US Soldier kills 16 civilians in Afghanistan-NOW WITH POLL

[berty1979]

A US soldier in Afghanistan has shot dead 16 civilians and wounded others after entering their homes in Kandahar province, Afghan and Nato sources say.
He reportedly left his base early in the morning to attack village homes. Nine children are among the dead.

I think this guy has had a breakdown and should be tried in his home country what does everyone else think?

 

[Milldrum]

Why did a guy that has had a breakdown have access to guns. I'm not talking about others safety, what about his own?

 

[Liquid]

After the koran burning farce, this is another reason for them to hate the US and the West in general.

 

[HOODFIELD]

I've been over there, and I've stayed in Kandahar. You don't just walk off base on your own free will, doesn't matter what time of the day it is, the average solider can't pull that off by himself. There is a side of the story we are not hearing.

 

[Milldrum]

I've been over there, and I've stayed in Kandahar. You don't just walk off base on your own free will, doesn't matter what time of the day it is, the average solider can't pull that off by himself. There is a side of the story we are not hearing.

Why did a guy that has had a breakdown have access to guns. I'm not talking about others safety, what about his own?

Why did he have gun/guns?

 

[HOODFIELD]

Why did he have gun/guns?

What do you mean? Everyone carries a weapon. It's the military. The breakdown happen after the fact I assume. Was he already a headcase beforehand? I did not read that anywhere.

 

[berty1979]

As above, you are carrying a weapon (or have access) when you have the breakdown. Things like this happened in the vietnam conflict. There are many reasons for it but fighting an almost invisible enemy that is causing attritional casualties while blending into the population can cause a lot of mental anguish. Some people cant take it and I believe he should be tried back in the US for this reason.

 

[Dotini]

A US soldier in Afghanistan has shot dead 16 civilians and wounded others after entering their homes in Kandahar province, Afghan and Nato sources say.
He reportedly left his base early in the morning to attack village homes. Nine children are among the dead.

I think this guy has had a breakdown and should be tried in his home country what does everyone else think?

The US President has declared he has the right to kill American citizens anywhere in the world without a trial or any kind of judicial sanction.

It would send a message to our Afghan allies - and to our own officers and soldiers - to have this errant soldier summarily executed in the village square.

Although this might be effective in temporarily restoring confidence in American reliability in the eyes of our allies, and saving some possibility of a graceful exit from Afghanistan, it would obviously be another step down the road to the unfettered tyranny of the US Executive branch. Why bother anymore with Judicial and Congressional branches when power can be so effectively concentrated in the hands and judgment of one individual?

You might think it a high crime or treason for the American President to go around killing anyone who irritates him. But no! The Congress and Judiciary are, in majority, on board and complicit in this scheme of extra-judicial liquidation of perceived threats to US interests.

Respectfully submitted,
Steve

 

[Bram Turismo]

It's almost as if some crazy, freaked out soldier decided to go out on a rampage and throw more fuel on the fire by doing this. It's as if they're asking for more hatred towards their country.

Sickening. What are the soldiers even doing there? Weren't they supposed to have left Afghanistan?

 

[Liquid]

What are the soldiers even doing there? Weren't they supposed to have left Afghanistan?

They/We haven't upturned every last stone for natural resources yet.

Oh wait, that's Iraq. I forget which countries we're in and why.

 

[Zenith]

The US President has declared he has the right to kill American citizens anywhere in the world without a trial or any kind of judicial sanction.

It would send a message to our Afghan allies - and to our own officers and soldiers - to have this errant soldier summarily executed in the village square.

Although this might be effective in temporarily restoring confidence in American reliability in the eyes of our allies, and saving some possibility of a graceful exit from Afghanistan, it would obviously be another step down the road to the unfettered tyranny of the US Executive branch. Why bother anymore with Judicial and Congressional branches when power can be so effectively concentrated in the hands and judgment of one individual?

You might think it a high crime or treason for the American President to go around killing anyone who irritates him. But no! The Congress and Judiciary are, in majority, on board and complicit in this scheme of extra-judicial liquidation of perceived threats to US interests.

Respectfully submitted,
Steve

Are you referring to the recent drone bombing of Anwar al-Awlaki? Because I heard that opinion from Colbert and disagree entirely. It was an act of war. Obama ordered a strike on a regional commander. That's an act of war, not an execution.

You want to have a public execution of an American soldier in a foreign country? Sorry, but no. It may win points over there, but how is that going to help if don't apply the morals we're trying to spread to ourselves.

 

[berty1979]

^^^Agreed^^^

 

[Dapper]

The US President has declared he has the right to kill American citizens anywhere in the world without a trial or any kind of judicial sanction.

It would send a message to our Afghan allies - and to our own officers and soldiers - to have this errant soldier summarily executed in the village square.

Although this might be effective in temporarily restoring confidence in American reliability in the eyes of our allies, and saving some possibility of a graceful exit from Afghanistan, it would obviously be another step down the road to the unfettered tyranny of the US Executive branch. Why bother anymore with Judicial and Congressional branches when power can be so effectively concentrated in the hands and judgment of one individual?

You might think it a high crime or treason for the American President to go around killing anyone who irritates him. But no! The Congress and Judiciary are, in majority, on board and complicit in this scheme of extra-judicial liquidation of perceived threats to US interests.

Respectfully submitted,
Steve

Did you miss this?

 

[Tornado]

You want to have a public execution of an American soldier in a foreign country? Sorry, but no. It may win points over there, but how is that going to help if don't apply the morals we're trying to spread to ourselves.

He was being satirical. Hence:

"Why bother anymore with Judicial and Congressional branches when power can be so effectively concentrated in the hands and judgment of one individual?"

Did you miss this?

I have to imagine he didn't miss it considering that was what he was talking about.

 

[Dapper]

I have to imagine he didn't miss it considering that was what he was talking about.

As usual, you couldn't be more wrong. He was talking about this http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/BILLS-112hr1540rh/pdf/BILLS-112hr1540rh.pdf

What I posted refutes what Dotini said, the typical Ron Paul anti-American rhetoric.

 

[Tornado]

Oh. I see. He was talking about HR1540, whereas you were talking about HR1540.


My mistake. Won't happen again.

 

[Dapper]

whereas you were talking about HR1540.

Why do you even bother?

Did you miss this?

*not hr1540*

Moreover, I want to clarify that my Administration will not authorize the indefinite military detention without trial of American citizens.

 

[Tornado]

Why do you even bother?

You want me to summarize that link for you, specifically Section 1022 which is what most people have a problem with?

"Don't worry guys. It was all Congress' fault that I have these awesome new powers, and I totally won't do those awesome new things that I'm now able to do."

Which, shockingly, isn't much in the way of reassurance.

 

[dxm8975]

This seems like the erratic US soldier murdered the local citizens to wreak his abhorrence toward the Afghanistan and its civilians on the people that came into his sight... The US congressional branches will still be negligent of the atrocious acts of the soldier and consider them to be tolerable insofar as the US doesn't cut in concerning attacks on the region.

 

[Dapper]

You want me to summarize that link for you, specifically Section 1022 which is what most people have a problem with?

"Don't worry guys. It was all Congress' fault that I have these awesome new powers, and I totally won't do those awesome new things that I'm now able to do."

Which, shockingly, isn't much in the way of reassurance.

1022 is the problem? The part that concerns "non-citizen detainees"? Give it up already.

 

[ExigeEvan]

It's almost as if some crazy, freaked out soldier decided to go out on a rampage and throw more fuel on the fire by doing this. It's as if they're asking for more hatred towards their country.

Sickening. What are the soldiers even doing there? Weren't they supposed to have left Afghanistan?

Or perhaps he lost it because he's seen his friends die, lose limbs and lose their families in all an effort to help a country which demands the deaths of Americans because a few books were accidentally burnt.

But hey, if you see nothing wrong with a country ruled by a religious mob, where women are second class citizens, plans are made to attack christians and the main export is opium (though admittedly this was a post-invasion issue) then fine.

 

[berty1979]

ExigeEvan
Or perhaps he lost it because he's seen his friends die, lose limbs and lose their families in all an effort to help a country which demands the deaths of Americans because a few books were accidentally burnt.

But hey, if you see nothing wrong with a country ruled by a religious mob, where women are second class citizens, plans are made to attack christians and the main export is opium (though admittedly this was a post-invasion issue) then fine.

This^^
What the guy did was sick and wrong but to understand why is impossible for most people, out of the hundreds of thousands of soldiers to rotate through the Afgan warzone one guy lost it. He should be repatriated, asessed then punished accordingly by his own people not thrown to a mob of baying villagers!

 

[Bram Turismo]

Or perhaps he lost it because he's seen his friends die, lose limbs and lose their families in all an effort to help a country which demands the deaths of Americans because a few books were accidentally burnt.

Which is why he breaks his way into homes and kills innocent people. Yeah, sounds reasonable. This makes him nothing better than the guy flying an Airbus into the WTC. There's just no excuse for killing completely innocent people.

 

[ExigeEvan]

Which is why he breaks his way into homes and kills innocent people. Yeah, sounds reasonable. This makes him nothing better than the guy flying an Airbus into the WTC. There's just no excuse for killing completely innocent people.

It's not an excuse, what he did was terrible, but I'd be certain he wasn't trying to "throw more fuel on the fire". And it's certainly not fair to put him in the same category as the rogue "kill squads" that were collecting human trophies.

 

[Azuremen]

Which is why he breaks his way into homes and kills innocent people. Yeah, sounds reasonable.

Pretty sure everyone is agreeing it isn't reasonable and is probably the result of a mental breakdown.

Which, by definition, tends to remove reasoning logically from any equation. Seems you can not grasp how a man could snap.

 

[Beeblebrox237]

Us needs to get out of Afghanistan. Now. Also, I think they should turn the man over to the Afghan government. It would help make us look better on the international stage. If one of their citizens killed a bunch of Americans we'd take him into custody and ignore their requests.

 

[hawkeye122]

So We burn books. Whoops. Obama apologizes, but why didnt he demand an apology when they KILLED soldiers who are protecting THEM? We didn't make any demands. And so one guy losses it. He should never have done that, but they couldn't have set up the situation any better than they did...

 

[Liquid]

If one of their citizens killed a bunch of Americans we'd take him into custody and ignore their requests.

He'd be in Guantanamo faster than you could utter 'The Hague' underneath the diplomatic bag over your face.

 

[MarinaDiamandis]

So We burn books. Whoops. Obama apologizes, but why didnt he demand an apology when they KILLED soldiers who are protecting THEM?

The taliban are the ones doing the killing, not the afghans. Please do not confuse them.

When afghan national army soldiers or afghan police have killed coalition soldiers, they have been cowardly, undercover taliban rebels waiting for their moment to strike.

Demanding an apology from the taliban would be like asking a bear to stop mauling your face... even if you still have a face left, it's pretty hopeless.

 

[Mike Rotch]

Which is why he breaks his way into homes and kills innocent people. Yeah, sounds reasonable. This makes him nothing better than the guy flying an Airbus into the WTC. There's just no excuse for killing completely innocent people.

As pointed out, the assumption he did this in a rational state of mind is highly likely to be incorrect. What is entirely likely is that he has had a PTSD-related mental breakdown; that is, the weight of gruesome experiences has finally outweighed his ability to cope. Result? New coping mechanism, or lashing out at the perceived source of mental trauma.

A time-limited troop withdrawal instead of an objective related troop withdrawal is and will always end in a mess; this and the Koran story just make it news sensational and give the general Afghan population discreet events to be angry at, instead of "damn you coalition forces!".

PTSD doesn't make what he did right, murder is wrong, but rather speaks to his ability to control his actions, which is no different to if a mental patient were to murder a fellow inmate. They won't get jail time, they will get more 'mental facility' time.