- 1,926
USA voted for Dubyya.
We are certainly not civilized then.
We are certainly not civilized then.
which is the most civilsed nation on earth?
- Thread starter ZAGGIN
- 501 comments
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- 288
Arwin
That discussion was lost a few pages back
Now we are into the name calling,and going after one another.
I don't know how we're supposed to have a decent conversation EVER with people taking things COMPLETELY out of context and not paying attention to this degree.askia47
I hereby resolve to ignore all frivolous, out-of-context, and downright stupid remarks in an effort to further develop the discussion at hand.
And I would suggest that one good measure of a "civilized country" would be their role in furthering peace and in raising the standard of living in other countries. Switzerland is a great example, and should be a top contender for most civilized, with the exception that they don't often (hardly EVER) get involved when push comes to shove (ie get involved militarily). On the other hand, the US and UK are great examples, too, except that we'll never come to agreement on their motives for their current action, since even if peace and prosperity come to the regions involved, we'll never reach any kind of agreementon on whether it was for the right reasons.
- 87,827
- Rule 12
- GTP_Famine
skicrush
Except they lied to their citizens in order to effectively ban cars from the centre of large towns.
skicrush
And the UK government is using the most appalling "research" ever conducted (in terms of how it has been conducted) in order to introduce road tolls (tracked by GPS and charged per mile, varying on time and type of road) which would cost the average motorist FOURTEEN THOUSAND POUNDS A YEAR just to drive to work - while the politicians introducing it would, naturally, be exempt.
- 10,116
- Maryland, USA
- swift-bass
Famine
Could you give some more details on that please?
Duke
If that's the case then speed traps and the like would be useless. YOu can just tap in and see how fast a particular module is going and where it is. Man, talk about "big brother"
- 2,648
the comment wasnt a serious one. Personally i would think that the more civlised countries existed in Northern Europe. Or perhaps the west indies? Barbados, even though not very wealthy, is very peaceful and its citezins are properly educated and are expected to act with manners and respect. Quite a contrast to the islands surrounding it.Duke
- 87,827
- Rule 12
- GTP_Famine
Okay, here's the bull****. Sorry, I mean "story".
Alaistair Darling and his good buddy Ian Ladyman (and I'm not making this up), believe that congestion is bad. Fine so far.
They believe that congestion is caused by too many cars on the road. Hmmm. Pushing it a bit, but as far as loose definitions go it'll do.
They believe that the reason there's so many cars on the road at rush hour is because people are picking that particular time to be on the roads. Errr...
So, in order to get people off the roads - and presumably into public transport - they plan to introduce a GPS-based tracking system. The system - the same one that says my house is in a river - will monitor where your car is at any given time and bill you according to how far you drive, on what types of road and when. There will be a sliding scale from 2p a mile on a nowhere country road at 2.30am to around £1.34 a mile on the M6 at rush hours - no distinction is to be made between types of car or engine size. When this scheme takes over, they will abolish road licence fund (which we pay each year to be allowed to drive - its purpose is to pay for the roads, yet only £1.8 billion of the annual £6 billion collected goes back there. This is another matter altogether), but they've kept rather quiet about whether duty on fuel - currently running at 70p/litre - will go or not.
Several problems spring immediately to my mind, but not to Darling and Ladyboy's, apparently.
1. People are on the road at the same time because they're going to work.
2. People are going to work by car because public transport sucks, smells, is inconvenient, doesn't get anywhere on time and is too expensive. And, in fact, already costs more at "peak" times - with the train companies now talking about their OWN congestion charging because their trains are overcrowded. Retards.
3. People will abandon motorways - which are designed to take large volumes of traffic - and use B-roads - which aren't because motorways cost more than B-roads. This will lead to people speeding on B-roads near people's houses, which will lead to them being stuffed with speed cameras due to increased accident rates. And then the B-roads will become congested.
4. At least petrol duty differentiates between 5 litre tanks and 1.1 econoboxes. From a government which hates cars on an "environmental" basis, this is amazingly stupid.
5. GPS devices will be used to track cars and how far they've travelled in how much time - your own little in-car speed camera.
6. Government officials will be exempt.
7. How will the cost of fitting 36 million cars with GPS black boxes be covered? Duty on fuel and Road Licence Fund which, just like they did with the QE2 bridge in Dartford, they'll "forget" to abolish. Or, just like the "compulsory" £93 Identity Cards, they'll make you have one and make YOU pay for it.
This is all utter, utter, utter, utter bollocks and I've had enough of it. If this **** ever reaches the point where it is introduced to the public I will be leaving the UK and you can shove your "civilised country" up your arse.
Alaistair Darling and his good buddy Ian Ladyman (and I'm not making this up), believe that congestion is bad. Fine so far.
They believe that congestion is caused by too many cars on the road. Hmmm. Pushing it a bit, but as far as loose definitions go it'll do.
They believe that the reason there's so many cars on the road at rush hour is because people are picking that particular time to be on the roads. Errr...
So, in order to get people off the roads - and presumably into public transport - they plan to introduce a GPS-based tracking system. The system - the same one that says my house is in a river - will monitor where your car is at any given time and bill you according to how far you drive, on what types of road and when. There will be a sliding scale from 2p a mile on a nowhere country road at 2.30am to around £1.34 a mile on the M6 at rush hours - no distinction is to be made between types of car or engine size. When this scheme takes over, they will abolish road licence fund (which we pay each year to be allowed to drive - its purpose is to pay for the roads, yet only £1.8 billion of the annual £6 billion collected goes back there. This is another matter altogether), but they've kept rather quiet about whether duty on fuel - currently running at 70p/litre - will go or not.
Several problems spring immediately to my mind, but not to Darling and Ladyboy's, apparently.
1. People are on the road at the same time because they're going to work.
2. People are going to work by car because public transport sucks, smells, is inconvenient, doesn't get anywhere on time and is too expensive. And, in fact, already costs more at "peak" times - with the train companies now talking about their OWN congestion charging because their trains are overcrowded. Retards.
3. People will abandon motorways - which are designed to take large volumes of traffic - and use B-roads - which aren't because motorways cost more than B-roads. This will lead to people speeding on B-roads near people's houses, which will lead to them being stuffed with speed cameras due to increased accident rates. And then the B-roads will become congested.
4. At least petrol duty differentiates between 5 litre tanks and 1.1 econoboxes. From a government which hates cars on an "environmental" basis, this is amazingly stupid.
5. GPS devices will be used to track cars and how far they've travelled in how much time - your own little in-car speed camera.
6. Government officials will be exempt.
7. How will the cost of fitting 36 million cars with GPS black boxes be covered? Duty on fuel and Road Licence Fund which, just like they did with the QE2 bridge in Dartford, they'll "forget" to abolish. Or, just like the "compulsory" £93 Identity Cards, they'll make you have one and make YOU pay for it.
This is all utter, utter, utter, utter bollocks and I've had enough of it. If this **** ever reaches the point where it is introduced to the public I will be leaving the UK and you can shove your "civilised country" up your arse.
- 10,116
- Maryland, USA
- swift-bass
Famine
That whole thing reminds me when congress voted themselves a raise(and lowered THEIR taxes a bit) Just because they felt like it.
Man, gov't people exempt? The laws don't apply to them? what kind of lunacy is that?
- 26,628
- OREGON
- a6m5zero
Swift
I agree with everything you've been saying.
When I heard about the "black boxes" in cars, I thought the "people" would never let that happen. Last I heard, almost all new cars have them.
In Oregon, they are considering Satellite tracking system to replace gas taxes. This is crazy. Once they start planting GPS tracking in all the cars, it's an beginning of an end of "Free America".
I've read horror stories about GPS tracking systems as well, some rental cars has them. Some people got ticketed for speeding, though they were never stopped by the police. Turns out the rental agency did a math on the distance driven on the freeway and the his "time". The agency ended up fining him also. There was another case I've heard about a rental car in California. In the rent-a-car agreement, it said that renter weren't supposed to drive the car outside the state of CA. Of course the guy drives to Arizona, and gets fined big time for it. OK, the second guy should have read the fine print little bit more closely, but I think you get the point.
- 10,116
- Maryland, USA
- swift-bass
a6m5
As much as I really don't like the black boxes. They are helpful in determining when someone was driving recklessly before an accident or it was just an "accident". There was an accident where 4 young people were in a Subaru WRX this past fall. They were hitting the windy backroads and slipped on some leaves and slammed into a tree. Two of them died and two lived. The two that lived made up the story that the transmission locked up and that caused them to slide. Of course, the black box told otherwise.
Yeah, if I had my choice I'd say yank them, but they do have there use.
As far as the rental car thing, the first instance is just weak that they can ticket you like that. The second, well, every time I rented a car the first thing they ask is if you're going out of state or not. The guy simply should've said, yes.
- 24,344
- Midlantic Area
- GTP_Duke
Personally, I'm not willing to submit to that invasion of privacy in order to reduce a perceived threat of crime.
In fact, I believe it was Robert Heinlein who said "any civilization that requires ID cards is already doomed".
In fact, I believe it was Robert Heinlein who said "any civilization that requires ID cards is already doomed".
- 1,766
Duke
I guess my country is doomed then. Since january I have to carry around my passport because that's my only ID I have. I could get another one that fits in my wallet, but that would cost me 20 bucks and I don't feel like spending that because of a stupid law like this. I know better ways to allocate that money. I'll just take the risk and leave my house without any ID.
- 1,766
Well, it isn't that bad. The police over here only asks for your ID if you are causing trouble already. It's not like they are constantly checking you everywhere you go. As a matter of fact, nobody checked my ID so far.
If it helps the police to solve crime more easily I wouldn't mind it, but I doubt that it helps much, so I hope that law will be removed soon.
If it helps the police to solve crime more easily I wouldn't mind it, but I doubt that it helps much, so I hope that law will be removed soon.
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