2020/21 Premier League & General Football Discussion

[redhed17]

To play devils advocate, it's no secret that both FIFA and UEFA are greedy and there has been no shortage of scandal and corruption. So any accusation that this Super League is all about greed flys straight back in the face of much of what FIFA and UEFA do and care about, money. I don't think it's a good idea, however it's a shame the immediate public response is along the lines of "we will not let you", " we will do everything we can to stop you", "we will ban you from as many competitions as we can" type fanfare. Wouldn't a statement confirming that they have asked the clubs involved to come together to discuss why they want this super league and what can be done to prevent any potential damaging split from occurring have been better?

That doesn't prevent the split but what it does is makes a clear pathway for constructive dialogue rather than pure threats. If the clubs don't take that opportunity that's on them and I'm sure the media will cover it appropriately and there will be no shortage of statements. But this immediate agressive reactionism is not constructive, it's the boy throwing a tantrum because he's been told something he doesn't like. That doesn't mean FIFA and UEFA are wrong about how damaging this could be, but they just make themselves look worse by jumping into an agressive stance and making threats immediately.

Of course those in the know, know that the clubs have been discussing thenew CL format set to be announced tomorrow. So this to me smacks that these top clubs looking to breakaway aren't getting what they want, but that's not how this has played out today. It's maybe more a case of both sides being the child that's playing up than just UEFA and FIFA but someone needs to act like the grown up. By simply highlighting the dialogue that has occurred and then offering an opportunity to see why and what could be done to avoid these clubs breaking away both UEFA and FIFA could make themselves look at lot better than they have done today.

There have, you would think, been discussions with all the European Football Associations with regard to the changes to the European competitions, though it has to be said that certain countries, and the clubs in these countries, will have had more 'input' on the plans than others.

These 12 clubs have decided that whatever the result of these changes, that they will have taken part in, they don't like it, it is not in their interests, so they are starting their own 'game'. Fair enough, but I don't think that when there is a organisation in place to oversee Football, be that UEFA in Europe, or FIFA globally, a handful of clubs can unilaterally decide to make up their own competition they want to play in, and who can be part of it, with no consequences. These 12 clubs are the 'petulant child', and FIFA and UEFA sadly, taking on the roles of the parents. That "FIFA and UEFA are greedy and there has been no shortage of scandal and corruption" means nothing, these teams are not taking a moral stance against any of that, they are being greedy themselves, and their has been enough dodgy dealing from some of the clubs involved so has to have no moral high ground, if that was indeed a reason for any of this. The clubs sign up to the rules of the organisation, if they decide not to follow the rules, then of course there has to be consequences. FIFA and UEFA are saying these will be the consequences, do what you will.

This is like the 12 best schools in the country telling the Government that not only will they define what qualifications other schools will be working towards, but our schools will always get the best grades, and we may let a few other schools also take some exams, no doubt a few chosen schools, if the 'wrong type' somehow get in. It's madness.

Backing the new European league, Andrea Agnelli, Chairman of Juventus and Vice-Chairman of the Super League said:

“Our 12 Founder clubs represent billions of fans across the globe and 99 European trophies. We have come together at this critical moment, enabling European competition to be transformed, putting the game we love on a sustainable footing for the long-term future, substantially increasing solidarity, and giving fans and amateur players a regular flow of headline fixtures that will feed their passion for the game while providing them with engaging role models.”

They are talking of 'history' and 'transforming European competitions'. Mmm, if UEFA decide to not go along with these plans, and continue the Champions League and Europa League, though altered with whatever plans they are about to announce, all that previous 'history' in those competitions ends with the start of this 'Super League' for these 12 clubs. There will be a lot more teams able to compete for the Champions League and Europa League with those teams not involved though. In 10 years time when Bayern Munich have a few more CL titles, how special will the 12 teams European 'history' be! I think Bayern Mucich may win a few more Champions Leagues with those 12 teams not involved.

Ah, and talking of morals, look up Calciopoli, and what family were in charge of Juventus at the time.

I know it is virtually pointless, but I have sent an email to Liverpool FC to register my opposition. I don't do Social Media, so that was the only way to show my opposition to this 'Super League'.

 

[NAXEHT]

Disgusting madness. To be honest, any potential matches that could be played are completely uninteresting. To watch these teams play each other on a frequent basis in this made up super league sounds incredibly awful and drab. Would definitely not pay to watch that, live or televised.

 

[mustafur]

Never going to work lol, Players will have to say no to internationals if they are European, as well as champions league.

The Big clubs don't have the power they think they have.

Honestly doesn't look like it's even supposed to be legitimate, most likely nonsense for a bargaining chip to get favourble TV rights or something in Domestic and European matches.

Spain and England FAs should just say they have a week to rip this up or they will get a massive point deduction(enough to stop any chance of them playing in Europe next season).

 

[Touring Mars]

The plan is for there to be two leagues of 10 who will play home and away midweek fixtures before a knock-out competition at the end between the top 3 from both leagues and two runners-up. That means at least 18 new midweek fixtures, and (obviously) destroys the existing European competitions. The clubs say that they intend to remain in their domestic leagues, though...

So, who will be the other 8 teams? PSG and Bayern are obvious stand-outs, and if they stick to their guns and don't sign up to the ESL, I believe the whole thing is a non-starter. But if they do, and I would expect Lyon and Dortmund to join too, that still leaves 4 slots. Porto, Ajax, Benfica, Celtic?

 

[redhed17]

From the BBC

'Fans across the world have experienced the ultimate betrayal'
Fan groups associated with all six English clubs involved in the European Super League proposal are strongly opposed.

Liverpool supporters' group Spirit of Shankly (SOS) said it was "appalled" by the decision of Fenway Sports Group, the club's US-based owner. In a social media post, SOS said: "FSG have ignored fans in their relentless and greedy pursuit of money. Football is ours, not theirs. Our football club is ours not theirs."

Chelsea Supporters' Trust called the move "unforgivable" and said its members and "football supporters across the world have experienced the ultimate betrayal".

The Arsenal Supporters' Trust called the club's agreement to join "the death of Arsenal as a sporting institution", while Manchester City's Official Supporters Club said the move showed "those involved have zero regard for the game's traditions", adding it was "determined to fight against this proposed Super League".

The Manchester United Supporters' Trust had earlier said the proposals were "completely unacceptable" and the ESL "goes against everything football, and Manchester United, should stand for".

Tottenham Hotspur Supporters' Trust said the ESL was a "concept driven by avarice and self-interest at the expense of the intrinsic values of the game we hold so dear".

Looks like the most hardcore fans are against this.

In an escalation, all 12 clubs have resigned from the European Club Association and their respective representatives from the ECA board. At what point will it be that the 12 clubs can't walk back from the edge, and have to jump!

 

[Famine]

Looks like the most hardcore fans are against this.

Worse still, you're going to have to find a bunch more currency symbols to use for the other four clubs. I'd suggest changing to Yen/Yuan for Cit¥ first, to free up the Euro sign for the E which isn't even in the name anyway.

PSG and Bayern are obvious stand-outs, and if they stick to their guns and don't sign up to the ESL, I believe the whole thing is a non-starter. But if they do, and I would expect Lyon and Dortmund to join too, that still leaves 4 slots. Porto, Ajax, Benfica, Celtic?

Bayern Munich and Borussia Dortmund are practically guaranteed not to be part of it. German football clubs cannot have any more than 49% ownership by private companies, so at least 51% of all German clubs are fan-owned.

 

[Touring Mars]

Jose Mourinho has been sacked as Spurs manager...

 

[Famine]

Jose Mourinho has been sacked as Spurs manager...

Right before a cup final. Noice.

Busy day in the Spurs board room yesterday, though I'm not sure how they decided they were a "Big Six" club...

 

[daan]

 

[redhed17]

Worse still, you're going to have to find a bunch more currency symbols to use for the other four clubs. I'd suggest changing to Yen/Yuan for Cit¥ first, to free up the Euro sign for the E which isn't even in the name anyway.

The 'E' in Cit€h is for the way some of their fans, particularly those from Manchester, pronounce the word. The use of Yen/Yuan for Cit¥ is great idea, I didn't think of that, and would free up the '€' for Liv€rpool.

Bayern Munich and Borussia Dortmund are practically guaranteed not to be part of it. German football clubs cannot have any more than 49% ownership by private companies, so at least 51% of all German clubs are fan-owned.

To not have the German teams, who have 7 European Cups/Champions League titles between them just undermines the 'Super League' concept from the start.

I was surprised PSG did not throw their hat in with the other 12, as although they win their league most years, and are by far more wealthy (I think) than any other French club, if you can guarantee participation regardless league placings, and also increase the chances of winning a competition because of that, them not joining is surprising, especially given their owners.

 

[andrea]

Right before a cup final. Noice.

It might be cheaper to fire him before winning a trophy.

 

[Dave A]

Right before a cup final. Noice.

Busy day in the Spurs board room yesterday, though I'm not sure how they decided they were a "Big Six" club...

It deflects attention away from Spurs being involved in the organisation of the Super League.

 

[Famine]

Haven't actually stopped laughing at this one yet.

 

[MUSC4EVER]

So the Super League is somewhat related to the revamp of the Champions League. UEFA have announced plan for the revamp.

From the 24/25 season.
36 teams instead of 32.
No more groups, just one league.
Top eight reach the knockouts.
Every club guaranteed at least 10 games.

This seems a bit more interesting but there are a lot more games and I just wonder how they are going to fit them all in??

About the Jose sacking, a lot of reports of whether or not this is ESL related as he has been vocal about it in the past, there was one report saying he refused to take training today, more likely he could've been sacked of his performance and the teams form, which has been pretty bad.

Ander Herrera and Mesut Ozil have taken to Twitter to register their disgust over the ESL and Liverpool have put Black banners outside Anfield with 'RIP Liverpool' on them.

 

[Dreadmed]

Just waiting to see if (dare I say WHEN) the active managers/players from the listed 12 will break cover and distance themselves from this lunacy. It's not too often you see such a level of consensus nowadays!

Jose might've been the first, rumours and hearsay indicating he made a stand by refusing to take training... (Tree'd)

 

[MUSC4EVER]

Leeds v Liverpool on the Monday Night Football tonight. Neville and Carragher in the studio.

Going to be interesting!

 

[redhed17]

It deflects attention away from Spurs being involved in the organisation of the Super League.

Not sure the usual Moaninho sacking scenario could distract from something this big.

 

[Barra333]

It takes something special to bring the fans of all of these clubs together with one voice. Even more amazing is that they are on the same page as FIFA, UEFA and the administration of the various legaues.

 

[redhed17]

It takes something special to bring the fans of all of these clubs together with one voice. Even more amazing is that they are on the same page as FIFA, UEFA and the administration of the various legaues.

It is amazing that an issue can align almost everyone, bar the greedy 12 clubs, with FIFA and UEFA.

It would have been interesting to sit in on some of those Zoom meeting between those clubs today. Liverpool Supporter's Clubs have asked for their banners be taken off the Kop before the next home game.

This could soon be reality.

 

[Barra333]

Look what happens when clubs are run by a bunch of people who don't give a **** about the sport. Half of these owners probably couldn't have found their club on a map 5 years before they owned it.

 

[andrea]

Let’s gooooo!

 

[Liquid]

I... have a huge rant I could write about this. I'm just going to distill it in one sentence:

Lock the door when they leave.

 

[redhed17]

Look what happens when clubs are run by a bunch of people who don't give a **** about the sport. Half of these owners probably couldn't have found their club on a map 5 years before they owned it.

I think a lot of them may not have even been to a game in those preceding years too. Just go where they think the money is, it would be Netball if the money was there.

 

[Touring Mars]

Let’s gooooo!

Wot no Spurs??!

I used to play my own European "super league" on FIFA. It did get a bit boring after Hearts reached 9-in-a-row though.

 

[MoLiEG]

As an overseas fan from both Inter and Chelsea I am beyond angry. But I'm pretty sure I'm not as angry as Italian and English fans.

Superleague? More like, Superfraud and Supersteal.

 

[DK]

Let’s gooooo!

That reminds me, I wonder what the ramifications of a real Super League will be for the FIFA and PES franchises. If either EA/Konami got the rights to the Super League, would all of the other leagues (e.g. Ligue 1, Bundesliga, Eredivisie) freeze them out?

 

[andrea]

Qué?

Didn't know this was a PS4 to PS5 upgrade.

 

[redhed17]

Qué?

Didn't know this was a PS4 to PS5 upgrade.

Really! I think UEFA, who the Champions League belongs to, will not just hand over the name and the history. The Champions League is misnamed as it it, but to have it to have anything to do with this abomination of a proposed league would be beyond absurd.

 

[Famine]

 

[Liquid]

Qué?

Didn't know this was a PS4 to PS5 upgrade.

I wish football discourse could make its mind up about what "counts" or doesn't count.