The General Airplane Thread

[Dan]

The C-17 may finally become an attacker aircraft! Ever since I've gained interest in the C-17, I've wondered if it would ever have a weapons system mounted onboard. Now, it seems like that will be a reality, but with lasers!

http://nextbigfuture.com/2016/05/us-air-force-will-have-first-combat.html

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

The C-17 may finally become an attacker aircraft! Ever since I've gained interest in the C-17, I've wondered if it would ever have a weapons system mounted onboard. Now, it seems like that will be a reality, but with lasers!

http://nextbigfuture.com/2016/05/us-air-force-will-have-first-combat.html

So five years in testing, and then finally scrapping due to inability to expand the manufacturing of such equipment. YAL-1 search is your friend. There is a KC-135 even earlier than that which was retrofitted in like slightly different set up but same result. There is a history...

EDIT: Didn't even read your article before posting, then I open it up and what do you know the years line up with what I predicted to what they have scheduled.

 

[catamount39]

LAZER BEAMZ!

 

[Dan]

So five years in testing, and then finally scrapping due to inability to expand the manufacturing of such equipment. YAL-1 search is your friend. There is a KC-135 even earlier than that which was retrofitted in like slightly different set up but same result. There is a history...

EDIT: Didn't even read your article before posting, then I open it up and what do you know the years line up with what I predicted to what they have scheduled.

With the C-130, it has a straight wing with engines mounted high above the sides of the plane, so side-mounted cannons can fire unobstructed during pylon turns. The C-17 has angled wings with low-mounted engines, so any weapons mounted on the side would be very obstructed. It seems to me that any laser system would have to be attached in the radome or possibly at the tail section to alleviate this problem.

Also, when the Air Force eventually retire both aircraft, could commercial business like UPS or FedEx use these to transport mail?

 

[Venom800tt]

Lockheed Martin actually has a civilian version of the C-130J called the LM-100J. The C-17 on the other hand is not FAA certified like the LM-100, along with costing a lot more to operate than airliner derived freighters.

And as far as lasers go, the talk of putting one in a C-130 or C-17 has been around for a while. The solid state laser being developed by Boeing is one candidate.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

With the C-130, it has a straight wing with engines mounted high above the sides of the plane, so side-mounted cannons can fire unobstructed during pylon turns. The C-17 has angled wings with low-mounted engines, so any weapons mounted on the side would be very obstructed. It seems to me that any laser system would have to be attached in the radome or possibly at the tail section to alleviate this problem.

Also, when the Air Force eventually retire both aircraft, could commercial business like UPS or FedEx use these to transport mail?

Then it wont be mounted on the side, I've given the examples of similar aircraft to C-17 fitted with lasers and while the 130 has been a candidate the same issues apply. Chemical lasers are too costly, solid state seems like the best alternative after what we've seen with Northrop and them on Destroyers.

 

[Swagger897]

Also, when the Air Force eventually retire both aircraft, could commercial business like UPS or FedEx use these to transport mail?

It could, but it's already used:

edit:
Also, the C130 isn't that practical of a freighter for civilian operations. Delta had them but they weren't as effecient, and when wide-bodied aircraft were a thing, they could put more cargo on them than the C130.

 

[Dan]

Then it wont be mounted on the side, I've given the examples of similar aircraft to C-17 fitted with lasers and while the 130 has been a candidate the same issues apply. Chemical lasers are too costly, solid state seems like the best alternative after what we've seen with Northrop and them on Destroyers.

I never knew about the NKC-135 until today. I always thought YAL-1 was the only anti-missile airborne laser program. Also, could you briefly explain the differences between the two laser types for me?

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

I never knew about the NKC-135 until today. I always thought YAL-1 was the only anti-missile airborne laser program. Also, could you briefly explain the differences between the two laser types for me?

I'm glad I can introduce you to the NC-135, YAL-1 is/was an anti-ICBM. Chemical lasers use various chemicals like chlorine gas ad such to make a reaction that produces heat and then an excited state happens yadda yadda and then boom a powerful continuous gas laser in the infrared is produced.

Now a solid state laser is as it sounds as well uses solid state emitters and fiber optic lasers in combination to create a powerful continuous beam. All the laser producing planes thus far that I know of have been chemical, which creates issues such as wasteful and toxic chemical byproduct, deadly chemicals that the crew may be introduced to. However, it creates a more powerful laser much easily in relation to solid-states, but solid states are a bit easier to build from what I've read in the past.

 

[Dan]

I'm glad I can introduce you to the NC-135, YAL-1 is/was an anti-ICBM. Chemical lasers use various chemicals like chlorine gas ad such to make a reaction that produces heat and then an excited state happens yadda yadda and then boom a powerful continuous gas laser in the infrared is produced.

Now a solid state laser is as it sounds as well uses solid state emitters and fiber optic lasers in combination to create a powerful continuous beam. All the laser producing planes thus far that I know of have been chemical, which creates issues such as wasteful and toxic chemical byproduct, deadly chemicals that the crew may be introduced to. However, it creates a more powerful laser much easily in relation to solid-states, but solid states are a bit easier to build from what I've read in the past.

Thanks. 👍 In theory, could you build a hybrid system that takes advantage of the positive aspects in both lasers?

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Thanks. 👍 In theory, could you build a hybrid system that takes advantage of the positive aspects in both lasers?

I don't think so, well I mean someone smarter than me would have to answer that. But the current systems both use some emitter as the medium to produce a powerful continuous laser with the help of smaller lasers.

 

[Venom800tt]

The only other type of viable weapons grade laser is the free-electron laser, which is being pushed by the US Navy for use on ships. It has the potential to be more powerful than even chemical lasers like COIL.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

The only other type of viable weapons grade laser is the free-electron laser, which is being pushed by the US Navy for use on ships. It has the potential to be more powerful than even chemical lasers like COIL.

Yeah it does, but from what I saw they still need much time to research it. Also Solid State lasers are already in use on Naval Destroyers.

 

[Venom800tt]

Yeah it does, but from what I saw they still need much time to research it. Also Solid State lasers are already in use on Naval Destroyers.

Right now, the main problem with the FEL is the size of particle accelerators. Although that may change soon.
And from what my brother told me (he is a sailor on a destroyer), they removed the laser from his ship after testing was completed. No idea when they will start outfitting them as standard equipment.

 

[TenEightyOne]

It could, but it's already used:

That's a military plane though (see the roundel under the wing). They have four operated by the Amiri flight for VIP stuff/support.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Right now, the main problem with the FEL is the size of particle accelerators. Although that may change soon.
And from what my brother told me (he is a sailor on a destroyer), they removed the laser from his ship after testing was completed. No idea when they will start outfitting them as standard equipment.

Yeah luckily I got to learn a bit about this first hand, my physics professor actually does FEL work for the university I go to and is well known for his research in it, well well known in those crowds. That's the only reason I know about it. He's working on condensing the size or the application, which seems to be what everyone is doing no matter what type of laser they specialize in.

edit: wanted to make sure you didn't misunderstand me, what is on Destroyers right now are solid state, LaWS weapons not anything FEL. LaWS already went through it's initial trails and is now being used as a weapon at sea but with some experimentation to it IIRC.

 

[Venom800tt]

Yeah, I know all about LaWS. All the current (or near current) combat capable lasers are solid state diode lasers. Although, I think there is a COIL one for land use that Northrop Grumman was trying to sell. I might be confusing that NG unit for a solid state laser though...

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Yeah, I know all about LaWS. All the current (or near current) combat capable lasers are solid state diode lasers. Although, I think there is a COIL one for land use that Northrop Grumman was trying to sell. I might be confusing that NG unit for a solid state laser though...

I know there is one land based on that was in New Mexico I think or California at an AFB, but last time I saw or heard anything about it was when it "supposedly shot at some unknown object in the upper atmosphere". Read into that what you will.

 

[Dan]

Is there a specific name for the person who directs aircraft to taxiways with the illuminated cones? I can't seem to find the name.

 

[Swagger897]

Is there a specific name for the person who directs aircraft to taxiways with the illuminated cones? I can't seem to find the name.

It's just ground crew.

Edit:

Or more correctly, ramp agents. Usually they are contracted workers by either the airline or the airport itself.

 

[Dan]

It's just ground crew.

Not just ramp marshall or aircraft marshall? The wikipedia page for the latter matches what I described.

 

[Swagger897]

Not just ramp marshall or aircraft marshall? The wikipedia page for the latter matches what I described.

Ahh, I see... Much different than the person I was thinking about.

Marshall is correct for what you're looking for. I was thinking about a mere ground member at the edge of the wings during pushback.

 

[Omnis]

Also, when the Air Force eventually retire both aircraft, could commercial business like UPS or FedEx use these to transport mail?

No, because parcel freight can be more cheaply loaded onto regular airliners in ULDs. These are strategic military transporters, so if they had a life post-AF, it'd have to be with a company that flies heavy equipment and other huge freight. And then they'd be better served by something with a lighter airframe and more efficient engines anyway. You don't need a bigass load ramp or airdrop capability on your plane if you're FedEx.

 

[Omnis]

I saw this old bird land the other day. Uglyass skyvan ftw.

 

[Carlos]

I saw this old bird land the other day. Uglyass skyvan ftw.

That paint isn't really helping. Looks like an old caravan Saw that thing for the first time in August, didn't knew what I was looking at!

"Germany’s parliament has been informed by the Ministry of Defense that Airbus intents to replace certain components in the A400M during regular maintenance and upgrades after cracks were discovered in a French aircraft."
Click here for the full story

"An official from Russian Helicopters told RIA Novosti that the company’s Mi-24K testbed will soon test speeds in excess of 240kts."
Click here for the full story

"Royal Air Force Eurofighters currently undertaking the NATO’s Baltic Air Policing mission in Estonia have been scrambled for the first time on May 12."
Click here for the full story

"The JSF Integrated Test Force at Edwards Air Force Base has started a series of tests to assess the tail hook of the F-35A."
Click here for the full story

"THE PENTAGON – The Marine Corps intends to add improved sensors and precision-strike capability to its entire KC-130J Super Hercules tanker/transport plane and MV-22 Osprey tiltrotor fleets, applying the “Harvest Hawk” concept to make both aircraft more multi-mission, the deputy commandant of the Marine Corps for aviation told USNI News this week."
Click here for the full story

 

[SPhilli911]

Don't have exact times yet, but this afternoon, there will be a "flyby" of an Airbus A320neo powered by Pratt & Whitney's PurePower PW1100G-JM engines over Pratt Middletown and East Hartford, Connecticut facilities (also West Palm Beach Florida today too). Usually pretty cool, they get fairly low. I'm curious how quiet it will be.

Flight times and flight paths will be released soon, I'll update if anyone is in the area and cares.

Update: The plane will fly over both CT Pratt facitilites at around 12:45 PM.

Double update: I watched the plane fly over, it was about 800 feet overhead and it circled the campus a few times and the thing snuck up on us, you could hardly hear it. Pretty surprising to say that about a passenger jet. I have a video, but it is super poor quality, I'll post once home. That, or I'll wait til Pratt publishes photos and video. PurePower is most definitely the future!

 

[Carlos]

https://theaviationist.com/2016/05/...ake-off-from-andersen-air-force-base-in-guam/

"
At 08.30AM LT on May 19, a B-52H Stratofortress bomber belonging to the 69th Expeditionary Bomb Squadron, crashed on the flightline at Andersen AFB, in Guam.

All the 7 crew members egressed the plane safely."

------

 

[wfooshee]

That article about the B-52 crash was perhaps the most useless piece of "news" I've ever seen. Granted, it's way to early to know what caused it, no way to know yet what failure or systems problem the aircraft may have experienced.

But three sentences: it crashed, everybody got out, and its home base is in North Dakota.

Then FOUR TIMES as much text outlining other crashes at or around the base.

So bleeping what?!?!?!? If all you can do is fill column-inches, then why not put up some sports scores or something. The relevance would have been the same!

 

[Dan]

There's been a lot of rumbling in my area the past few days, likely from heavy military aircraft. Yesterday, I saw two C-17s flying together, although separated by several miles. Less than ten minutes ago, I witnessed a KC-10 Extender making a long turn over my house. Where are all the fighters, dammit?!

EDIT: Apparently, the B-52 mentioned above was on takeoff when it crashed. More info will be coming soon as to what caused it to crash, but the B-2 Spirit of Kansas also crashed during takeoff in 2008. That was due to a computer error resulting in the plane pitching up harder than it should have at a lower speed.

 

[Carlos]

http://www.ekathimerini.com/208882/...-dispatched-as-airline-pilots-fail-to-respond

So I went searching a bit and read that the Soviet Union shot down a passenger jet in '83 with a Su-15.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_Air_Lines_Flight_007