Transgender Thread.

[Daniel]

I suppose I can't tell then.

Go back to the video you posted above with the larger-bodied, purple haired trans women with a deeper voice. I'm going to ask some questions like I did before. Just like before, they're rhetorical. I'm not asking you to answer each and every one, but I would appreciate you sharing your thoughts on the last question that I have bolded.

Why do you think she was not a 'legitimate' trans person?
Was it because she was fat?
Was it because she was older?
Was it because she was balding?
Was it because her voice was low?
Was it because you could easily tell she was assigned male at birth?
What do you think would make her a 'legitimate' trans person in your eyes?

 

[ScottPuss20]

Go back to the video you posted above with the larger-bodied, purple haired trans women with a deeper voice. I'm going to ask some questions like I did before. Just like before, they're rhetorical. I'm not asking you to answer each and every one, but I would appreciate you sharing your thoughts on the last question that I have bolded.

Why do you think she was not a 'legitimate' trans person?
Was it because she was fat?

No

Was it because she was older?

No

Was it because she was balding?

No

Was it because her voice was low?

Yes

Was it because you could easily tell she was assigned male at birth?

Yes

What do you think would make her a 'legitimate' trans person in your eyes?

Someone with breasts. Wait, that would mean that women who had them removed due to cancer aren't women. ****.

 

[Daniel]

Someone with breasts. Wait, that would mean that women who had them removed due to cancer aren't women. ****.

Do you think that's fair for someone who feels the exact same way but can't afford breast implants or estrogen for home-grown breasts?

What about a cis man (i.e. someone assigned male at birth and believes himself to be a man) who has gynaecomastia? He has breasts?

What do you think is needed for someone -- who genuinely wants to be a woman but just happened to be born a man?

 

[TexRex]

Yeah and?

It's idiotic, moronic, and/or imbecilic. It also ignores biological reality.

Very special indeed.

Yep.

 

[ScottPuss20]

Do you think that's fair for someone who feels the exact same way but can't afford breast implants or estrogen for home-grown breasts?

No.

What about a cis man (i.e. someone assigned male at birth and believes himself to be a man) who has gynaecomastia? He has breasts?

Yeah that's where my reasoning falls flat.

What do you think is needed for someone -- who genuinely wants to be a woman but just happened to be born a man?

I don't even know anymore.

 

[Daniel]

No.

Yeah that's where my reasoning falls flat.

I don't even know anymore.

Right, so taking those thoughts into consideration, do you think it's possible that she is still a legitimate woman (I'm not using Matt Walsh's definition on account of the fact he doesn't even bring gender into the question):

• happens to be transgender
• didn't realise until she was older
• might not be able to afford surgeries?

 

[ScottPuss20]

Right, so taking those thoughts into consideration, do you think it's possible that she is still a legitimate woman (I'm not using Matt Walsh's definition on account of the fact he doesn't even bring gender into the question):

• happens to be transgender
• didn't realise until she was older
• might not be able to afford surgeries?

I'm never going to be fully convinced of it but if that's what they want, that's what they should get. I don't get to decide based on my views, which I now realise has a tonne of holes in it.

 

[novcze]

Actually, it's not.

"Sex change" surgery is "gender-affirming", because it changes the presentation of the body from the sex that doesn't match the gender to the one that does. It "affirms" the gender.

Yes, that’s the correct terminology—'sex change surgery.' Gender is affirmed by aligning it with the individual’s sex.

Then how do you define 'sex'?

For me it's primary sex characteristics. Male primary sex characteristics are the penis, the scrotum and the ability to ejaculate when matured. Female primary sex characteristics are the vulva, vagina, uterus, fallopian tubes, cervix, and the ability to give birth and menstruate when matured.

The reason I ask is because you imply here that sex seems to be based on biological reality, but you later agree that it can be changed via legal means.

Not what I wrote and wrong context. People can do whatever they want without conforming to expectations associated with their sex, except where biological reality is a limiting factor—for example, a male/man cannot bear a child.
Legal sex change is different because, even if you are legally female after sex change surgery, you still cannot bear a child.

 

[Daniel]

Yes, that’s the correct terminology—'sex change surgery.' Gender is affirmed by aligning it with the individual’s sex.

For me it's primary sex characteristics. Male primary sex characteristics are the penis, the scrotum and the ability to ejaculate when matured. Female primary sex characteristics are the vulva, vagina, uterus, fallopian tubes, cervix, and the ability to give birth and menstruate when matured.

Not what I wrote and wrong context. People can do whatever they want without conforming to expectations associated with their sex, except where biological reality is a limiting factor—for example, a male/man cannot bear a child.
Legal sex change is different because, even if you are legally female after sex change surgery, you still cannot bear a child.

When you say 'gender is affirmed' in which case -- how do you define gender?