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  • Thread starter GhostZ
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The__Ghost__Z
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About:
I may not be a drifting team per say, but I'm online often and have lots of knowledge of the drift teams currently, and I've been drifting for a long, long time. I do not compete anymore (that was my old account) but I still observe and test a lot. I wrote The Purest Drifting Experience (which can be found below) and I use exclusively a '71 HS30 240ZG that has been meticulously tuned into what I consider the best overall drift car on GT5. For higher power applications, I use a NISMO Nissan 350Z S-Tune, but rarely.

The purpose of this entire account here is to test and practice refined and unexplored drift techniques that are ignored or overlooked in drift competitions or open lobbys, or better yet, are prohibitively difficult to do.

I'll be keeping a log of the nights I drift and any notable things that happen, and when/if I schedule a meet or have an open room. In short, an organized thread just like any other drifting team would have, but for my own specific study and experiment of the art.

The Purest Drifting Experience:
Part 1 - On the nature and purposes of Drifting
Part 2: Precision - More complex factors in drift physics
Part 3: Weapons - Novice Drift Initiation Techniques
Part 4: High Caliber Weapons Advanced Drift Initiation Techniques
Part 5: Mid-Corner Drift Physics - Executing a drift at a speed and angle.
Part 6: Math and Comparative Tuning - Tuning drift cars in relation to eachother
Part 7: Beyond Competition - An Ending Note
 
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Good luck with the idea! I'm sure we'll meet somewhere along the line, if not me then my teammates anyway.
 
This sounds good you On uk time?

US time. But that doesn't say much about my drifting schedule. Ghosts don't sleep.

11/18, Morning:

Spent about 20 minutes this morning tuning a RUF RGT. I call it "The Pendulum" for how its heavy rear weight swings during transitions. While a beautiful car, I was surprised at how highly underpowered it is compared to the 240ZG. Its certainly fast around corners and a course, but just doesn't have the torque necessary for optimal drifting. Perhaps a lower mileage example would be better.

At any rate, after some testing and browsing some lobbies this morning, I got to do some fantastic tandems with Nissan_G-I-Z-M-O in his white Camaro SS. Very good, and got a consistent 1-2ft gap between us up and down Suzuka East. This Porsche is particularly fast in low angles, (viciously so, able to lap Tsukuba with drifting on every corner 5 seconds faster than my Z!!! Though not nearly as consistently) but can be a little hard to manage the rebound from high angles (hence the name) but I am satisfied with it.

It feels rather dirty to use though, because its so much faster than my Z that I can make mistakes and still make up distance in the tandem, unlike my Z which has to corner perfectly to tandem well. It's similar to an S2000 and a Ferrari in how it drifts.

It's a quick (20-30 min) tune, but try it out for yourself if you want.

RUF RGT
531 HP
360 Ft/Lbs
1220 kg
33,000 Km
Full upgrades, no chassis reinforcement
Ballast: 50, set -50
Ride Height: 15/15 (as in +15, not -15)
Spring Rates: 9.0/11.6
Damp. Ext.: 6/4
Damp. Com.: 4/6
Anti Roll: 3/4
Camber: 1.6/1.6
Toe: 0.0/0.1

Final Gear: 5
1st: 3.25
2nd: 2.3
3rd: 1.75
4th: 1.375
5th: 1.111
6th: .9

LSD: 7/15/5
Tires: CH (I would not recommend higher under any circumstances, especially without a retune)
Brake Balance: 8/5 (Do not use ABS, ever, no matter what car you are using)

EDIT: Also did some testing with an Open differential on a wet track. Found something interesting regarding the advantages of an Open Differential to drift with. Would love to see how it translates to this heavier car, but the RUF doesn't have an Open Diff option.
 
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That is defiantly a unique way of tuning. My way I tune is almost opposite of yours, I guess it depends on your driving style.
 
I tune with a massive Excel document I wrote up using equations to calculate the movements of the car on entry, mid, and on corner exit for both grip and drifting to find the optimal ratios of various numbers based on the inputs. Then I adjust the values accordingly so that those ratios maintain, while arriving at the closest limit that I can drive with. Then I tone it down a bit, assuming that I want a little 'give' for unforeseen circumstances, like custom-generated tracks.
 
I tune with a massive Excel document I wrote up using equations to calculate the movements of the car on entry, mid, and on corner exit for both grip and drifting to find the optimal ratios of various numbers based on the inputs. Then I adjust the values accordingly so that those ratios maintain, while arriving at the closest limit that I can drive with. Then I tone it down a bit, assuming that I want a little 'give' for unforeseen circumstances, like custom-generated tracks.

Yeah I made one for the spring rates, the rest I just setup by feel. 👍
 
Interesting, I really like what you're doing & hope to drift with you one day. May I add you once I get back on?
 
11/22, Evening:

Just a short (20-30 min) session while I have free time. Some more good drifts with Nissan-G-I-Z-M-O and others, possibly in the same team (unconfirmed so far, but negligible). Unfortunately, the room was filled with microphone usage so I had to mute all of them - only once or twice in playing this game online have I met someone with a microphone who uses it productively.

During the course of this (and another room, and in previous sessions) I've met several members from Team Driftmonkey. In all instances, I've been disappointed: they display traits indicative of a bad drift team. There is an inattention to detail, lack of guidance or aim, and a skill/knowledge gap among their members. But the important, the most important, quality is an inability to see problems and solve them in pursuit of growth. I've noticed this through watching them as a spectator and observing their conversations and interactions, as well as drifting with them. It is a self-serving form of drift, where both drifters' performance suffers, rather than cooperation making myself and the other drifter perform better. Such drifting is very far from the precisely organized and absolutely objective drifts I try to achieve.

This is not commentary designed to criticize their team (I simply do not have the time or care to justify a full analysis of a relatively inconsequential team) but helps explain some of the qualities found in many poor drift teams that lack the cohesive, aimed effectiveness of some of the more successful teams. I do not know the source of these traits however, if it is from a lack of self-confidence in drifting, a gap of experience or knowledge, or perhaps an ambition that wasn't served in other drift teams, but learning more about how drift teams become successful (and the inhibiting factors that prevent their success) is another study in and of itself that should be done.

I still advocate individual drifting over drift teams for many reasons, and if I do this study, I will likely explain them more thoroughly.

On another note, I would like to join Night Slide Thursdays, but (like many weeks before this) it doesn't look like I will have time.
 
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Hey, GhostZ, your points on the drift teams is pretty straight on. It's pretty agreeable that there are teams with no purpose. I feel like these teams form just for fun with no clear purpose and people end up with teams entering lobbies in groups with over-confidence with a big mouth and cars that just says they're fast, when in reality, they're not.
 
Ghostz just one question... You say your not analysing teams where you obviously are.... So what I want to know is were you here when most of us started 2 yrs ago or are you views on what you have seen over a couple of months?

Btw what was your old account psn?
 
try this on extension F-1 R-5 and this on compression F-9 R-1 and ride height raise the front to -11 and the rear to the lowest just try it it sound be pretty quick and the antirolls at either F-3 R-1 or F-2 what ever feels better :dopey:
 
@Drift Monkey: I have not done a study on drift teams. That does not mean that I don't notice or analyze some things over time. As for where I was before this account, I've been drifting on GT in both competitions and online for a long time, since before Prologue. I've used multiple PSN accounts. Anonymity is 90% of the reason I use this account, so no, you cannot have my previous PSN.

@Drift Emotion: No. There are a lot of reasons I won't do that, but those settings are not at all optimal for what I use my cars for.

11/29/12, Evening (so far)

Drifted in a room with a BMXGuy and one of the HIIIIPower team members, both in C6 corvettes. First course was a custom Toscana course, which was 'okay' but I have seen much more difficult custom courses. Next, they switched to Grand Valley. Had a few decent tandems, but got stuck behind a very slow Blitz Skyline car. The one with the neon. One of my favorite parts about this course however, is the available dirt and cut-in pavement on the corners. Halfway through our next tandem I passed him over the dirt. This is similar to one of my pass techniques on Tsukuba, where I drop the rear into the dirt and take the corner slower, but with enough speed entering that I can pass. The room closed shortly thereafter.

Utilizing the entirety of a course's available space is something that I feel is underimplemented. In competitions, where it is not often allowed, is one thing. But in a free room tandem, rules are much less strict.

Something I think I will continue to improve on, and I definitely see room for improvement, is noticing when a car in front of me that I have a close tandem with, is slowing down dramatically because the drifter is either less confident, or the car is just simply not as fast at the same angle. More times than not I've gotten too close or lovetapped a car because they slow down suddenly. Because the 240ZG has rather poor off-the-line acceleration (something I might want to re-tune my 1st and 2nd gear ratios for... hm...) that most drifters give not enough time for it to get close at the beginning, and I have to make up time.
 
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About your comment using the Driftmonkey team as exemple:

I´m not here to criticize them too, far from that... mostly because i honestly dont remember if i drifted with them or not so far. But called my attention about your view related to teams and drifters who tandem avoiding tandeming, like if they was escaping or running away as long as you come closer. This "competitive" and even "selfish" instinct ruins the fun and the coperative aspect around this sport. Behaving like this only makes the line´s importance and the space measure training so much poor. Maybe thats why i like to compare the tandem pratice to Capoeira (a brazilian martial art where 2 fighters try their best to strike hits without touch themselves in an optimal, predictble and helpfull maner). Unfortunaly here on GT5 some people don´t even know what means "courtesy launch".

Even in real life drifting pratice with professional drifters, its normal to see them having long conversations before get into the section, combining what and how it will be done. Only after these kind of understanding they are ready to do their best on the section. Of course they do it for diferent reasons (they have a real and expensive car witch they depend to keep it working, while we can do all kind of atrocity using our virtual models on GT5), but even stills we also should be more forgiving... so would be easier to match diferent levels of skills and diferent specs of cars.
 
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I tune with a massive Excel document I wrote up using equations to calculate the movements of the car on entry, mid, and on corner exit for both grip and drifting to find the optimal ratios of various numbers based on the inputs. Then I adjust the values accordingly so that those ratios maintain, while arriving at the closest limit that I can drive with. Then I tone it down a bit, assuming that I want a little 'give' for unforeseen circumstances, like custom-generated tracks.

This formula doesn't seem very likely to work.
 
About your comment using the Driftmonkey team as exemple:

I´m not here to criticize them too, far from that... mostly because i honestly dont remember if i drifted with them or not so far. But called my attention about your view related to teams and drifters who tandem avoiding tandeming, like if they was escaping or running away as long as you come closer. This "competitive" and even "selfish" instinct ruins the fun and the coperative aspect around this sport. Behaving like this only makes the line´s importance and the space measure training so much poor. Maybe thats why i like to compare the tandem pratice to Capoeira (a brazilian martial art where 2 fighters try their best to strike hits without touch themselves in an optimal, predictble and helpfull maner). Unfortunaly here on GT5 some people don´t even know what means "courtesy launch".

Even in real life drifting pratice with professional drifters, its normal to see them having long conversations before get into the section, combining what and how it will be done. Only after these kind of understanding they are ready to do their best on the section. Of course they do it for diferent reasons (they have a real and expensive car witch they depend to keep it working, while we can do all kind of atrocity using our virtual models on GT5), but even stills we also should be more forgiving... so would be easier to match diferent levels of skills and diferent specs of cars.

This is very true. However, I don't believe it is very easy to change the nature of the online community for GT5, and it is an unfortunate fact.

And for Drift Monkey, it does work, and well. It saves me any trial-and-error and time in tuning a drift car by giving me everything I need in precise mathematical manner.
 
This is very true. However, I don't believe it is very easy to change the nature of the online community for GT5, and it is an unfortunate fact.

And for Drift Monkey, it does work, and well. It saves me any trial-and-error and time in tuning a drift car by giving me everything I need in precise mathematical manner.

The way you describe your method wouldn't bring about any useable figures. you have not accounted for the grip of the road surface vs the compound of tire which by all means is almost impossible to calculate without knowing the program algorithm of the game.

Tuning your car on how it pivots and the center of mass/gravity would give you the same figures for every car with similar specs (height, weight, length etc.). But, you fall short on a few variables. You have to take into account the differential, gearing, brake balance and torque. Your "mathematical" method of tuning is only limited to the suspension given that you already know the exact figures of the lateral grip of the compound (which is not a real tyre). So in other words you don't have the correct figures to make mathematical calculations on how the overall setup should be.

Reading your post I can tell that you seem to think that your figures DO work, but for whom? For you they may work because you punch in your useless figures and they give you a number that you punch in which seems to work. But the reason why it works isn't because of those calculations. You're assuming that because of this, your formula is correct. I'm sure if you put that tune on other cars and ask anyone else to drift it, it wouldn't be ideal for him/her.

I admire that you try to put science into tuning but fact of the matter is that tuning is ALL about trial and error.

I think the best thing for you to do is to stop talking about your illegitimate forumlas and show us that it works. Join a room with any team on GT5, announce yourself and we will watch. If you're drifting is as good as your tune then you would've proven me wrong. But as of now, I'm calling this myth, BUSTED!
 
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I think you misunderstand what I am doing with these formulas. I am not imposing them on anyone else, just explaining that this is how I do it. I do not claim that they are best for everyone, but I do claim that they are best for my purposes. Otherwise, why would I use them? Saying that mathematical representation is poor judgement for tuning within a simulated game is a little silly though. Of course it can work, and should work better than in real life. I think it is childish and, frankly, stupid for you to attack me for this.

I am very confident in my tuning method and I've tuned in very short time successful and reliable drift cars that I feel do not need trial-and-error tuning. That is not to say the tune is "magic" for everyone, but that it achieves the reliability, speed, and control that I demand. I do not share, ask to share, hand out, impose on, or provide critique with any other tunes that people do that differ, though I may sometimes ask why they do something to gain insight, but I believe mine is the best for what I want to do, and that others can learn from my method, but that is all.

If you don't believe me, then don't. I have nothing to try and prove to you. I am certainly not tuning for the benefit of anyone except myself. That is all I do here. If you happen to see me drift somewhere, go ahead and watch. If not, deal with it on your own time.

EDIT: I will admit, my description of the document is brief, but I honestly don't see the need or point in describing all that it does. It gives me numbers for almost every aspect of the car that can be tuned in-game, and what it doesn't give me numbers for, it gives me suggested values for that I alter as I see fit. Nothing more, nothing less.
 
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Anonymity is 90% of the reason I use this account, so no, you cannot have my previous PSN.

Why do you need multiple accounts unless imo you go around the internet making posts where you get under peoples skin :-

Or are you really KAZ....

If you didnt waffle on so much an kept it technical it could of been a sticky...

Join Sunday night missiles... Or tell us when your next on GT5.
 
I think you misunderstand what I am doing with these formulas. I am not imposing them on anyone else, just explaining that this is how I do it. I do not claim that they are best for everyone, but I do claim that they are best for my purposes. Otherwise, why would I use them? Saying that mathematical representation is poor judgement for tuning within a simulated game is a little silly though. Of course it can work, and should work better than in real life. I think it is childish and, frankly, stupid for you to attack me for this.

I am very confident in my tuning method and I've tuned in very short time successful and reliable drift cars that I feel do not need trial-and-error tuning. That is not to say the tune is "magic" for everyone, but that it achieves the reliability, speed, and control that I demand. I do not share, ask to share, hand out, impose on, or provide critique with any other tunes that people do that differ, though I may sometimes ask why they do something to gain insight, but I believe mine is the best for what I want to do, and that others can learn from my method, but that is all.

If you don't believe me, then don't. I have nothing to try and prove to you. I am certainly not tuning for the benefit of anyone except myself. That is all I do here. If you happen to see me drift somewhere, go ahead and watch. If not, deal with it on your own time.

EDIT: I will admit, my description of the document is brief, but I honestly don't see the need or point in describing all that it does. It gives me numbers for almost every aspect of the car that can be tuned in-game, and what it doesn't give me numbers for, it gives me suggested values for that I alter as I see fit. Nothing more, nothing less.

The what's the point in math. This only shows that your knowledge about cars and suspension systems is low.

If your tuning is for you and you alone then why post all this non-sensical misinformation here on gtp? Your posts are long, repetitive and lacks sources. All of them are based highly on your pseudo-intellectual way of looking at GT5.

"Of course it can work, and should work better than in real life." Says who? And better for who? You're pulling imaginary numbers and drift it with the mindset that, "this should work". That's the only reason why you think it works.
 
The what's the point in math. This only shows that your knowledge about cars and suspension systems is low.

If your tuning is for you and you alone then why post all this non-sensical misinformation here on gtp? Your posts are long, repetitive and lacks sources. All of them are based highly on your pseudo-intellectual way of looking at GT5.

"Of course it can work, and should work better than in real life." Says who? And better for who? You're pulling imaginary numbers and drift it with the mindset that, "this should work". That's the only reason why you think it works.

Love this, I hate people with their egotistical posts! Some forget that this is a "Community" forum not a "place for my own" forum! On-screen, we're all the equal, there's no room for elitism here!
 
Love this, I hate people with their egotistical posts! Some forget that this is a "Community" forum not a "place for my own" forum! On-screen, we're all the equal, there's no room for elitism here!

Exactly. If you want to blog, there's wordpress.
 
@Drift_Monkey:

What you have said in this thread, about my tuning methods and myself, is at best a poor assumption, and at worst a set of complete lies.

The way you describe your method wouldn't bring about any useable figures.

This is a lie, and a very uninformed one. Not only do you not describe was a "useable" figure would be, but you don't even know why I consider a usable figure. My tuning gives me data for a car I can handle almost instantly without adjustment or practice, that is similar to what I am used to, and is as close to the fastest and highest angle drifting tune I believe I am capable of handling.

But, you fall short on a few variables. You have to take into account the differential, gearing, brake balance and torque.

This is a lie. My tuning accounts for all of those, and much more.

Reading your post I can tell that you seem to think that your figures DO work, but for whom? For you they may work because you punch in your useless figures and they give you a number that you punch in which seems to work

This is a lie. I do not accept my figures blindly and I learned to tune without mathematics long before I used the formulas. If the formulas were not better, why would I use them? You're assuming that I am stupid. I would hope that after all this time and effort I put into my methods, I would have learned something about tuning. I believe I have.




I have no "elitism" or "ego" on this board. I give people my opinions, but I never force them on anyone and I spend a good deal of time justifying myself so that other people can understand where I come from. I have no reason to convince you my tuning works. I don't care what you think about it unless you have legitimate and helpful knowledge. But I do care if you're going to harass me in my own thread over what is, essentially, a bunch of unfounded attacks against someone who really has nothing against you. It's silly.

PM me if you have more personal problems with me, but I don't think there is any reason for you to continue harassing me on this thread. It doesn't help anyone, including yourself.
 
I wasn't solely directing anything at you, rather anyone fitting the description. You DO present yourself as an elitist and above everyone else. You say you don't push your ideas, and whatnot, onto people but you've been back and forth with Drift_Monkey for a while now? You really need to get off your cloud and realize that a board like this is filled with all sorts of opinions that don't necessarily blend with yours.

I have a suggestion, clearly you are here to show that your tuning techniques work, why not find a member (known member not an alias you make up) and see if it can work for them? Heck, I might even try it out!

Edit: Opinions are not equal to the truth/fact! Calling someone a liar based on his/her opinion, isn't a fair choice of word!

Edit2: Where's that Excel document you posted?
 
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Well I for one have enjoyed these chronicles..No I don't see too much of what he says or postulates as being helpful to my particular drifting experience, but after the manga, anime, and live action movie, I've always felt there had to be a reality show next..Ghost Z, compile these logs and send them to the producers of MTV, propose the show be called The Real World: Initial D; for continuity purposes, your stage name will be Ryosuke Takashi and the contract will only be good until your eventual entry into medical school. That is all.
 
@Drift_Monkey:

What you have said in this thread, about my tuning methods and myself, is at best a poor assumption, and at worst a set of complete lies.



This is a lie, and a very uninformed one. Not only do you not describe was a "useable" figure would be, but you don't even know why I consider a usable figure. My tuning gives me data for a car I can handle almost instantly without adjustment or practice, that is similar to what I am used to, and is as close to the fastest and highest angle drifting tune I believe I am capable of handling.



This is a lie. My tuning accounts for all of those, and much more.



This is a lie. I do not accept my figures blindly and I learned to tune without mathematics long before I used the formulas. If the formulas were not better, why would I use them? You're assuming that I am stupid. I would hope that after all this time and effort I put into my methods, I would have learned something about tuning. I believe I have.




I have no "elitism" or "ego" on this board. I give people my opinions, but I never force them on anyone and I spend a good deal of time justifying myself so that other people can understand where I come from. I have no reason to convince you my tuning works. I don't care what you think about it unless you have legitimate and helpful knowledge. But I do care if you're going to harass me in my own thread over what is, essentially, a bunch of unfounded attacks against someone who really has nothing against you. It's silly.

PM me if you have more personal problems with me, but I don't think there is any reason for you to continue harassing me on this thread. It doesn't help anyone, including yourself.

You still haven't posted a single shred of evidence to support your claims. So why should we believe you. I'm not attacking you, I'm simply saying that you are the one with the ego here, not me. If you feel threatened in some way then please point out any thing that I have said to directly insult you. I'm having a very grown-up conversation with you and if you feel that I'm insulting you then you need to re-think being on GTP.
 
I have a Porsche RGT tune that I got from this program within 20-30 minutes on the previous page. While I still think that the car is underpowered, despite having a nearly reverse weight distribution, twice as much HP (though very little torque compared to the grip of the tires) and a redline about 1-1.5K higher... it drifted perfectly for me without trial and error in the tuning. If you're desperate to see what a car tuned by this method feels like, by all means, use it. It's not my best however, I've done this with a Dodge Challenger '70, SL65 AMG, Fairlady 2000, Nissan 350Z Z tune and S tune, Skyline GTS-T, Jaguar E-Type and many more. My goal is to provide quick and easy tunes that I do not need to test, and can drift reliably and comfortably without much effort or worry. It does not provide the "Fastest" drifting for some cars, but it appreciably reaches it and makes the cars almost instantly easy to manage. I never have a problem with not being able to drift a car once it's tuned, regardless of whether it is a gutless RGT or an overweight Dodge Challenger. Drifting ability has something to play in that, but I never find that the qualities or tune of my cars, even for slapped-together-in-online-lobbies tunes cause me trouble.

If you would like, give me a car and I'll run it through the program and show it to you. Provided it's a viable enough drift car, it should run fine (though still catered toward my taste in driving, as most of the ratios this program gives me are tied to what I was already comfortable with, or just augmented from that point)

The comparative tuning section of my formulas are designed to take a car you feel comfortable with, and make a second car drive as similar to that one. By focusing on the similarities between the physical properties of cars, I believe I have achieved that.

For Engine And Weight: I enter in weight, static weight distribution, Horsepower at peak, Torque at horsepower peak, torque at shifting point, torque 1K below shifting point, and torque 2K below shifting point. I may add 3K below if, after tuning, the car's shifts are very long. The formulas give me the static weight over each wheel, taking into account downforce. (an estimate since GT5 tuning does not give precise measurements of max downforce, I don't have a need to change this as I rarely used spoilers or wings) it also gives me a

For Suspension: Using spring rates, it tells me the drop on the suspension when the car is standing still, including the lowering height. With a Center of Mass measurement and tire G-force, it gives me the load transfer under ideal cornering. This tells me the "weight" over each wheel during cornering, including whether or not I have lifting forces on a particular wheel. It gives me the roll angle of the body during ideal cornering. Then, it takes into account acceleration and braking, and tells me all of that data again except this time it assumes first that I am turning while accelerating, and then turning while braking. It gives me a suggested camber value (though I usually go lower than this) based on the change of position of the Center of Mass under the previously mentioned scenarios, which changes the angle at which the force of weight is pushing on the wheel. I do not use toe, though if I wanted to add it to the sheet, I would have to start measuring wheel diameter and width so I know the exact contact patch, and then calculate the deformation of that to give me the idea rear width of tread from toe. While this is something I can do, I don't know if GT5's tire model is accurate enough to include real compression rates of the gases within the tires under the temperature of the tires under friction. Because it gives me the load transfer, I can select dampening rates in the same ratios as I want the load transfer to happen (as greater load transfer requires stiffer dampening to slow the change usually) and then move the rates higher or lower based on the track. For the most part, however, I keep them at a moderate level so I don't have to mess with them for every track. Same goes for anti-roll bars and the roll rate of the car. The sheet tells me if the front end rolls before the rear end does, and what the degree of angle is rolls is. It tells me the visual change in suspension drop on the outside of the car under cornering roll, at each wheel. It tells me the ratio of weight on the inside to the outside of the car under cornering, which I want to maximize to 1 to get the greatest cornering grip. Of course, no car has a 1:1 ratio, but the higher the number the better. It tells me how far the nose dips when I brake. All of these length of suspension travel measurements are important, because they tell me for a given spring rate set whether or not I am going to bottom out the car under normal cornering. All of these are kept in ratios similar to a car I am already capable with, and can be intensified if I want to speed the car up.

For Brake Balance: Using load transfer under braking (from previous section) I can calculate the lift forces employed at the wheels. This tells me the ratio of brake balance I need for all four wheels to lose traction simultaneously, and then I usually increase the front by 1 or 2 to compensate for cars where the front brakes are more powerful than the rear. While this is not an extremely precise measurement, all it does it make the front wheels lock first, which is all I want it to do, without having to do trial and error tests.

For Transmission Ratios: Using the ratios of the transmission I calculate the torque at the wheels for the torque values presented above (all of them) and the gear ratios. I try to get the ratio of weight over the rear wheels to the torque at full throttle the same, and the same under braking. To take into account the varying shapes of the torque curve for cars, I provide an average torque across the entire operating RPM spectrum based on the values I measured. This tells me that at the same throttle input at the same braking and at the same cornering, both cars (the original tune and the new car) will lose traction with the same force of sideways movement in proportion to the weight of the car. This dispels a huge misconception that horsepower determines the drifting character of the car, and while to some extent that is true, it rarely is useful. While the Fairlady Z has nearly 280 ft/lbs at the rear wheels, seemingly underpowered, it has, under braking, double-digit weight at the rear of the car. With the aggressive transmission ratios I use, it spins the tires at will from the driver, but is completely manageable in a straight line. It also lets me know which is more advantageous: a broader torque curve at lower peak numbers, or a higher one with a smaller breadth. It tells me whether or not I should have more torque at a lower RPM so that I can run gears at appropriate drifting speeds. I have to make the decision whether to do that, but the sheet tells me if that would be more similar to what I am used to, or less similar.

There are other things in it that I tune for, but these are the big 4 that I am concerned with, and the rest are usually stylistic measures to find cars that look more dramatic (higher rear/front ratio for a given angle of rotation, for example) that has little effect on performance. Does this give you a better idea of the depth of my tuning?
 
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I have a Porsche RGT tune that I got from this program within 20-30 minutes on the previous page. While I still think that the car is underpowered, despite having a nearly reverse weight distribution, twice as much HP (though very little torque compared to the grip of the tires) and a redline about 1-1.5K higher... it drifted perfectly for me without trial and error in the tuning. If you're desperate to see what a car tuned by this method feels like, by all means, use it. It's not my best however, I've done this with a Dodge Challenger '70, SL65 AMG, Fairlady 2000, Nissan 350Z Z tune and S tune, Skyline GTS-T, Jaguar E-Type and many more. My goal is to provide quick and easy tunes that I do not need to test, and can drift reliably and comfortably without much effort or worry. It does not provide the "Fastest" drifting for some cars, but it appreciably reaches it and makes the cars almost instantly easy to manage. I never have a problem with not being able to drift a car once it's tuned, regardless of whether it is a gutless RGT or an overweight Dodge Challenger. Drifting ability has something to play in that, but I never find that the qualities or tune of my cars, even for slapped-together-in-online-lobbies tunes cause me trouble.

If you would like, give me a car and I'll run it through the program and show it to you. Provided it's a viable enough drift car, it should run fine (though still catered toward my taste in driving, as most of the ratios this program gives me are tied to what I was already comfortable with, or just augmented from that point)

The comparative tuning section of my formulas are designed to take a car you feel comfortable with, and make a second car drive as similar to that one. By focusing on the similarities between the physical properties of cars, I believe I have achieved that.

For Engine And Weight: I enter in weight, static weight distribution, Horsepower at peak, Torque at horsepower peak, torque at shifting point, torque 1K below shifting point, and torque 2K below shifting point. I may add 3K below if, after tuning, the car's shifts are very long. The formulas give me the static weight over each wheel, taking into account downforce. (an estimate since GT5 tuning does not give precise measurements of max downforce, I don't have a need to change this as I rarely used spoilers or wings) it also gives me a

For Suspension: Using spring rates, it tells me the drop on the suspension when the car is standing still, including the lowering height. With a Center of Mass measurement and tire G-force, it gives me the load transfer under ideal cornering. This tells me the "weight" over each wheel during cornering, including whether or not I have lifting forces on a particular wheel. It gives me the roll angle of the body during ideal cornering. Then, it takes into account acceleration and braking, and tells me all of that data again except this time it assumes first that I am turning while accelerating, and then turning while braking. It gives me a suggested camber value (though I usually go lower than this) based on the change of position of the Center of Mass under the previously mentioned scenarios, which changes the angle at which the force of weight is pushing on the wheel. I do not use toe, though if I wanted to add it to the sheet, I would have to start measuring wheel diameter and width so I know the exact contact patch, and then calculate the deformation of that to give me the idea rear width of tread from toe. While this is something I can do, I don't know if GT5's tire model is accurate enough to include real compression rates of the gases within the tires under the temperature of the tires under friction. Because it gives me the load transfer, I can select dampening rates in the same ratios as I want the load transfer to happen (as greater load transfer requires stiffer dampening to slow the change usually) and then move the rates higher or lower based on the track. For the most part, however, I keep them at a moderate level so I don't have to mess with them for every track. Same goes for anti-roll bars and the roll rate of the car. The sheet tells me if the front end rolls before the rear end does, and what the degree of angle is rolls is. It tells me the visual change in suspension drop on the outside of the car under cornering roll, at each wheel. It tells me the ratio of weight on the inside to the outside of the car under cornering, which I want to maximize to 1 to get the greatest cornering grip. Of course, no car has a 1:1 ratio, but the higher the number the better. It tells me how far the nose dips when I brake. All of these length of suspension travel measurements are important, because they tell me for a given spring rate set whether or not I am going to bottom out the car under normal cornering. All of these are kept in ratios similar to a car I am already capable with, and can be intensified if I want to speed the car up.

For Brake Balance: Using load transfer under braking (from previous section) I can calculate the lift forces employed at the wheels. This tells me the ratio of brake balance I need for all four wheels to lose traction simultaneously, and then I usually increase the front by 1 or 2 to compensate for cars where the front brakes are more powerful than the rear. While this is not an extremely precise measurement, all it does it make the front wheels lock first, which is all I want it to do, without having to do trial and error tests.

For Transmission Ratios: Using the ratios of the transmission I calculate the torque at the wheels for the torque values presented above (all of them) and the gear ratios. I try to get the ratio of weight over the rear wheels to the torque at full throttle the same, and the same under braking. To take into account the varying shapes of the torque curve for cars, I provide an average torque across the entire operating RPM spectrum based on the values I measured. This tells me that at the same throttle input at the same braking and at the same cornering, both cars (the original tune and the new car) will lose traction with the same force of sideways movement in proportion to the weight of the car. This dispels a huge misconception that horsepower determines the drifting character of the car, and while to some extent that is true, it rarely is useful. While the Fairlady Z has nearly 280 ft/lbs at the rear wheels, seemingly underpowered, it has, under braking, double-digit weight at the rear of the car. With the aggressive transmission ratios I use, it spins the tires at will from the driver, but is completely manageable in a straight line. It also lets me know which is more advantageous: a broader torque curve at lower peak numbers, or a higher one with a smaller breadth. It tells me whether or not I should have more torque at a lower RPM so that I can run gears at appropriate drifting speeds. I have to make the decision whether to do that, but the sheet tells me if that would be more similar to what I am used to, or less similar.

There are other things in it that I tune for, but these are the big 4 that I am concerned with, and the rest are usually stylistic measures to find cars that look more dramatic (higher rear/front ratio for a given angle of rotation, for example) that has little effect on performance. Does this give you a better idea of the depth of my tuning?

How about you show us your formulas instead of trying to vaguely explain it.
 
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