26 cars lined up for 2010 & bile from Bernie

[Ardius]

One or two fatalities and teams with non-symmetrical cars and it'll have come back in style!

Return the circuits to their "dangerous" states too? Old Silverstone anyone? Old Monaco with no barriers to the harbour?

 

[PeterJB]

Return the circuits to their "dangerous" states too? Old Silverstone anyone? Old Monaco with no barriers to the harbour?

Screw Seatbelts and Helmet visors!

 

[prisonermonkeys]

So if there are more than thirteen entries, what will happen? Would the "weakest" entries be denied, or would we have pre-qualifying again?

Ecclestone has said the three positions will be given to the three best entrants. I don't think pre-qualifying would come back because sponsors wouldn't be too keen on paying to have their name on the cars with no guarantee they will even make the grid. I actually think some of the circuits like Shanghai could actually hold as many as thirty cars, but others like Monaco obviously can't.

 

[Studentdriver]

How do you think will the "best" entrants be determined? Financial stability? Team pedigree? International diversity?

 

[Cap'n Jack]

How do you think will the "best" entrants be determined? Financial stability? Team pedigree? International diversity?

A balloon race around the world.

 

[peterjford]

How do you think will the "best" entrants be determined? Financial stability? Team pedigree? International diversity?

All the team owners report to Max's dungeon. The last 3 left get to join.

 

[NapoleonMikey]

the teams are brought into a secluded room with a table. they all sit down at the table and in the center theres a revolver with enough bullets to kill all but 3 of the teams representatives. they all take turns the 3 lucky ones get to go race the others get to report to there designated graves.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

As an alternative to metaphorical murder, the prospective new teams are likely to be assessed on how they plan to take on Formula One in the long term, especially in finding ways to fend for themselves once FOM's financial support runs out at the end of their freshman season. They'll have to prove they can stay in the game, that they can secure spsonsor funding on their own and that they have the facilities to develop their own cars.

 

[Metar]

I certainly hope we'll see qualifying turn from the spectacle of "fighting for the same number of grid positions as cars" into actual qualifying again.

Imagine if Ferrari made the same kind of mistakes they did early season, or Hamilton repeats his Monaco Q1 effort and actually fails to start the race as a result. We might well have a new golden era of F1 - not to mention with four different world champions in the pitlane again (come on, Jens )...

^ That's what I'd love to see, as well. Q1 to become pre-qualifying... First 18 (current regulations for 26 cars make it 8 cars locked per qualifying session) progress to the next session, the next 8 locked in, and the rest out of the weekend. Yeah!

Return the circuits to their "dangerous" states too? Old Silverstone anyone? Old Monaco with no barriers to the harbour?

If it weren't for the seatbelts, I'm sure flying into the harbour wouldn't be so unsafe - except for the wings, but who knows how they work under water...

As an alternative to metaphorical murder, the prospective new teams are likely to be assessed on how they plan to take on Formula One in the long term, especially in finding ways to fend for themselves once FOM's financial support runs out at the end of their freshman season. They'll have to prove they can stay in the game, that they can secure spsonsor funding on their own and that they have the facilities to develop their own cars.

Nope. The idea is that FOM's financial support will be almost as big as the budget cap and continue in the following years, effectively allowing teams to run on FOM-money only. Exact figures on the FOM money so far haven't been precise, but that's the plan for the future, anyways.

They'll be tested on their organization, staff, facilities, ties to potential suppliers, and how far their car is already planned. In the case of a tie, as suggested, a balloon race will solve the issue fairly.

 

[PeterJB]

If it weren't for the seatbelts, I'm sure flying into the harbour wouldn't be so unsafe - except for the wings, but who knows how they work under water...

And the risk of 'going down with your car'.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Nope. The idea is that FOM's financial support will be almost as big as the budget cap and continue in the following years, effectively allowing teams to run on FOM-money only. Exact figures on the FOM money so far haven't been precise, but that's the plan for the future, anyways.

They'll be tested on their organization, staff, facilities, ties to potential suppliers, and how far their car is already planned. In the case of a tie, as suggested, a balloon race will solve the issue fairly.

Hmmm. I was under the impression that FOM would pay them ten million apiece to help them in their debut season to relieve their stresses a little, and phase it out once they can stand on their own two feet. Someone needs to go back and re-edit Wikipedia.

 

[Metar]

Hmmm. I was under the impression that FOM would pay them ten million apiece to help them in their debut season to relieve their stresses a little, and phase it out once they can stand on their own two feet. Someone needs to go back and re-edit Wikipedia.

Ten million as a first-year get-up-and-go start, perhaps - because new teams don't get FOM money on their first year (Brawn being the exception). Every existing team from Ferrari to Toro Rosso get FOM money according to their championship position - but far more than $10m in any case - though there's a special bit regarding non-scorers like Force India, if I'm not mistaken.

The ideal that Max is after is a scenario where a slightly-increased FOM share would essentially cover the expenses for operating an F1 team.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

The ideal that Max is after is a scenario where a slightly-increased FOM share would essentially cover the expenses for operating an F1 team.

Say what you will abut Mosely, but that right there is one of his better ideas; in theory at least. Too bad the shares from FOM wouldn' be nearly enough to cover the expenses.

Anyway, while Epsilon Euskadi are remaining silent on their Formula One ambititons for the time being, a suprise has come up in the shape of March Engineering allegaedy submitting an entry. However, F1-Live is the only webste reporting it as yet; the usual suspects of GP Update and Autosport have nothing. Not yet.

 

[Metar]

F1-Live is trustworthy - more than GPupdate, usually.

FOM's incomes are more than enough to cover the grid - currently, the top teams get around $60m or more, from what I've heard. - and they'd be more than enough if Bernie budged a little and gave up a bit more than just 50%.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

I can't imagine that FOM's income is only redirected to the teams and to Ecclstone's bank account. Surely there's somewhere else they have to spend money.

 

[zed300]

Surely there's somewhere else they have to spend money.

No doubt who knows what deals Max has made and with whom.

Oh we know one ...Two German girls ....wasn't it.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Alex Wurz has submitted his own entry for 2010:

Wurz set to lead Superfund into F1

By Simon Strang - Sunday, May 31st 2009, 15:00 GMT

Former Formula 1 driver Alex Wurz has lodged an entry in the 2010 Formula 1 World Championship with a new start-up operation called Team Superfund, AUTOSPORT can reveal.

The former Williams, McLaren and Benetton racer, will become team principal of the new outfit, which is set to be funded by Austrian business tycoon Christian Baha - the founder and owner of the investment company Superfund. The team's cars will be powered by the standard-specification Cosworth engine.

Superfund joins Prodrive, Lola, Campos Meta1 and Team US F1 as one of several new ventures seeking to enter the sport following the FIA's plan to introduce budget caps to F1 for 2010.

AUTOSPORT understands that Superfund has been in serious discussions with the FIA already, that planning for the project is at an advanced stage, and that it has been in contact with key personnel. The team is waiting until it has secured its entry before it begins acquiring assets and staff however.

Superfund is also understood to be awaiting the outcome of talks between the governing body and the Formula One Teams' Association over proposals for existing teams to assist new outfits before it decides on how to structure the operation.

It is believed that Wurz would prefer to align the team with an existing constructor based in the UK, perhaps renting space, facilities and staff from its factory, while Superfund takes time to build-up its own headquarters, possibly based on existing resources in Austria. This would also give the new team an opportunity to gain essential experience from existing expertise.

It is understood however that finances are already in place for Superfund to create a team from the ground up if necessary.

Baha, who is known to be a huge motorsport fan, has sponsored F1 teams and junior series in the past and came close to setting up a Superfund category of his own earlier in the decade.

Wurz retired from Formula 1 racing at the end of 2007 with Williams, though he spent last year as test and reserve driver for Honda and has stayed on the team's roster since it became Brawn.

The 34-year-old Austrian is expected to continue racing for Peugeot in sportscars and will compete in the Le Mans 24 Hours next month.

Right now, I'm thinking they're an outside chance. To me, Team US-F1, Prodrive, Campos Meta 1 and Lola are stronger cases, but you never know.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Pardon the double-post - I seem to be the only one interested in this - but we have another one. And, like March before it, it's another famous name: Brabham.

Brabham could return to Formula

03 June 2009

The famous Formula 1 team Brabham could make its return to the Formula One grid next season. German business man Franz Hilmer has submitted an entry for the 2010 F1 season according to German magazine Motorsport Aktuell.

The Brabham Formula 1 team completed its last race back in 1992. The team won the Formula 1 championship four times with its drivers and won the constructors' championship twice. Franz Hilmer owns the Brabham brand since a while and bought up Super Aguri's assets when the team went bankrupt one year ago.

Brabham isn't the only team who wants to join Formula 1. Prodrive, Superfund, USF1 and Campos also confirmed their entry. The current 10 Formula 1 teams also submitted their entries which means there are a total of 15 entries known so far while there is space for just 13 teams.

However, I was under the impression Formtech bought Aguri's assets last year. Unless both Formtech and Brabham did it, or Formtech and Brabham are one and the same.

 

[Ardius]

Wait, are we getting close to 10 entries that aren't current teams? If we are, this could be getting dangerously close to use seeing many of the current teams not making it in...

 

[prisonermonkeys]

But they have conditional entries. The way I'm seeing it, they have entries, but they will not use them unless a new Concorde Agreement is found. Of course, that raises the question of whether the FIA will grant them those entries in the first place because they're threatening to withdraw, but I've never known the FIA to refuse an entry except under certain circumstances - I'm thinking Andrea Moda here - so maybe they're obligated to grant entries to all current teams.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Pardon the double-posting again, but overnight another new entrant has been made public: the rather oddly-named N. Technology ...

N.Technology submit entry for 2010

03 June 2009

The Italian MSC organisation submitted an entry to Formula One governing body the FIA last Friday, the company has revealed. The firm, which would label the team N.Technology, is hoping to enter the sport for the 2010 season, managed by a former Eurosport CEO as well as a past team boss of the World Touring Car Championship.

MSC becomes the latest name in a selection to put an entry bid forward for next year, headed by Angelo Codignoni - a former chief executive officer of the Eurosport network - and Mauro Sipsz, founder of Formula Master and boss of past WTCC team N.Technology.

The outfit has also announced that its staff would include Alessandro Alunni Bravi, team boss of Trident in GP2. The full line-up for 2010, which will feature 13 teams with a total of 26 drivers, will be revealed by the FIA next Friday, 12 June.

 

[Metar]

This just in: Five year old John McSucklethumb announces that his team, Huggies Waa Waa Racing, has submitted an entry. He claims his team already has strong sponsorship by diaper-conglomerate Huggies, which will also provide branded uniforms for his mechanics and the Huggies Babes. 'Our advantage', says McSucklethumb, 'is our advanced research. We already have the manufacturing facilities to build a whole car out of baby-snot and poo-poo.' Team WWR stated the budget-cap has finally made an entrance to the sport possible, since the previous superman-caps worn by Red Bull Racing officials were too expensive.

Can we please, collectively, move on with every other team on the planet announcing F1 ambitions? Just because it's slightly cheaper now doesn't mean you'll suck any less at it. (rant aimed at the teams, not at the reporting you do, dyr)

 

[SUPER NUMBBER]

That, right there, is a sign that the cap's too low...when everyone and their brother can afford an F1 entry.

 

[PeterJB]

So, how many people have submitted an entry now?

 

[prisonermonkeys]

I do agree slightly ... I think some of these are political moves, aimed at drawing attention to oneself. Personally, I can't see the likes of Superfund and N.Technology lining up on the grid. I do have one more to report as confirmed, even though their name has come up before: Epsilon Euskadi. Now, I know collective opinion is pretty low; that they're a bunch of half-cocked would-bes who can't sit still long enough to commit to one project for any substantial period of time. But in reading the comments made by Joan Villadelprat, I think they might actually be on to something. This is the comment that sticks out in my mind:

"We submitted our entry with the budget cap in mind, but we are waiting for the FIA to decide what the final rules will be. As of today, we are under the budget cap, but the budget cap is a bit misleading, because it's £45 million plus drivers, plus marketing and a series of things. The budget I think is needed is around 70-75 million."

Villadelprat seems to get it. Some of these teams that we've never heard of seem to be a case of "Forty five million? Thank you, we're there!", but Villadelprat seems intelligent enough to realise that certain things are excluded from the proposed budget cap. He knows he's going to need more than forty-five million (assuming that's the final number, which is probably won't be), and he's already got the facilities in place. He also claims hehas secured the funding for the next four years if the project goes ahead, and he's got experience in the sport coming from nowhere to becoming a success story.

He doesn't sound like he's going off half-cocked to me ...

 

[Ardius]

That, right there, is a sign that the cap's too low...when everyone and their brother can afford an F1 entry.

That was the point.....

 

[Hun200kmh]

Ok, so what the status now in the FIA/FOTA war?


A) Teams that lodged applications according to the published rules:

1 - Williams
2 - Epsilon Euskadi
3 - N. Technology
4 - Prodrive
5 - Lola
6 - USF1
7 - Superfund
8 - March
9 - Campos
10 - Litespeed
11 - Brabham
12 - Carlin (rumoured)
13- Manor Motorsport (rumoured)
14 - unannounced Italian team (rumoured)


B) FOTA Teams that lodged their entry with conditions

1 - Ferrari
2 - McLaren
3 - Brawn
4 - Toyota
5 - Red Bull
6 - STR
7 - Force India
8 - BMW
9 - Renault


The words we get?

- From FOTA, close to nothing

- From Mr. Mosley, this:

"I think we are looking quite good," the FIA President said when asked about the teams already entered for next season.

Turning his attention to the existing FOTA teams, he told Switzerland's Motorsport Aktuell: "What I would say to them is that if they want to write the rules, they should organise their own championship."

So, I still have my hopes that I will see big red LMP prototypes in Le Mans next year. And Mr. Mosley out of the FIA soon ...

 

[Ardius]

I support Mosley this time, what he's done here is take F1 a step forward rather than waiting around for the manufacturers to agree to things. The ball is in FOTA's half at the moment - he really doesn't need the FOTA teams now seeing as we have plenty of entries so they really need to either come forward with better proprosals or agree to the rules, as has been said, I don't see him or the FIA backing down now because the FOTA threats are somewhat meaningless.

I think teams like Brawn, Force India and perhaps McLaren and Ferrari will relent eventually.

 

[Hun200kmh]

We shall see. We are 8 days away from June 12th, so it won't be a long wait.

Anyway, I don't agree with you. In my view, Mosley wants absolute power, disregards everything FOTA says and I'm glad (as you are also) that FOTA won the only "clash" they had with him before this one

(when he - out of the blue and, like in this case, without previous consultation to the teams * - changed the 2009 rules about points system and was reminded by FOTA that he couldn't do it. I think this humiliation enraged him and got us where we are now).

If Mosley wants to run a F1 Championship of small, low-cost, low-tech, poor teams, fine with me. He will have no trouble to impose his will on them.

I will be watching something else, anyway.


Not WRC, of course. The FIA doesn't seem to bother much with the dying status of that championship.

Probably MotoGP and the Le Mans Series.



* According to him, that rule change was made because Bernie told him the teams agreed. Yeah, right ...

 

[Soundtrack]

Somehow, Bernie considered the “medal proposal” his own indeed.