What PD Has Been Doing For 5 Years.....

[BenzAMG]

Would you be happy if that was all implemented in GT, BUT at the cost of the incredibly beautiful graphic detail they have acheived? Because I would imagine that is the first thing they would have to sacrifice in order to add stuff like that to the game...

No sacrifice, the new metal gear solid has better graphics and a lot more gameplay features. It's far superior to the old metal gear solid in every way.
A lot of games are a huge improvement because of the next gen consoles.
Forza 3(sorry to bring that up again) has graphics that are just a little bit behind the ones of GT5. If it can be done on the 360, why not on the more powerful PS3?

 

[Custer85]

It only has 8 cars on track, so there is allways sacrifice. I prefer to have more cars on track, than damage at all.

 

[Strittan]

GT1:
First Game of its type, pretty much the racinggame with the most cars, most customization and best physics on a console. TOCA Touringcars was close i might add, but it was lagging the feel of weight, which basicly is one of the best thing about GT1.

GT2:
They added more cars, more tracks and added offroad racing and
new replay options that revisit how you actually pressed your acceleration and brake buttons during the course of the game.

GT3:
Pretty much Gran Turismo 2 with less cars but better visuals and physics and with endurace races. They even had mechanical damage.

GT4:
Its GT3 with better visuals, more cars and special conditions (wet) tracks. Also they included ForceFeedback (iam not sure if GT3 allready had it, because i got my first ff wheel after GT4 was released)
And hybrid cars.

Endurance races were already featured in GT2. Mechanical damage was not in GT3, but in GT2. Yes, force feedback was already featured in GT3. Wet tracks were already in GT3 as well.

 

[BenzAMG]

There are so many little things that Gran Turismo doesn't have, yet crappy racegames had them for years. But this is al not in the game because of the graphics and the 16 cars on track?

Really, I expect more...

 

[Gerath]

Comparing MGS with GT5 is kinda strange .

A little bit ? If you are using monitor set on 1280x1024 - please set-up it 1024x768 Small difference ? Now lets count the cars...1...2...3...4...5...6....7...8.......oh my god there is no more cars in forza...maybe theye are hiding behind those beautiful mountains...or maybe not

Really, I expect more...

-

But lets back to the MGS case and compare it to GT5

"New" GT5 have damage, better physic (and 2 types of physic), more cars, more tracks, damage, incredibly modeled cars, in-cockpit view and i think few more things with i skipped (and even more additional features will be in full GT5) - if this is not a progress then i dont know how you name it .

Sorry for bad english.

 

[Blitz187]

No sacrifice, the new metal gear solid has better graphics and a lot more gameplay features. It's far superior to the old metal gear solid in every way.
A lot of games are a huge improvement because of the next gen consoles.
Forza 3(sorry to bring that up again) has graphics that are just a little bit behind the ones of GT5. If it can be done on the 360, why not on the more powerful PS3?

Ok, I see where youre coming from but I think Forza has also made certain sacrifices to fit other features into their game and the priorities of PD just differ greatly from those of Turn10, which makes sense. Two different business cultures and different companies with different aims... but that again is stating the obvious I think...

If you look at the progression of GT games though you will see significant improvement in each game... its just that things like Online gaming, livery editor, damage and tuning have become such a norm nowadays that its taken for granted and if a game doesnt have it, its automatcally labaled as sub-par... No matter how good the graphics are or that it runs at 60FPS in 1080P with cockpit views and the whole shabang...

 

[killanite]

Indeed. So I guess the key is not wasting 5 years but trying to do the best you can within 2 or 3 years - like 90% of developers out there. Nothing against " I need my time to make it perfect " if it actually is at least close to perfect then- which means to me : best on the market in most ways to date by a huge margin. Maybe GT 5 is. I don't think so, but I'll hope for the best.

Well you're assuming that PD did nothing in those 5 years but GT5... in truth.. since GT4.. Tourist Trophy, GT HD, GT5 and GTPSP (2 full games and 2 pretty big demo's) have been (and will be) released from PD. So they've been doing other work with those 110 employees then just GT5 and they could still manage 1000 cars and all the features shown so far (and yet still people complain -.-)

 

[BenzAMG]

Comparing MGS with GT5 is kinda strange .

A little bit ? If you are using monitor set on 1280x1024 - please set-up it 1024x768 Small difference ? Now lets count the cars...1...2...3...4...5...6....7...8.......oh my god there is no more cars in forza...maybe theye are hiding behind those beautiful mountains...or maybe not

It's not about Forza, its about what I expect of GT5.
2 year old Project gotham racing 4 can produce 10 different kind of weather situations.
So I expect that GT5 at least had rain...

I just want to say, that wat we have seen so far is not good enough and we can't be happy with it. They toke 5 years for another game! Did they go on a vacation for 2,5 years?

 

[Gerath]

Lets compare F3 and GT5 (i know i know there are not here yet ) to sprinters

Forza2 maded 100m in 16 seconds now Forza3 do 100m in 11.5 second so there is 4.5s progress, now the GT5P (or put it GT4 if you want i think it will works also) runs 100m in 11.5 and now GT5 will do 100m in 9.5s - Forza3 maded bigger progress but who is better ? The bigger progress will be always better visible

Sorry for bad english

 

[J-PaP]

It's not about Forza, its about what I expect of GT5.
2 year old Project gotham racing 4 can produce 10 different kind of weather situations.
So I expect that GT5 at least had rain...

I just want to say, that wat we have seen so far is not good enough and we can't be happy with it. They toke 5 years for another game! Did they go on a vacation for 2,5 years?

You don't get it do you? PD hasn't worked on GT5 for 5 years! Read what other people have posted. PD has released 4 other games since GT4. Not only that, They spent a year updating GT5p improving the game for everyone. Infact, they doubled the number of cars in it!

Ontop of it all you pass judgement on a DEMO at a game expo that is purposely limited. They aren't going to show every game feature or include the whole game at a demonstration stand.

Now if you can't understand that then you are completely unrealistic in your expectations and understanding of how games are made. Go see how long it takes you to make 1000 cars for a game.

 

[Schmo]

We'll see. For me the first post seems a little bit too optimistic. If the final product is really that much better than what we saw on GamesCom,well, then I'm happy - no doubt about that.

Its better to be optimistic then pessimistic, which you seem to be.

 

[BenzAMG]

You don't get it do you? PD hasn't worked on GT5 for 5 years! Read what other people have posted. PD has released 4 other games since GT4. Not only that, They spent a year updating GT5p improving the game for everyone. Infact, they doubled the number of cars in it!

Ontop of it all you pass judgement on a DEMO at a game expo that is purposely limited. They aren't going to show every game feature or include the whole game at a demonstration stand.

Now if you can't understand that then you are completely unrealistic in your expectations and understanding of how games are made. Go see how long it takes you to make 1000 cars for a game.

I'm not judging. I'm saying what i'm expecting and that what we have seen so far is not stacking up to a lot of other games.

I expect more and a think GT5 will give us more.
If this is it then I will be a little disappointed.

 

[Strittan]

Its better to be optimistic then pessimistic, which you seem to be.

Well, it's not good to be too optimistic. Everyone who is disapointed after seeing the GC demo, has obviously been too optimistic, their expectations were too high in other words.

 

[Zathra5_]

I just want to say, that wat we have seen so far is not good enough and we can't be happy with it. They toke 5 years for another game! Did they go on a vacation for 2,5 years?

We haven't seen everything yet so what makes you think it is a good idea to question what PD has been doing for the past number of years? We have next to zero official information of what will be included in GT5. All that gamescon has given us is a glimpse of what default damage will probably be like. The E3 trailer may suggest that there is more to the damage model than what we are seeing in the demo. Personally, I am satisfied with the damage right now. I'd like to see bigger consequences as an option but I am much more interested in hearing about other features that haven't been revealed as of yet.

 

[Tired Tyres]

Its better to be optimistic then pessimistic, which you seem to be.

Really? An optimist will either be right or disappointed. A pessimist will either be right or pleasantly surprised. Therefore it looks like it's better to be a pessimist.

 

[Max_DC]

We don't even know what PD has been doing, we will find out, this 1 track, 1 car choice demo cannot represent 5 years of work and they clearly don't intend for it too.

Maybe that does not represent the current status. Fine with me. If it does, I'm disappointed for the reasons I stated above. But I want to make one thing clear - if the game is motivating and fun as a whole experience I can live without a lot of features.

Your expectations have obviously, for whatever reason, been set WAY too high.. I mean come on... If you really expect all of this to be in GT5:
Then youre looking in the wrong place... You said youve been playing the series from the start then you SHOULD know that the focus is on driving and PD have done a good job in that respect.. I think people are losing focus as to WHAT this game is all about... Livery editors... moving trees, cheering people... How many times do you go down a straight at 200+ mph and look at the cheering crowd? Or the moving trees?!?! In the total picture that stuff is actually really irrelevent... It WOULD be nice... but considering the platform and the numbers of cars and such, they probably wouldnt be able to do that without sacrificing graphic detail which they strive so hard to acheive with what they have...
You also go and compare FM2 to Prologue... Full game vs Half a game... You also do not acknowledge the fact that in the leaked spec list of GT5 the online capabilities they WILL be implementing are IMO one of the greatest things to HAPPEN to the game... The demo we saw at GamesCom is a gameshow demo... not finished build... Who knows when they had this finished??? Maybe this is a demo from when they FIRST tried to implement damage... Nobody knows.... So before you make your conclusion I would suggest waiting for more info and eventually the whole game before making these conclusions already... But in the end it's up to you... If you are seriously disappointed I cannot do anything about it, but I think youre judging to soon...

Ok my opinion might not be representative, I don't question that.
For me realism is a huge factor. And now read carefully : The overall experience is just as realistic as its weakest part :

What is GT5 prologue ? It's driving with beatutiful designed cars with realistic handling through a PSX 1995 landscape in High Def. And that kills it for me.
Simple as that. I don't care about 16 cars, 8 is enough for me, no need to have 10 lemming cars that you overtake in the first lap before you fight the same 6 cars you fought in GT1.

Examples : GTA4 : The cars handle arcade, the graphics are not that strong, but the overall experience feels a lot more real : People, weather, the sky is changing, paper is moving on the ground.

Take Midnight Club 2 - People walking around, cars driving in the background ( and on your track, no need for that in GT ), the buildings have 3D rooms - feels a lot more realistic than GT imo.

GT5p is like racing in Stephen King's Langoliers * - it's a dead world without moving water, without wind, without life. Next gen, for me that's simulating the whole deal, not just perfection in a few aspects.

If it's for me, implement all those features including a believable damge model and make it 200 instead of 1000 cars, 8 cars on the track instead of 16, and kill a few million polygons per car.

GT5:
-multiplayer with lobbys and voice chat
-damage, mechanical and visual (for certain cars, maybe even with rollover)
-better visuals and physics
-more cars and tracks
-16 cars on track
-headtracking
-electric cars
-online photo and replay album
-YouTube replay output
(-maybe weather)
(-maybe visual tuning)
(-maybe fully animated pitcrews)

- like about every other game in the past 5 years - standard, not worth mentioning
- ok it's there, but it's not good or realistic ( at least not at the GamesCom demo
- ok, but again, after 5 years it should be better, it all depends how much better GT is at release comapred to GT5p and other games like Forza 3
- we'll see. ( again a personal thing, but I don't really care so much for all those lookalike grand prix courses. I prefer the fantasy courses.
- ok
- ok if it works ( = fun or realistic feel )
- electric cars, wow I've really waited for that.
- ok
- ok
- 3 maybe ; so far I don't see anything of these features, great if they're in

Play GT4 until GT5 comes out and be amazed.
I know there are other games and i actually play them, but playing a GT game always felt like coming home, Polyphony Digital captures the spirit of the cars and i think this is the thing that always makes me come home for more.
I would still buy the game even if it took 6 years to develop.

Maybe that's my problem. I don't play PS2 anymore, I have all current consoles, a 55 inch HDTV, Dolby 5.1 and an uptodate gaming pc along with hundrets of games. I know what's out there, I know what's possible in other genres and if PD takes 5 years and talks about perfection I have certain demands regarding quality.

Well you're assuming that PD did nothing in those 5 years but GT5... in truth.. since GT4.. Tourist Trophy, GT HD, GT5 and GTPSP (2 full games and 2 pretty big demo's) have been (and will be) released from PD. So they've been doing other work with those 110 employees then just GT5 and they could still manage 1000 cars and all the features shown so far (and yet still people complain -.-)

TT is GT with bikes, not that much effort, GT HD is a demo, GT5P is sth the probably shouldn't have done ( maybe then we already GT 5 ) and GT PSP is probably just GT4.
Ok I don't say that they wer sitting on their a.... and doing nothing - but at the end it's the result that counts. Time management is not my problem, it's theirs.

 

[Dbo129]

We haven't seen everything yet so what makes you think it is a good idea to question what PD has been doing for the past number of years? We have next to zero official information of what will be included in GT5. All that gamescon has given us is a glimpse of what default damage will probably be like. The E3 trailer may suggest that there is more to the damage model than what we are seeing in the demo. Personally, I am satisfied with the damage right now. I'd like to see bigger consequences as an option but I am much more interested in hearing about other features that haven't been revealed as of yet.

Amen to that brother

 

[sher_da_putt]

Really? An optimist will either be right or disappointed. A pessimist will either be right or pleasantly surprised. Therefore it looks like it's better to be a pessimist.

By being pessimistic, you are telling PD you aren't satisfied, and knowing PD they will always try and make sure their consumers are satisfied, for all we know, GT5 might have just got delayed due to negative feedback. However so many people are satisfied NOTHING disappointed me from gamescom.

 

[killanite]

Time management is not my problem, it's theirs.

I love it how people speak like they think PD owe them this game.. They owe you nothing, if you don't like what gt5 is bringing, don't buy it let alone start bitching about it to us.

you think its so easy to create a game of GT5 calibre? you go and make one, I'm sure your multimillion dollar company will have no trouble in producing a game better than gt5 in every aspect in 2 years.

 

[Max_DC]

I love it how people speak like they think PD owe them this game.. They owe you nothing, if you don't like what gt5 is bringing, don't buy it let alone start bitching about it to us.

you think its so easy to create a game of GT5 calibre? you go and make one, I'm sure your multimillion dollar company will have no trouble in producing a game better than gt5 in every aspect in 2 years.

forum = discussion

Can't handle it ?

 

[Blitz187]

Ok my opinion might not be representative, I don't question that.
For me realism is a huge factor. And now read carefully : The overall experience is just as realistic as its weakest part :

What is GT5 prologue ? It's driving with beatutiful designed cars with realistic handling through a PSX 1995 landscape in High Def. And that kills it for me.
Simple as that. I don't care about 16 cars, 8 is enough for me, no need to have 10 lemming cars that you overtake in the first lap before you fight the same 6 cars you fought in GT1.

Examples : GTA4 : The cars handle arcade, the graphics are not that strong, but the overall experience feels a lot more real : People, weather, the sky is changing, paper is moving on the ground.

Take Midnight Club 2 - People walking around, cars driving in the background ( and on your track, no need for that in GT ), the buildings have 3D rooms - feels a lot more realistic than GT imo.

GT5p is like racing in Stephen King's Langoliers * - it's a dead world without moving water, without wind, without life. Next gen, for me that's simulating the whole deal, not just perfection in a few aspects.

If it's for me, implement all those features including a believable damge model and make it 200 instead of 1000 cars, 8 cars on the track instead of 16, and kill a few million polygons per car.

I understand what you mean and what you say is true in respect to the environments in a new HD jacket. They have actually upgraded older models instead of laying down brand new ones... I believe they have their reasons for doing this of course, but if the OP is right to any degree and Kaz is doing this deliberately to keep us in the dark and make us talk about the game this way. Then maybe the unannounced demo at GC was also a part of his ploy in respect to information being freed about GT5.... Which means that he is holding off the BIG surprise for the release OR TGS... I mean the leaked spec list and the surprise showing of GT5 cant all be a coincidence if you think about it... Or can it?

 

[Tired Tyres]

By being pessimistic, you are telling PD you aren't satisfied, and knowing PD they will always try and make sure their consumers are satisfied, for all we know, GT5 might have just got delayed due to negative feedback. However so many people are satisfied NOTHING disappointed me from gamescom.

Nothing I've seen has disappointed me either. It's a two minute playable demo with damage. It reveals a new track and some cars. It's not the finished article and more will be revealed in Tokyo (I assume).

 

[BenzAMG]

We haven't seen everything yet so what makes you think it is a good idea to question what PD has been doing for the past number of years? We have next to zero official information of what will be included in GT5. All that gamescon has given us is a glimpse of what default damage will probably be like. The E3 trailer may suggest that there is more to the damage model than what we are seeing in the demo. Personally, I am satisfied with the damage right now. I'd like to see bigger consequences as an option but I am much more interested in hearing about other features that haven't been revealed as of yet.

I'm not questioning, I'm not the thread starter. I'm actually pretty confident that we didn't see it all.

 

[killanite]

forum = discussion

Can't handle it ?

I can handle it, what i can't handle is the amount of bitching you people dish up to this game company. First you want damage, they give you it, your not satisfied (and again I say if you think its so easy , do it yourself). THEN you start shooting off all these random skyhigh expectations of the game when the features haven't even been said and you suddenly turn those expectations into "MUST HAVE OR GAME FAIL" type thing. How about you all take a step back, wait till the game is released (or at least when it's featurelist and full version comes out) before you rip it to threads.. don't base all ur judgements on demo's.. AND AGAIN FOR BILLIONTH TIME, if you don't like it don't buy it, bitching about it on these forums will solve nothing (what.. do you expect PD will be looking at your critisizm and fix it for you?), take the game as it is or don't take it at all.

 

[Custer85]

Maybe that's my problem. I don't play PS2 anymore, I have all current consoles, a 55 inch HDTV, Dolby 5.1 and an uptodate gaming pc along with hundrets of games. I know what's out there, I know what's possible in other genres and if PD takes 5 years and talks about perfection I have certain demands regarding quality.

I have a PS3 60Gb that is capable of playing PS2 games and i have a 32" FullHD Samsung TV with Logitech 5.1 Soundsystem, why should that keep me away from GT4? I played it until i got Formula 1 Championship and even thereafter. I stoped playing GT4 the day i had GT5 Prologue and i will never go back, just because the driving has been vastly improved. The visuals are superior and even the ai has been improved. Its just that the jump from GT4 to GT5p is huge.

I also have certain demands reguarding quality but i give a **** about damage. Its there, fine i will probably be driving the licenced NASCAR and WRC series with damage but i actually dont care. The collision physics have been improved and thats all i asked for.

This is not refering to your post, but some people here seem to expect far too much. They want GT5 to be the übergame with every feature that has ever been in a racinggame since the invention of the computer. If you dont like it, then dont buy it, but you will hardly find another game that does everything right.

I guess i should stay away from the forums for the next few days or even until TGS. Iam happy about the news we got about GT5 and iam looking foreward to finally play it with my G25.
There just too many scaremongers around here.

 

[BolgOfThe North]

You don't get it do you? PD hasn't worked on GT5 for 5 years! Read what other people have posted. PD has released 4 other games since GT4. Not only that, They spent a year updating GT5p improving the game for everyone. Infact, they doubled the number of cars in it!

And they developed the data computer for the Nissan GTR, not a colossal job but still.

 

[J-PaP]

Lots of stuff

From what I gather from that. You would rather PD got rid of fairly accurate physics and photo realistic graphics for you to get some wind and animations in the background and cars that blow up to smitherines?

PD makes a game that features car models that are photo realistic and drive as accurate as possible on a console. Infact the game looks to try and make itself unnaturally picture perfect. If you want skid marks, destruction derby's and a bunch of animations then GT was never really the game for you and I understand your dissapointment.

I think that you may not realise what PD is trying to make. Maybe it is all lost in translation. But the way I view the game is that it is driving cars that look like they really exists in some kind of perfect world bound to physics as we know it.

Anyhow that's just how I understand the GT franchise.

 

[ANFD]

After reading the positive and negative comments I can't help but feel that we, as people, simply have differing tastes and opinions. I like blondes, you like red heads. You like Porsches, I like Hondas ..... no big deal. Some will prefer Forza 3 no matter what and same for GT5. The bottom line is that I can appreciate each for it's own merits and strengths and will derive the maximum enjoyment possible. I won't dwell on shortcomings, I will revel in the graphics, car control and racing expeiences. I don't care a hoot about paper blowing in the streets or whether or not the leaves flutter on the trees. For those who are so down on PD and the coming spectacle that is GT5, simply don't buy it or do buy it and be dissappointed .... your call. Either way, it's your loss

All I know, is that I'll be having the time of my life

 

[Zathra5_]

From what I gather from that. You would rather PD got rid of fairly accurate physics and photo realistic graphics for you to get some wind and animations in the background and cars that blow up to smitherines?
.

Isn't that Grid?

But seriously grid overemphasizes a lot environmental stuff like crowd noises, cockpit movement and sense of speed to add environment. GT goes for a more realistic approach which to some is more sterile. When I'm racing, I'm concentrating too much on the driving to worry about what the crowd is doing.

 

[Leonidae]

*big boo-hoo*

Aww.. Poor baby.. Do you want a lollipop?