The 2017 F1 driver transfer discussion/speculation threadFormula 1

[Terronium-12]

The beef with Williams for years now is that, no matter how promising they are at the beginning of the season, they run out of development (money) before the end. This deal may be their big chance for a strong run at season's end.

That and their often times horrible pit stops that drop them from a podium finish down to 5th or so.

 

[EDK]

That and their often times horrible pit stops that drop them from a podium finish down to 5th or so.

They actually set out to fix that this year and seemed to have done pretty well.

https://www.formula1.com/en/championship/awards/dhl-fastest-pit-stop-2016.html

 

[calvins48]

So they'll get Lowe to replace Symonds in exchange for Bottas? That simple?

And Williams practically get free engines from Mercedes.

James Allison looks set to join Mercedes in Lowe's place.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

And Williams practically get free engines from Mercedes.

James Allison looks set to join Mercedes in Lowe's place.

Yeah I talk about that actually on the 2017 Constructor thread.

 

[Ex_Driver]

I'm still banking on Merc going with a wild card entry. Bottas is quick, but not terribly fast. I've just got a feeling they'll buy out Button. He and Hammy have a good amount of history together, and good chemistry. Button is quick and consistent and easy to work with. And I guarantee for enough money he'd come to Merc. He probably wouldn't challenge Ham for position too often, and would be quite happy to bring the car home second every weekend. And that's exactly what Mercedes needs.

The only reason for them not to do it is that they're both British. And a German team like Mercedes probably wants a German in at least one seat. (even though Rosberg was Monegasque, shh)

 

[prisonermonkeys]

I've just got a feeling they'll buy out Button.

Based on what? He said that he's had enough and that he's retired.

And I guarantee for enough money he'd come to Merc.

So you know him personally, do you? Well enough to know what he's thinking, even when he says something else in public?

He probably wouldn't challenge Ham for position too often

Despite being the first (and until this year, only) person to beat Hamilton in the championship when they were team-mates?

The only reason for them not to do it is that they're both British.

No, the only reason for them not to do it is because Button has said that he doesn't want to race anymore.

I'm still banking on Merc going with a wild card entry. Bottas is quick, but not terribly fast.

He has just visited the Mercedes factory. Drivers rarely do that if they're not joining the team.

 

[Ex_Driver]

Based on what? He said that he's had enough and that he's retired.


So you know him personally, do you? Well enough to know what he's thinking, even when he says something else in public?


Despite being the first (and until this year, only) person to beat Hamilton in the championship when they were team-mates?


No, the only reason for them not to do it is because Button has said that he doesn't want to race anymore.


He has just visited the Mercedes factory. Drivers rarely do that if they're not joining the team.

Everyone has a price. They offer him Rosberg's salary, and I bet he'd dance the Macarena in a tutu. As would I and would you.

Yeah, he beat Hammy. 6 years ago. Lest you forget, he'll be 37 in 2 weeks. Very few drivers in modern F1 have remained competitive past 35. Schumacher (just), Alonso, Massa. All drivers with either multiple world champions or were deserving of one. Button sort of lucked out with being at Brawn at 2009. Without that loophole abuse, he never would've been a world champion.
He's fast but he ain't a legend. Hamilton is, no matter what we'd like to think. Especially since 2008. He's only gotten faster, Button's only gotten slower.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Everyone has a price.

Did it ever occur to you that maybe he values more than money? If he has achieved everything that he wants to achieve in the sport and wants to find something new, then that's exactly what he will do.

All of this is moot, anyway. You're one of the few people who still thought he was ever under consideration, and the only one who thinks Mercedes are genuinely interested in him. Everyone else accepts that Bottas will go to Mercedes, Massa will stay with Williams, and Button will go on to do whatever he wants to.

 

[Ex_Driver]

Did it ever occur to you that maybe he values more than money? If he has achieved everything that he wants to achieve in the sport and wants to find something new, then that's exactly what he will do.

All of this is moot, anyway. You're one of the few people who still thought he was ever under consideration, and the only one who thinks Mercedes are genuinely interested in him. Everyone else accepts that Bottas will go to Mercedes, Massa will stay with Williams, and Button will go on to do whatever he wants to.

Your whole argument hinges on him keeping to his "I'm retiring" line. Which by the way, he never said he was retiring. He said he was taking a sabbatical. It's not like any F1 driver has ever changed their mind about retiring though, right? Lauda, Prost, Schumacher, Räikkönen, arguably Massa. Nope, once they said they were done they never came back. Never once been a driver in F1 history to ever come out of retirement, ever ever ever.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Your whole argument hinges on him keeping to his "I'm retiring" line.

And yours hinges on Mercedes suddenly doing something that they have so far shown no indication of doing, for reasons that make absolutely no sense.

 

[Bram Turismo]

I'm still banking on Merc going with a wild card entry. Bottas is quick, but not terribly fast. I've just got a feeling they'll buy out Button. He and Hammy have a good amount of history together, and good chemistry. Button is quick and consistent and easy to work with. And I guarantee for enough money he'd come to Merc. He probably wouldn't challenge Ham for position too often, and would be quite happy to bring the car home second every weekend. And that's exactly what Mercedes needs.

The only reason for them not to do it is that they're both British. And a German team like Mercedes probably wants a German in at least one seat. (even though Rosberg was Monegasque, shh)

You're assuming Mercedes will be equally as far ahead of everyone else like it was the case this season. Which will not be the case. If they can get Bottas, why the hell would you get Button instead. That's what's been puzzling me. Why would you bring a 37 year old out of retirement to defend your constructors title?

Bottas is exactly the man they need. He has never been in a top car, the Williams has always been an upper midfield car. They only ever stood a chance against Ferrari and RBR because of the Mercedes engine on fast circuits.

I will even go as far as to say we haven't even seen the best of Bottas yet, because of the mediocre Williams.

 

[Ex_Driver]

And yours hinges on Mercedes suddenly doing something that they have so far shown no indication of doing, for reasons that make absolutely no sense.

I never said that's exactly what they were going to do. I said I think it's more probable.

Having two fast drivers that have proven to work well together and know their place 'makes no sense'? What does make sense to you?

 

[prisonermonkeys]

What does make sense to you?

Hiring a driver with a view to getting several seasons out of him to ensure continuity within the team. Not hiring a guy who doesn't want to be there for a single season because you think it would be a nice thing to do.

 

[Ex_Driver]

Hiring a driver with a view to getting several seasons out of him to ensure continuity within the team. Not hiring a guy who doesn't want to be there for a single season because you think it would be a nice thing to do.

If you think my argument was for only one season and 'because it would be nice', then you have no clue what point I was making.

 

[MCFerocious]

Chill out guys.

I doubt they will go for Button but Ex Driver is right; he would finish second every week and everyone would be happy. But Mercedes will not employ two,British drivers, no doubt about that.

I still hope they go for Alonso. I bet he will have tried to move there. And against Hamilton that would be just delicious.

 

[Ex_Driver]

Chill out guys.

I doubt they will go for Button but Ex Driver is right; he would finish second every week and everyone would be happy. But Mercedes will not employ two,British drivers, no doubt about that.

I still hope they go for Alonso. I bet he will have tried to move there. And against Hamilton that would be just delicious.

The only thing with Alonso is he's said specifically he wants to win a title with McLaren. That's why he left Ferrari for them. Granted, money talks, but still. Would take a hefty cheque to get him to walk. And for Maccer to let him walk.

 

[FutureF1]

Well according to F1Fanatic, Bottas has already done a seat fitting at the Merc factory. As much as I'm not a fan of the decision, it's now almost guaranteed that Bottas is going to take that seat.

 

[Ex_Driver]

We can't forget that even Valentino Rossi has thrown his hat in the ring. He's test driven an F1 car before and apparently set highly competitive times very quickly into the session.
Imagine if Rossi came in and managed to win a WC. Would be only the second person to ever win the motorcycle world championship and formula 1 world championship.

 

[Jimlaad43]

We can't forget that even Valentino Rossi has thrown his hat in the ring. He's test driven an F1 car before and apparently set highly competitive times very quickly into the session.
Imagine if Rossi came in and managed to win a WC. Would be only the second person to ever win the motorcycle world championship and formula 1 world championship.

No, Mercedes have invited Rossi and Ogier to have a test with the team. They won't pass the Superlicense requirements anyway, Toro Rosso tried to get Sebastien Loeb to do the 2009 Abu Dhabi GP, and that got nowhere

 

[calvins48]

Well according to F1Fanatic, Bottas has already done a seat fitting at the Merc factory. As much as I'm not a fan of the decision, it's now almost guaranteed that Bottas is going to take that seat.

This.

 

[mustafur]

Things that will never happen, Rossi Being in F1 would be number 1.

 

[Ex_Driver]

No, Mercedes have invited Rossi and Ogier to have a test with the team. They won't pass the Superlicense requirements anyway, Toro Rosso tried to get Sebastien Loeb to do the 2009 Abu Dhabi GP, and that got nowhere

The Superlicense normally is only given out to those with good success in lower car formulae. But there is a clause for exceptional circumstances. I reckon 7 world championships in premier motorcycle racing and a demonstrable skill behind the wheel of a motor car qualifies as 'exceptional circumstances'.

 

[TheElbows]

He's also, what, 37 years old like Button? It's cool that they let the guys test the car (likely just for media fun), but let's not get carried away.

 

[calvins48]

The Superlicense normally is only given out to those with good success in lower car formulae. But there is a clause for exceptional circumstances. I reckon 7 world championships in premier motorcycle racing and a demonstrable skill behind the wheel of a motor car qualifies as 'exceptional circumstances'.

"Under exceptional circumstances Appendix L also allows the FIA to award a Super Licence to a driver who does not meet the normal criteria if a vote reveals unanimous agreement by the members, and provided that the driver has completed 300 kilometers of testing at racing speeds in a current car."

Doesn't say anything about bikes.

 

[Ex_Driver]

He's also, what, 37 years old like Button? It's cool that they let the guys test the car (likely just for media fun), but let's not get carried away.

He's going on 38, but he also is a frequent winner in motorcycles and just nearly lost the 2015 and 2016 championship. And arguably MotoGP is more physically taxing than is F1. Though not as mentally.

"Under exceptional circumstances Appendix L also allows the FIA to award a Super Licence to a driver who does not meet the normal criteria if a vote reveals unanimous agreement by the members, and provided that the driver has completed 300 kilometers of testing at racing speeds in a current car."

Doesn't say anything about bikes.

Doesn't say anything about excluding bikers either. Just says they have to prove their skills in 300km worth of testing in a car. 300km of testing can be knocked out in a week, you know.

 

[jake2013guy]

He's going on 38, but he also is a frequent winner in motorcycles and just nearly lost the 2015 and 2016 championship. And arguably MotoGP is more physically taxing than is F1. Though not as mentally.


Doesn't say anything about excluding bikers either. Just says they have to prove their skills in 300km worth of testing in a car. 300km of testing can be knocked out in a week, you know.

Or about 1.5 hours in an F1 race sim at Monza.

 

[DesertPenguin09]

Just read an article on Motorsport.com saying Bottas visited the Mercedes HQ before Christmas. Pretty much set, just waiting for Williams to finalize the driver filling his spot (Wehrlein) and then Mercedes can finalize Bottas. And then there's Massa proving to be the first Formula 1 car driven on auto-pilot as he's no longer in it.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

If you think my argument was for only one season and 'because it would be nice', then you have no clue what point I was making.

Wait, you actually think that Button would commit to a multi-year deal despite retiring? That's even more ridiculous than suggesting that he would agree to a single season.

 

[calvins48]

He's going on 38, but he also is a frequent winner in motorcycles and just nearly lost the 2015 and 2016 championship. And arguably MotoGP is more physically taxing than is F1. Though not as mentally.


Doesn't say anything about excluding bikers either. Just says they have to prove their skills in 300km worth of testing in a car. 300km of testing can be knocked out in a week, you know.

Lol. Whatever way you spin it, nobody's taking Rossi.

 

[TRGTspecialist]

Doesn't say anything about excluding bikers either. Just says they have to prove their skills in 300km worth of testing in a car. 300km of testing can be knocked out in a week, you know.

I don't think this is the case anymore, 5.1.6 and 5.1.7 specifically outline that the "outstanding ability" judgement is not sufficient to qualify (unless you are an old super license holder). So unless the regulations change or Rossi decides to enter (and succeed) at junior formula level, it is impossible for him to take part in an F1 race.