America - The Official Thread

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Not if they can't keep it, and to keep it they need independents to vote for them.

Based on the gallup polls his approval amound independent voters has fallen from a steady 38 to 39 percent, to 31 since the shutdown.

https://news.gallup.com/poll/203198/presidential-approval-ratings-donald-trump.aspx
All good, true speculation of what may be at stake in the future. Which may include a viable 3rd/4th party of some sort, dividing the vote. Meanwhile, in the here and now, Trump is redefining reality on the ground. Once the shutdown goes on past 30 days, coming up rapidly, he may begin introducing permanent reductions in force. Libertarians may be pleased, as would surely be Tea Partiers and the broad GOP.
 
All good, true speculation of what may be at stake in the future. Which may include a viable 3rd/4th party of some sort, dividing the vote. Meanwhile, in the here and now, Trump is redefining reality on the ground. Once the shutdown goes on past 30 days, coming up rapidly, he may begin introducing permanent reductions in force. Libertarians may be pleased, as would surely be Tea Partiers and the broad GOP.

The only viable option for another party is to split the democratic party. Perhaps a Social democrat party, but that would only strengthen the seemingly loyal Republican voterbase. Or am I wrong that there are actually a lot of independants/moderates that voted for Trump in protest of Hillary?

Is he legally allowed to reduce the government workforce without consent from congress? Would the furloughed workers get severance pay?
 
The only viable option for another party is to split the democratic party. Perhaps a Social democrat party, but that would only strengthen the seemingly loyal Republican voterbase. Or am I wrong that there are actually a lot of independants/moderates that voted for Trump in protest of Hillary?

Is he legally allowed to reduce the government workforce without consent from congress? Would the furloughed workers get severance pay?
Not under an emergency federal shut down, which this is. As far as I am aware, Rrump will not have the ability to RiF any federal employees.
 
Then watch the videos of the kids being approached they give no ground and the videos of them all around them.

https://www.vox.com/2019/1/19/18189668/white-students-maga-gear-harass-native-elders




https://www.tmz.com/2019/01/19/maga...merican-vietnam-vet-indigenous-peoples-march/

Its said repeatedly in this video.


And yet you cite it as proof?


The poster quite clearly attempted to link the two groups, as did you twitter post. That they are clearly different groups that your sources are attempting to conflate is acutely relevant to the honest and clear bias of your sources on this matter.



A disclaimer doesn't change the tone of the view, the attempts to link two utterly different groups, or the nature of your source.


What could they have done?

Not shouted 'build the wall', not surrounded them, not obstructed them, just a few basic niceties.

It seems that the kids (and you) seem to forget that freedom of speech (they are free to shout 'build the wall' and freedom of consequences are not the same thing.

It's also turning out to be quite the institute for this kind of behaviour.

https://mobile.twitter.com/christapeterso?ref_src=twsrc^tfw|twcamp^tweetembed|twterm^1086787337860743169&ref_url=https://washingtonpress.com/2019/01/19/ex-students-of-the-high-school-of-racist-maga-teens-just-revealed-their-horror-stories/

https://eu.cincinnati.com/story/new...xavier-commit-charged-rape-sodomy/2283381002/

https://washingtonpress.com/2019/01...aga-teens-just-revealed-their-horror-stories/

However I'm sure some will dismiss it as boys being boys. :banghead:

Maybe next time you will get all the information:

These kids where surrounded by Hostile Adults, hardly the intimation claimed.
 
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Maybe next time you will get all the information:

These kids where surrounded by Hostile Adults, hardly the intimation claimed.


I havent found an impartial report about this incident at all. It is both sides using their own narratives based on basically the same footage. So my opinion is reserved. I personally think that nothing really happened and its being blown way out of proportion.
 
I havent found an impartial report about this incident at all. It is both sides using their own narratives based on basically the same footage. So my opinion is reserved. I personally think that nothing really happened and its being blown way out of proportion.
Going just by the videos, I would say that is the case, nothing really happened.

But that is a problem, these kids are probably going to be damaged for life from this, having the world's media attacking you and having your face out there like that is extremely negligent of the media, I would expect big lawsuits incoming.
 
Going just by the videos, I would say that is the case, nothing really happened.

But that is a problem, these kids are probably going to be damaged for life from this, having the world's media attacking you and having your face out there like that is extremely negligent of the media, I would expect big lawsuits incoming.

I get that. But you are assuming they are innocent. I have read some first person accounts, but these are just as unreliable.
 
I get that. But you are assuming they are innocent. I have read some first person accounts, but these are just as unreliable.
I'm not assuming nothing, I have only been going by the footage, most of the footage seen is filmed by the Black Hebrew Israelites who where calling the group Homosexuals before the natives even arrived, then the natives came across and walked into the group where the supposed stand off happened. But you can even see in the videos the kids where not hostile to the Natives at least at first.

Even still watching the footage it just seems like nonsense given the amount of media attention.
 
Maybe next time you will get all the information:
These kids where surrounded by Hostile Adults, hardly the intimation claimed.

Good job I said this then:

Overall its a difficult situation, but its certainly not a bunch of innocent kids being harassed by the nasty man that the above sources attempt to paint it

As for Tim Pool, seriously....
 
Good job I said this then:



As for Tim Pool, seriously....
Can you explain your comment about Tim Pool? I don't like Tim Pool by the way.. by reading your messages I am getting the idea that you don't really care about the facts and care more about who is bringing the facts and if they support your political ideology. I could be wrong.. if so than sorry.
 
Can you explain your comment about Tim Pool? I don't like Tim Pool by the way.. by reading your messages I am getting the idea that you don't really care about the facts and care more about who is bringing the facts and if they support your political ideology. I could be wrong.. if so than sorry.
I care deeply about the facts (which is also why I said that this was overall a difficult position, and pointed out that its was actually three groups involved, not two). Which is why I have an issue with Tim Pool.

He's certainly not above misrepresenting them, and certainly has his own ideological agenda.
 
Say what you want about Tim Pool but he presented this story quite well, he had sources to back up everything he said and he didn't really add much personal opinion to it.
 
I'm not assuming nothing, I have only been going by the footage, most of the footage seen is filmed by the Black Hebrew Israelites who where calling the group Homosexuals before the natives even arrived, then the natives came across and walked into the group where the supposed stand off happened. But you can even see in the videos the kids where not hostile to the Natives at least at first.

Even still watching the footage it just seems like nonsense given the amount of media attention.

You are still assuming they are innocent. Based on the video you cant fully rule out they were provoking them from just a single camera pov. I personally think all the groups there had been provoking each other. But I fully agree that the kids have been unjustly singled out.

edit: added link

So the native american claims he sought them in an effort to diffuse. I think there were still children mocking them (not all). So I agree again that the initial narrative was incorrect and the native american has acknowledged that.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/20/us/nathan-phillips-covington.html
 
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Maybe next time you will get all the information before you get poor information:

These kids where surrounded by Hostile Adults, hardly the intimation claimed.

20190121_023427.png


:lol:

"One of these things is just like the others
All of these things are exactly the same
Can you tell these things are just like the others by the time I finish this song?"
 
View attachment 794184

:lol:

"One of these things is just like the others
All of these things are exactly the same
Can you tell these things are just like the others by the time I finish this song?"

I hate these clickbaity titels. In gaming there is this guy CleanPrincegaming who uses the same strategy on youtube. Using overdramatic titles with misleading and sometimes unrelated thumbnails. What he also does is spread inaccurate stories and sometimes conspiracy theories (all about gaming) that are not very well researched.
 
Say what you want about Tim Pool but he presented this story quite well, he had sources to back up everything he said and he didn't really add much personal opinion to it.
I didn't watch Tim Pool but I have seen the entire video unedited. The indian fellow and his posse came in shouting racist, xenophobic and hateful insults towards the kids and then, instead of standing outside their group he marched right into it and started drumming right in this kids face, while his buddy was behind him yelling the racist, xenophobic insults. The kid committed the egregious sin of smiling and, for that, must have his entire future taken away from him and be damned to hell for all eternity.
 
I didn't watch Tim Pool but I have seen the entire video unedited. The indian fellow and his posse came in shouting racist, xenophobic and hateful insults towards the kids and then, instead of standing outside their group he marched right into it and started drumming right in this kids face, while his buddy was behind him yelling the racist, xenophobic insults. The kid committed the egregious sin of smiling and, for that, must have his entire future taken away from him and be damned to hell for all eternity.

That is inaccurate it already was established there was a third racist black hategroup there. They had nothing to do with the indian group.
 
That is inaccurate it already was established there was a third racist black hategroup there. They had nothing to do with the indian group.
No he is right, there was a native behind the drummer telling them they don't belong here they should go back to Europe, it's in the video, but it happened at the same time he was right in front of the kids face.
 
Much of Trump's populist agenda is understood by his slogans, "Make America Great Again" and "America First".

It may be time to examine The Shutdown as a deliberate, active economic plan - a great, final and triumphal plan to "Drain the Swamp", another of his slogans. We know for sure the government will not get funded and reopened as normal anytime soon. It may well go for years, or even forever. Really. This could amount to what we might call a fascist, nationalist, capitalist and patriarchal consolidation of the American government. He does not need to build a wall. He does not need to declare a national emergency. He's already doing what he wants most. Permanent layoffs are the next step. Maybe Trump has maneuvered the Democrats into a trap.

Goals:
- Permanently reduce or destroy "massive, bloated, unnecessary government" in all but absolutely essential respects
- ditto the central bank
- ditto unsustainable government debt
- ditto the strength of the deep state
- ditto socialist democracy

https://dailycaller.com/2019/01/14/smoke-out-resistance/

If that really were his aim it would be seriously misguided and will backfire.

First of all, the shutdown will not last forever. Congress can and will bypass Trump at some point and reopen. The American people will demand it. Especially when they can't fly (TSA and air traffic control stopped getting paid), and their unversities shut, and not only all government offices shut, but all government contractors shut. How well do you think people will tolerate it when SpaceX closes their doors due to a lack of funding? How well do you think people will tolerate it if the IRS doesn't hand back tax refunds? What do you think happens when the federal courts shut down? What happens when you can't renew a passport, or get a visa? Those are both coming. Border patrol is working without pay.

These are the big effects, but there are a ton of smaller more personal effects. I've already explained why a government shutdown is not equivalent to a reduction in government size. Ultimately it costs more.
 
View attachment 794184

:lol:

"One of these things is just like the others
All of these things are exactly the same
Can you tell these things are just like the others by the time I finish this song?"
Ah yes, his thumbnails and subjects are similar in a select group of videos provided by you, guess that makes the facts with sources he provides in the only video I recommended invalid.

Your free to choose your own sources.
 
This shutdown is stupid. Power struggle. Trump wants it "his way", and it's not even that bad of a proposal. Nancy and Chuck aren't willing to back down, just to stick it to him to say "you wanted this, this is your shutdown".

And, this: https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/21/us/politics/kamala-harris-2020-president.html

I don't know enough to have an opinion of her, but there's not a chance she makes it if she pushes it too far left.
 
This shutdown is stupid. Power struggle. Trump wants it "his way", and it's not even that bad of a proposal. Nancy and Chuck aren't willing to back down, just to stick it to him to say "you wanted this, this is your shutdown".

And, this: https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/21/us/politics/kamala-harris-2020-president.html

I don't know enough to have an opinion of her, but there's not a chance she makes it if she pushes it too far left.
Kamala Harris the right colour of skin combined with approval of the establishment I would suspect she is the next one to get Democrat support like Clinton.

Her track record would conflict with what a Democrat would agree with(regarding her support for private prisons, and donations received by them) but I suspect that's going to swept under the rug.
 
a select group of videos provided by you him
Fixed that for ya. See, those were presented as [presumably, I wasn't compelled to dig any deeper into his upload history] the five most recent videos, and all I did was provide a screen grab from his channel. If you look, there's no more than a day of separation between their consecutive uploads.

;)

Read into that however you like, but to me it illustrates a substantial right-wing bias...not that I wasn't already familiar with his political leanings.

This shutdown is stupid. Power struggle. Trump wants it "his way", and it's not even that bad of a proposal. Nancy and Chuck aren't willing to back down, just to stick it to him to say "you wanted this, this is your shutdown".
Neither the need for nor the efficacy of a border wall has been demonstrated, and funding for it has appropriately been denied. Rather than continue to attempt to deal, Trump opted to hold hundreds of thousands of federal employees hostage as part of his extortion scheem and Pelosi and Schumer won't cave to him. It is his shutdown.

Now he *sniff* wants to *sniff* use something *sniff* that wasn't his to *sniff* take and isn't his to *sniff* offer as *sniff* a bargaining chip?

All this does is confirm my suspicions that he can't make deals, and instead takes advantage of others in an effort to get ahead.

Kamala Harris the right colour of skin combined with approval of the establishment I would suspect she is the next one to get Democrat support like Clinton.
Kamala Harris and Hillary(?) Clinton don't have the same skin color...
 
Kamala Harris the right colour of skin

The jokey answer to that is "what about Trump?", the more serious answer is "what!?".

She's qualified, she's clever, she's prosecuted the holders of the keys to The Swamp, she's not Hillary Clinton... she seems a good candidate to me? This "surprise" has been on the cards for fifteen years.

I was having a dig at identity Politics, black or non white being the right colour.

But you're the one playing the identity-politics card? She's the one standing on her record.
 
Poor attempt at trolling 2/10.
How's that? You suggested that Kamala Harris and [Hillary?] Clinton share two characteristics--skin color and approval of the establishment--and while I don't know enough about Harris to come out directly against the latter assertion, I know for danged sure that Hillary Clinton is white. That makes me wonder if there's another [non-white] Clinton to whom you're referring.

Or are you referring to your own comments as a poor attempt at trolling?
 
How's that? You suggested that Kamala Harris and [Hillary?] Clinton share two characteristics--skin color and approval of the establishment--and while I don't know enough about Harris to come out directly against the latter assertion, I know for danged sure that Hillary Clinton is white. That makes me wonder if there's another [non-white] Clinton to whom you're referring.

Or are you referring to your own comments as a poor attempt at trolling?
Maybe you should read again, I said she is maybe the next one to get Democrat support, your the one that put everything I said about Kamala Harris and put it with Hillary.

Not treating me like an idiot, would be great.
 
Maybe you should read again, I said she was the next one to get Democrat support, your the one that put everything I said about Kamala Harris and put it with Hillary.
You said:

Kamala Harris the right colour of skin combined with approval of the establishment I would suspect she is the next one to get Democrat support like Clinton.
That suggests that Kamala Harris possesses qualities (specifically skin color and a supposed approval of the establishment) to get Democrat support like Clinton. You put them together.
 

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