Turn 10 Confirms Microtransaction Plans for Forza 7

[Ialyrn]

Anyone defending this decision, must not play mobile games. While I do play them, I have always enjoyed console game because I didn't have to use micro transactions to play the game.

But then a few years ago something happened that changed that called DLC. Now you buy half a game at launch and "micro transact" the rest of the game or you buy 90% for an inflated price and still have a few DLC packs you have to purchase later.

Adding in this new system is a major fear to me. Not just for FM series games but look at Bethesda now. Everyone is jumping on this new wagon.

You can defend it by saying it's not needed now, but that's now. Wait a few games.. there was a time when controversial DLC wasn't needed to enjoy a full game but now that has changed, and we haven't even noticed. We just pick up the ultra deluxe special goty edition and purchase whatever else is needed like it's whatever.

Tomorrow will be the same I fear, only you will be buying the game, the dlc, and the currency to play the game. Will you have to? Probably not. Will the future renditions be as enjoyable without it? Probably not..

In the end all I'm saying is go play ESO without a single purchase.. you can do it. But it's not fun at all. Or play ANY mobile game without purchasing stuff.

Tldr; itroducing micro transactions may be OK now but in a few renditions it will become a monster you cannot enjoy without spending big.

I can see it now when the term "whale" comes to the console world..

DLC and Microtransactions are not the same thing. Also, game expansions and additional content have been around for years. Take Sonic 3 for example, Sonic and knuckles was originally intended to be included as part of the Sonic 3 experience. Due to the price of manufacture for the cartridge capacity required, Sega decided it best to separate the 2 and sell Sonic and Knuckles as an expansion (with some extra stuff thrown in on top). Duke Nuken 3d... another case of a game receiving additional content after release, the vast majority of which can now be enjoyed in the digital release. Games have had DLC in some form or another far longer than people realise, it is far from a new invention in regards to video games, or even gaming in general. People where paying for expansions to table top RPG games like Dungeons and Dragons for years, it is a method of creating content that brings in extra income for a business; which allows them to keep making more content. It is a sound business model, whether people like it or not.

The same can be said for micro transactions, it brings income for a business because some are willing to part with their cash; and so it becomes a good business model for a company to use. Right or wrong, what earns money will always be the deciding factor for a company.

 

[Sage Ages]

Compared to what, PD? It was almost $200 to buy the jaguar XJ13 in GT6 when they first had that micro transaction debacle. That's for one freaking car.

It was the exact same price as it was in GT5. No one was complaining about it then.

 

[V12orchestra]

That is what made the first couple of Forza Motorsport games great to play. The fact you had to play the game to unlock and buy cars and upgrades, it made it fun, made it a challenge, and allowed the player to set their own goal posts with what they wanted to earn the credits for.

What challenge ? If i can buy that car with 10-20 euros that's not a challenge . Don't know about FM7 but modern games like PUGB are the worst because you have to play x amount of hours (usually up to 50) and pray that RNG gods give you the damn jacket or hat you want but HEY YOU CAN SPEND 1000 dollars and buy it from a player ! That's a steal . It is way worse than DLCs because they make you think that you can get a game feature for free but that's not the case . And by the way i bought that game but i sometimes regret my decision and i will never buy loot crates . Jim Sterling on Youtube explains this very well , he has a lot of videos on this topic .

God i never thought i would have defended DLCs but here we are .

 

[bremics]

It wouldnt be so bad if they were priced sensibly but T10 are known for their insane extremely expensive pricing.

Eh, post Xbone yeah.

In FM4 for example, $5 could get you 3 (or more) of the most expensive cars in the game. It was worse in FH but you could still get some super expensive cars.

In FM5 I think $5 was worth a Honda Civic.

Also, those utter ***** did in fact nerf VIP... utter bastards.

 

[V12orchestra]

Eh, post Xbone yeah.

In FM4 for example, $5 could get you 3 (or more) of the most expensive cars in the game. It was worse in FH but you could still get some super expensive cars.

In FM5 I think $5 was worth a Honda Civic.

Also, those utter ***** did in fact nerf VIP... utter bastards.

The best way to end this joke is to ignore those in game transactions . And ignore season pass as well since they added less cars this time . The models are the same of FH3 and FM6 so they didn't rebuild them from scratch .
But of course this is just an advice . The game is definitely worth it . It's the greed behind that is bad .

 

[FordGTGuy]

Everyone ignoring Forza Rewards... of course.

Don't buy them and they'll go away.

Either way, what if someone can buy a super rare car for 20 Euros? Are they faster for it? No.

You can also use just the normal mods to get pretty giant credit boosts.

 

[bremics]

Lol Reddit is amusing as hell

 

[aurcom]

Same loot crap, different pile of game.

 

[AudiMan2011]

MTs are always unacceptable in $60 games but T10 usually plays the economy so they're not needed. But the consumable VIP stuff and loot boxes are a much bigger negative.

But what really sickens me is the fact there are some consumers out there who will actively DEFEND loot boxes despite it being essentially being incentivized gambling. Those who don't realise that are what sicken me about the attitudes of today's generation of gamers who demand instant gratification.

 

[FordGTGuy]

We are using in-game currency, it isn't gambling.

If you could only buy the crates with real money you might have a point, or if it was hard to get enough credits to buy the crates.

As is a mod crate is 20k credits and gives you enough mod cards to easily make back many times that amount.

 

[bremics]

We are using in-game currency, it isn't gambling.

So, what you're saying is I should make a slotmania type game using bitcoins? Since its not gambling since you're not using real money?

+edit
According to my bro this is already a thing. ****.

 

[V12orchestra]

MTs are always unacceptable in $60 games but T10 usually plays the economy so they're not needed. But the consumable VIP stuff and loot boxes are a much bigger negative.

But what really sickens is the fact there are some consumers out there who will actively DEFEND loot boxes despite it being essentially being incentivized gambling. Those who don't realise that are what sicken me about the attitudes of today's generation of gamers who demand instant gratification.

They defend this s. because they like the game. They jump to conclusions and they say that you hate the game and you are whiner because you criticize something which is definitely not right . Forza Motorsport 6 had microtransactions but they were not important because you could gain millions quite easily .

 

[FordGTGuy]

So, what you're saying is I should make a slotmania type game using bitcoins? Since its not gambling since you're not using real money?

Last I checked, bitcoins are real money.

If you made a "slotmania" game where you only used money earned in the game to play it, it wouldn't be gambling.

I honestly don't care about the MT, some will buy them and that's their choice but the game doesn't make it hard to make money.

Mod cards that make easy profits, Forza rewards that literally throw money at you, drivatar rewards that throw daily money at you and you profit from tune and paintjob usage.

 

[V12orchestra]

We are using in-game currency, it isn't gambling.

If you could only buy the crates with real money you might have a point, or if it was hard to get enough credits to buy the crates.

As is a mod crate is 20k credits and gives you enough mod cards to easily make back many times that amount.

People sell loot crates of PUGB for 1000 dollars and they contain certain items which are almost impossible to get if you play the game . So there is definitely a business behind loot crates . This is not the case for FM7 but imho it's getting worse in this game as well . They locked the cars not to make a sense of progression in the game but to earn money with microtransactions . It's pretty clear and considering they gain with DLCs and stuff this doesn't put T10 and MS in a good light .

 

[Ialyrn]

They defend this s. because they like the game. They jump to conclusions and they say that you hate the game and you are whiner because you criticize something which is definitely not right . Forza Motorsport 6 had microtransactions but they were not important because you could gain millions quite easily .

I am pretty sure that for most in this thread, this sort of racing game list is a familiar sight. I think we can all agree microtransactions are scummy, T10 usually give those of us who do not like/want them the ability to hide them. Either way it is a non issue, as I cant see T10 implementing a system where users need to buy them to play the game.

 

[FordGTGuy]

They locked the cars not to make a sense of progression in the game but to earn money with people .

Why not both?

Funny watching people get mad because they implemented unlockable content.

Last I checked you can rent any car in the game from the start.

 

[V12orchestra]

I am pretty sure that for most in this thread, this sort of racing game list is a familiar sight. I think we can all agree microtransactions are scummy, T10 usually give those of us who do not like/want them to hide them. Either way it is a non issue, as I cant see T10 implementing a system where users need to buy them to play the game.

Codemasters are the most fair developers at least in recent years . They don't charge money for additional content , the game is the full package with maybe 1 or 2 cars as preorder bonus and i don't think they have the same budget as SMS or T10 .
Unlockable content is GT4 career , everyone has to complete a race of 24 hours to get X car without some kind of exploit with real money .

 

[FordGTGuy]

I just love everyone in here bitching about earning credits when:

1. Forza Rewards
2. Drivatar Rewards
3. Paintjob earnings
4. Tuning earnings
5. Mods with huge credit bonuses
6. Credit bonuses on leveling
7. Forzathon credit bonuses(free cars)

Still exist.

If Turn 10 were as scummy with MT as you guys make them out to be, none of those would exist.

Hell when you buy a car you get the default homologation upgrades for free, and you get the option to get a McLaren F1 for free at the very start of the game.

 

[V12orchestra]

I just love everyone in here bitching about earning credits when:

1. Forza Rewards
2. Drivatar Rewards
3. Paintjob earnings
4. Tuning earnings
5. Mods with huge credit bonuses
6. Credit bonuses on leveling
7. Forzathon credit bonuses(free cars)

Still exist.

If Turn 10 were as scummy with MT as you guys make them out to be, none of those would exist.

"I opened 30 Lucky Car Crate and got 0 Legendary Car. I'll just let that sink in"

And correct me if am wrong but those legendary cars are the ones that you have to unlock and this guy just bought those crates . I got this from reddit . They took away VIP bonuses as well so if you buy it it's worthless because you get like 3 crates .

 

[FordGTGuy]

"I opened 30 Lucky Car Crate and got 0 Legendary Car. I'll just let that sink in"

And correct me if am wrong but those legendary cars are the ones that you have to unlock and this guy just bought those crates . I got this from reddit . They took away VIP bonuses as well so if you buy it it's worthless because you get like 3 crates .

I never said what they implemented was perfect but let's not pretend as if they neutered the ability to earn money in the game.

I also never defended what they did with VIP.

 

[ITR Motorsports]

I bought one of the $300K crates last night thinking I would get a supercar or something of the like. Got a Cadillac ATS-V, not the Forza Special, just the standard Cadillac, and some non-memorable mod cards.... Avoid like the plague...

 

[ImaRobot]

P2W

Realize the difference between pay to win and pay to speed a system. Getting a car isn't making you win, as skill comes into the picture. A better driver without the car can very much blow them out if the water with ease. Another fact is that you can literally attain the same cars without paying, so that automatically goes against that. Pay to win crates would be giving you a significant step up that you wouldn't be able to get by just playing, which is literally not the case.

 

[SPhilli911]

Not sure how I feel about this yet. From what I can tell so far playing FM7 is that cars will be tough to collect, whereas in FM6 it was easy to get pretty much everything by playing normal career mode. I don't mind a little grinding to get the cars I want, but if it becomes almost impossible to obtain cars I want without tokens or endless grinding, then there is a problem.

Other Forzas had tokens too, but there was never really a need for them. Hope that is the case in 7.

 

[Sander 001]

We are using in-game currency, it isn't gambling.

If you could only buy the crates with real money you might have a point, or if it was hard to get enough credits to buy the crates.

As is a mod crate is 20k credits and gives you enough mod cards to easily make back many times that amount.

You're mistaken, it is gambling. It doesn't matter if you're putting your stamp collection on the line, your kid's bike or your mom's pearl necklace. It doesn't have to be real currency, just as long as it has value.
And just because you place a lower perceived value on it personally, doesn't change the fact that it is gambling.

 

[FordGTGuy]

You're mistaken, it is gambling. It doesn't matter if you're putting your stamp collection on the line, your kid's bike or your mom's pearl necklace. It doesn't have to be real currency, just as long as it has value.
And just because you place a lower perceived value on it personally, doesn't change the fact that it is gambling.

Is it technically gambling? Sure; is it really gambling? no...

 

[Sander 001]

Is it technically gambling? Sure; is it really gambling? no...

Yeah you can keep repeating the same thing but it doesn't make you any less wrong. This is legit gambling especially since you're gambling with values greater than money.

 

[Joey D]

Yeah you can keep repeating the same thing but it doesn't make you any less wrong. This is legit gambling especially since you're gambling with values greater than money.

It's not gambling at this time, at least not per the legal definition. Gambling requires you to wager material goods to win material goods, typically money. Right now players are using fake currency to win digital prizes with credits they earned in the game. There's no actual money or goods exchanging hands. Right now it's more of a "mini game" than anything else.

Once tokens are introduced though, then yes, it'll be gambling to some degree if you can use those tokens to buy crates. However, I'm not really sure the legality of it since you aren't actually winning anything material. If you could convert those tokens back into money though, then there would be an issue.

I'm sure the MS and T10 legal team have looked over the plans though.

 

[urmie]

It's not gambling at this time, at least not per the legal definition. Gambling requires you to wager material goods to win material goods, typically money. Right now players are using fake currency to win digital prizes with credits they earned in the game. There's no actual money or goods exchanging hands. Right now it's more of a "mini game" than anything else.

Once tokens are introduced though, then yes, it'll be gambling to some degree if you can use those tokens to buy crates. However, I'm not really sure the legality of it since you aren't actually winning anything material. If you could convert those tokens back into money though, then there would be an issue.

I'm sure the MS and T10 legal team have looked over the plans though.

When this was being discussed with Shadow of War, I said the ESRB should just mark such games, with illegal gambling (real world money for a shot at the slot machine), as Ao (Adults Only). Watch their sales drop, but we all know that won't happen.

 

[The Chosen One]

Forza needs some threatening competition again.

The reason I believe they've over-driven the money milking is that no franchise can really touch them right now. For now, I still deeply regret dropping $100 on this game.

surprise discussion link

 

[GumShoe]

So..

It's entirely optional
It provides no advantage
The game is balanced otherwise
You can get all the content legit anyway
It's not gambling.

Now please explain then why it actually is necessary at all, particularly in the form of loot boxes rather than just spend x CR for y reward/content?