2009 Nissan GT-R - Zero tolerance for asshattery

[exigeracer]

Or would be if Lotus hadn't come out with the massively underrated sales bomb known as the Lotus Elan to compete with the MX-5.

That was GM's decision. They kept Lotus alive, so I don't care. Not to mention the M100 was probably one of the top 5 FWDers of all time.

 

[niky]

Too bad people didn't feel like paying Lotus Prices for FWD goodness. They'd pay Honda prices, though... witness the Integra Type R.

Give me an original Porsche 2.7 GT3RS anyday.. mhmmm... lightweight...

If the GT-R ends up being unavailable for any less than 30k over sticker, I suppose a twin-turbo 350Z would be the next closest thing... give me one with a proper helical limited slip (not that viscous crap), and a proper suspension/wheel/tire set-up. But GT-R luxury... hmmmm... Infiniti G35 Coupe with the same set-up?

 

[skylineGTR_guy]

Give me an original Porsche 2.7 GT3RS anyday.. mhmmm... lightweight...

If the GT-R ends up being unavailable for any less than 30k over sticker, I suppose a twin-turbo 350Z would be the next closest thing... give me one with a proper helical limited slip (not that viscous crap), and a proper suspension/wheel/tire set-up. But GT-R luxury... hmmmm... Infiniti G35 Coupe with the same set-up?

The 370z should be shown in november at the La auto show, supposedly 4 inches shorter than the current one and lighter too

 

[Tornado]

Not to mention the M100 was probably one of the top 5 FWDers of all time.

Pft. Top 3.

 

[niky]

"The Lotus Elan M100 has the second longest pen*s in the animal kingdom.

Of course, mine is the first."

 

[YSSMAN]

Infiniti Fans Will Be Happy:

A senior Nissan source has confirmed the company is studying the possibility of producing a high-performance four-door sedan based on the exotic Nissan GT-R hardware. The source suggested the car may be sold as an Infiniti.

Producing a four-door GT-R is certainly feasible, though it wouldn't be cheap. Although the GT-R coupe is based on Nissan's flexible FM (front midship) platform, it is what one analyst calls "a major deviation" from that platform's architecture, to the point where it's known internally as PM (premium midship).

The PM platform could be stretched to allow an extra set of doors and useable rear passenger space, while keeping the existing suspension pickup points, powertrain mountings, and other sheetmetal. This would enable the four-door to share a lot of the GT-R's mechanical hardware, including the 480-horsepower twin-turbo 3.8-liter VR38 V-6 engine, all wheel drive, and the rear-mounted six-speed DSG-style auto-clutch transmission.

However a sedan version would require a new bodyside, plus expensive revisions to the carbon fiber intensive front structure, so while Nissan could save some money through component sharing with the GT-R, it's likely that a sedan variant would cost $3000 to $5000 more. One alternative would be to make the car with a conventional steel body (it would add weight, but Nissan would want the GT-R coupe to remain its performance flagship anyway).

The drawings here are purely illustrative; it's unlikely Nissan would retain too many GT-R cues on an Infiniti-badged car. Nissan knows a four-door GT-R would have about as much credibility in Japan as a four-door Corvette would here in the U.S. Furthermore, American and European buyers likely would balk at the idea of paying $85,000 for a sedan with Nissan badges. Making the car an Infiniti could help solve both problems, and it would give the brand the halo vehicle it lacks.

A high-tech, high-performance Infiniti sedan also could serve as a halo car for the expansion of Nissan's luxury brand into Europe, China, Japan, and other world markets. After dithering for a decade or more, Toyota has finally made Lexus a global brand, and its new IS-F sedan signals an entry into the premium high-performance segment dominated by Mercedes-Benz's AMG and BMW's M cars.

The significance of both moves won't have been lost on Nissan CEO Carlos Ghosn.

 

[CodeRedR51]

That won't sell. It's just to please the Infiniti dealers who were b*tching about not getting the GT-R. I hope they reconsider this.

 

[Joey D]

They probably will have some sort of sports model of the G35 with a de-tuned GT-R engine in it. If they priced it right it would sell just fine.

 

[YSSMAN]

Or they can do what the G deserves and give it a proper V8 and a dual-clutch transmission...

 

[Omnis]

G Coupe, right? They will never ever sell a V8 G Sedan. That's M territory. Actually, a Skyline sedan would shoot Infiniti in the foot.

They just need to bring over THE Skyline and give it a full color nose with Infiniti badges. and maybe even square tail lights like on Hakosuka.

 

[niky]

Hmmm... Skyline engine and drivetrain in an M sedan, anyone?

 

[Scaff]

Nissan GT-R vs 911 Turbo Twin Test - Autocar 20th Feb 2008

Autocar have put the GT-R up against its development benchmark on UK roads and the results have been quite one sided, to quote....

Even if they were equally priced, any objective assessment of these vehicles would have to conclude that the Nissan is the better car. I can't believe I'm writing this, but it really is the case

Progress is thrilling for the consumer but cruel to the competition. The Turbo must respond, and soon, because the GT-R is the undisputed winner here.

What makes this piece all the more interesting is that the author (Chris Harris) is without a doubt biased; he is a huge Porsche fan, serial 911 owner and contributor to a number of different Porsche publications.

Discuss


Scaff

 

[YSSMAN]

I don't find it all that surprising, personally. Despite being a closet 911 freak, I've been nothing but underwhelmed by the 997T, it just all seems too heavy and artificial. While the GT-R comes off feeling the same way, the thing is, it also seems much more adept at being a proper sports car.

Stick the GT-R up against the true performance icons of the price/performance bracket, the SRT-10 Coupe and Z06, and I'll be in a very deep thought process. I'd bank money on the Corvette (its still the cheapest), but the GT-R will make a good showing. We'll see. We're still months from getting the GT-R in the US...

=====

Speaking of that!

While at the Nissan dealer yesterday I asked about the GT-R. We're only getting two at Fox Nissan for 2008, one has already been spoken for by the owner, the other has been as well (there are five more in line).

The real kicker?

They're only marking it up about $8-10K, which is outstandingly low compared to Chicago (about $20K) and the other cited examples in this thread that exceed the actual price of the car...

 

[Dave A]

The current 997T is a better car than the SRT10 and Z06 that's for certain, value for money or not and that's debatable, but it's a better car than thoes two.

You talk about the SRT10 and Z06 as true performance icons, well I'm sorry, but you can't class the 997T as less of a performance icon than thoes two. As a performance icon it's way ahead of thoes, more so the Viper than the Vette but still ahead of both.

The Z06 is far too unrefined to take on the GT-R in any fair test, the GT-R not only storms the track but it's a refined car which is the Z06's undoing or appeal depending on where your preferences lie. But as cars, when both are compared I can't see any way the Z06 could win. And I'm not having a dig at the Z06, I just think that as a machine the GT-R is astonishing. I wouldn't buy one given the money to spend, I don't actually like them that much but I think it's a prime example of top level automotive engineering. I'd never expect it to appeal to everyone much like it doesn't appeal to me, but if I take away and bias based on looks and character and things that you can't test or describe with stats and figures, the GT-R is simply amazing.

 

[Jim Prower]

I'm gonna have to ask the Uftring reps at the Central Illinois Auto Show (Basically, the dealers bring a few of their nice models, and maybe a three-year-old concept and CAT's NASCAR stock car,) If they're getting any GT-Rs from the first batch, or if Chi-town's gonna hog them all.

 

[Leonidae]

well, GT-R beat the beetle evolution turbo by a second on slightly damp track.. though, they did dry it off by drifting a new M3..

 

[Div is back]

The current 997T is a better car than the SRT10 and Z06 that's for certain, value for money or not and that's debatable, but it's a better car than thoes two.

You talk about the SRT10 and Z06 as true performance icons, well I'm sorry, but you can't class the 997T as less of a performance icon than thoes two. As a performance icon it's way ahead of thoes, more so the Viper than the Vette but still ahead of both.

The Z06 is far too unrefined to take on the GT-R in any fair test, the GT-R not only storms the track but it's a refined car which is the Z06's undoing or appeal depending on where your preferences lie. But as cars, when both are compared I can't see any way the Z06 could win. And I'm not having a dig at the Z06, I just think that as a machine the GT-R is astonishing. I wouldn't buy one given the money to spend, I don't actually like them that much but I think it's a prime example of top level automotive engineering. I'd never expect it to appeal to everyone much like it doesn't appeal to me, but if I take away and bias based on looks and character and things that you can't test or describe with stats and figures, the GT-R is simply amazing.

I agree with everything you said, what in bold more precisely.
The fact is the Z06 and Viper are only performance icons to the Americans, what point would it be for european magazines to compare it to cars that barely sell worldwide and/or have no appeal to buyers/readers outside of America?

The Z06 and Viper are a patriotic thing, nothing else. Wether it has 10000000hp and can lap the nurb in 2 seconds, it will always remain as such.

 

[YSSMAN]

I should have stated what I meant more clearly, stick the GT-R against its true performance rivals in price *In America* and I'm eager to see the results. Neither the Corvette nor the Viper have even a fraction of the following, and furthermore, the reputation as kings of the value/performance ratio as they do here in the United States and Canada. We won't be getting the GT-R until this late spring, early summer, so the presumed test will likely happen...

I look at it this way:

The Z06 is pretty much the fastest car you can buy for $70K, a grand or so less than where the GT-R starts as I recall. It won't likely match it for overall comfort, but given that it is far less-harsh than the SRT-10 on the road, I'd suspect that the Z06 would fair well in that comparison. In terms of performance, the GT-R will likely win in a drag race if they're using launch control, but even then, it is only fractions of a second faster than the Z06 and SRT-10. Stick all three of them out there on the track and it would be my guess that it would be a dead-heat, all equally skilled in their own respects to put them one over the other in various places.

All of this of course is going to depend on where they run the cars, who is testing them, and what magazine we're talking about. I could fairly easily predict a win for the Z06 (I think) in a Car and Driver test, Motor Trend likely giving the nod to the GT-R, Road and Track likely split between the Corvette and GT-R, and I think Automobile would be the wildcard, but would likely be split between the Corvette and GT-R as well.

You've gotta remember that this is Corvette country, bar-none. They'll stick it up against anything they damn well please if it makes an interesting story. My estimation is that it would hold its own against the GT-R, likely better than the 997T (which I've personally found underwhelming), but again thats just the way the game plays out in the US. Its not that I don't like the 997T (because I equally love all 911s), it just hasn't lived up to what I had expected (ie, beating the snot out of the Corvette and Viper, justifying the price)... I'd just rather have the 997 GT3.

 

[McLaren]

You talk about the SRT10 and Z06 as true performance icons, well I'm sorry, but you can't class the 997T as less of a performance icon than thoes two. As a performance icon it's way ahead of thoes, more so the Viper than the Vette but still ahead of both.

Define performance icon, because both the Viper & the 'Vette have had no problems running with the Porsche. The Z06 is easily just as fast as the Turbo, & vice versa. And while I don't have a complete list of times with the Viper next to the Porsche, there is 1 track (Vir. IR) where the Viper Coupe ran 8 seconds faster. But even then, the SRT-10 (Conv.) can run next to a 911 Turbo on certain circuits.

So, like I said, you're going to have to define what you consider a true performance icon.

I agree with everything you said, what in bold more precisely.
The fact is the Z06 and Viper are only performance icons to the Americans, what point would it be for european magazines to compare it to cars that barely sell worldwide and/or have no appeal to buyers/readers outside of America?

Maybe this is because the price of a Corvette, god forbid the Viper, outside the US is ridiculously high? A used Viper from the 2nd generation (GTS) still goes for over a $100,000 outside the America. That's around $30,000 over what the GTS cost us here new.

Don't believe me? Look here.
Dodge Vipers in Europe
Corvettes in Europe
If it costs nearly $100K minimum to own a SRT-10 or Z06 in Europe, I don't even want to know how much it costs to buy a brand new one.

So don't say these 2 cars are only performance icons in America. Where a car is from shouldn't have any affect on that. People in Europe don't buy Vipers & Vettes because they can't perform. They don't buy them because the amount of cash it takes to get one is way more than a good ol' Porsche or M3.

 

[Jim Prower]

which is reversed over here.

gee, does shipping a high-performance car REALLY cost THAT much?

 

[Dave A]

Define performance icon, because both the Viper & the 'Vette have had no problems running with the Porsche.

I was using the word icon as the word icon, which is not directly related to the cars performance capabilities. I have no doubt, in fact I know the Z06 and SRT10 are very fast cars on a track, but they arn't icons in the same bracket as the 911 is an icon. The 911 is a global icon the Viper and Vette are only National icons. It wasn't a performance related comment rather a direct response to YSSMAN's comment which makes more sense (and I should have firgured anyhow) after his last post .

Maybe this is because the price of a Corvette, god forbid the Viper, outside the US is ridiculously high? A used Viper from the 2nd generation (GTS) still goes for over a $100,000 outside the America. That's around $30,000 over what the GTS cost us here new.

The Vette has only now in it's 6th geenration become a car good enough for us to open our eyes to it. But it's lhd only, cue, no impact on the £50k sportscar market made by that car. Vipers are well, just badly designed in virtually every aspect for our country. They wern't designed for our country ofcourse, but that doesn't change the fact that owning a Viper here makes no sense at all. They are vastly over priced, vastly under economical (they make the Vettes look green) and like the Vettes they are lhd only.

You can buy second hand GTS's and RT/10's fairly cheap-ish here but why would you want to, they're no more reliablael than a second hand Griffith, only the Griffith looks better, goes nealy as quick and costs less to run.

The Vettes main problem is it's lhd only, other than that it's not as fuel efficient as a lot of our cars in any comparisons I've read. Price wise it's about where it should be to be competetive. The Z06 is a total non-event over here though, it's performance for it's price is fantastic, but it's been ripped to shreds by virtually every publication for it's horrbile ride quality on the road. The regular C6 wasn't, we like that car. Nowhere near an icon though.

 

[McLaren]

I was using the word icon as the word icon, which is not directly related to the cars performance capabilities. I have no doubt, in fact I know the Z06 and SRT10 are very fast cars on a track, but they arn't icons in the same bracket as the 911 is an icon. The 911 is a global icon the Viper and Vette are only National icons. It wasn't a performance related comment rather a direct response to YSSMAN's comment which makes more sense (and I should have firgured anyhow) after his last post .

So, what doesn't make the Corvette a world icon?

It's won international races, been around over 50 years (longer than the 911), and has improved just as much as the Porsche? So what makes the Corvette only an American icon? Because of the fact the Corvette is just very expensive outside the US?

I don't honestly think that should make a difference when you're talking about a performance icon. The country should be irrelevant when it comes to talking about a car's performance with certain exceptions.

The Vette has only now in it's 6th geenration become a car good enough for us to open our eyes to it. But it's lhd only, cue, no impact on the £50k sportscar market made by that car. Vipers are well, just badly designed in virtually every aspect for our country. They wern't designed for our country ofcourse, but that doesn't change the fact that owning a Viper here makes no sense at all. They are vastly over priced, vastly under economical (they make the Vettes look green) and like the Vettes they are lhd only.

You can buy second hand GTS's and RT/10's fairly cheap-ish here but why would you want to, they're no more reliablael than a second hand Griffith, only the Griffith looks better, goes nealy as quick and costs less to run.

The Vettes main problem is it's lhd only, other than that it's not as fuel efficient as a lot of our cars in any comparisons I've read. Price wise it's about where it should be to be competetive. The Z06 is a total non-event over here though, it's performance for it's price is fantastic, but it's been ripped to shreds by virtually every publication for it's horrbile ride quality on the road. The regular C6 wasn't, we like that car. Nowhere near an icon though.

You pretty much just proved my point.

The Viper & Vette are not only American icons because there's "no point" in comparing them to European cars in Euro mags. There's a plenty big point. And I'm sure there's a lot of folks in Europe who wouldn't mind having either.

But they don't sell outside the US because they're just not worth their price being asked for outside America. Despite this, again, there's still a fairly large point to why we should compare the Z06 & Viper to the Porsche, the GT-R or whoever. To see whose faster, and where they're being tested and by who shouldn't matter. Isn't that the whole point of these cars anyways? To out-perform the other competitor for the money?

which is reversed over here.

gee, does shipping a high-performance car REALLY cost THAT much?

True, except in the US, performance cars aren't going over for what they originally were new unless they've reached a certain stage where the rarity & value has now gone up, i.e. the iconic Ferrars, Lamborghini Diablo, etc. (Note that this also happens all over the world for these cars.)

I don't see a 12 year old Viper being quite into that stage yet, even in Europe, though.

 

[Dave A]

So, what doesn't make the Corvette a world icon?

The fact that outside of American very few people know about them, care about them or hold then in any regard higher than that of a Lada Riva. To be an icon you have to be liked, you have to something that people are aware of, sometihng people focus on, something people talk about. People all over the world talk about the 911, it's globally recognised and it's held in high regard all over the world. Not so with either of the above.

It's won international races, been around over 50 years (longer than the 911), and has improved just as much as the Porsche? So what makes the Corvette only an American icon? Because of the fact the Corvette is just very expensive outside the US?

Whether it's improved as much as the 911 is highly debateable but I'm not interested in a Vette v 911 debate here, the two cars were brought up in relation to the GT-R and then simply that the Vette isn't an icon globally like the 911 is. Which is true. The Corvette and Viper just arn't liked enough outside the US.

I don't honestly think that should make a difference when you're talking about a performance icon. The country should be irrelevant when it comes to talking about a car's performance with certain exceptions.

I don't know wher your going with this, I never said the country was relevelnt, but the in the case of the Corvette and Viper they are only big in the US and that is a fact. They probably sell more in the US in one or two months than they do in a whole year eveywhere else combined.

You pretty much just proved my point.

The Viper & Vette are not only American icons because there's "no point" in comparing them to European cars in Euro mags. There's a plenty big point. And I'm sure there's a lot of folks in Europe who wouldn't mind having either.

How did I prove your point, the fact that magazines think the Vette is okay doesn't mean the Vette is an icon. No ones calling it an icon, no ones giving it awards and the fact it's okay does not mean it's the best. The Marcos TSO was more than okay according to magazines and road tests but that didn't make the TSO an icon. So many people want Corvettes here I've seen two C6's, both in a showroom and a Z06 at a motorshow that's it. I see more TVR's, Nobles, Aston Martins and Jaguar XK's by a long shot. Aston Martins are icons here and all over Europe possible in the US I don't know but an Aston is an icon here a Corvette is not.

But they don't sell outside the US because they're just not worth their price being asked for outside America. Despite this, again, there's still a fairly large point to why we should compare the Z06 & Viper to the Porsche, the GT-R or whoever. To see whose faster, and where they're being tested and by who shouldn't matter. Isn't that the whole point of these cars anyways? To out-perform the other competitor for the money?

No not really, first of all the Viper is stupidly over priced for what it is the C6 Vette isn;t, it still doesn't sell but it's a good deal. Also outside the US a GT-R and Corvette comparison is almost meaningless, the Corvette despite being decent is still almost a non-entitly in Europe. It's not that relvent for our market to compare them. And no, the sole purpose of these cars isn't be the best bang for your bucks, because none of them come close. Particularlly the 911. Image is a big thing, like it or not, image is big. The Corvette has a good image in America, and generally a bad one in Europe. Also when it comes to speed, these are fast cars with the added bonus of being easy to live with, imo the GT-R looks like a winner here, I can't imagine it being more expensive to run than the Vette and Viper and I can't imagine it being less refined on the road as either too. But then we won't see a direct comaprson between them anyway so why do I care.

 

[McLaren]

The fact that outside of American very few people know about them, care about them or hold then in any regard higher than that of a Lada Riva. To be an icon you have to be liked, you have to something that people are aware of, sometihng people focus on, something people talk about. People all over the world talk about the 911, it's globally recognised and it's held in high regard all over the world. Not so with either of the above.

Oh, and you can prove that no one cares about them or holds them in a higher regard than a Lada? I'd love to see how you can prove such a thing. Have you talked to the rest of the world about the Corvette? Can you prove people all over talk about the 911? I know folks in Europe who love to see the Corvettes run next to the Astons at LeMans, and folks who easily would like to see Carsport Holland continue to run successfully.

If the Corvette was not held in a higher regard than a Lada anyways, then why are there 2 teams in the FIA GT3, & 4 teams in the FIA GT running a Corvette? OBVIOUSLY, there are more than a few people who care for them if there are 6 teams running them in a European Motorsport with their own set of fans.

Whether it's improved as much as the 911 is highly debateable but I'm not interested in a Vette v 911 debate here, the two cars were brought up in relation to the GT-R and then simply that the Vette isn't an icon globally like the 911 is. Which is true. The Corvette and Viper just arn't liked enough outside the US.

Again, can you actually prove this?

I don't know wher your going with this, I never said the country was relevelnt, but the in the case of the Corvette and Viper they are only big in the US and that is a fact. They probably sell more in the US in one or two months than they do in a whole year eveywhere else combined.

Because you said they are only National icons in America. Just because they are more well-liked in America than the world should have no affect on them being performance icons.

How did I prove your point, the fact that magazines think the Vette is okay doesn't mean the Vette is an icon. No ones calling it an icon, no ones giving it awards and the fact it's okay does not mean it's the best. The Marcos TSO was more than okay according to magazines and road tests but that didn't make the TSO an icon. So many people want Corvettes here I've seen two C6's, both in a showroom and a Z06 at a motorshow that's it. I see more TVR's, Nobles, Aston Martins and Jaguar XK's by a long shot. Aston Martins are icons here and all over Europe possible in the US I don't know but an Aston is an icon here a Corvette is not.

You didn't prove what you just typed.

You proved my point that the Viper & Corvette don't do well because they're not worth their price over there, not because no one has any interest in them.

No not really, first of all the Viper is stupidly over priced for what it is the C6 Vette isn;t,

Sorry, I don't agree with that. The Viper runs on par with the Z06 usually, can run with a Turbo. It's that big V10 that drives it up an extra $15K from the Vette's V8.

Also outside the US a GT-R and Corvette comparison is almost meaningless, the Corvette despite being decent is still almost a non-entitly in Europe. It's not that relvent for our market to compare them.

So, that immediately means a Euro magazine shouldn't waste the time to compare the Z06 to the GT-R on a performance level?

I guess Chevrolet is just wasting time tuning the car at the 'Ring then since no one is actually going to drive it there.

And no, the sole purpose of these cars isn't be the best bang for your bucks, because none of them come close. Particularlly the 911.

Sorry, but that's not what I mean. Is it not true that a big reason for even making these types of cars is so that they can perform next to each other?

What hurts any magazine comparing these cars on a track when that is part of the reason they exist?

 

[YSSMAN]

Well, lets look at it this way:

I'd dare to say that for the most part, the Corvette is just as relevant as the GT-R that had been an Japan-only car for more than four decades. So why can't that qualify it for a GT-R battle? The Chevy is sold all over the world, not just the United States, so I see no reason why the little car from Kentucky can't compete.

Its just as fast, a hair bit cheaper, I'd say it looks better, and appeals to high-performance fans just as much as any other $70-100K sports car could. I see absolutely no reason why Top Gear or CAR couldn't stack it up against the GT-R and the 997T just for the hell of it, because I'm pretty sure they'll use the same cars here in the United States. The Viper, as always, is the wildcard.

Which also makes me wonder: Now that the Sagaris is supposed to be on-sale in the US, I do wonder how long it will be until we see that face off with the Z06...

 

[niky]

Darn it, can't any thread go more than one page without a Corvette debate going on?

In terms of outright speed, yes the Vette and Viper can kick ass. And they can turn in excellent lap-times, too, thanks to good suspension, braking and light-weight (at least on the Vette's part)... else they wouldn't be used in endurance racing series.

But the GT-R's natural competition is the 911 Turbo and the Audi R8. It's all about luxury performance... and luxury just isn't in the Viper/Vette dictionary (at least not till we get a Cadillac version of the Viper... ). I'd say the GT-R's handicap is that it lacks the visual flair and drama of the R8 (also reputed to handle well... and possibly faster on the right race track (less long straights, please... )) and that it possibly didn't handle as well as the 911.

But for at least one well-known 911 fanatic (Isn't Chris the guy who always does their Porsche reviews?) to pan the 997 Turbo in favor of the GT-R, that's a coup for Nissan... Now... could the GT-R V-Spec take on the 911 GT2? That'd be interesting indeed.

 

[YSSMAN]

Hold on a second there: Why wouldn't we mention the Corvette? It costs exactly the same, performs exactly the same, and can be had with the same level of relative "luxury" as the GT-R very easily. It depends on who's checking the option boxes by day's end...

I could honestly care less if its a "lesser" car worldwide, it nevertheless is the leading performance car for the Americas, bar-none. It may not have to live up to the same Audi and Porsche standards for luxury in their vehicles, but I'll be damned if I didn't think the interior is just as comfortable and if not, more functional, given the relative lack of "luxury" (ie too many buttons, screens, switches and settings).

People complained about us shutting the GT-R out because it was a Nissan, are you not doing the same because this is the "cheap" Corvette? Dollar-for-dollar, there isn't a car in this hemisphere that comes anywhere close to the GT-R's performance for GT-R money other than the Corvette. Its the perfect competition if you ask me. And with the rather obvious differences in style and the way in which it creates these dramatic levels of performance, it creates one helluva competition.

 

[SlipZtrEm]

People complained about us shutting the GT-R out because it was a Nissan, are you not doing the same because this is the "cheap" Corvette? Dollar-for-dollar, there isn't a car in this hemisphere that comes anywhere close to the GT-R's performance for GT-R money other than the Corvette. Its the perfect competition if you ask me. And with the rather obvious differences in style and the way in which it creates these dramatic levels of performance, it creates one helluva competition.

Yes, we get it. The Corvette is God's gift to sports cars. If the people who are nothing but hostile about the idea of the GT-R being a great car can continue to justify it for a myriad of reasons, from the badge on the snout to their mood of the day, you have to accept people are going to not like the Corvette for the same reason: personal preference. This double standard is getting rediculous.

I think niky's comment is more about the fact the Corvette will pop up in almost any conversation in the Open Road, no matter how little it has to do with the actual discussion at hand. And if not the Vette, GM. If I've misunderstood his comment, well, this is my own opinion.

Re: The topic at hand: definitely a great boost for Nissan if a Porker-lover prefers the GT-R 👍

 

[Scaff]

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But for at least one well-known 911 fanatic (Isn't Chris the guy who always does their Porsche reviews?) to pan the 997 Turbo in favor of the GT-R, that's a coup for Nissan... Now... could the GT-R V-Spec take on the 911 GT2? That'd be interesting indeed.

He is indeed that Chris Harris, a huge Porsche/911 fan, as such the article does carry quite a bit of weight.

I can also fully understand why the first car they put the GT-R against was the 911 Turbo, as it was Nissan's benchmark car. One thing I forgot to mention when I first posted this up, the GT-R in the test is not a Nissan press car. I bring this up because I know how often the acusation is raised that Nissan 'prep' cars for review and test. In this case the car in question is a private import into the UK and was purchased out of a Japanese showroom (Nissan have already said they will not supply the UK via Japan).


In reply to YSSMAN's points about the 'vette, on paper the GT-R gives a lot away to it, price being the main areas they match in. However I certainly will be interested to see how the ineviatable contest goes. Personally I don't see them as being direct competitors, the 'average' Corvette driver is, in my opion, unlikely to look at the GT-R as a possiable alternative and the same would be true of the average GT-R customer. Foer me they occupy two different market places, which a quite distinct target audience; that's not however to say that I don't want to see the two slug it out.


Regards

Scaff

 

[YSSMAN]

For the regular Corvette, you're completely right that it would have absolutely no comparison to it and the GT-R. I don't know many "young" people who are interested in high-performance that own the "lesser" versions of the Corvette, or for that matter, who would even be remotely interested in a GT-R. I could personally see those interested in the GT-R consider a Corvette, but only for a moment, as it isn't the same deal. Shoehorn the LS7 into a Holden Monaro with AWD and I think the case could be a little different...

I think niky's comment is more about the fact the Corvette will pop up in almost any conversation in the Open Road, no matter how little it has to do with the actual discussion at hand. And if not the Vette, GM. If I've misunderstood his comment, well, this is my own opinion.

Well, lets consider this for a moment: What "sports cars" dominate the American and Canadian landscape? More often than not, it is the Corvette and the Mustang that are inevitably compared to every new vehicle that comes out. Have a Honda Fit that handles well? Oooh look, its almost as good as a Corvette! Have a Subaru WRX that accelerates quickly? Ooooh look, its as fast as the Mustang GT!

Like it or not, these cars are part of the fabric of the American automotive landscape. I'm going to talk about the Corvette, and if you don't like it, thats too damn bad. Find me another car that costs $70K or less and can run to 60 in 3.7 seconds (or less) and tops out at 200 MPH. One with a warranty and serviceable at thousands of dealers nationwide...

Hmm?

Its not about the Corvette being a GM product either. Note that I talk about the SRT-10 in this thread just as often. Hell, I still push for the 911 as well. There is plenty of room for the GT-R in this market, and I welcome the competition. I'm very interested in the car, seeing it in person hopefully sometime in the near-future. It wouldn't be on my list of things to buy, those dollars go towards a Carrera or Z51 first. But hey, God forbid someone still likes the "establishment" cars...