The Bugatti Veyron

I drove the Veyron in the license test, and I must say,it's an absolutely beautiful handling car!
 
The veyron wasn't designed to be a track car. It was designed to be a blisteringly fast grand tourer.

You can learn to how drive it fast around a track, but it will never be as fast in the corners as a purpose built track racer. It weighs too much and it struggles to get it's power down coming out of slower corners.
 
Let's be honest, it makes other road-legal production cars in the game look pedestrian :lol: Even the legendary McLaren F1 looks pretty sluggish by comparison (in a drag race) Weighing in at two tonne, it isn't going to be great at cornering, is it? Fact is, it was the first car to officially beat the McLaren F1's top speed after 12 years. One of the reasons, no doubt, why Gordon Murray was crying and whinging when his F1 was surpassed and why he hates it.
 
Ryan81
Fact is, it was the first car to officially beat the McLaren F1's top speed after 12 years. One of the reasons, no doubt, why Gordon Murray was crying and whinging when his F1 was surpassed and why he hates it.
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Yeah, I don't think Gordon Murray has the mentality of a twelve year old boy.

The fact reamains, the Veyron is a very compromised car when it comes to handling, both in Gran Turismo 6 and in real life.
 
Ryanswannell
So on loads of individual threads scattered all over the forum I have noticed there is a lot of hate for the Bugatti Veyron, in particular it's handling. Many people say that it is overpriced (which I agree with, until you take in the costs of parts used to produce it) and ugly (again, I agree) but one complaint I don't get is the handling.
Below is a quote from myself from another thread:



So, what do the rest of you think about this car? Is it a terrible car which has only one purpose and that is to reach 250+ mph, or do you have a different view on it?
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I've always loved the Bugatti Veyron and the way it looks, the only thing I hate about it is it price tag.
 
Ryan81
Fact is, it was the first car to officially beat the McLaren F1's top speed after 12 years. One of the reasons, no doubt, why Gordon Murray was crying and whinging when his F1 was surpassed and why he hates it.
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Unlike the Veyron, top speed was never a design goal for the F1 (just what happens if you stick a powerful engine into a relatively small, aerodynamic car). What I remember reading from Murray about the Veyron actually was quite objective and balanced. Most interestingly he thinks the Veyron is pretty capable as a track car, much more than as a GT car (due to its size, poor visibility, massive turbo lag, harsh ride). Go figure...
 
Its a dream car most of us will never get to drive. Happy its in the game. I don't race with 15 or so in my garage, but I do like to cruise, test, tune them on the ring.
 
Vegard
Yeah, I don't think Gordon Murray has the mentality of a twelve year old boy.

The fact reamains, the Veyron is a very compromised car when it comes to handling, both in Gran Turismo 6 and in real life.
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Not disputing that at all. However, it still beat the F1's top speed and acceleration times which were comfortably the quickest throughout the 1990's and early 2000's.
I do really like the F1 though because even today there are still very few cars that can truly challenge it and also because it gets so much out of a NA engine and technology which is now 20 years old.
 
I think it is funny when I see people defend the handling on the Veyron. It really does handle poorly, yes it is drivable and yes you can beat the AI with it but get it on a real course against a decent human driver in pretty much any super car and watch the Veyron disappear in the rear view mirror.

For those who think it is so great and fast on the track go over to Forza site and look at the leaderboards. See if you can find it at the top anywhere other than on a track that is mostly straight. Oh and btw Forza does allow you to add downforce to it but it still drives like a big heavy brick
 
Verbal
I'm actually beginning to like it. You need to remember it's a road car without much downforce and on road tires. It will go around corners perfectly fine at road car speeds, but because of its power you will arrive there faster than in many of the race cars. So people brake much too late, plow straight on and declare it rubbish...
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This. It's amazing how this argument still rages. It's a road car for crying out loud (I've seen older threads around GT5 where people complain it doesn't perform against a field of race cars with huge downforce) plus OK it's not the most agile car ever either but just check your speed you approach those corners and allow for it. I tested the Veyron against the F1 and a bunch of other road cars that should've been its closest competitors in GT5 on 3 very different tracks, and the Veyron was in every instance the fastest road car in the game, by at least a second a lap.

Oh and I'm not a Veyron fanboy, I like it but it's far from a favourite car of mine. I'm just mature and reasonably objective. And OK at GT :)
 
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Big heavy car built for one purpose as we know, many of us overlook this and presume it will be great around corners hence the complaints/hate. If people looked at the facts e.g. kerb weight >1900 kg, that would address a lot of the complaints it receives.
 
I would like the Veyron more if it sounded like one. Only does at idle and when starting it up. But yeah, it's not a bad car. It's not great, but it's not bad. I guess the way to enjoy the Veyron is not seeing it like any other car, or expecting it to handle like an ordinary sports car; because it isn't. Good or bad, this thing is unique in every sense, and that is the beauty of it.

By the way, has anyone checked if the power gauge of the Veyron is working now?
 
SAFFY
Big heavy car built for one purpose as we know, many of us overlook this and presume it will be great around corners hence the complaints/hate. If people looked at the facts e.g. kerb weight >1900 kg, that would address a lot of the complaints it receives.
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My complaint is the weight and that weight makes it a poor handling car, to heavy = poor stopping distance and poor cornering ability.

I also think it is funny how several people will defend this car and let on like others must not know how to drive if they think it handles poorly. Ironically it is usually those who don;t drive so well that like it due to its rapid recovery potential on straights.

It definitely does not compare to the other super cars in terms of lap times nor should it. It is not a nimble track car. It is a big, heavy, awd, very heavy cruiser. A little Lotus Elise with 1/3rd the HP can eat it alive on a track ;)
 
Saying that the Veyron sucks because it can't turn is like saying that GT6 sucks because you can't shoot people in it. It just isn't meant for track use.

However nothing will ever change how ugly it is. Sweet baby Jesus is the Veyron ugly.
 
Ryan81
Not disputing that at all. However, it still beat the F1's top speed and acceleration times which were comfortably the quickest throughout the 1990's and early 2000's.
I do really like the F1 though because even today there are still very few cars that can truly challenge it and also because it gets so much out of a NA engine and technology which is now 20 years old.
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The McLaren F1 is a masterpiece no doubt, but also extremely expensive, even more than the Veyron considering the era. The engine has GOLD parts to handle the high temperatures. It was about a million pounds back in 1994? Just insane. How much would that equal to today?
brianwong
However nothing will ever change how ugly it is. Sweet baby Jesus is the Veyron ugly.
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Why do some people say its ugly... it isnt... at all. Its a sculpture on wheels. It has a lot of personality and it's shape and design is different to everything else. Its unique and original.

Bugatti-Veyron_Centenaire_2009_800x600_wallpaper_01.jpg
 
The car need to be stopped more than other 1000bhp car because of the weight, but if you find the right speed in turns you'll have a great car that can be fast!
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Found Gordon Murray's take on the Veyron from Top Gear:
Gordon Murray
Whatever else you think of it, the Bugatti is certainly a first-rate engineering job, just because they've made it work at all having had those starting points - a body shape, that power figure, that top speed. So it must have its place in history. But an owner or driver can only judge it when they know what it wants to be as a car: what's it for? And I'm not sure about that at all. It's not trying to be the ultimate driver's car. Only the ultimate machine.
My heart really goes out to the Bugatti engineers, in a way I wouldn't have understood at all if we hadn't done the McMerc SLR. With the McLaren F1, there were really only seven of us full-time engineers - we had complete freedom and focus, and I set targets and we saw them through. Starting with the weight and weight distribution, because weight affects everything dynamically - acceleration, braking, cornering, steering, ride. Then there was the package, and the aerodynamics. Then you do the body design taking into account those targets. The SLR was the same as the Veyron in that it was done completely the other way round. The styling was done as a show car, and the next step was 'Make that.' So you have to do all the packaging, aerodynamics and weight distribution after you have the body shape. With the Bugatti it was more difficult again, because they had two other arbitrary figures to meet - 1,001bhp and 400kmh. So they needed 70 engineers and another 70 quality control people, just sorting out things as they went along, finding solutions to problems they would never have had if they'd started from the right point. And it's not a bad car, not at all. I find it very hard to knock it.
Besides, if it turns the tide, finally puts an end to this mad concentration on power figures and top speed, well that's a good thing. Yes, the McLaren F1 had a high top speed, but honestly we never once considered top speed as one of its development targets, because you just can't use that sort of top speed.
Even so, I'm not sure how advanced it is. In aerodynamics, it's no further ahead of the F1, which has the automatic air brake but also automatic brake cooling and fan assisted boundary layer control. In body structure it's behind the F1 and the SLR in that it's a hybrid construction using carbon for the primary structure only, whereas they are all-carbon. But the engine and transmission are excellent. The Bugatti's transmission and clutches work really well, even though personally I'd prefer a clutch and gearlever because I like to be involved. But the main advance since the F1 is in driver aids. The ESP system lets you get on with chucking the car about. I reckon only five per cent of drivers could use all the power of the F1, whereas 90 per cent could use the power of the SLR, and it's the same here.
That's not enough to make it a truly usable supercar, though. Which brings me back to the question of what the Veyron really is for. What's its point? I have a checklist of essentials for genuine real-world use. A Ferrari F430 meets most of them, and so does the SLR. But the Bugatti? Very few.
Item one is size - especially perceived width and a feeling you know where the extremities are. The Veyron looks small from the outside but from the inside it feels so big, so wide and intimidating to drive. Item two on the list is ergonomics. It's mostly alright here. You can adjust the wheel and seat nicely. But I couldn't read the secondary instruments. And there's a huge pedal offset, which was actually quite uncomfortable after an hour's drive.
Item three is drivability, and how easy the powertrain is to use in traffic and so on. It's really good, except for the turbo lag. Next up: ride and handling. The Bugatti Veyron has easy handling and an excellent primary ride - the way it absorbs bumps and crests, the body control. But the secondary ride - the harshness over small sharp bumps, the road roar and tyre slap - are not very good. And that's really tiring over a long journey. It's very hard to fix with all that unsprung weight - the massive tyres, the driveshafts, the hydraulic variable-height struts and so on. And the tyre sidewalls are very shallow.
Next on my real-world list is luggage, both for the stuff you need to carry with you in the cabin, and bootspace - there's space for a briefcase only. Straight on, then, to number six, visibility. The screen pillars can sometimes obscure an entire oncoming car around a bend, and rear three-quarter vision is zero, even though there's actually good rearward visibility using the mirrors. Which impacts on the last item, parking. You'd need someone to wave you in.
Overall a pretty poor total. So it's just not a real-world car in my view. Bringing me back to the question, what is it for?
The real disappointment is that it doesn't feel very quick in a normal road-driving situation. Oh, once you're going there's loads of torque, then power and the acceleration that goes with it, but there's turbo lag and far too much rotating mass. I have a test for this. Put a car in third gear, 3000rpm steady speed. In a McLaren F1 or a Zonda, it will throw the passenger's skull against the headrest. In the Bugatti you count 1-2-3 then you go. On the road, that means you decide to overtake two or three cars and you wonder where the acceleration is - then it comes and - woaah - you've arrived at the next corner far too fast.
But they have done some amazing things with it. One really good thing, and I simply never expected this, is that it does change direction. It hardly feels its weight. Driving it on a circuit I expected a sack of cement, but you can really throw it at the tight chicanes. The steering weights up a bit in corners too, which is good. It's not ponderous at all and there's loads of grip, even in mountain hairpins. The polar moment must be pretty low.
The braking is phenomenal. Anyone can make a car stop quickly, but the stability under brakes is excellent too. I did a hands-off stop from 170mph and it pulled up dead straight. And the primary ride and body control are pretty impressive too. It also feels really solid - the carbon tub obviously gives the car exceptional torsional stiffness.
Bugatti kept telling us it's not a track car but a road car. But in the end I enjoyed it more on the track than in the mountains. I'd have bet anything beforehand on it being the other way around. It's spoiled on the road by the width and the turbo lag. On the track the chuckability, the steering and braking really shine. So if I had one that's all I'd do with it - take mates to the track and give them rides, show them what 1,001bhp feels like when the turbos get going, and what the brakes are like. It's brilliant at that.
Which leaves me even more confused about where it fits in the supercar landscape. It's a huge achievement for the management and engineering teams to have gone from that starting point and to then produce a very well resolved and drivable car. One place it does work is as a showcase for the VW Group's engineering expertise. I'd love to get the job of doing a proper lightweight one. I would take all the turbos off for a start.
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I remember people saying the McLaren F1 was ugly when it arrived.

I don't enjoy the car. But I don't enjoy 4wd cars. The fact it is a heavy car doesn't help it go fast - though I do have a soft spot for these heavy underdog cars... Veyron - underdog? I feel sorry for it.

Looks. Distingtive... The bold twin body colour and those swooping vents that hides all those radiators...

more radiators = more Power... that is the rules.


Didn't you read the small print in the Bugatti showroom?

Warning...
Veyron is not for everyone, including people who are weak or easily disturbed.
Veyron should not be left alone with other cars.
Do not look Veyron directly in the eyes.
In time Veyron will grow physically stronger.
Unexplained oil spots on the tarmac could be a sign that Veyron is unhappy.
Veyron is not a toy.
Veyron can hear you, even when you whisper.
At night Veyron will watch you sleep.
Veyron cannot be destroyed.
If Veyron escapes from Cage, leave the country. Leave now.
(Cage sold separately)
 
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It's not necessary to expect every car handles like a go-kart or Elise or F1. It'd be better appreciating them as what they are, and what they are good at.

Zero complain about it, except the modded suspension bug. Well, I didn't go back and check if it's fixed because occupied by other things. So, I don't think I care much about its handling.:lol:

And, if I had the car IRL, there'd not be any complain, either. :D

Also, I won't mind people's laughing. :D
 
What is interesting about the McLaren F1 is it was never intended to be the fastest car in world, just a no compromise supercar. Incidentally it has a better power to weight ratio than the veyron and is still the fastest naturally aspirated car in the world, not bad for something roughly 20 years old!
 
The naturally aspirated F1 isnt much slower in acceleration compared to the Bugatti. I like both, but the McLaren impresses more considering its age, cost of design, performance as a racer compared to the Veyrons legitimate touring abilities, and don't drivers aids help the Veyron more?

I think of them as being like the F35-an expensive, advanced bomb truck / and the Typhoon-a proper fighter that costs less, arrived earlier when different technologies were available, and can nearly do what the F35 can do, as well as its air superiority. Different machines for a different role. But one can do the job of the other to varying degrees. I think the Typhoon is more capable in a broader role.

(Veyron = F35. Typhoon = the svelte F1. I like them all for their abilities)
 
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eSZee
I was under the impression that the rear hatch and engine bay were lined with gold "foil". I was not aware they used gold in the engine itself.
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I only know that they used gold somewhere in the engine to handle the temperatures... how much I dont know
 
NixxxoN
I only know that they used gold somewhere in the engine to handle the temperatures... how much I dont know
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Mind sharing where you saw that?
I've never heard of gold being used inside the BMW engine but maybe you'll show me something new.
 
eSZee
Mind sharing where you saw that?
I've never heard of gold being used inside the BMW engine but maybe you'll show me something new.
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I havent said the inside, maybe its the outside... I honestly I dont know, I'm only saying that they used gold, thats for sure
 

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