2024 US Presidential Election Thread

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Democrats' plan to fight Trump and win future elections:

Cooperation.


Apparently Trump is not an existential threat to democracy, but is actually reasonable and may share some common ground with Democrats. They talk about Trump doing bad things with the word "If", not "When".

I'm sure when midterms roll around, and Democrats campaign on all the bipartisan bills they helped push through alongside Republicans, that'll really convince the electorate of the importance of rejecting Republicans and voting in Democrats instead.
 
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The Democratic Party is dead. It's going to take an Obama-like figure to make any of it makes sense, and you'll note that Obama was rather moderate during his tenure. Liberals are just way too in their feelings about way too many things for any of it to make sense. They've got Bernie Sanders and AOC and that's about it, nobody else with a name is that liberal and can defend it sensibly, and all other Democrats are far more moderate.
 
I’ve said this so many times. Democratic politicians want bipartisanship, unity, compromise, to inhibit the party platform from moving leftward, which risks threatening corporate donor interests. They commit the fallacy of the golden mean- the best outcome is not guaranteed to be, and rarely ever is, the middle of two extremes. And it’s obvious that the median democratic voter, whether more moderate or more left, does not want bipartisanship with republicans. Because they can see so clearly that the GOP is completely opposed to democracy and egalitarianism and would not be willing to cooperate with Democrats under any circumstances.

Meanwhile no Republican politicians, not even the most moderate ones anymore, talk about bipartisanship. Acting as flagrantly partisan as possible is a winning strategy for them- it not only gives their base faith in the party (meanwhile actively worsening their own lives in the process), and doesn’t threaten the donor class at all. After all, fascism requires state corporatism and oligarchy, and does not meaningfully threaten the livelihoods of elites.

Until democrats ditch the “adults in the room” and the “when they go low, we go high” approach and play the republicans at their own game, they will not sustain as a party. Only winning elections because the GOP has so obviously made things worse off for people, while doing nothing to make fundamental changes, is not a viable long term strategy.

Democrats will also not win by being the perpetual opposition party. Not only because their opposition to fascism is not strong enough (and it won't be until they can, at least, actually address institutional failures and adopt bold, populist narratives), but because people actually want change. The conventional wisdom amongst Democratic politicians is that running "Republican-lite" campaigns, in which candidates concede issues to the Republicans (such as being somewhat anti-immigration) will be attractive to voters is plain wrong. People will always vote for the real thing (in this case, the Republican who is unabashedly anti-immigration) as opposed to half-measures. This is especially true for Democrats running in more moderate/swing districts, being told that running a more liberal/progressive campaign cannot win.

It's interesting that Fetterman proved this narrative wrong, and then completely strayed from it. He ran an unapologetically populist campaign in a swing state and was progressive on pretty much every issue outside of Israel. And he won handily in the primary against the "establishment democrat" Conor Lamb who ran on a centrist platform, and beat out Oz in the general. And now Fetterman is mostly a Republican-lite Democrat. The simple answer is that he was bought. The more cynical one would be that he understood that running a progressive campaign- or at the very least, one that is very distinct from the GOP platform- would win an election, but since the Democratic party as a whole seems to not learn its lesson, that there's no point in following through with it.
 
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Any country you send him to will essentially be an insult so send him to Pitcairn Island so he can't find his way home (yes I know it isn't a country).
Some days after dipping a toe in social media and news, I'm ready for reassignment to Pitcairn Island or Tristan de Cunha.

We are trying to be #1 in embarrassment.
Thank god for Mississippi Russia.
 
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The Democratic Party is dead. It's going to take an Obama-like figure to make any of it makes sense, and you'll note that Obama was rather moderate during his tenure. Liberals are just way too in their feelings about way too many things for any of it to make sense. They've got Bernie Sanders and AOC and that's about it, nobody else with a name is that liberal and can defend it sensibly, and all other Democrats are far more moderate.
It's almost like when progressive candidates (or Democrats who actually believe in anything and not merely interchangeable pawns for the status quo) are constantly given the cold shoulder by the party establishment, there won't be very many left. AOC and Bernie really made a name for themselves and are too powerful to topple. But when obscenely large AIPAC/corporate contributions have astroturfed reps like Cori Bush and Jamaal Bowman out of their seats, and AOC- perhaps the most popular Democrat at all right now- being snubbed for the position of Oversight Committee leader in favor of a septugenerian centrist, it's not exactly encouraging for progressive voices to want to move up the ranks in the Democratic party. AOC and Sanders, despite their popularity (amongst not only their own constituents but Democratic voters nationwide and even independents and disaffected voters) and adroitness at making change within the Democratic party, are still mostly met with hostility by party leaders.
 
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I need a sanity check. Can someone read this and tell me that Democrats aren't actually blaming "wokeness" for their election loss?


Tell me that "weirdness that doesn’t affect my kids" isn't thinly veiled blame towards trans or at the very least LGBTQ+ people.


Let's just ignore that several progressive policies are supported by a majority of Americans, including some like generic pharmaceuticals which actually poll better among rural voters.


How can anyone look at all the progressive ballot options that performed better than Democrats and think Democrats are unpopular because they're too progressive?

Missouri and Alaska both voted for Trump, and also voted to raise the minumum wage and guarantee paid sick leave. What is the DNC's explanation for that?!

 
I don't think the wokeness they're talking about is better minimum wages or paid sick leave; those seem like perfectly reasonable policies to support. I think where the wokeness comes in is when you see all these weird, made-up genders (I will never recognize xir, it's he, she, or they) and have to tip-toe around everything because you can't "offend" anyone, or else you get "canceled." I know it's a relatively small group of people, but social media gives them a voice to be really loud. The Democrats seemed to have leaned into that a bit too and it was probably to capture the young Gen Z vote. It gave Trump a perfect rebuttle too with his "transgender surgery for all prisoners" ad where they showed Harris herself suggesting that it should happen.

Honestly, I get it. I don't care about the "culture war," and both Democrats and Republicans are feeding into it and it's likely to distract most of us from the bigger issue of a class war. If we're too busy fighting about pronouns or who's playing what sport, we won't pay any attention to the government allocating money to rich people so they can get richer. I'm not talking about a successful business owner who's a millionaire either, I'm talking about the mega rich who've bought Congress. I have way more in common with a middle-class Republican than I do with a high-class Democrat and the middle-class Republican and I want much of the same.
 
Missouri and Alaska both voted for Trump, and also voted to raise the minumum wage and guarantee paid sick leave. What is the DNC's explanation for that?!
Democratic politicians are too engrained in the lobby system to place blame where the people know it is - in corporatism. Because the current establishment helped create it and have gotten rich off of it.

If Democrats wanted to gain support for universal healthcare, all they'd have to do is establish a party narrative that healthcare corporations are evil - because we all think they are, including scruffy old conservative men I've spoken to who are being effected by it personally - and actually push policy and behavior that backs that up. Simple. They could get yuge support if they could illustrate how everyone is getting screwed.

But the politicians are getting paid. Evidence is how Pelosi tried her damndest to make sure AOC wasn't in charge of anything here a few days ago. They're getting paid, and that's why the new largest age demographic of Democratic voters, Millennials and younger, abandoned them in droves.

Democrats will not succeed again until they allow principled liberals to take over the party, like Bernie Sanders or his youthful progenies.
 
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Democratic politicians are too engrained in the lobby system to place blame where the people know it is - in corporatism. Because the current establishment helped create it and have gotten rich off of it.

If Democrats wanted to gain support for universal healthcare, all they'd have to do is establish a party narrative that healthcare corporations are evil - because we all think they are, including scruffy old conservative men I've spoken to who are being effected by it personally - and actually push policy and behavior that backs that up. Simple. They could get yuge support if they could illustrate how everyone is getting screwed.

But the politicians are getting paid. Evidence is how Pelosi tried her damndest to make sure AOC wasn't in charge of anything here a few days ago. They're getting paid, and that's why the new largest age demographic of Democratic voters, Millennials and younger, abandoned them in droves.

Democrats will not succeed again until they allow principled liberals to take over the party, like Bernie Sanders or his youthful progenies.
Yep. You could see it in the comment sections of Walsh & Shapiro trying to defend the CEO who was killed & people weren't having it. It's why Fox has gone into overdrive trying to make sure the cult knows that the CEO was just a sweet, innocent man with a family who provided a service to all Americans & it's the "Left" championing a cold blooded killer. Don't bother giving insight on Luigi or that United Healthcare denies every 1 in 3 claims filed making them the worst health insurer for claims, 1 guy is good, 1 man is bad, that's all the cult needs to know.

And I'm sure the rhetoric has ramped up even more since Luigi was hit with terrorism charges.
 
made-up genders
They all are.
(I will never recognize xir, it's he, she, or they)
Why not? If someone with whom you're close prefers to be referred to as such, why would you disregard a preference of so little consequence? Why be such a pussy about that? Make it make sense.
have to tip-toe around everything because you can't "offend" anyone, or else you get "canceled."
Free association is good, actually.

Offense is subjective and so any condition for association may be subjective. It doesn't have to be rational. Not only may one condition association so arbitrarily, but they may advocate for others to similarly condition association. Free expression is also good, actually. An individual conditioning or withholding association on whatever arbitrary basis isn't a violation of rights, rather it's free exercise of rights.

Among neologisms (and apparently you've decided "cancel" is okay but "xir" is not...because reasons) such as "political correctness" and "cancel culture," connie crybitches also have the audacity to refer to such free association by individuals as "McCarthyism," named for the connie rat Joseph McCarthy what used lawfare and baseless accusations from a Senate-confected pedestal to persecute political opponents, homosexuals and Jews using the ambiguous specter of communism. McCarthy would die a drunk and junkie at 47 of complications from hepatitis rather than a wholly appropriate public hanging.

Ah but the state is also plenty weaponized against "offense," and even the Miller test for obscenity explicitly refers to the subjectivity of offense in determining when expression may not be protected by the First Amendment to the United States Constitution.
 
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Why not? If someone with whom you're close prefers to be referred to as such, why would you disregard a preference of so little consequence? Why be such a pussy about that? Make it make sense.
It’s reminds me of Miriam Margolyes on one of our late night talk shows…

* Warning - Strong Sweary Language *

 
It’s reminds me of Miriam Margolyes on one of our late night talk shows…

* Warning - Strong Sweary Language *


What About Me Singing GIF by Greyhound Australia
 
I think one of the most disturbing aspects of the 2024 GE is the impact of lying. Not your usual small-scale political lying but a big, fundamental, foundational lie. When Trump totally refused to accept the results of the 2020 election it was not altogether unexpected, but it seemed perverse - the action of a habitual liar & perpetual narcissist. It seemed like a bit of a joke. In hindsight, it was another stroke of Trumpian genius. If Trump had acknowledged he had lost, he would have cast himself as a "loser" and might have been dismissed from the role of Republican leader. As it was, he maintained his control over the MAGA base and by extension, the whole of the Republican party.

But it was not the MAGA base or the whole of the Republican party that won Trump the 2024 election - it was the hundreds of thousands of working class voters who drifted further into the Trump camp, together with "Latinos" and "young men". They did so based on the perception that the US economy was "terrible" under Biden. It was also based on the party of Trump focusing oncCulture wars issues. Again, Trump correctly identified that Democrat "Wokeness" was a significant vote loser for Democrats, so he hammered away at.

The problem is, Trump's ability to lie on a grand scale made him impervious to the Democrats feeble attempts to combat the lies. The The events of Jan 6th, the Jan 6th committee, the numerous court cases, the opposition of a raft of public celebrities, Late Night hosts, Republican traditionalists, the mainstream media - none of it seems to have made much of a dent in Trump's position. You can be sure that going forward he will continue to lie about everything - everything to do with the economy, foreign affairs, tariffs, the "Deep State", the border etc. It's easier for an uninformed American public to believe the big lies than to believed the nuanced complexities the Democrats bring to the table.

All this was inspired by the principle – which is quite true within itself – that in the big lie there is always a certain force of credibility; because the broad masses of a nation are always more easily corrupted in the deeper strata of their emotional nature than consciously or voluntarily; and thus in the primitive simplicity of their minds they more readily fall victims to the big lie than the small lie, since they themselves often tell small lies in little matters but would be ashamed to resort to large-scale falsehoods.

It would never come into their heads to fabricate colossal untruths, and they would not believe others could have the impudence to distort the truth so infamously. Even though the facts which prove this to be so may be brought clearly to their minds, they will still doubt and waver and will continue to think there may be some other explanation. For the grossly impudent lie always leaves traces behind it, even after it has been nailed down, a fact which is known to all expert liars in this world and to all who conspire together in the art of lying
.

Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf, vol. I, ch. X
 
I don't think the wokeness they're talking about is better minimum wages or paid sick leave; those seem like perfectly reasonable policies to support. I think where the wokeness comes in is when you see all these weird, made-up genders (I will never recognize xir, it's he, she, or they) and have to tip-toe around everything because you can't "offend" anyone, or else you get "canceled." I know it's a relatively small group of people, but social media gives them a voice to be really loud. The Democrats seemed to have leaned into that a bit too and it was probably to capture the young Gen Z vote. It gave Trump a perfect rebuttle too with his "transgender surgery for all prisoners" ad where they showed Harris herself suggesting that it should happen.

Honestly, I get it. I don't care about the "culture war," and both Democrats and Republicans are feeding into it and it's likely to distract most of us from the bigger issue of a class war. If we're too busy fighting about pronouns or who's playing what sport, we won't pay any attention to the government allocating money to rich people so they can get richer. I'm not talking about a successful business owner who's a millionaire either, I'm talking about the mega rich who've bought Congress. I have way more in common with a middle-class Republican than I do with a high-class Democrat and the middle-class Republican and I want much of the same.
The Rock Applause GIF

Oh my dad HATES this song
 
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