An Honest Opinion

[twitcher]

OP + subsequent posts

After having read all of your posts, I would have to guess that most of your opinions were based off of experiences had with one or some of the countless "teams" that frequent the open lobbies?

If so, then it should be noted that most of the GTP based teams tend to hold themselves to higher standard, both in terms of drifting ability, as well as manners.

Also, as others have touched on, just because a car is fast, it doesn't mean that it has a lot of HP, or that the driver depends on the speed as a crutch. Some of the cars that people around here use literally have over 100 hours of tuning and practice in them. The car is as fast or as slow as the driver wants it to be from one corner to the next.

Judging by your post count, I'm guessing your new to GTP (or is this just a new account). Take some time to get to know more of us, and I'm sure you'll find most of us are quite friendly

Just don't let us catch you drifting a Spirit R (too fast), Viper (too fast), 'Vette (too fast), Exotics (too fast, duh), SS '10 (too fast), anything MR (too fast), anything RR (too slow), any and all BMWs (they're all too fast!!), IS-F (too many gears), trucks (too trucks), NASCARs (too silly), LMPs (unless you're Astroman, you can't drift a car that looks like a spaceship!), any racecar for that matter (too.......fast, you guessed it), anything goofy (too silly), FF (we'll hurt you), 4WD/AWD (we'll hurt you worse), OR ON ANY TIRE OTHER THAN CH!!!!! (off with your head!), and you'll do just fine

 

[DriftEmotion FC]

After having read all of your posts, I would have to guess that most of your opinions were based off of experiences had with one or some of the countless "teams" that frequent the open lobbies?

If so, then it should be noted that most of the GTP based teams tend to hold themselves to higher standard, both in terms of drifting ability, as well as manners.

Also, as others have touched on, just because a car is fast, it doesn't mean that it has a lot of HP, or that the driver depends on the speed as a crutch. Some of the cars that people around here use literally have over 100 hours of tuning and practice in them. The car is as fast or as slow as the driver wants it to be from one corner to the next.

Judging by your post count, I'm guessing your new to GTP (or is this just a new account). Take some time to get to know more of us, and I'm sure you'll find most of us are quite friendly

Just don't let us catch you drifting a Spirit R (too fast), Viper (too fast), 'Vette (too fast), Exotics (too fast, duh), SS '10 (too fast), anything MR (too fast), anything RR (too slow), any and all BMWs (they're all too fast!!), IS-F (too many gears), trucks (too trucks), NASCARs (too silly), LMPs (unless you're Astroman, you can't drift a car that looks like a spaceship!), any racecar for that matter (too.......fast, you guessed it), anything goofy (too silly), FF (we'll hurt you), 4WD/AWD (we'll hurt you worse), OR ON ANY TIRE OTHER THAN CH!!!!! (off with your head!), and you'll do just fine

LOOOOL i agree with this post 100%

 

[dice1998]

Just don't let us catch you drifting a Spirit R (too fast)

But other RX-7's are okay?

Exotics (too fast, duh)

Lexus LFA's have been drifted before.

anything MR (too fast)

What about an MR2?

anything RR (too slow)

Ruf Yellowbird? Too slow? what?

any and all BMWs (they're all too fast!!)

1 Series Concept isn't that fast..

OR ON ANY TIRE OTHER THAN CH!!!!! (off with your head!)

Comfort Mediums work well for me on some cars. What.

 

[Lock2Lock]

After having read all of your posts, I would have to guess that most of your opinions were based off of experiences had with one or some of the countless "teams" that frequent the open lobbies?

If so, then it should be noted that most of the GTP based teams tend to hold themselves to higher standard, both in terms of drifting ability, as well as manners.

Also, as others have touched on, just because a car is fast, it doesn't mean that it has a lot of HP, or that the driver depends on the speed as a crutch. Some of the cars that people around here use literally have over 100 hours of tuning and practice in them. The car is as fast or as slow as the driver wants it to be from one corner to the next.

Judging by your post count, I'm guessing your new to GTP (or is this just a new account). Take some time to get to know more of us, and I'm sure you'll find most of us are quite friendly

Just don't let us catch you drifting a Spirit R (too fast), Viper (too fast), 'Vette (too fast), Exotics (too fast, duh), SS '10 (too fast), anything MR (too fast), anything RR (too slow), any and all BMWs (they're all too fast!!), IS-F (too many gears), trucks (too trucks), NASCARs (too silly), LMPs (unless you're Astroman, you can't drift a car that looks like a spaceship!), any racecar for that matter (too.......fast, you guessed it), anything goofy (too silly), FF (we'll hurt you), 4WD/AWD (we'll hurt you worse), OR ON ANY TIRE OTHER THAN CH!!!!! (off with your head!), and you'll do just fine

Agreed 100%...

Drifter's worst nightmare = RS tires + red bull + entrance comment stating he's the drift king

 

[adrnv]

After having read all of your posts, I would have to guess that most of your opinions were based off of experiences had with one or some of the countless "teams" that frequent the open lobbies?

If so, then it should be noted that most of the GTP based teams tend to hold themselves to higher standard, both in terms of drifting ability, as well as manners.

Also, as others have touched on, just because a car is fast, it doesn't mean that it has a lot of HP, or that the driver depends on the speed as a crutch. Some of the cars that people around here use literally have over 100 hours of tuning and practice in them. The car is as fast or as slow as the driver wants it to be from one corner to the next.

Judging by your post count, I'm guessing your new to GTP (or is this just a new account). Take some time to get to know more of us, and I'm sure you'll find most of us are quite friendly

Just don't let us catch you drifting a Spirit R (too fast), Viper (too fast), 'Vette (too fast), Exotics (too fast, duh), SS '10 (too fast), anything MR (too fast), anything RR (too slow), any and all BMWs (they're all too fast!!), IS-F (too many gears), trucks (too trucks), NASCARs (too silly), LMPs (unless you're Astroman, you can't drift a car that looks like a spaceship!), any racecar for that matter (too.......fast, you guessed it), anything goofy (too silly), FF (we'll hurt you), 4WD/AWD (we'll hurt you worse), OR ON ANY TIRE OTHER THAN CH!!!!! (off with your head!), and you'll do just fine

I'm the kind of guy that doesn't like first impressions, so of course I'll take the time to know. As the matter of the cars, I feel like some cars are an exception when it comes to the word fun. Volkswagen Classic Beetle was a fun car to drive. It's pretty fascinating when you take a weird car and just take it out sliding through turns. Bruise it up and what not.

I've been using a Pontiac Solstice Coupe Concept lately... 333 hp, 377 horsepower when super charged. No Engine Tuning from Stage 1-3. 1079 kg. Pretty balanced car with default settings.

Drifter's worst nightmare = RS tires + red bull + entrance comment stating he's the drift king

Oh goodness...those guys really are worse than nightmares...

 

[CJDA9]

Twitch the last part of that post is hilarious!

 

[JustDrift893]

Off with they heads

 

[LPTuner]

Hahahahaaa that is a hilarious post twitcher, and exactly what this thread needed to lighten the mood BTW my viper has 400-450 hp, am I still not allowed to be seen by you?

 

[Drift_Monkey]

But other RX-7's are okay?


Lexus LFA's have been drifted before.


What about an MR2?



Ruf Yellowbird? Too slow? what?


1 Series Concept isn't that fast..



Comfort Mediums work well for me on some cars. What.

LFA = supercar with no ability to maintain deep angle.
MR2 = is okay but very fast for it's power range
RUF = very slow
1 series = IS fast if you know how to tune

 

[GhostZ]

Any car can be used as a drift car, there are only a few however with the right combinations of variables to work near consistent perfection. Horsepower numbers are completely irrelevant to a properly tuned drift car, as is the position of the engine or the performance points given to the vehicle. It is only the measurable attributes about the cars that matters, which none of those are.

The continued ritualistic beliefs in attributes of cars and the methods of drifting that are not based in fact is one of the main reasons why Drift Teams can be detrimental to the overall progress of the technique. That is what this thread is about. Anything after that is unnecessary.

 

[Gonales]

Any car can be used as a drift car, there are only a few however with the right combinations of variables to work near consistent perfection. Horsepower numbers are completely irrelevant to a properly tuned drift car, as is the position of the engine or the performance points given to the vehicle. It is only the measurable attributes about the cars that matters, which none of those are.

I'm sorry, but that post makes NO sense what so ever. :/

 

[Downhill Dino]

Basically he's saying that drifting skill (I suppose) can not be based off of horsepower figures and such rather then the actual driving characteristics of the car. At least, that's what I got out of it. I might have worded it poorly but I gave it a shot.

 

[Gonales]

Basically he's saying that drifting skill (I suppose) can not be based off of horsepower figures and such rather then the actual driving characteristics of the car. At least, that's what I got out of it. I might have worded it poorly but I gave it a shot.

He doesnt mention the driver or skill once. He is talking about something on the car that makes a bigger difference than weight, hp and drivetrain.

 

[Downhill Dino]

I tried my best to interpret it. I added a bit for more understanding, as it would seem he may have even left out or didn't mention such words but intended the same idea in them.

 

[JustDrift893]

He is saying if you tuned your car properly and your a good driver, then the other things such as HP limit should not be a problem.

 

[GhostZ]

He is saying if you tuned your car properly and your a good driver, then the other things such as HP limit should not be a problem.

No.

I'm saying that a drift car's effectiveness is found in its instant movements and how the tuning affects that. Tire shapes, diameter, contact patch under deformation, length x width, instantaneous torque at the rear wheels, grip coefficient, weight transfer, etc.

Horsepower is an after-the-fact measurement that does not directly explain movements of the car instantaneously. Torque does, but not the torque from the tuning sheet, but rather instantaneous torque during drifting.

Once you have found the most precise and advantageous qualities of a car from tuning, the only limiting factor afterwards is driver skill. If you have a clear objective to fulfill, there is a perfect tune and perfect drift car and a perfect drifter. It is a lie to say that any drift car can be perfect if it is driven properly. Tuning a car to fit someone's "drifting style" only means making concessions on potential ability of the car, because the driver is not able to produce the results with a perfect tune.

This relates to the topic because drift teams ignore these facts almost universally. However, not all drift teams (though many) take them to the conclusions that make drifting almost religious, or fashionable with no regard to performance.

Those who have read my Purest Drifting Experience articles should know what I am explaining: If you define exactly what you want to do with your drift car, and to what extent, there is a perfect setting that can achieve it with the most ability and consistency. My entire GT5 experience, the point of this account, mostly this last year with this alternate account, has been a study to find that.

I do feel some responsibility for this thread, since some of what I have typed in the past prompted it. Explaining my preferences against many GT5 drift teams would take lots of effort for little gain. That is why I point out the worst aspects of drift teams, so that they might improve on a general level. To finish the thread, my general consensus is that most teams are without an objective aim or understanding of what drifting can be at its most skillful and efficient. Those who do, however, are bad at approaching it, compared to how good they could be. I do what I do so that they can improve in the ways I've experimented with.

That is all I will say on the subject.

 

[JustDrift893]

 

[D-Max]

As for the rest of the "team" generalization, I don't find it to be entirely true. Sure, some new teams start off on the wrong foot by putting together a bunch of guys that don't know each other and hope to "mesh", or start a team to just "get a name out". There are many teams though, where members actually associate and socialize outside of GT5 or GTP, those are the teams that actually make it, they don't look for a sense of "belonging", they are about the comradery and friendship tossed in with a bit of learning.

Bingo Bango Bongo.

The D-Max guys, although we don't have a lot, are more than GTP and GT5. It's more than a team! It's friendship which a lot of people maybe don't see. The guys at NEMESIS are the perfect example of what a team should be like no matter what it is or where it is based (Internet, in person).

You can't jump in a room a couple of times and get automatic acceptance. that's not how life is. That's why when people ask to join us, we say, no!. Come drift with us, if we get on, cool! You are more than welcome. If we're not for you, then that's fine .

I'm saying that a drift car's effectiveness is found in its instant movements and how the tuning affects that. Tire shapes, diameter, contact patch under deformation, length x width, instantaneous torque at the rear wheels, grip coefficient, weight transfer, etc.

I do like your posts, you go in depth and explain, but that's not true in the case of GT5, which this is. On a real car yes, but GT5 has no way of knowing majority of this information nor can you alter it. It is totally irrelevant.

 

[Duman079]

No.

I'm saying that a drift car's effectiveness is found in its instant movements and how the tuning affects that. Tire shapes, diameter, contact patch under deformation, length x width, instantaneous torque at the rear wheels, grip coefficient, weight transfer, etc.

Horsepower is an after-the-fact measurement that does not directly explain movements of the car instantaneously. Torque does.

Once you have found the most precise and advantageous qualities of a car from tuning, the only limiting factor afterwards is driver skill. There is a perfect tune and perfect drift car and a perfect drifter. It is a lie to say that any drift car can be perfect if it is driven properly. Tuning a car to fit someone's "drifting style" only means making concessions on potential ability of the car, because the driver is not able to produce the results with a perfect tune.

This relates to the topic because drift teams ignore these facts almost universally. However, not all drift teams (though many) take them to the conclusions that make drifting almost religious, or fashionable with no regard to performance.

Those who have read my Purest Drifting Experience articles should know what I am explaining: If you define exactly what you want to do with your drift car, and to what extent, there is a perfect setting that can achieve it with the most ability and consistency. My entire GT5 experience, the point of this account, mostly this last year with this alternate account, has been a study to find that.

Allright then. I'd like to ask you a question.

If you would enter a D1GP or D1SL championship. Would you buy a missile or a lamborghini murcielago and tune the bull so it would drift? GT5 is a game, but to keep drifting constistent and continiously it would be weird to buy a supercar and make it your primary car. Of course it is normal that someone would use a AWD , RR or MR car once in a while, we want to have fun sometimes too. But if you are used to RWD so much, even the slightest amount of difference in drivetrain will be felt horrible, because it feels not correct.

I drifted a RUF BTR and RR cars, racecars, drifted several AWD cars and very few MR cars. But I know when I could use it and when not. It is like you are saying we cannot tune cars and drift with it. Man I know so much people who used AWD cars ( and sometimes still use AWD) and drift like it is RWD. In the end they always conclude that AWD is for the giggles and that it couldn't be something for competative use.

It is not reigious or anything like that. But it is like doing Formula 1 with AWD cars. That is something that would not be accepted in general. Of course you could try it, but I'm sure you wouldn't get far.

I must add also that RR cars are not always too slow... I do not agree with that post. The RUF RGT can be very fast...

 

[LPTuner]

^ Agreed. I have a friend that im sure ya'll may have heard of, goes by the name of MegamarcX_84 for PSN. He drifts a RUF BTR and is super fast. Why you would say RR isnt fast enough is beyond me but I think you need to research.

 

[DriftEmotion FC]

Any car can be used as a drift car, there are only a few however with the right combinations of variables to work near consistent perfection. Horsepower numbers are completely irrelevant to a properly tuned drift car, as is the position of the engine or the performance points given to the vehicle. It is only the measurable attributes about the cars that matters, which none of those are.

The continued ritualistic beliefs in attributes of cars and the methods of drifting that are not based in fact is one of the main reasons why Drift Teams can be detrimental to the overall progress of the technique. That is what this thread is about. Anything after that is unnecessary.

I also agree with this but i hope your not saying there is a perfect tune for any car because due to physics there is no such this as a perfect drift car and driver but most of what you are saying is pretty accurate, i don't agree with your tunes fully though some could be faster, overall though your tunes are close to mine in the way that you tune, well not really its just how the tune affects that car but to each his own and we all have different styles

 

[SlipZtrEm]

No.

*snip*

A few things I wouldn't mind clarification on:

• We allow people a single account here on GTP, not multiple ones. Why do you feel the need to be an exception?
• Snubbing one elitist approach to drifting and then suggesting another, equally elitist approach strikes me as odd. The real-life variables that you touch on are interesting, without a doubt, but as D-Max points out, quite a few of them aren't even simulated properly in GT5 (the game's tire and suspension physics modelling being the two most-often targeted areas), so choosing a car based on those criteria won't always translate to the game.
• You're talking about efficiency in regards to drifting, and I think still overlooking one of the major aspects of the teams; fun. Efficiency is always going to be a strange grey area for drifting anyways; it's the art of inefficiency anyways

 

[mcgloney]

No offence "ghostz" but i actually get bored reading the longggggg essays how something works. Well it's cool but at least try to make it more simple so i don't have to bring the pillow with me, make it relate more to gt5 than the real thing?

As for the teams. Where everyone does things differently. As far as i know D-max has always been about having fun. For me a team doesn't work without having banter or it just makes it boring. D-max more than just a team, i can say we are a good bunch of friends.


expect for you jimmy, your an assholeeee. Kidding loveyoubbzzz oxoxox

 

[DriftEmotion FC]

A few things I wouldn't mind clarification on:

• We allow people a single account here on GTP, not multiple ones. Why do you feel the need to be an exception?
• Snubbing one elitist approach to drifting and then suggesting another, equally elitist approach strikes me as odd. The real-life variables that you touch on are interesting, without a doubt, but as D-Max points out, quite a few of them aren't even simulated properly in GT5 (the game's tire and suspension physics modelling being the two most-often targeted areas), so choosing a car based on those criteria won't always translate to the game.
• You're talking about efficiency in regards to drifting, and I think still overlooking one of the major aspects of the teams; fun. Efficiency is always going to be a strange grey area for drifting anyways; it's the art of inefficiency anyways

THANK YOU!!! nobody could have explained it better

 

[alpacaflip]

I also agree with this but i hope your not saying there is a perfect tune for any car because due to physics there is no such this as a perfect drift car

👍

Everyone of you has a health that is unique and totally different from everybody else. Completely! Because we… are all like snowflakes. -Lewis Black

Lewis Black is great lol.This quote isn't about drift, but can relate. Everyone is different, and we all like different tunes; which shows our different styles. In return which makes drifting awesome.

 

[Lazy Liquid]

Honestly i don´t understand why such type of threads comes up, and stills. Second, i also don´t understand why it becomes so popular, and so fast. I simply didn´t had patience to read all pages, all huge answers and feedbacks, mostly because i know how it started, how it goes and how it will ends.

My opinion is not new about this subjects, i guess ill copy what ill say now to any .TXT file and paste somewhere any near future, because i doubt that this will be the last time that ill see something similar here. Here we go:

1 - About overpowered cars:
Many of you already pointed witch cars are (or at least should be) considered as "emergency cars" only to be used in extreme situations, specialy when you open hands of your self-respect to still able to keep up with someone. Did i appealed to it anytime? Yes, every time i use my SLS AMG or my SS `10, i am automaticaly recognizing that i need something to make the gap of skills between myself and anybody a bit shorter.

2 - About finetuned cars:
What exactly the term "finetune" is? Some people thinks that is set your car to be so confortable and responsive to drift that you and your vehicle simply becomes one. For me, is more than that. Even more than, it´s make all what i said before, but in bringing to a whole new level. How do you feel when you see an ordinary car drifting so fast and clean (and still achieving decent angles), that´s what finetune is. So yes, that S14, that Miata, that Z34 still the same cars, yet in the right hands after "100 hours of tunning and testing", you hardly will believe that they are using CH tires.

3 - Finetuned cars x Driver´s behavior:
There is no how to build any paralel between both aspects, but there are some common points.

• Abusers using abusive cars. Sounds clear, but for me there is no relation between any of both. An abuser don´t need an abusive car to become an a-hole, nor a abusive cars automaticaly turns anyone into a a-hole.
• It´s easy to build a mistaken impression of people based in a short experience. That´s called "first impressions". The biggest problem is that "first impressions" tends to stay for long time. Much more than it should.
• Headset users easily tends to overuse their mics, specialy for who isn´t using the same device. It´s hard to explain, but its like compare 2 completly diferent experiences of interaction in the same place.
• There isn´t much to becomes a moron, a bullier, a troll or whatever. A bad day, some bad words put in the wrong places, a sad sucession of coincidences. Also, for someone who is on the defensive, everything sounds offensive, and when you´re into a loby filled with old friends who speaks anything anytime, its easy get scare or take something to the personal side.
• I really feel sorry for the team members that had to come here explain how their teams are not what they are pointed of. And that´s why i don´t belong to any of them and i strongly suggest to everytone to think twice before join one, because if you mess up (or be acused of), you take the responsability of mess up the whole team, not only yourself.
• It´s not that easy to find people what have a matchable personality and drifting style to blend to yours. It doesn´t happens all times, not even everytime with persons that use to blend. Thats a relationship principle, and works similar in every sphere of the relationships. At the end of the day, its just a game... where we put many effort, strugle and passion... but stills just a game.

 

[Gonales]

[/QUOTE]

[*]Abusers using abusive cars. Sounds clear, but for me there is no relation between any of both. An abuser don´t need an abusive car to become an a-hole, nor a abusive cars automaticaly turns anyone into a a-hole.

This is true, however some cars are nearly always driven by people with less than average intelligence or social skills. (Drifting an X1 for example.)

[*]It´s easy to build a mistaken impression of people based in a short experience. That´s called "first impressions". The biggest problem is that "first impressions" tends to stay for long time. Much more than it should.

I have to admit, i'm very guilty when it comes to this. But then again, most people i want to avoid have really deserved it. (Boh Gt5 and RL ) ^^

[*]Headset users easily tends to overuse their mics, specialy for who isn´t using the same device. It´s hard to explain, but its like compare 2 completly diferent experiences of interaction in the same place.

The over use isnt the problem, the way they are used... Random social talks, fine... But i will mute those convo's. If people actually would say stuff related to the drift session, 'direct' traffic etc

[*]There isn´t much to becomes a moron, a bullier, a troll or whatever. A bad day, some bad words put in the wrong places, a sad succession of coincidences.

This is true as well. However, IF such things happen, the decent people find out why the other person is upset, and talk about it. (Or does that seem weird?)

[*]I really feel sorry for the team members that had to come here explain how their teams are not what they are pointed of. And that´s why i don´t belong to any of them and i strongly suggest to everyone to think twice before join one, because if you mess up (or be accused of), you take the responsibility of messing up the whole team, not only yourself.

Very much agreed. If you want to represent a team, think of what your team stands for etc.

[*]It´s not that easy to find people what have a matchable personality and drifting style to blend to yours. It doesn´t happens all the time, not even every time with persons that use to blend. Thats a relationship principle, and works similar in every sphere of the relationships. At the end of the day, its just a game... where we put many effort, struggle and passion... but stills just a game.

Yeah, but as with everything, the game means different things to everyone.