America - The Official Thread

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I find it hilarious that Trump's appointed Federal Judge and Trump's appointed FBI director are all in on Merrick Garland's hexagonal liberal conspiracy to take out a political rival of Biden's for violating a law Trump signed that he's been accused of breaking by the (famously partisan, of course) National Archives virtually since the day he left office.



I mean, that has to be what is happening, because remember that Trump can't be corrupt because he's too smart to be corrupt.
 
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So since this is apparently the thread in which this is to be discussed because Chrunch threw a bitchfit about people not discussing it in this thread, I'm going to put this here.

www.justsecurity.org

Expert Backgrounder: Criminal Statutes that Could Apply to Trump's Retention of Government Documents

Experts survey the possible crimes underlying search warrants executed at Mar-a-Lago.
www.justsecurity.org www.justsecurity.org

It was a really good read. It doesn't tilt so far into legalese that I couldn't understand it and it provides some good insight into where such an investigation may lead.

Also on the subject, lots of stupid people are clamoring for the affidavit to be made public, but they tend to not be. Why not publish the warrant itself? Trump's legal team would have gotten that as it's required by law to provide it. It would show, very specifically, what was being sought and would likely show where said materials were believed to be. The only thing stopping Trump and company from releasing that is Trump and company.
 
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Trump is going to have a hell of a time explaining why he doesn't still hold Presidential documents when he has spent much of the last two years insisting that he is the President...
 
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Tornado
I find it hilarious that Trump's appointed Federal Judge and Trump's appointed FBI director are all in on Merrick Garland's hexagonal liberal conspiracy to take out a political rival of Biden's for violating a law Trump signed that he's been accused of breaking by the (famously partisan, of course) National Archives virtually since the day he left office.



I mean, that has to be what is happening, because remember that Trump can't be corrupt because he's too smart to be corrupt.
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Or Trump didn't read the law he signed off on so because he didn't read it, it doesn't apply to him.
 
McLaren
Man, I remember when Republicans couldn’t jerk off enough about “Law & Order” & “Back the Blue”. Now apparently Trump should be free to commit crimes as long as he doesn’t kill anyone and bury them on his golf course.
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FTFY
 
TexRex
So since this is apparently the thread in which this is to be discussed because Chrunch threw a bitchfit about people not discussing it in this thread, I'm going to put this here.

www.justsecurity.org

Expert Backgrounder: Criminal Statutes that Could Apply to Trump's Retention of Government Documents

Experts survey the possible crimes underlying search warrants executed at Mar-a-Lago.
www.justsecurity.org www.justsecurity.org

It was a really good read. It doesn't tilt so far into legalese that I couldn't understand it and it provides some good insight into where such an investigation may lead.

Also on the subject, lots of stupid people are clamoring for the affidavit to be made public, but they tend to not be. Why not publish the warrant itself? Trump's legal team would have gotten that as it's required by law to provide it. It would show, very specifically, what was being sought and would likely show where said materials were believed to be. The only thing stopping Trump and company from releasing that is Trump and company.
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Interesting read. Still too many unknowns to really be able to tell how bad this is, if at all. But if this ends up just being some procedural BS, then I think it could be argued that this was an over reach. Either way, it really puts Trump’s feet to the fire on wether he’s gonna run again or not
 
Can someone explain to me how a (probably) Republican judge in Republican Florida signing a warrant for a local office of FBI - with its Republican-appointed Director - to carry out a search and seizure... is a Democrat-led "raid" on a political opponent?

Also, Trump would have a copy of the warrant, and could simply release it to show what the purpose behind it was. That would easily show just how much of an "over reach" it is and end all the speculation. I mean, he's got nothing to fear because he has nothing to hide, right?

Right?

1660134443154.png
 
Yard_Sale
Still too many unknowns to really be able to tell how bad this is...
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Yep, and yet stupid people are still going to be stupid.
Yard_Sale
...if at all.
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Er, no. I mean I can understand the appeal of that narrative for you, but this isn't anything other than bad. Still, how bad is presently an unknown. Trump and company could shed some light on how bad it is by coming forward with the warrant, but for whatever reason, they have opted to keep that close to the vest even as they demand that investigators come forward with the affidavit upon which warrant issuance was based. Weird.
Famine
View attachment 1182366
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On all occasions said of a political opponent. Now that side is insisting that this is political rather than being about law and order. They're telling on themselves. They would push for this sort of action against a political opponent.
 
Famine
Can someone explain to me how a (probably) Republican judge in Republican Florida signing a warrant for a local office of FBI - with its Republican-appointed Director - to carry out a search and seizure... is a Democrat-led "raid" on a political opponent?

Also, Trump would have a copy of the warrant, and could simply release it to show what the purpose behind it was. That would easily show just how much of an "over reach" it is and end all the speculation. I mean, he's got nothing to fear because he has nothing to hide, right?

Right?

View attachment 1182366
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Projection. He probably means people who are not PUBLICLY being investigated by the FBI.
 
Famine
Can someone explain to me how a (probably) Republican judge in Republican Florida signing a warrant for a local office of FBI - with its Republican-appointed Director - to carry out a search and seizure... is a Democrat-led "raid" on a political opponent?

Also, Trump would have a copy of the warrant, and could simply release it to show what the purpose behind it was. That would easily show just how much of an "over reach" it is and end all the speculation. I mean, he's got nothing to fear because he has nothing to hide, right?

Right?

View attachment 1182366
Click to expand...
It was an Obama appointed judge
TexRex
Yep, and yet stupid people are still going to be stupid.

Er, no. I mean I can understand the appeal of that narrative for you, but this isn't anything other than bad. Still, how bad is presently an unknown. Trump and company could shed some light on how bad it is by coming forward with the warrant, but for whatever reason, they have opted to keep that close to the vest even as they demand that investigators come forward with the affidavit upon which warrant issuance was based. Weird.

On all occasions said of a political opponent. Now that side is insisting that this is political rather than being about law and order. They're telling on themselves. They would push for this sort of action against a political opponent.
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By “if at all”, I was just referring to it being a simple procedural thing where he went to declassify something, but his staff didn’t follow through. I think to the American public, that would be classified as a nothing burger by pretty much all Republicans and most moderates.

For the record, I’ve always hoped Trump doesn’t run again. Too Much baggage and there’s other Republican candidates that would do a much better job. Besides, I think the only shot the democrats have in 2024, is if Trump IS on a he Republican ticket
 
Yard_Sale
By “if at all”, I was just referring to it being a simple procedural thing where he went to declassify something, but his staff didn’t follow through. I think to the American public, that would be classified as a nothing burger by pretty much all Republicans and most moderates.
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Even if they're not classified documents, Trump is still in breach of the Presidential Records Act by taking the documents with him. No president since Gerald Ford has been entitled to do so. The documents could be scribbled McDonald's orders for all we know, but even if they are, it's still in breach of the law to keep them.

I don't believe for a second that the documents that were kept are benign. Why would Trump keep something without any meaning at all? And if he did, why didn't he just give them back and say, "oops, my bad." It's not like they haven't been asking for this stuff for nearly two years now.
 
Joey D
Even if they're not classified documents, Trump is still in breach of the Presidential Records Act by taking the documents with him. No president since Gerald Ford has been entitled to do so. The documents could be scribbled McDonald's orders for all we know, but even if they are, it's still in breach of the law to keep them.

I don't believe for a second that the documents that were kept are benign. Why would Trump keep something without any meaning at all? And if he did, why didn't he just give them back and say, "oops, my bad." It's not like they haven't been asking for this stuff for nearly two years now.
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Also Trump is currently trying to cover his ass by not-so-subtly implying that the FBI might've planted documents during their "raid"... I don't think they'd be "planting" McDonalds orders, even to make a low-hanging ketchup joke.
 
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Yard_Sale
It was an Obama appointed judge
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How the hell did Obama manage to appoint Reinhart in 2018 (which is when he was appointed to the position of Magistrate Judge)?

www.newsweek.com

Fact Check: Did Trump Appoint Judge Who Approved FBI Mar-A-Lago Raid?

Social media posts claim the judge who reportedly approved the Mar-a-Lago search was a Donald Trump appointee.
www.newsweek.com www.newsweek.com

For the record, Trump didn't appoint him either, Presidents don't appoint Magistrate Judges, but I am still intrigued as to what plane of nonsense you pulled the Obama claim from?
Yard_Sale
By “if at all”, I was just referring to it being a simple procedural thing where he went to declassify something, but his staff didn’t follow through. I think to the American public, that would be classified as a nothing burger by pretty much all Republicans and most moderates.
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It would take significantly more than that to get a warrant, but as Hillary's emailed proved, your talking nonsense in regard to Republican views on this ('lock her up' ring any bells).
Yard_Sale
For the record, I’ve always hoped Trump doesn’t run again. Too Much baggage and there’s other Republican candidates that would do a much better job. Besides, I think the only shot the democrats have in 2024, is if Trump IS on a he Republican ticket
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DeSantis fan then?

Famine
Oh cool. I guess it's definitely Biden sending in the troops in an attack on a political opponent and totally fascism then.
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@Yard_Sale has, to be blunt, pulled that out of his backside. Reinhart was appointed in 2018, by a majority vote of active district judges of the court in question.
 
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Joey D
Even if they're not classified documents, Trump is still in breach of the Presidential Records Act by taking the documents with him. No president since Gerald Ford has been entitled to do so. The documents could be scribbled McDonald's orders for all we know, but even if they are, it's still in breach of the law to keep them.
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This is what that creepy looking mother****er Asa Hutchinson, Republican governor of Arkansas, pushed back against on PBS NewsHour yesterday:

"I think what's important here, too, is the public is not gonna get too excited if these documents are routine documents at the White House that the pesident took out in violation of the presidential documents act."

Of course when he says "public" he really means Republicans, "the law and order party," who aren't going to get "too excited" if a Republican president violates a law explicitly conceived to constrain the president; it's right there in the ****ing name.

Hillary deleted emails that she wasn't supposed to delete. There are federal laws pursuant to record retention. The contents of those emails is unknown, whether it's "procedural" stuff or whatever, and stupid mother****ers have been screaming "lock her up" over it for six years.
 
TexRex
Hillary deleted emails that she wasn't supposed to delete. There are federal laws pursuant to record retention. The contents of those emails is unknown, whether it's "procedural" stuff or whatever, and stupid mother****ers have been screaming "lock her up" over it for six years.
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Here's the thing, she didn't even do that, the closest is that her Chief of Staff got the hosting company to change the servers retention period to 60 days, which the tech assigned to do it then totally forgot to do, only doing it when they had a later 'oh ****' moment.

Hillary Clinton email controversy - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org

She did a lot of objectively stupid (but not it seems, criminal) stuff with regard to that email server, but mass delete 30K records wasn't one of them. Yet Trump and the GOP have repeated the lie so many damn times its now truth in the public consciousness.
 
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Famine
Can someone explain to me how a (probably) Republican judge in Republican Florida signing a warrant for a local office of FBI - with its Republican-appointed Director - to carry out a search and seizure... is a Democrat-led "raid" on a political opponent?
Click to expand...

4d7ca1c5b0ba91a84cdf13668c0b90ff.gif


/s
 
Scaff
How the hell did Obama manage to appoint Reinhart in 2018 (which is when he was appointed to the position of Magistrate Judge)?

www.newsweek.com

Fact Check: Did Trump Appoint Judge Who Approved FBI Mar-A-Lago Raid?

Social media posts claim the judge who reportedly approved the Mar-a-Lago search was a Donald Trump appointee.
www.newsweek.com www.newsweek.com

For the record, Trump didn't appoint him either, Presidents don't appoint Magistrate Judges, but I am still intrigued as to what plane of nonsense you pulled the Obama claim from?

It would take significantly more than that to get a warrant, but as Hillary's emailed proved, your talking nonsense in regard to Republican views on this ('lock her up' ring any bells).

DeSantis fan then?


@Yard_Sale has, to be blunt, pulled that out of his backside. Reinhart was appointed in 2018, by a majority vote of active district judges of the court in question.
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I stand corrected with the Obama appointed judge comment. Mid-read something on my end.

The whole “lock her up” thing was stupid. Just a political rally cry.

As far as DeSantis, I could be a fan. But he’s not my personal front runner. There’s some stuff I agree with him on. Some I don’t. I for sure don’t think he’s the most electable of the lot. He’s too easy to sound-bite into oblivion.
 
Scaff
Here's the thing, she didn't even do that, the closest is that her Chief of Staff got the hosting company to change the servers retention period to 60 days, which the tech assigned to do it then totally forgot to do, only doing it when they had a later 'oh ****' moment.

Hillary Clinton email controversy - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org

She did a lot of objectively stupid (but not it seems, criminal) stuff with regard to that email server, but mass delete 30K records wasn't one of them. Yet Trump and the GOP have repeated the lie so many damn times its now truth in the public consciousness.
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Okay, stupid mother****ers have been screaming "lock her up" for six years based on the belief that she deleted emails, without knowledge of the contents of those emails.

The notion that the supposed inconsequential contents of documents removed from the White House has any bearing on records retention and oversight is pure partisan inanity.
 
Yard_Sale
I stand corrected with the Obama appointed judge comment. Mid-read something on my end.
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OK.
Yard_Sale
The whole “lock her up” thing was stupid. Just a political rally cry.
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Indeed, but plenty of Republicans did just that.
Yard_Sale
As far as DeSantis, I could be a fan. But he’s not my personal front runner. There’s some stuff I agree with him on. Some I don’t. I for sure don’t think he’s the most electable of the lot. He’s too easy to sound-bite into oblivion.
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He's a blatant power crazed bigot, thatbaline should be enough to not entertain him on any level.
 
So the FBI had the records the National Archives have claimed were missing for the past year and a half.


This whole time under the Republican-appointed FBI head, mind you.




All in order to frame Trump for a crime that he could have very easily proven he didn't do by producing chain of custody information the day he left the White House?

Scaff
He's a blatant power crazed bigot, thatbaline should be enough to not entertain him on any level.
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Okay but.

Consider this:


Both sides.
 
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Scaff
OK.

Indeed, but plenty of Republicans did just that.

He's a blatant power crazed bigot, thatbaline should be enough to not entertain him on any level.
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Which is why I don’t think that desantis is the most electable candidate. Wether I vote for him or not will depend on the democratic candidate and his/her associated baggage. Plus, I think that from a strategy point of view, Desantis is more valuable in Florida than he is in the whitehouse. Furthermore, the 2024 election is a once in a generation opportunity for the Republican Party to rebrand itself for the next 50 years by elevating a minority to the top of the ticket. They need to play the long game on this. Wether or not their smart enough….eh, I’m not holding my breath
 
Yard_Sale
Which is why I don’t think that desantis is the most electable candidate. Wether I vote for him or not will depend on the democratic candidate and his/her associated baggage. Plus, I think that from a strategy point of view, Desantis is more valuable in Florida than he is in the whitehouse. Furthermore, the 2024 election is a once in a generation opportunity for the Republican Party to rebrand itself for the next 50 years by elevating a minority to the top of the ticket. They need to play the long game on this. Wether or not their smart enough….eh, I’m not holding my breath
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The fact that you consider DeSantis to have value says more than enough...
 
Scaff
The fact that you consider DeSantis to have value says more than enough...
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In your opinion..


I’m willing to accept that “intersectional” political figures on both sides of the isle are going to come with a list of stupid stuff they’ve said. I can disagree with certain things a candidate says or stands for. But hey, what can I say… I’m non college educated blue collar type folk. There’s not a whole lot that truly gets under my skin.
 
Yard_Sale
In your opinion..


I’m willing to accept that “intersectional” political figures on both sides of the isle are going to come with a list of stupid stuff they’ve said. I can disagree with certain things a candidate says or stands for. But hey, what can I say… I’m non college educated blue collar type folk. There’s not a whole lot that truly gets under my skin.
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Said?

It's not just what he's said, it's what he's done.

That its not directly targeted at people such as yourself doesn't make it OK.
 

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