Update 2.10 - Major PP changes

  • Thread starter crazy206
  • 774 comments
  • 70,623 views
Why do we have to have 500pp, 450pp and 550pp as some kind of normal value?
Can't we lower the PP in races to match the new PP settings? Like 470pp is the new 500pp and 530 is the new 550pp (taking as example, figures not to be taken as real proposals). I think that can make the PPrestricted races more balanced. There is no need to stick to old PP values in races.
 
400pp races got ridiculously unbalanced, before, every car had a chance, now, FR vehicles simply fly on the straights... because they have over 220hp, against FF/4WD/MR with 150hp. Simply ridiculous, or you drive a FR, or you can't stand a chance.
 
Mulan
Why do we have to have 500pp, 450pp and 550pp as some kind of normal value?
Click to expand...

We don't. The issue is when we had cars that were already competitive with each other at a certain PP but now are supposedly balanced even though they are at different PP levels.
 
DarkAvengerZR1
400pp races got ridiculously unbalanced, before, every car had a chance, now, FR vehicles simply fly on the straights... because they have over 220hp, against FF/4WD/MR with 150hp. Simply ridiculous, or you drive a FR, or you can't stand a chance.
Click to expand...


Here's the official quote from PD regarding the upadte;

"Adjusted performance point calculations to correct an issue where the speed of cars in races with PP (Performance Point) restrictions would be matched unfairly."


So they've fixed the issue of some cars having more speed than others, by making all FR cars have more speed than others! If you don't think about it, it makes perfect "PD-Sense". What planet are they on? :ouch:
 
Step tune your cars, and see what happens. I've been step tuning all my motors since the 2.06 update. During the time that I was developing the WGTC series I noticed something about the PP system. I developed a rough formula to break it down and I found the PP group system. I made a chart with these group numbers. Before the update when I stepped tuned my cars only up to a stage 2 motor every car was within their respective group running at 100%. Now with the update every car I tested are still within their group and others are one point in or out of a group.

After a major change like this and my cars are still falling within their respective PP group is pretty dang good. Pending on the what motor mod is added the car will move up two to three groups. If any of you decide to down load the chart to see how it works and if you don't understand just do a oil change with a new car. See where is falls at in a group then go from there. The chart works..
 
Mulan
Why do we have to have 500pp, 450pp and 550pp as some kind of normal value?
Can't we lower the PP in races to match the new PP settings? Like 470pp is the new 500pp and 530 is the new 550pp (taking as example, figures not to be taken as real proposals). I think that can make the PPrestricted races more balanced. There is no need to stick to old PP values in races.
Click to expand...

That's completely not the issue with these changed values, and it's not like the 450/500/550PP regulations can't, aren't or weren't changed before.
Those are just used the most since they're convenient round numbers people can prepare cars for beforehand, unlike say entering a 467PP room (unless you coincidentally prepared a bunch of 467PP cars for some reason).

The issue is that some of the same cars people used before in a certain PP number restricted room and which could be made to match can't be made to match within the same level of PP, basically meaning that the cars now still are evenly matched and perform the same as before but have a different PP number, meaning they have become an artificial mismatch for no apparant reason.
 
OK, will it let me paste this much?

If a value is blank, i haven't checked it yet. If there is for example 27.5 , it means I had with two or more cars, one with a -27 change and another with a -28 change.

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-49	Mazda MX-5 J-Limited (NA, J) ’91
-49	Mazda MX-5 J-Limited II (NA, J) ’93
-47	Mazda MX-5 Miata (NA) ’89
-28	Mazda MX-5 Miata 1.8 RS (NB, J) ’98
-6	Mazda MX-5 Miata 1600 NR-A (NB, J) ’04
-5	Mazda MX-5 Miata 1800 RS (NB, J) ’00
-6	Mazda MX-5 Miata 1800 RS (NB, J) ’04
-50	Mazda MX-5 Miata J-Limited (NA, J) ’91
	Mazda MX-5 Miata J-Limited II (NA, J) ’93
-50	Mazda MX-5 Miata SR-Limited (NA, J) ’97
-49	Mazda MX-5 Miata S-Special I (NA, J) ’95
-49	Mazda MX-5 Miata S-Special Type I (NA, J) ’95
-50	Mazda MX-5 Miata VR-Limited (NA, J) ’95
-50	Mazda MX-5 Miata V-Special II (NA, J) ’93
-49	Mazda MX-5 S-Special Type I (NA, J) ’95
-49	Mazda MX-5 SR-Limited (NA, J) ’97
-49	Mazda MX-5 VR-Limited (NA, J) ’95
	Mazda MX-5 V-Special II (NA, J) ’93
0	Mazda MX-Crossport Concept ’05
0	Mazda Protegé ’02
-27.5	Mazda Roadster 1.8 RS (NB) ’98
-5	Mazda Roadster 1600 NR-A (NB) ’04
-6	Mazda Roadster 1800 RS (NB) ’00
-6	Mazda Roadster 1800 RS (NB) ’04
	Mazda Roadster RS (NC) ’07
-37	Mazda Roadster TC
-51	Mazda RX-7 GT-LIMITED (FC, J) ’85
-53	Mazda RX-7 GT-X (FC) ’90
-52	Mazda RX-7 GT-X (FC, J) ’90
-7	Mazda RX-7 LM Race Car
	Mazda RX-7 Spirit R Type A (FD) ’02
-7	Mazda RX-7 TC (Touring Car)
	Mazda RX-7 Type R (FD, J) ’91
	Mazda RX-7 Type R (FD, J) ’93
-7	Mazda RX-7 Type R Bathurst R (FD) ’01
-6	Mazda RX-7 Type RS (FD) ’00
-6	Mazda RX-7 Type RS (FD) ’98
-7	Mazda RX-7 Type R-S (FD, J) ’95
-6	Mazda RX-7 Type RS (FD, J) ’96
-7	Mazda RX-7 Type RS-R (FD) ’97
-6	Mazda RX-7 Type RZ (FD) ’00
-7	Mazda RX-7 Type RZ (FD, J) ’92
	Mazda RX-7 Type RZ (FD, J) ’93
-6	Mazda RX-7 Type RZ (FD, J) ’95
-6	Mazda RX-7 Type RZ (FD, J) ’96
-6	Mazda RX-8 ’03
-6	Mazda RX-8 Concept (Type-I) ’01
-6	Mazda RX-8 Concept (Type-II) ’01
-7	Mazda RX-8 Concept LM Race Car
-5.5	Mazda RX-8 Type E ’03
-6	Mazda RX-8 Type S ’03
	Mazda RX-8 Type S ’07
-52	Mazda SAVANNA RX-7 GT-Limited (FC) ’85
-53	Mazda SAVANNA RX-7 INFINI III (FC) ’90
0	McLaren F1 ’94
	McLaren MP4-12C ’10
-53	Mercedes-Benz 190 E 2.5 – 16 Evolution II ’91
-61	Mercedes-Benz 190 E 2.5 – 16 Evolution II Touring Car ’92
-56	Mercedes-Benz 300 SL Coupe ’54
0	Mercedes-Benz A 160 Avantgarde ’98
	Mercedes-Benz C 63 AMG ’08
-54	Mercedes-Benz CL 600 ’00
-56	Mercedes-Benz CLK 55 AMG ’00
-58	Mercedes-Benz CLK Touring Car ’00
	Mercedes-Benz CLK-LM Race Car ’98
-32	Mercedes-Benz E 55 AMG ’02
0	Mercedes-Benz Sauber Mercedes C9 Race Car ’89
-54	Mercedes-Benz SL 500 (R129) ’98
-6	Mercedes-Benz SL 500 (R230) ’02
	Mercedes-Benz SL 55 AMG (R230) ’02
-56	Mercedes-Benz SL 600 (R129) ’98
-55	Mercedes-Benz SL 600 (R230) ’04
-56	Mercedes-Benz SL 65 AMG (R230) ’04
-6	Mercedes-Benz SLK 230 Kompressor ’98
	Mercedes-Benz SLR McLaren (19inch Wheel Option) ’09
0	Mercedes-Benz SLR McLaren ’03
	Mercedes-Benz SLS AMG ’10
-59	Mercury Cougar XR-7 ’67
0	MG MGF ’97
	MG TF160 ’03
	Mine’s BNR34 SKYLINE GT-R N1 base ’06
0	Mine’s BNR34 SKYLINE GT-R V-spec N1 base ’00
0	Mine’s LANCER EVOLUTION VI ’00
0	Mini Mini Cooper 1.3i ’98
0	MINI COOPER S ’02
	MINI COOPER S ’05
	MINI COOPER S ’07
0	Mini MINI COOPER ’02
	Mini MINI COOPER S ’02
	Mini MINI COOPER S '11
0	Mini MINI COOPER S Countryman '11
0	MINI ONE ’02
0	Mitsubishi 3000GT MR (J) ’95
0	Mitsubishi 3000GT MR (J) ’98
0	Mitsubishi 3000GT SL (J) ’95
0	Mitsubishi 3000GT SL (J) ’96
0	Mitsubishi 3000GT SL (J) ’98
0	Mitsubishi 3000GT SR (J) ’95
0	Mitsubishi 3000GT SR (J) ’96
0	Mitsubishi 3000GT SR (J) ’98
0	Mitsubishi 3000GT VR-4 (J) ’98
0	Mitsubishi 3000GT VR-4 Turbo (J) ’95
0	Mitsubishi 3000GT VR-4 Turbo (J) ’96
0	Mitsubishi 3000GT VR-4 Turbo (J) ’98
0	Mitsubishi AIRTREK Turbo-R ’02
0	Mitsubishi COLT 1.5 Sport X Version ’02
	Mitsubishi CZ-3 Tarmac ’01
0	Mitsubishi CZ-3 Tarmac Rally Car
0	Mitsubishi ECLIPSE GT ’06
0	Mitsubishi ECLIPSE GT ’95
0	Mitsubishi ECLIPSE Spyder GTS ’03
0	Mitsubishi FTO GP Version R ’97
0	Mitsubishi FTO GP Version R ’99
0	Mitsubishi FTO GPX ’94
0	Mitsubishi FTO GPX ’97
0	Mitsubishi FTO GPX ’99
	Mitsubishi FTO GR ’94
0	Mitsubishi FTO GR ’97
0	Mitsubishi FTO Super Touring Car
0	Mitsubishi GALANT 2.0 DOHC Turbo VR-4 ’89
-50	Mitsubishi GALANT GTO MR ’70
0	Mitsubishi GTO SR ’95
0	Mitsubishi GTO SR ’96
0	Mitsubishi GTO SR ’98
0	Mitsubishi GTO Twin Turbo ’95
0	Mitsubishi GTO Twin Turbo ’96
0	Mitsubishi GTO Twin Turbo ’98
0	Mitsubishi GTO Twin Turbo MR ’95
0	Mitsubishi GTO Twin Turbo MR ’98
	Mitsubishi HSR-II Concept ’89
0	Mitsubishi i Concept ’03
	Mitsubishi i-MiEV ’09
-38	Mitsubishi Lancer 1600 GSR ’74
-42	Mitsubishi Lancer 1600 GSR Rally Car ’74
0	Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution GSR ’92
0	Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution II GSR ’94
0	Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution III GSR ’95
	Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution IV GSR ’96
0	Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution IV Rally Car ’97
	Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution IX GSR ’05
	Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution IX GSR ’05 RM
0	Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution Super Rally Car ’03
0	Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution V GSR ’98
0	Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution VI GSR ’99
	Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution VI GSR T.M. SPC ’99
0	Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution VI GSR T.M. ’00
0	Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution VI Rally Car ’99
0	Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution VI RS ’99
0	Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution VI RS T.M. ’00
0	Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution VII GSR ’01
0	Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution VII GT-A ’02
0	Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution VII RS ’01
0	Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution VIII GSR ’03
0	Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution VIII MR GSR ’04
0	Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution VIII RS ’03
	Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution X GSR PP ’07
0	Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution X TC (Touring Car)
	Mitsubishi Lancer EX 1800GSR IC Turbo ’83
0	Mitsubishi LEGNUM VR-4 Type V ’98
0	Mitsubishi MINICA DANGAN ZZ ’89
0	Mitsubishi MIRAGE 1400GLX ’78
0	Mitsubishi MIRAGE CYBORG ZR ’97
0	Mitsubishi PAJERO Evolution Rally Raid Car ’03
0	Mitsubishi PAJERO Rally Raid Car ’85
0	Mitsubishi STARION 4WD Rally Car ’84
-6	Mugen MUGEN S2000 ’00
	NISMO 270R ’94
0	NISMO 400R ’96
-21	NISMO Fairlady Z S-tune (Z33) ’02
	NISMO Fairlady Z Z-tune (Z33) ’03
	NISMO GT-R LM Road Going Version ’95
0	NISMO Skyline GT-R R-tune (R34) ’99
	NISMO Skyline GT-R S-tune (R32) ’00
-53	Nissan 180SX Type X ’96
-51	Nissan 200SX (S14) ’96
-53.5	Nissan 200SX ’96
-58	Nissan 240RS Rally Car ’85
-52	Nissan 240SX (S14) ’96
-54	Nissan 240SX ’96
-52	Nissan 240ZG (HS30) ’71
-41	Nissan 300ZX 2by2 (Z32) ’98
-41	Nissan 300ZX 2seater (Z32) ’89
-41	Nissan 300ZX 2seater (Z32) ’98
-20	Nissan 350Z (Z33, EU) ’03
-20	Nissan 350Z (Z33, US) ’03
	Nissan 350Z Concept LM Race Car
-28	Nissan 350Z Gran Turismo 4 Ltd. (Z33) ’05
-40	Nissan 350Z Roadster (Z33, EU) ’03
-40	Nissan 350Z Roadster (Z33, US) ’03
	Nissan 370Z Tuned Car ’08
0	Nissan Be-1 ’87
	Nissan BLUEBIRD 1600 Deluxe (510) ’69
-48.5	Nissan BLUEBIRD Hardtop 1800SSS (910) ’79
-52	Nissan BLUEBIRD Rally Car (510) ’69
-6	Nissan Calsonic IMPUL GT-R (SUPER GT) ’08
-59	Nissan CALSONIC SKYLINE ’00
0	Nissan CALSONIC SKYLINE GT-R Race Car ’93
0	Nissan CUBE EX (FF/CVT) ’02
0	Nissan CUBE X ’98
-59	Nissan C-WEST RAZO SILVIA ’01
0	Nissan EXA CANOPY L.A.Version Type S ’88
-53.5	Nissan Fairlady 2000 (SR311) ’68
-51.5	Nissan Fairlady 240ZG (HS30) ’71
	Nissan Fairlady Z (Z34) ’08
-51	Nissan Fairlady Z 280Z-L 2seater (S130) ’78
-55	Nissan Fairlady Z 300ZX (Z31) ’83
	Nissan Fairlady Z 300ZX TT 2seater (Z32) ’89
-41	Nissan Fairlady Z 300ZX Ver. R TT 2by2 (Z32) ’98
-41	Nissan Fairlady Z 300ZX Ver. S TT 2seater (Z32) ’98
	Nissan Fairlady Z Concept LM Race Car
	Nissan Fairlady Z Roadster (Z33) ’03
-29	Nissan Fairlady Z Version S (Z33) ’02
	Nissan Fairlady Z Version S (Z33) ’07
-28	Nissan Fairlady Z Version ST (Z33) ’02
0	Nissan FALKEN*GT-R Race Car ’04
0	Nissan GRAN TURISMO SKYLINE GT-R (Pace) ’01
0	Nissan GRAN TURISMO SKYLINE GT-R ’01
	Nissan GT-R ’07
	Nissan GT-R Black edition '12
	Nissan GT-R Black Mask
0	Nissan GT-R Concept (Tokyo Motor Show 2001) ’01
	Nissan GT-R Concept LM Race Car
0	Nissan GT-R N24 GT Academy '12
	Nissan GT-R N24 Schulze Motorsport '11
	Nissan GT-R Proto ’05
0	Nissan GT-R R35 TC (Touring Car)
	Nissan GT-R SpecV (GT Academy Version) ’09
	Nissan GT-R SpecV ’09
0	Nissan Leaf G '11
	Nissan LOCTITE ZEXEL GT-R ’00
0	Nissan March 12c 5door ’03
0	Nissan March 12SR ’07
0	Nissan March G# ’99
	Nissan MICRA ’03
	Nissan mm-R Cup Car ’01
-7	Nissan MOTUL AUTECH GT-R ’08
-14	Nissan MOTUL PITWORK Z ’04
-34	Nissan OPTION Stream Z ’04
0	Nissan PAO ’89
	Nissan PENNZOIL Nismo GT-R ’99
-46	Nissan PENNZOIL ZEXEL GT-R ’01
0	Nissan PRIMERA 2.0Te ’90
0	Nissan PRIMERA 20V (EU) ’01
0	Nissan PRIMERA 20V ’01
0	Nissan R390 GT1 Race Car ’98
0	Nissan R390 GT1 Road Car ’98
	Nissan R89C Race Car ’89
	Nissan R92CP Race Car ’92
	Nissan SILEIGHTY ’98
-47	Nissan SILVIA (CSP311) ’65
	Nissan SILVIA 240RS (S110) ’83
-51	Nissan SILVIA K’s (S13) ’88
	Nissan SILVIA K’s (S13) ’91
-53.5	Nissan SILVIA K’s AERO (S14) ’93
-52	Nissan SILVIA K’s AERO (S14) ’96
	Nissan SILVIA K’s Dia Selection (S13) ’90
	Nissan SILVIA Q’s (S13) ’88
	Nissan SILVIA Q’s (S13) ’91
-50	Nissan SILVIA Q’s AERO (S14) ’93
-49	Nissan SILVIA Q’s AERO (S14) ’96
	Nissan SILVIA spec-R AERO (S15) ’02
-53	Nissan SILVIA spec-R AERO (S15) ’99
	Nissan SILVIA spec-R AERO (S15) ’02 RM
-48	Nissan SILVIA spec-S AERO (S15) ’99
-49	Nissan SILVIA Varietta (S15) ’00
-46.5	Nissan SKYLINE 1500Deluxe (S50D-1) ’63
-50	Nissan SKYLINE 2000GT-B (S54A) ’67
-51.5	Nissan SKYLINE 2000GT-R (KPGC110) ’73
	Nissan SKYLINE Coupe 350GT ’03
	Nissan SKYLINE Coupe 370GT Type SP ’07
0	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R (R32) ’89
	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R (R32) ’91
	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R (R33) ’95
0	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R (R33) ’96
	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R (R33) ’97
0	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R (R34) ’00
0	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R (R34) ’99
0	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R M.N.P III (R34) '00
0	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R M.N.P. II (R34) ’99
0	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R M•spec (R34) ’01
0	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R M•spec Nür (R34) ’02
0	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R N1 (R32) ’91
	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R N1 (R33) ’95
0	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R R32 TC
0	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R R33 TC
0	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R R34 TC
0	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R V•spec (R32) ’93
	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R V•spec (R33) ’95
0	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R V•spec (R33) ’96
	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R V•spec (R33) ’97
	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R V•spec (R34) ’99
	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R V•spec II (R32) ’94
0	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R V•spec II (R34) ’00
0	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R V•spec II N1 (R34) ’00
	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R V•spec II Nür (R34) ’02
	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R V•spec LM Limited (R33) ’96
	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R V•spec N1 (R32) ’93
0	Nissan SKYLINE GT-R V•spec N1 (R34) ’99
-52	Nissan SKYLINE GTS25 Type S (R32) ’91
	Nissan SKYLINE GTS-R (R31) ’87
	Nissan SKYLINE GTS-t Type M (R32) ’89
	Nissan SKYLINE GTS-t Type M (R32) ’91
	Nissan SKYLINE HT 2000 RS-X Turbo C (R30) ’84
-54	Nissan SKYLINE HT 2000 Turbo RS (R30) ’83
-52	Nissan SKYLINE HT 2000GT-R (KPGC10) ’70
-21	Nissan SKYLINE Sedan 300GT ’01
	Nissan SKYLINE Sedan 350GT Type SP ’06
-20.5	Nissan SKYLINE Sedan 350GT-8 ’02
-48	Nissan SKYLINE Sport Coupe (BLRA-3) ’62
0	Nissan STAGEA 25t RS FOUR S ’98
	Nissan STAGEA 260RS AutechVersion ’98
-7	Nissan WOODONE ADVAN Clarion GT-R ’08
-45	Nissan XANAVI HIROTO GT-R ’01
-23	Nissan XANAVI NISMO GT-R ’03
-6	Nissan XANAVI NISMO GT-R ’08
	Nissan XANAVI NISMO Z ’06
-7	Nissan YellowHat YMS TOMICA GT-R ’08
-57	Opel Astra Touring Car (Opel Team Phoenix) ’00
1	Opel Calibra Touring Car ’94
0	Opel Corsa Comfort 1.4 ’01
	Opel Speedster ’00
0	Opel Speedster Turbo ’00
0	Opel Tigra 1.6i ’99
0	Opel Vectra 3.2 V6 ’03
-29	Opera Performance 350Z ’04
	Opera Performance S2000 ’04
0	Oullim Motors Spirra 4.6 V8 '04
	Oullim Motors Spirra Prototype ’04
0	Pagani Zonda C12 ’00
	Pagani Zonda C12S ’00
	Pagani Zonda C12S 7.3 ’02
0	Pagani Zonda LM Race Car
	Pagani Zonda R ’09
-62	Panoz Esperante GTR-1 Race Car ’98
	Pescarolo Courage – Judd GV5 Race Car ’04
	Pescarolo Courage C60 – Peugeot Race Car ’03
0	Pescarolo C60 Hybride – Judd Race car ’05
0	Peugeot 106 Rallye ’03
	Peugeot 106 S16 ’03
0	Peugeot 205 Turbo 16 ’85
	Peugeot 205 Turbo 16 Evolution 2 Rally Car ’86
0	Peugeot 205 Turbo 16 Rally Car ’85
	Peugeot 206 CC ’01
0	Peugeot 206 Rally Car ’99
0	Peugeot 206 RC ’03
	Peugeot 206 S16 ’99
	Peugeot 207 GTi ’07
	Peugeot 307 CC Premium AVN ’04
	Peugeot 307 XSi ’04
	Peugeot 905 Race Car ’92
-7	Peugeot 908 HDi FAP – Team Oreca Matmut ’10
-7	Peugeot 908 HDi FAP – Team Peugeot Total ’10
0	Peugeot coupé 406 3.0 V6 ’98
-59	Plymouth Cuda 440 Six Pack ’71
	Plymouth Superbird ’70
-51	Pontiac GTO 5.7 Coupe ’04
	Pontiac Solstice Coupe Concept ’02
0	Pontiac Sunfire GXP Concept ’02
	Pontiac Tempest Le Mans GTO ’64
0	Pontiac Vibe GT ’03
	RE Amemiya AMEMIYA ASPARADRINK RX7 (JGTC) ’04
	RE Amemiya Amemiya AsparaDrink RX7 ’06
	RE Amemiya RE Amemiya FD3S RX-7
	Renault 5 Maxi Turbo Rally Car ’85
0	Renault 5 Turbo ’80
0	Renault AVANTIME ’02
	Renault Megane 2.0 16V ’03
0	Renault Megane 2.0 IDE Coupe ’00
0	Renault Sport Clio Renault Sport 2.0 16V ’02
	Renault Sport Clio Renault Sport Trophy Race Car ’00
0	Renault Sport Clio Renault Sport V6 24V ’00
0	Renault Sport Clio Renault Sport V6 Phase 2 ’03
	Renault Sport Lutecia Renault Sport 2.0 16V ’02
0	Renault Sport Lutecia Renault Sport Trophy Race Car ’00
0	Renault Sport Lutecia Renault Sport V6 24V ’01
	Renault Sport Lutecia Renault Sport V6 Phase2 ’03
	Renault Sport Megane Renault Sport ’08
-51	RUF 3400S ’00
0	RUF BTR ’86
0	RUF CTR “Yellow Bird” ’87
0	RUF CTR2 ’96
0	RUF RGT ’00
	Saleen S7 ’02
-27	Scion FR-S '12
0	Scion xA ’03
0	Scion xB ’03
0	Seat Ibiza Cupra ’04
	Shelby Cobra 427 ’66
-60	Shelby GT350R ’65
-7	Shelby Series One Super Charged ’03
	Spoon CIVIC TYPE R (EK) ’00
	Spoon CR-Z
	Spoon FIT Race Car ’03
0	Spoon INTEGRA TYPE R (DC2) ’99
	Spoon S2000 ’00
-6	Spoon S2000 Race Car ’00
	Spyker C8 Laviolette ’01
-27.5	Subaru BRZ S '12
	Subaru CUSCO DUNLOP SUBARU IMPREZA ’08
-31	Subaru CUSCO SUBARU ADVAN IMPREZA ’03
0	Subaru IMPREZA Coupe 22B-STi Version ’98
0	Subaru IMPREZA Coupe WRX typeR STi Version VI ’99
	Subaru IMPREZA Rally Car ’01
0	Subaru IMPREZA Rally Car ’03
0	Subaru IMPREZA Rally Car ’99
0	Subaru IMPREZA Rally Car Prototype ’01
	Subaru IMPREZA Sedan WRX STI (18inch BBS Wheel Option) ’10
0	Subaru IMPREZA Sedan WRX STi ’02
	Subaru IMPREZA Sedan WRX STI ’10
	Subaru IMPREZA Sedan WRX STi ’94
	Subaru IMPREZA Sedan WRX STi spec C ’04
0	Subaru IMPREZA Sedan WRX STI spec C Type RA ’05
	Subaru IMPREZA Sedan WRX STI spec C Type RA ’05 RM
0	Subaru IMPREZA Sedan WRX STi Version ’00
0	Subaru IMPREZA Sedan WRX STi Version II ’95
0	Subaru IMPREZA Sedan WRX STi Version III ’96
0	Subaru IMPREZA Sedan WRX STi Version IV ’97
0	Subaru IMPREZA Sedan WRX STi Version V ’98
0	Subaru IMPREZA Sedan WRX STi Version VI ’99
0	Subaru IMPREZA Sport Wagon STi ’00
	Subaru IMPREZA Sport Wagon WRX STi Version VI ’99
	Subaru IMPREZA Super Touring Car
0	Subaru IMPREZA TC
	Subaru IMPREZA WRC 2008
	Subaru IMPREZA WRX STI (18inch BBS Wheel Option) ’07
	Subaru IMPREZA WRX STI ’07
0	Subaru IMPREZA WRX STi Prodrive Style ’01
0	Subaru LEGACY B4 2.0GT ’03
0	Subaru LEGACY B4 2.0GT spec.B ’03
0	Subaru LEGACY B4 3.0R ’03
0	Subaru LEGACY B4 Blitzen ’00
0	Subaru LEGACY B4 RSK ’98
0	Subaru LEGACY Touring Wagon 2.0GT ’03
0	Subaru LEGACY Touring Wagon 2.0GT spec.B ’03
0	Subaru LEGACY Touring Wagon 3.0R ’03
0	Subaru LEGACY Touring Wagon GT-B ’96
0	Subaru SUBARU 360 ’58
0	Suzuki ALTO LAPIN Turbo ’02
0	Suzuki ALTO WORKS RS-Z ’97
0	Suzuki ALTO WORKS SUZUKI SPORT LIMITED ’97
	Suzuki Cappuccino (EA11R) ’91
	Suzuki Cappuccino (EA21R) ’95
-5	Suzuki Cappuccino (EA21R) ’95 RM
	Suzuki CERVO SR ’07
	Suzuki CONCEPT-S2 ’03
0	Suzuki ESCUDO Dirt Trial Car ’98
0	Suzuki GSX-R/4 Concept ’01
	Suzuki Kei WORKS ’02
0	Suzuki MR Wagon Sport ’04
	Suzuki SWIFT Sport ’05
	Suzuki SWIFT Sport ’07
	Suzuki SX4 WRC ’08
0	Suzuki WAGON R RR ’98
	Tesla Motors Tesla Roadster ’08
-54	Tom’s X540 CHASER ’00
0	Tommykaira ZZII ’00
-3	Tommykaira ZZ-S ’00
-52.5	Toyota 2000GT ’67
	Toyota 2010 Brian Vickers #83 CAMRY
	Toyota 2010 Denny Hamlin #11 CAMRY
	Toyota 2010 Joey Logano #20 CAMRY
	Toyota 2010 Joey Logano #20 CAMRY
	Toyota 2010 Kyle Busch #18 CAMRY
	Toyota 2011 Brian Vickers #83 CAMRY
	Toyota 2011 Denny Hamlin #11 CAMRY
	Toyota 2011 Joey Logano #20 CAMRY
	Toyota 2011 Kyle Busch #18 CAMRY
	Toyota 86 GT '12
-50	Toyota ALTEZZA AS200 ’98
-51	Toyota ALTEZZA Gita AS300 ’01
-53	Toyota ALTEZZA RS200 ’98
-54	Toyota ALTEZZA Touring Car
-55	Toyota ARISTO 3.0V ’91
	Toyota ARISTO V300 ’00
-30	Toyota ARISTO V300 Vertex Edition ’00
	Toyota au CERUMO Supra ’01
0	Toyota bB 1.5Z X Version ’00
0	Toyota Caldina GT-Four '02
	Toyota CARINA ED 2.0 X 4WS ’89
	Toyota Castrol TOM’S SUPRA ’00
-15	Toyota Castrol TOM’S SUPRA ’01
	Toyota Castrol TOM’S SUPRA ’97
-49.5	Toyota CELICA 1600GT (TA22) ’70
	Toyota CELICA 2000GT-FOUR (ST165) ’86
	Toyota CELICA 2000GT-R (ST162) ’86
	Toyota CELICA GT-FOUR (ST205) ’98
0	Toyota CELICA GT-FOUR Rally Car (ST185) ’95
	Toyota CELICA GT-FOUR Rally Car (ST205) ’95
0	Toyota CELICA GT-FOUR RC (ST185) ’91
0	Toyota CELICA GT-R (ST183, 4WS) ’91
0	Toyota CELICA SS-II (ST202) ’97
	Toyota CELICA SS-II (ZZT231) ’99
-52	Toyota CELICA XX 2800GT ’81
0	Toyota COROLLA LEVIN BZ-R ’98
	Toyota COROLLA LEVIN GT-APEX (AE86) ’83
0	Toyota COROLLA Rally Car ’98
0	Toyota COROLLA RUNX Z AEROTOURER ’02
-15	Toyota DENSO SARD SUPRA GT ’00
	Toyota FT-86 Concept ’09
	Toyota FT-86 G SPORTS Concept ’10
-27	Toyota FT-86 II Concept ’11
-7	Toyota GT-ONE Race Car (TS020) ’99
	Toyota ist 1.5S ’02
0	Toyota MINOLTA Toyota 88C-V Race Car ’89
	Toyota MR2 1600 G ’86
0	Toyota MR2 1600 G-Limited Super Charger ’86
0	Toyota MR2 G-Limited ’97
0	Toyota MR2 GT-S ’97
0	Toyota MR2 Spyder (6MT) ’02
0	Toyota MR2 Spyder ’99
	Toyota MR-S S Edition ’99
0	Toyota MR-S V Edition (6MT) ’02
0	Toyota PRIUS G (J) ’02
	Toyota PRIUS G ’09
	Toyota PRIUS G Touring Selection (J) ’03
0	Toyota PRIUS TC
0	Toyota RSC ’01
	Toyota RSC Rally Raid Car
	Toyota SERA ’92
-55	Toyota SOARER 2.5GT-T ’97
-41	Toyota SOARER 430SCV ’01
-15.5	Toyota SPORTS 800 ’65
0	Toyota SPRINTER TRUENO BZ-R ’98
-43	Toyota SPRINTER TRUENO GT-APEX (S. Shigeno Ver.) ’00
	Toyota SPRINTER TRUENO GT-APEX ’83
0	Toyota STARLET Glanza V ’97
	Toyota SUPERAUTOBACS APEX MR-S ’00
-53	Toyota SUPRA 2.5GT Twin Turbo R ’90
	Toyota SUPRA 3.0GT Turbo A ’88
	Toyota SUPRA RZ ’97
-50	Toyota SUPRA SZ-R ’97
	Toyota Tacoma X-Runner ’04
0	Toyota Toyota 7 Race Car ’70
	Toyota VITZ F ’99
	Toyota VITZ RS 1.5 ’00
	Toyota VITZ RS 1.5 ’07
0	Toyota VITZ RS Turbo ’02
	Toyota VITZ U Euro Sport Edition ’00
0	Toyota VOLTZ S ’02
	Toyota WEDSSPORT CELICA ’03
0	Toyota WiLL VS ’01
	Toyota WOODONE TOM’S SUPRA ’03
0	Toyota Yaris F (J) ’99
0	Toyota Yaris RS 1.5 (J) ’00
0	Toyota Yaris RS Turbo (J) ’02
0	Toyota Yaris U Euro Sport Edition (J) ’00
	Toyota YellowHat YMS Supra ’05
	TRD CELICA TRD Sports M (ZZT231) ’00
	TRIAL CELICA SS-II (ZZT231) ’03
	Triumph Spitfire 1500 ’74
-67	TVR Cerbera Speed 12 ’00
-56	TVR Cerbera Speed 6 ’97
	TVR Griffith 500 ’94
	TVR T350C ’03
-7	TVR Tamora ’02
	TVR Tuscan Speed 6 ’00
-7	TVR Tuscan Speed 6 ’00 RM
	TVR V8S ’91
	Vauxhall Astra Super Touring Car ’00
	Vauxhall Calibra Super Touring Car ’94
0	Vauxhall Corsa Comfort 1.4 ’01
0	Vauxhall Tigra 1.6i ’99
0	Vauxhall Vectra 3.2 V6 ’03
0	Vauxhall VX220 ’00
0	Vauxhall VX220 Turbo ’00
	Volkswagen Beetle 1100 Standard (Type-11) ’49
0	Volkswagen Bora V6 4MOTION ’01
0	Volkswagen Golf I GTI ’76
	Volkswagen Golf IV GTI ’01
	Volkswagen Golf IV GTI ’01 RM
	Volkswagen Golf IV R32 ’03
	Volkswagen Golf V GTI ’05
	Volkswagen Golf VI R '10
0	Volkswagen Karmann Ghia Coupe (Type-1) ’68
35	Volkswagen Kubelwagen typ82 ’44
	Volkswagen Lupo Cup Car ’00
	Volkswagen Lupo GTI ’01
	Volkswagen Lupo GTI Cup Car (J) ’03
0	Volkswagen Lupo1.4 ’02
	Volkswagen New Beetle 2.0 ’00
	Volkswagen New Beetle Cup Car ’00
	Volkswagen New Beetle RSi ’00
0	Volkswagen Polo GTI ’01
	Volkswagen Schwimmwagen typ166 ’42
0	Volkswagen Scirocco R '10 
	Volkswagen typ2(T1) SambaBus ’62
-7	Volkswagen W12 Nardo Concept ’01
0	Volkswagen 1200 '66
	Volvo 240 GLT Estate ’88
	Volvo C30 R-Design ’09
0	Volvo S60 T-5 Sport ’03
 
Last edited:
analog
That's completely not the issue with these changed values, and it's not like the 450/500/550PP regulations can't, aren't or weren't changed before.
Those are just used the most since they're convenient round numbers people can prepare cars for beforehand, unlike say entering a 467PP room (unless you coincidentally prepared a bunch of 467PP cars for some reason).

The issue is that some of the same cars people used before in a certain PP number restricted room and which could be made to match can't be made to match within the same level of PP, basically meaning that the cars now still are evenly matched and perform the same as before but have a different PP number, meaning they have become an artificial mismatch for no apparant reason.
Click to expand...

I understand this, but isnt that the way PD wants to even things up? By setting lower or higher PP restriction you take some cars out that were strong before and others go up instead. If a maxtuned car goes from 500pp to 460pp then adjust PP setting to 460 instead and see what happens. I guess other cars that were maxtuned and had like 550pp and then were set down to 500pp through enginesetting will have trouble at 460pp or will be more competitive. So question is which PP restriction number PD has been focusing on when they did this PP balancemodification?

By the way: played seasonal race 500GT with 600PP max. Some cars in it were above 600pp. Dont know if that was so before. And its (for me) tough to win them now, my Yellowbird is set to 600PP and its a lot harder to win now.Dont know if that is because PP settings are changed but its fun!
 
Wow, 50-60 pp swing is ALOT!

Some cars needed it, I love the c-west razo Silvia, but it was never competitive before, so I'm happy it's better.

Some cars I'm ok with, the Aston Martin v8 vantage it soo fast but handles soo bad that most cars pass it in the corners making for a crazy, but fair, race on most tracks.

But some cars were very formidable before. The ruf 3400 and Mercedes evo road car were my favorites and very fast, now with 50 less pp they are insanely fast!

Then some cars were just left alone. C12 gets a pp slash but the corvette doesn't. They are very similar and based off the same car. Some jags get a slash but astons like the v12 dlc don't.

Just not very comprehensive pd!
 
Mulan
I understand this, but isnt that the way PD wants to even things up? By setting lower or higher PP restriction you take some cars out that were strong before and others go up instead. If a maxtuned car goes from 500pp to 460pp then adjust PP setting to 460 instead and see what happens. I guess other cars that were maxtuned and had like 550pp and then were set down to 500pp through enginesetting will have trouble at 460pp or will be more competitive. So question is which PP restriction number PD has been focusing on when they did this PP balancemodification?
Click to expand...

There was no need to balance it other than doing it to exactly those cars which indeed had too much or too little PP, which they didn't.
I entered my fully tuned BreezeFrees cars in 500PP (Sports tyres) rooms multiple times and they were very competitive and I won several times, now they're about 470PP, which would mean they'd probably run rings around other cars in 460PP rooms if those other cars people mostly used before in those rooms haven't had an equally significant reduction in PP.

Which means it just doesn't only affects 500PP rooms but those below as well.
 
Spagetti69
Blaming users who are just working within the parameters of the game that PD created doesn't excuse PD IMHO.
Obviously PD aren't intentionally trying to annoy people and want to improve the experience. So they deserve some slack.

However the "Evolution" of the game, if we can call it that is a issue that the users are in no way responsible.

Imagine making changes to your cars ( some irreversible ). Then future patches have a negative effect on your pre patch changes. Quite an annoyance I would imagine.

Just my opinion.
Click to expand...

The major changed with the PP system in GT5 not GT5P was the addition of the power limiter. The power limiter was never attended for GT5, just only GT5P due to it was a test bed for GT5. 99.9% of the users wanted the power limiter in GT5 because they wanted to do the same thing as in GT5P. Once the limiter was unlocked users started de-tuning their maxed out cars so they’ll handle better. From there it was a snow ball effect. Users started finding cars that perform the best within pp number block as in 450, 500 and 650 and so on.

Over the two years the pp system changed three times, three times I say. And this changed was a big one for some due to 99.9% of you max out your cars then de-tune them to fit in a block. For the 1% it hasn't changed it just became clearer. PD and Kaz mad that first change to satisfy US not them US. So putting blame on the users is 100% justified. And now they made a change to the system to get the cars even closer and people want to complain about it.

I’m going to say it again. “Step tunes your cars” Not every car in the sim needs a stage 3 motor mod or turbo. Intelligently build the cars, don’t go waked out like some STAGE 3 motor junky.
 
You had to intelligently build your cars before this patch. Overly limited cars were already slower than properly setup ones.

Zuel
And now they made a change to the system to get the cars even closer and people want to complain about it.
Click to expand...

People are complaining because it doesn't actually do that. All PD had to do was raise the PP levels on the rabbit cars, which I'm sure they have the data for to know which ones usually win races online (and they've done it before for cars anyway). Shifting around portions of the car list but not touching those cars (and even lowering the PP on some of them) doesn't do much that doesn't deserve ire.
 
Last edited:
I've started to rebuild some PP data too on my side, on the mygranturismo.net database. What i've done so far :
- Copy all pre-2.10 values, and check all Premium and a few Standard to correct PP field.
- Display a message according to the state of data on each car page : changed, unchanged, value up to date, and not checked yet. With previous and current value when changed.
- Added a filter on the main cars list to show only confirmed changed so far
- Added a % change on that same list behind each pp value.
- Faded all PP value that haven't been checked after 2.10.

Wild Cobra Z28, do you work with a given "acceptable" state for Standard cars (ie 0 to 300 km range with or without oil change)? (which is not easy when it comes to Standard cars, i have a real problem here to rebuild the Standard PP base)
 
They went a little overboard in my opinion. Yes there were a few cars that needed some attention but how they came up with the numbers they did is beyond me.

Let's hope they come to their senses and do a fix very soon and this time put some real thought into what they do and make things better not just different.
 
Toronado
You had to intelligently build your cars before this patch. Overly limited cars were already slower than properly setup ones.



People are complaining because it doesn't actually do that. All PD had to do was raise the PP levels on the rabbit cars, which I'm sure they have the data for to know which ones usually win races online (and they've done it before for cars anyway). Shifting around portions of the car list but not touching those cars (and even lowering the PP on some of them) doesn't do much that doesn't deserve ire.
Click to expand...

The NEW PP system does work, it seems none of you are taking the time to see how it works. If you can't do that then you have no reason to complain.

Added comment.

If some of you were taking the time to see if the system correctly work. The GT 5 Performance Points thread would be flooded with comments buy now.
 
Last edited:
Blaming the users for a patch is ridiculous, I can possibly understand it being our fault that we manipulated the previous system but to say it's our fault that the fix is worse is, as I say, ridiculous.

Zuel
The NEW PP system does work, it seems none of you are taking the time to see how it works. If you can't do that then you have no reason to complain.
Click to expand...

Why don't you tell us all then, oh wise one.
 
Zuel
The NEW PP system does work, it seems none of you are taking the time to see how it works. If you can't do that then you have no reason to complain.
Click to expand...

So now not only is it my fault that PD changed how the system works, but I have completely restart my garage from scratch for cars that I had setup before or I can't take issue with the new system? How about the fact that I need to do that at all and we can work from there.


You keep saying it works and works and there are plenty of examples being shown that show there are problems, so what about those? You keep saying that it is forcing you to tune your cars intelligently ignoring that you already had to, so what about that?
 
There are really no more problems that I can see. Here is a challenge for the GTP community. Tune three cars of the different drive trans to the three PP groups. Break them in run them at 100% power. You can do what ever you want to the cars but you can not add a stage 3 motor, stage 3 turbo or a super charger. You'll see that the MR and FR will be around the beginning to the end of the groups and AWD cars will be right in the middle of the group. If a car is within 1 or out of 1 of a group add a stage 2 motor. If you have done everything correctly you see that the system works and my chart shows the PP groups.

Sorry for the groups LOL

1. 500/508
2. 542/550
3. 594/602

Now let see who the first to do it right.
 
Last edited:
Zuel
The major changed with the PP system in GT5 not GT5P was the addition of the power limiter. The power limiter was never attended for GT5, just only GT5P due to it was a test bed for GT5. 99.9% of the users wanted the power limiter in GT5 because they wanted to do the same thing as in GT5P. Once the limiter was unlocked users started de-tuning their maxed out cars so they’ll handle better. From there it was a snow ball effect. Users started finding cars that perform the best within pp number block as in 450, 500 and 650 and so on.

Over the two years the pp system changed three times, three times I say. And this changed was a big one for some due to 99.9% of you max out your cars then de-tune them to fit in a block. For the 1% it hasn't changed it just became clearer. PD and Kaz mad that first change to satisfy US not them US. So putting blame on the users is 100% justified. And now they made a change to the system to get the cars even closer and people want to complain about it.

I’m going to say it again. “Step tunes your cars” Not every car in the sim needs a stage 3 motor mod or turbo. Intelligently build the cars, don’t go waked out like some STAGE 3 motor junky.
Click to expand...

For starters, my PPs are set according to the seasonal events and online races, and since mostly are at rounded numbers (300/400/500/600/650) I set my cars to that.

I'm in that 1% who doesn't go stage 3 of both engine or weight on all cars, and still got problems with cars set to a specific pp, which some got too low and ironicaly started needing stage 3, which still wasn't enough to make some of them reach the pre-patch pp, needing to reduce their power and (sometimes) increasing weight to be able to reach another set pp. Namely my Nissan Skyline 2000 GT which had 350 pp and because of this patch I had to remove parts to reduce to 300 pp 👎

I only use the power limiter down to 98.5% to round the numbers, and if that doesn't do it I start removing parts. The reason I do that is because the power curve gets completly ruined and that affects the performance, power to weight ratio, and the way the gearbox is set.
If a car can't reach a higher or lower set pp, I just give up on it.

Turbos are another thing I usually don't use, unless I want to change the power curve. If the power curve is good enough for me, I tend to go N/A.

One more thing to meantion is the sometimes huge difference in Power/Weight ratio in cars of the same pp range. And example is of two cars with 350pp, where one has a crappy 8,64 and other, a decent 5,07.

And PD says it's ballanced?!
 
Spagetti69
Blaming users who are just working within the parameters of the game that PD created doesn't excuse PD IMHO.
Obviously PD aren't intentionally trying to annoy people and want to improve the experience. So they deserve some slack.

However the "Evolution" of the game, if we can call it that is a issue that the users are in no way responsible.

Imagine making changes to your cars ( some irreversible ). Then future patches have a negative effect on your pre patch changes. Quite an annoyance I would imagine.

Just my opinion.
Click to expand...
well put i've racing online since gt5 came out, and have really enjoyed the experience overall, however this latest patch seems to have negated hours and hours of tuning,testing tuning again to get my cars to where they were. now i have to do it again and find the new "ringer" cars? i don't know if i care to do it again, taking a break. the guys i regularly race with are equally frustrated and it shows in their gameplay. not a good thing. if it works don't fix it comes to mind. just my 2 cents
 
Zuel
There are really no more problems that I can see. Here is a challenge for the GTP community. Tune three cars of the different drive trans to the three PP groups. Break them in run them at 100% power. You can do what ever you want to the cars but you can not add a stage 3 motor, stage 3 turbo or a super charger. You'll see that the MR and FR will be around the beginning to the end of the groups and AWD cars will be right in the middle of the group. If a car is within 1 or out of 1 of a group add a stage 2 motor. If you have done everything correctly you see that the system works and my chart shows the PP groups.

Sorry for the groups LOL

1. 500/508
2. 542/550
3. 594/602

Now let see who the first to do it right.
Click to expand...

So what you're saying is if people use something PD provided to us in the game (stage 3 equipment) that is the reason the PP comes out flawed, and somehow that is our fault? For using what is given to us? What you are suggesting screams "workaround", it doesn't mean there isn't a problem because clearly if you're telling us not to use certain parts if we want competitive cars, it is.

That also still doesn't explain all of the cars that aren't well matched BONE STOCK.
 
Zuel
you can not add a stage 3 motor, stage 3 turbo or a super charger.
Click to expand...

That's all fine and dandy and I'm not knocking your work. If this is true then the option to add these should be removed yes?

What I mean is if this is the way to go why have PD left the option in?

Edit beaten quite comprehensively.
 
Spagetti69
That's all fine and dandy and I'm not knocking your work. If this is true then the option to add these should be removed yes?

What I mean is if this is the way to go why have PD left the option in?

Edit beaten quite comprehensively.
Click to expand...

A year ago I said stated that the pp system had wholes in it. As for cars being BONE STOCK, if you do a oil change the car will fall into it's group.
 
Depending on which car is fastest around 500pp the rooms will be setup according to those cars. Guess all will be same in the end.

Might be a first PP change from PD to see how community responds. I bet there will be more fixes to this.
 
It seems that alot of racers on here are getting mixed up on what the PP system is intended for. Each car has different performance characteristics, strengths and weaknesses, and is assigned a PP rating from stock. My advice is go back to the dealership and look at cars in the 460-485pp range. I' m again going to use examples of extreme differences between the nsxr and the c63 amg. Both have similer stock pp ratings, however the c63 weighs nearly 500kg more than the nsxr and has the additional 200+ hp to help it out. Before, the c63 was highly overrated and when brought in line with nsxr would get crushed. Now it is more balanced. When tuning is involved, and the PP restriction set, the PP is to be used as an equalizer among ALL cars, big or small, high hp or low hp. Before the latest patch, the nsxr, m3 csl, and a few others were runaway cars which there should not be if there is an equalizer such as the PP system. Pp is a car to car rating, but when restricted in rooms it becomes a way to even the field among all cars. I still say it was the right move.
 
I assume its near impossible to find a working "balance of performance" - both in GT5 as in RL. In theory the new PP ratings have to work equally well on Tsukuba and Le Sarthe. And I highly doubt they will. I give you some chassis were a bit larger than life, and probably still are. But how many of the 1000 cars of GT5 can you fit in the same PP bracket through tuning? 20? 50? Throw in suspension tuning and you got a thousand or more variables to consider.

It's mission impossible in my book. So I'd rather say refine the concept of shuffle racing, or do spec races. But that would limit the choices of the player which car to use. Either way there's no "fair" PP.
 
ItsHim
I assume its near impossible to find a working "balance of performance" - both in GT5 as in RL. In theory the new PP ratings have to work equally well on Tsukuba and Le Sarthe. And I highly doubt they will. I give you some chassis were a bit larger than life, and probably still are. But how many of the 1000 cars of GT5 can you fit in the same PP bracket through tuning? 20? 50? Throw in suspension tuning and you got a thousand or more variables to consider.

It's mission impossible in my book. So I'd rather say refine the concept of shuffle racing, or do spec races. But that would limit the choices of the player which car to use. Either way there's no "fair" PP.
Click to expand...

I disagree with you here. The PP changes work best at a track that's balanced with straights and corners. If there's a track that doesn't have that balance, then you can't expect all the cars to be even. Before, all the best cars excelled in handling more than in speed unless you were racing at Sarthe. Now, speed is a little more important than handling. Some cars will win at some tracks and will lose in others. You can't use a NSX and dominate 98% of the time anymore. That's a huge plus for me.
 

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