8BC125797B00344B65/$FILE/1-2012 SPORTING REGULATIONS 07-12-2011.pdf

 

[LancerEvo7]

Although I disagree that he couldn't have gone back left, there are still many ways for him to avoid causing a crash. He could've let off the gas instead of running up the ARTA's back bumper.

 

[IforceV8]

Although I disagree that he couldn't have gone back left, there are still many ways for him to avoid causing a crash. He could've let off the gas instead of running up the ARTA's back bumper.

So in your mind the lead car has the right to do whatever he wants?

 

[LancerEvo7]

I'm saying you should do everything you can to avoid an accident. I'd personally say both drivers are equally at fault in this case.

 

[Panoz]

My two cents on the ARTA and WedsSport incident.

At 1:25:19 in the video, both cars are pretty such nose to tail with the Lamborghini on the outside edge of the track. That takes away the WedsSport's opportunity to pass on the ARTA's left. Then the ARTA started to move over to the center of the track in my guess to make the Weds take a outside line going to turn 1.

Problem is the Weds had a better run out of the previous turn and already committed on passing on the ARTA's right.

I like to say its a racing accident but both drivers have some blame on for it, the ARTA's attempted block and the contact by the WedsSports for sending the ARTA into the wall.

 

[Müle]

If there wasn't two changes in direction, it was fine. They're the rules outlined.

No, you don't understand.

The front car (Will Power) moved down the track in reaction to the behind car moving down to attempt to pass. The result was the behind car suffering a broken front wing. The front car made only 1 move, but that 1 move was a block that ruined the behind cars race. If you think that's "fine," then don't even bother replying again because I'll just put you on my ignore list.

This incident is the exact same, except it was the front car that got his race ruined.

 

[Mac K]

Love this..

 

[Bo]

No, you don't understand.

The front car (Will Power) moved down the track in reaction to the behind car moving down to attempt to pass. The result was the behind car suffering a broken front wing. The front car made only 1 move, but that 1 move was a block that ruined the behind cars race. If you think that's "fine," then don't even bother replying again because I'll just put you on my ignore list.

This incident is the exact same, except it was the front car that got his race ruined.

I didn't know his wing got clipped, so that is dirty. This is not comparable to the ARTA crash though because the move took place with some space between the two cars. Can we agree to disagree on the subject?

So in your mind the lead car has the right to do whatever he wants?

In defending his positions, he made one legal move, so he had the right to position his car in that manner. Weaving would be dirty.

Although I disagree that he couldn't have gone back left, there are still many ways for him to avoid causing a crash. He could've let off the gas instead of running up the ARTA's back bumper.

Pretty much what I was going for the whole time. He has two things at his disposal - steering and brakes. You can't make contact and then stay full throttle on the back of him, that's a deliberate move to take another driver out the race. Mainly though, and I don't think I touched on it last night, it's the thought process of the Bandoh driver I don't get. If you come out of the corner, you are nowhere near the back of him, this is what you should think:

I'm going to draft him here, so I need to make sure I can flick the car to a set line for turn 1.

There's a GT300 up above, he'll need to avoid it, so whatever way he moves i'll do the opposite to make it as clean as possible.

He was far back enough to change direction as Ralph started to move to his inside line, so it was basically one bad judgement to another.

Back on topic now, we're derailing the thread a little.

 

[Müle]

You're missing the point. I'm done trying to explain it because I already have multiple times. Welcome to the ignore list.

 

[Bo]

You're missing the point. I'm done trying to explain it because I already have multiple times. Welcome to the ignore list.

I said we can agree to disagree on the subject. I understand what you're saying, just want you to know that people can have a differing view on one subject without having to go on the ignore list.

 

[Third Reign]

Seeing your comments on the BTCC thread as what you find "exciting" in racing, I can see you point of view on the matter. But for most drivers who value racing etiquette, BTCC and the move from Firman are dirty racing.

 

[Furinkazen]

You're missing the point. I'm done trying to explain it because I already have multiple times. Welcome to the ignore list.

Seeing your comments on the BTCC thread as what you find "exciting" in racing, I can see you point of view on the matter. But for most drivers who value racing etiquette, BTCC and the move from Firman are dirty racing.

One block is usually permitted. ARTA moved to cover inside and took nose off the Wedssport machine. The move was legal but the Lexus was closer than perhaps ARTA realised. These cars have no mirrors remember. Just a tv screen.

Also BTCC usually isn't dirty.

 

[Bo]

@Third Reign Believe me, i'm not lobbying for crashes if that's what you think . I just like close racing.

 

[Müle]

The move was legal

No it wasn't.

 

[Furinkazen]

No it wasn't.

If Wedssport had been what half a car length further behind, no, a quarter, the Weds driver best bet would be pull out to middle. You are allowed one block. Also Arta had to come off line the first place to avoid the GT300.

 

[Bo]

If Wedssport had been what half a car length further behind, no, a quarter, the Weds driver best bet would be pull out to middle. You are allowed one block. Also Arta had to come off line the first place to avoid the GT300.

The guy is now ignoring me because I pushed that argument, so you'd better to quit while you're ahead!

 

[Tired Tyres]

You are not ahead. Neither is he. You are both adamant that your view is right.

You are, of course, both wrong. My view is right.

You can block, but only one move and not too late. ARTA was too late. That is what caused the accident.

It would be really funny if we had been the three Stewards at the race deciding who did what.

 

[Bo]

You are not ahead. Neither is he. You are both adamant that your view is right.

You are, of course, both wrong. My view is right.

You can block, but only one move and not too late. ARTA was too late. That is what caused the accident.

I think we can all agree that there were several dodgy actions which caused the incident.

 

[RACECAR]

It would be really funny if we had been the three Stewards at the race deciding who did what.

That would take a long while.

 

[SuperShouden]

So, for GT6, we just need the new GT500 cars and one could have a Super GT series. All the GT300 cars are there.

 

[Bo]

All the GT300 cars are there.

They have one current GT300 car in the game, with GT3's technically four more, but that's still not proper liveries and restricted power. It's not good enough.

 

[Tired Tyres]

So, for GT6, we just need the new GT500 cars and one could have a Super GT series. All the GT300 cars are there.

No they are not. CR-Z GT300, Ferrari 458 GT3, Aston Martin Vantage GT3 and McLaren MP4/12C GT3 are missing.

 

[Appie]

Looking forward to the new cars in 2014

 

[SuperShouden]

No they are not. CR-Z GT300, Ferrari 458 GT3, Aston Martin Vantage GT3 and McLaren MP4/12C GT3 are missing.

The Wiki only lists the Z4 GT3, BR-Z and SLS GT3 for the 2014 season.

 

[Bo]

The Wiki only lists the Z4 GT3, BR-Z and SLS GT3 for the 2014 season.

That is four confirmed teams of about twenty teams. By your logic, ARTA, Mugen, Cars Tokai Dream28, Team Mach, Dijon and JLOC would have all magically disappeared or changed to one of those three cars for absolutely no reason.

 

[sumbrownkid]

What do they do with all the old cars? Sell them to private collectors or return them to the manufacturers?

And getting these GT500 machines in the first place, are they purchased outright or are they leased?

 

[Bo]

What do they do with all the old cars? Sell them to private collectors or return them to the manufacturers?

And getting these GT500 machines in the first place, are they purchased outright or are they leased?

I saw an article about someone who bought the UNISIA JECS Silvia, but they thought it was just a track tuned S15. When they got it delivered, Nissan sent some people round to remove all the sponsors from the car. I think the manufacturers snap up the important championship winning cars for their collections, but the other cars are simply sold on privately.