3D3 Racing: WRS-based races moved to new WRS sub-forum!

[LeftyWright69]

I'm in fer this un ........ Yee Haw.....

I can't remember which car I was using but that shouldn't be too hard to recall once I start grinding the practice laps out.

------------------- Film Critic ------------------
Cool video of the race, love the transitions.

Small suggestion about future productions, if you switch scenes you can take a still shot and move it into PS, mark up the still to indicate who the players are for the next action series, splice it back into the video stream w/ a small hold time for the viewer to understand whoz who and wha la.

The titles on the screen worked great for scene descriptions to keep the viewer in touch with the event being shown.

 

[WRP001]

I'm in fer this un ........ Yee Haw.....

I can't remember which car I was using but that shouldn't be too hard to recall once I start grinding the practice laps out.

You may not want to use the same one... One may be better hot lapper and another easier to drive... Or more likely it's the tune that's too aggressive... I ran the Opel in WRS but I think the Audi is easier to drive... At least until I learn to tune properly.

 

[Hydro]

👍 Lefty, you're in!

I think I'm switching to the BMW for this race.
I ran the Audi for the WRS event, but beat my best lap by over half a second using the BMW about a week later after setting up a pretty good tune.

I think the Audi is easier to drive, and control, which may be more important considering this will be a race, and it's about an hour long.

But if I am going to be in the car for a whole hour+, I choose the BMW. It's exhaust/engine sound is just awesome.

 

[WRP001]

But if I am going to be in the car for a whole hour+, I choose the BMW. It's exhaust/engine sound is just awesome.

Really? I love the nice quiet purrr of the Audi. After running the Opel and it's engine whine the Audi was a nice change of pace on the eardrums... especially if we enable chat 👍

Plus with the Audi paint job I can pretend I'm Mark Webber for an hour at least.

 

[Gravitron]

I'll probably use the Audi or BMW, and pretend I'm Vettel. zzziiiinnnngggGGGG!

Track felt nice in the Audi last night, in my lobby. Not as slippery as I was fearing, and I was 1-2sec off my slow WRS time, but at least keeping it on the track fairly easily.

 

[WRP001]

I'll probably use the Audi or BMW, and pretend I'm Vettel. zzziiiinnnngggGGGG!
Track felt nice in the Audi last night, in my lobby. Not as slippery as I was fearing, and I was 1-2sec off my slow WRS time, but at least keeping it on the track fairly easily.

I'm going to try this praiano tune for the Audi. Might need to adjust something as I think it's set up with more upgrades and higher PP which might impact a few settings. Scared about the chassis reinforcement as we can't get a 2nd car right now and we're stuck if we install it. I would modify the transmission or carry over from WRS. The LSD is way different from the CSL offline tune: 8/16/8 for CSL vs 12/36/8 for Praiano. Praiano suspension is softer, ride height lower... should be good fun just comparing the tunes. Wish I had two of these cars so I could swap easily and test that reinforcement option.

If you pretend to be Vettel, don't think we'll have team orders and I'll let you win. I'll punt you off the track the first time the team director says "hold your position" and claim after the race I thought he said "hold your throttle".

 

[MilleRSVR]

The online track is slower than the offline version, a second at least for me. Not sure which car to use yet. Probably the one with the best tire wear. The BMW is fast, tough on fronts though. Should be interesting to see who has the best tires the last few laps.

Seeing as how I'm a D4 guy, shouldn't I get a head start against you D2 & D3 guys.💡

Seriously though, should be a great race. Very technical track, one I struggle with. Back to the track now, Audi or Opel this time?

 

[WRP001]

The online track is slower than the offline version, a second at least for me. Not sure which car to use yet. Probably the one with the best tire wear. The BMW is fast, tough on fronts though. Should be interesting to see who has the best tires the last few laps.

Seeing as how I'm a D4 guy, shouldn't I get a head start against you D2 & D3 guys.💡

Seriously though, should be a great race. Very technical track, one I struggle with. Back to the track now, Audi or Opel this time?

You kept up fine at Trial Mountain until I got in your way on turn 1 and you lost all the momentum. If not for that mishap, all 3 of us in the lead pack would have kept out of the clutches of that 2nd pack at least until the first pit stop. Looking at the replay, that 2nd gaggle of cars was a riot and I'm lucky to have maintain ample distance from their 'event horizon'. If they had gotten into my slipstream I would have been assimilated borg-style.

This is definitely going to be a different kind of event... I have a feeling it'll take a lot more out of me as the concentration required at GP/F is pretty intense compared to running last week where little mistakes rarely turned into big ones... @ GP/F in a proper race car the tiniest thing can throw you off rhythm and mess up the next 3-4 corners. When it happens in WRS I just reset the lap... but can't do that here

Looking forward to it already.

 

[Hydro]

The online track is slower than the offline version, a second at least for me. Not sure which car to use yet. Probably the one with the best tire wear. The BMW is fast, tough on fronts though. Should be interesting to see who has the best tires the last few laps.

Seeing as how I'm a D4 guy, shouldn't I get a head start against you D2 & D3 guys.💡

Seriously though, should be a great race. Very technical track, one I struggle with. Back to the track now, Audi or Opel this time?

I'm really thinking that this race will be more about consistency and a stable car. I can't run the same setup as I did in the WRS just because it was too tight to keep driving lap after lap. It made for a great TT lap, but would probably wind up spinning/offtrack in certain places, or drive me nuts trying to keep it inline. It certainly needs adjusting for an hour long race to be comfortable for me.

Setting an overall best lap is far from my goal in this event.

As car choice goes.... SuperSic won that week with the Audi, the other two D1 guys ran the BMW, Jon won D2 with the BMW, followed by 2 Opel's. Lynx won D3 with Opel, then Audi, Opel.
How's that for a toss up
Oddly (to me), the Audi was only used by myself, and SuperSic (of those who posted their car choice).
I really thought it would be a BMW/Audi shootout, even though the Opel had the best Power to weight ratio. Shows how much I know

I'm really not putting any thought as to "what car is best" at all. Just go with what you like best, even if it's just the paint job that helps with the decision.
Far more important to get a good setup on one car, and run some test laps than to switch back and forth. 👍

 

[WRP001]

Far more important to get a good setup on one car, and run some test laps than to switch back and forth. 👍

+1

FYI... If I find or create a tune that works for this event I'll post it here in the thread (most likely found like the praiano above and maybe tweaked a little as I'm a neophyte at tuning).

We should approach this topic just like the WRS as far as tunes. Everyone is free (and actively encouraged) to share tunes if they want, but absolutely not required to do so and can keep them as a competitive advantage if they so choose. I think, in the WRS, directly asking for an entire tune from another individual is frowned upon as it puts the tuner in a bad spot. But asking the general group for specific tips on setup (tranny, susp) or fixing a specific issue with the car is totally fine.

One of 3D3's primary goals is to be able to race without too much additional time investment in practice/tuning, but unfortunately the different racing physics throw a wrench into that for some events. Hopefully we can share some "raceable" online tunes for those who won't have time to do much additional practice and then we can duke it out on the track.

 

[Hydro]

+1

FYI... If I find or create a tune that works for this event I'll post it here in the thread (most likely found like the praiano above and maybe tweaked a little as I'm a neophyte at tuning).

We should approach this topic just like the WRS as far as tunes. Everyone is free (and actively encouraged) to share tunes if they want, but absolutely not required to do so and can keep them as a competitive advantage if they so choose. I think, in the WRS, directly asking for an entire tune from another individual is frowned upon as it puts the tuner in a bad spot. But asking the general group for specific tips on setup (tranny, susp) or fixing a specific issue with the car is totally fine.

One of 3D3's primary goals is to be able to race without too much additional time investment in practice/tuning, but unfortunately the different racing physics throw a wrench into that for some events. Hopefully we can share some "raceable" online tunes for those who won't have time to do much additional practice and then we can duke it out on the track.

That's a great idea Tim 👍

I'll do some testing this weekend and post my settings.
I have a good setup for the Audi, and BMW, but not for the Opel, so that's up to you to figure out

 

[WRP001]

That's a great idea Tim 👍

I'll do some testing this weekend and post my settings.
I have a good setup for the Audi, and BMW, but not for the Opel, so that's up to you to figure out

I'm not going to use the Opel anyway even though I used for WRS. I'm definitely going for the purring Audi... already made up my mind and sticking to it.

Not that it wouldn't be a good learning experience to take what you post and try to apply it to the Opel... That may be a good exercise if I have the time.

Are you applying the chassis reinforcement in the Audi? I want to know if I should take that plunge as the praiano tune suggests it... And if your tune also uses it I won't be left in the lurch if the praiano tune doesn't work out.

EDIT: I may also investigate this tune without the illegal upgrades of course... not exactly for this version of the Opel but read elsewhere it can work with a little modification.

 

[Hydro]

I do have the chassis reinforcement on all three cars.
I'd say wait until you find a good tune as is, and we can compare test times, seeing as we will be posting our setups anyway.
After installing the reinforcement (if you do) you will need to adjust the suspension a bit, and that might throw off an otherwise great tune setup.

Just remember too, that the trasnmission setup from the Tune you linked to might not work well at all with this race, as it was setup with a Stage 3 turbo.

Edit- With the BMW being available in the OCD, I'll buy it and do a side-by-side test with the BMW I have to see what the car feels like without the reinforcement 👍

 

[WRP001]

Took the Audi out for a test drive in my online lobby. At first I could not break 2'00, but after about 15 minutes of playing with setup I noticed my HP were down and needed an oil change

Anyway, went back to the CSL tune to get a baseline for future changes. I was running 1'59.1-1'59.6 pretty consistently which seemed a bit slow, but I wasn't hitting my marks very consistently and this course is unforgiving.

After 10-15 laps practice I adjusted a few of my lines, started to drive better and got this string of times in laps 2-4 of a run:

• 1'58.806
• 1'58.550
• 1'57.737 (<1 sec from my WRS hot lap)

The Audi felt pretty good with CSL's tune and I took a shallower line with later braking through Dunlop which made a significant difference, plus it seemed to be less tail happy that way. The Audi doesn't exhibit the "lift off oversteer" like the Opel, but this line is still an improvement.

Now that I've found some rhythm I'm going to test with some pieces of praiano's tune, but keep CSL's transmission as that seems to be pretty spot on for GP/F. If I could get the chassis a bit more stable for the rumbles and run consistent mid 1'58 I'd be pretty happy for the race. Running 1'57 right now seems a bit too much on the edge (without draft).

For any others signing up, I think I could run the CSL tune for the Audi unmodified for the race and be pretty comfortable. I may try to make a few modifications to tame it just a bit, but unlike the Opel setup, it's a good base online tune for GP/F.

 

[Beefalicious]

I have yet to actually test any of the cars, I'm pretty sure I'll go with the BMW but will reserve that decision until tonight when I've run all three a few times.

Thanks for doing the video WRP, was fantastic!! We were SO busy duking it out for 4th that you guys just took off in the front.

About my WRS Quali, submitted it a day or two ago, I'm sure whomever it is that updates it has a real life and is quite busy etc.. It'll show up sooner or later

 

[WRP001]

I have yet to actually test any of the cars, I'm pretty sure I'll go with the BMW but will reserve that decision until tonight when I've run all three a few times.

Thanks for doing the video WRP, was fantastic!! We were SO busy duking it out for 4th that you guys just took off in the front.

About my WRS Quali, submitted it a day or two ago, I'm sure whomever it is that updates it has a real life and is quite busy etc.. It'll show up sooner or later

Sounds good... glad you enjoyed it and glad to have you racing with us next week too. 👍

It's going to be impossible to get 4 wide into the corners next week on GP/F... that's for sure!!!

I did a little more testing this afternoon and managed a 1'57.470 best lap with slight adjustments to the LSD from CSL's tune to tame it down. Overall the car felt a bit slower actually and more stable (but not much of either) which was the goal and that PR lap time was mostly due to lower fuel weight (half tank) as I made a long run with a couple pit stops and fresh tires.

It's going to be tricky to make it the distance on one stop (IMO) unless the driver is very easy on tires. Lap times go down pretty quickly after 8 laps so it seems to set up nicely for a 2 stop strategy. Probably lose 28-30 seconds per stop so two will be costly, but with tires older than 8 laps the lap times go down 2-4 secs per lap pretty quickly plus the chance of a mistake goes way up after 10 laps on the tires. It gets very loose on a couple of the tricky high speed turns which are before long straights and that can cost a lot of time if missed. In any case, it should be very close between 1 and 2 stops over 25 laps which is perfect so people mix up strategies. I'm going to make the decision on the fly depending on what's happening on the track. If I'm having a hard time passing someone who is holding me up (e.g. Hydro ) and I can slot into a 2 pit strategy I'll just dive in and pit. If I'm in the open or especially if I'm drafting a slightly faster driver I may just stay out.

One warning to everyone... don't go too fast into pit lane. We don't have a pit lane speed limit, but it's very easy at GP/F to overshoot the lane on the sharp entry and end up back on the front straight with no way back into the pits... I did it *twice* in practice when I was trying to push my speed into the pits. I'd say treat the pit entry like a 2nd gear corner and brake/downshift early... entering in 3rd gear is too fast to make the narrow corner in pit lane... especially with old tires.

EDIT: Good walk through by Yanaran for this car/track (for offline, but still useful) in case you missed it: https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?p=5798527#post5798527

 

[Hydro]

About my WRS Quali, submitted it a day or two ago, I'm sure whomever it is that updates it has a real life and is quite busy etc.. It'll show up sooner or later

Glad to see you ran the Qualifier!
It will take a bit to process, I think it took about 10-12 days for my GT5 re-qualifier (from GT5P), but I'm really not sure what the cycle is.

Signed you up for the Decisions event as well 👍

 

[WRP001]

Hey Hydro,

Sign up my friend GTP_SCBuilder also... he's got a steep learning curve this week as he's never run this track or this car, and neither are very forgiving, but what the heck. If you guys don't mind if he's a couple seconds slower per lap... Still working on him to get in the qualifier for the WRS.

 

[Hydro]

Hey Hydro,

Sign up my friend GTP_SCBuilder also... he's got a steep learning curve this week as he's never run this track or this car, and neither are very forgiving, but what the heck. If you guys don't mind if he's a couple seconds slower per lap... Still working on him to get in the qualifier for the WRS.

Cool, he's on the board 👍

I wouldn't worry about his laptimes, but yes, this is definitely going to be a challenge simply because we (ok, I ) ran so many laps in the WRS to get it right.
I think this was the WRS week I lost track of all of my friends, family, etc.
This was such an addictive combo, I'm really dying to race this one 👍

 

[WRP001]

So I take back what I said earlier about CSL's offline WRS tune for the Audi working online... that was actually some kind of mess up and I didn't actually have that tune on at the time of the test. . It's "driveable", but definitely exhibits the lift off understeer in Dunlop online that eliminates it for me in a longer race. But if I grab parts of CSL's BMW tune and apply it to the Audi and then put my own preference into LSD... I like the result 👍 (below).

Note: The praiano tune is "slightly" better online. It just eats up the first sector of Nurb GP/F, but it's not so great for Dunlop either with a bit of lift off understeer and even though it's got a ton more LSD it's not that stable or forgiving. The ride height is too low for this track I think and the springs too stiff.

Here's what I came up with and it works over a 25 laps really well and it's not super twitchy, but still fast. It does do some damage to tires so probably requires 2 pit stops over 25 laps if you push the car to the limit. But I can run low 1'57s to 1'58s from laps 2-7 in a stint without pushing too hard. It'll drop off to 1'59-2'00 beyond 9 laps though and get harder to handle on several parts of the track so get ready for slip 'n slide if you try to go for 13 laps.

Give it a shot and let me know what you think!

ABT Audi TT-R Touring Car '02 -- Online Tune
Tuned specifically for Nurburgring GP/F Online using Racing Hard Tires

Aero

35 / 60 (max)​

Transmission

Default
Top Speed 149
Set Final Gear to reach 190 (Top Right) ~ 2.690​

LSD

10 / 24 / 8​

Suspension

-5 / 10
12.0 / 11.5
6/5
4/3
3/2​

Camber/Toe

2.3 / 0.8
0.00/0.10
​

Brakes

7/5
ABS: 2​

 

[LeftyWright69]

Here's what I came up with

Great job "W" I took 2 seconds off my other tune, and the Stage 3 helped also

 

[MilleRSVR]

I think I'm taking the conservative approach to this race. Some of you guys were a couple seconds quicker than me in the WRS event. I think my best strategy is a one stop race. The Opel is easier on tires for me, if some guys make two stops that's about 30 sec. I stand to gain. That's assuming I stay on track and don't make any big mistakes, which is easy to do on this circuit.

Should be very interesting to see the different strategies play out.

I need lots more practice and tweaking on the setup before Wed.

 

[WRP001]

Great job "W" I took 2 seconds off my other tune, and the Stage 3 helped also

Awesome! I like the stability of the setup. If hydro posts a tune you might want to try it also as he is a better tuner. But maybe I got lucky this time. Note: I did NOT install rigidity upgrade... Did you lefty? I'm not going to since I can't uninstall or buy new car so not risking it with audi.

I think I'm taking the conservative approach to this race. Some of you guys were a couple seconds quicker than me in the WRS event. I think my best strategy is a one stop race. The Opel is easier on tires for me, if some guys make two stops that's about 30 sec. I stand to gain. That's assuming I stay on track and don't make any big mistakes, which is easy to do on this circuit.

Should be very interesting to see the different strategies play out.

I need lots more practice and tweaking on the setup before Wed.

Cool strategy. If you can get the Opel to behave it is lighter and should be better on tires. 👍

After testing I really think I'm going with the full on rabbit strategy and I'm going to try and punish my tires.

Could come down to efficient passing with freshies and not getting behind an entire pack of cars on older tires after the first pit. I don't think there will be many packs left by lap 10 though.

This is fun 👍

Now if we could just get a few more on grid... Doesn't appear T13r is going to race since he didn't do original combo... If you guys know anybody on the fence, give them a shove.

And waffles... Thanks for the 3D3 shout out on the WRS thread... That was cool. 👍

 

[LeftyWright69]

I did NOT install rigidity upgrade... Did you lefty?

I didn't either because I run A/T and I like the frame to flex so I can track through the corner.

I just wish I could calm down the BMW because I like it the most. It has a late exit weight transfer issue, in other words it spins out on exit just before or as I start to power up.

 

[Hydro]

I didn't either because I run A/T and I like the frame to flex so I can track through the corner.

Hmmmm.. Interesting.
I did install the reinforcement on all of the cars.
Might spring for the BMW in the OCD to see the difference.

Of course that would be my 3rd BMW (one is stock, one WRS spec)
Thankfully the seasonals have made credits a bit of a non-issue (plus, how do you argue a half-a-million dollar discount? )

Just jumping online to do some testing. 👍
If anyone wants to join that isn't already on my list, just send a FR to GTP_Hydro (you may as well anyway, I'll be hosting some of the events as well)

 

[Hydro]

Ok, I ran some test laps with the BMW, and Audi.
Nice to see WRP, and Miller join me for a bit 👍
Both cars are setup pretty close to each other in the end.

I was getting times very similar to WRP -1'57's-158's in both the BWM, and Audi, with 1 lone 1'56 (.989 in the BMW).
Tire/fuel on, All testing done with a full tank, first 10 laps or so (I'll always test this way for posting results).

Here's the setups I ran:

BMW
-9/-6
15.1/14.9
6/5
6/5
4/3

2.5/2.1
-0.08/0.22

ABS 1, 8/7 BB (I always set brakes a touch higher for online to avoid rear ending other drivers , and adjust settings on the fly when I'm not in traffic)

10/9/5 ** LSD settings were originally 21/42/19, but after testing with Miller it seems I may not understand LSD settings as well as I thought - I'll check back if ther are any changes/revelations

Trans:
Top speed: lower right box - 240 (149 mph - seriously guys, PLEASE embrace Metric!!! - On a national level )
Final gear: 2.726
4.970
3.199
2.518
2.078
1.729
1.485

Top right speed is 291 (~181)

This trans setup matches the gears to the most relevant corners, avoiding any in-turn / awkward shifts. Top speed is setup for drafting.
The Audi trans settings below use the same formula, as do all of my trans setups.

-------
I'll post Audi settings/results soon, but here's the trans. for now... 👍

Audi:
Top speed: lower right box : 240 (149)
final gear: 2.691

4.304
2.762
2.215
1.809
1.526
1.303

Top speed, top right box: 291 (181)

The rest:

-10/-8
15.3/14.2
6/5
6/5
4/3

2.5/2.1
-0.09/0.08

9/11/8

Abs 1 , 8/7 BB

Both the Audi and BMW shift at almost exactly the same spot on the track, even though the BMW revs higher.
The Audi however has to shift up to 4th for a sec in the short straight between Kumho and Bit corners, where the BMW does not.

I'm thinking the Audi might be the car for me after all. It's just easier to handle IMO.
I'll be flip-flopping right up until the event I'm sure

 

[WRP001]

BAD NEWS!!!

I saw on the GT5 news page (in the game) that they are scheduling a maintenance event right at the start of our next event on Wednesday Sept 21. 🤬 Here's the information on gran-turismo.com:

http://us.gran-turismo.com/us/news/d5939.html

The online service of Gran Turismo 5 will undergo maintenance during the following hours:

Start&#65306;09/21/2011 22:00 EDT
Finish&#65306;09/21/2011 23:00 EDT

During the maintenance, you will not be able to connect to any of the online services.

*Please note that the exact time of the maintenance may slightly vary.​

We need to take a vote as to who can race when and we need to move it. The scheduled downtime is only 1 hour from 10:00 PM EST to 11:00 PM EST. We could either move it later on Wednesday immediately after the maintenance OR try it on another night... Thursday? Tuesday? I know how maintenance goes so it's possible if we keep it on Wednesday they could run into issues and run late... or it might be ready earlier... it's just a risk.

What do you guys think? I know Blair is on the East coast so moving it back an hour might not work for him.

 

[MilleRSVR]

I'd be up for a different night if all agree. Those updates don't always go off as scheduled. Tuesday or Thursday is good for me.

 

[Gravitron]

I'd vote for Tues. Wed seems too risky, and Thursday is a definite no-go for me until around 9:30pm PT.

Good thing you noticed so quick, Tim. 👍

EDIT: All the testing you guys are doing, and publishing of tunes...WOW!

 

[WRP001]

I'd vote for Tues. Wed seems too risky, and Thursday is a definite no-go for me until around 9:30pm PT.

Good thing you noticed so quick, Tim. 👍

EDIT: All the testing you guys are doing, and publishing of tunes...WOW!

Tuesday better for me too. Hopefully Marc, lefty and waffles are good that night too.

The testing is fun actually. I've got to try Marc's tunes though. I plan to be in my lounge tonight. If anyone is online you can join me. Probably after 8 pm PST.

Lucas -- have you tried my tune on the Audi? If not come on in my lounge and give it a shot. Don't waste your time trying to catch me in WRS.

EDIT: Lucas you dirty rat!!! You already beat me in the Merc.