Assetto Corsa | News and General Discussion

[Johnnypenso]

This is why these people are referred to as "Aliens" because it appears to be not humanly possible ;-) Some people are naturally talented, some are dedicated and practice for thousands of laps where as I am neither and so am content with being slower ;-)

BTW in GT5/6 when they used to be 20-30 secs faster they were then known as "hackers" ;-) Modders was the accepted term but I preferred hackers.

When you get to that level you don't need thousands of laps, a few will do. In AC, as in real life, understanding the limits of car, using the whole track and being smooth is the generally the key to speed. In RSR you can see how many laps were run to attain that best lap and what mode they were run in. Many of the records are set in just a few laps.

 

[Fredzy]

Yea of course but the thing is when i played GT5 and/or iracing i could see how the aliens were faster then me. I couldn't mimic them but i could see where the time was coming from. In AC even the style of driving seems extremely weird.

Assuming you're a pretty competent driver, I would hope it's at least partly tuning. If they're staying glued to the road I can't imagine it being some physics exploit. I will say that in an 8 lap GT3 race I did at Spa online, my fastest laps seemed to come once I was comfortably in the lead and started settling down to reduce risk of an error or off. Maybe we need to adjust our perception of over-driving the car in AC. Dial down the aggression and dial up the smooth.

I do hate it when unnatural driving technique yields faster times. I recall getting smoked (figuratively and literally) in GT5P by people using a crazy drifting technique that was untouchably fast. I think PD remedied it a few times, but even in GT6 I recall certain MR cars being a lot faster when their rear ends would come out and point them through the turn.

 

[BrandonW77]

I do hate it when unnatural driving technique yields faster times. I recall getting smoked (figuratively and literally) in GT5P by people using a crazy drifting technique that was untouchably fast. I think PD remedied it a few times, but even in GT6 I recall certain MR cars being a lot faster when their rear ends would come out and point them through the turn.

That was prevalent in GT5 and 6, the fastest guys would usually back it into a corner like Marc Marquez.

 

[Johnnypenso]

Assuming you're a pretty competent driver, I would hope it's at least partly tuning. If they're staying glued to the road I can't imagine it being some physics exploit. I will say that in an 8 lap GT3 race I did at Spa online, my fastest laps seemed to come once I was comfortably in the lead and started settling down to reduce risk of an error or off. Maybe we need to adjust our perception of over-driving the car in AC. Dial down the aggression and dial up the smooth.

I do hate it when unnatural driving technique yields faster times. I recall getting smoked (figuratively and literally) in GT5P by people using a crazy drifting technique that was untouchably fast. I think PD remedied it a few times, but even in GT6 I recall certain MR cars being a lot faster when their rear ends would come out and point them through the turn.

If someone is 6+ seconds off the pace it's mostly driving not tuning. Harsh but true.

 

[mister dog]

Assuming you're a pretty competent driver, I would hope it's at least partly tuning. If they're staying glued to the road I can't imagine it being some physics exploit. I will say that in an 8 lap GT3 race I did at Spa online, my fastest laps seemed to come once I was comfortably in the lead and started settling down to reduce risk of an error or off. Maybe we need to adjust our perception of over-driving the car in AC. Dial down the aggression and dial up the smooth.

So true! When i'm in a race and i'm not having that mindset of 'i need to break the lap record now', my later laps are always faster than what i managed to get out of the car during quali.

I still have a long way to go to even get close to that consistency aliens possess, as they do manage to be on the pace within a few laps like @Johnnypenso says. I guess we fall in that 'lesser gods' category

 

[Dhalism]

That was prevalent in GT5 and 6, the fastest guys would usually back it into a corner like Marc Marquez.

View attachment 590937

yea i think the main reason why i struggle so much in AC, that its driving style is the opposite of GT

If someone is 6+ seconds off the pace it's mostly driving not tuning. Harsh but true.

 

[BrandonW77]

If someone is 6+ seconds off the pace it's mostly driving not tuning. Harsh but true.

He's right, you can find more time on the track by improving your driving than improving your tune. But once you reach the level where you can drive most cars properly then you need to tune to get that extra second. I have not reached that level yet, in my last online race I was 6 seconds off the pace of the leaders.

 

[ALB123]

I love watching replays from the top tier drivers. Their laps are always so smooth. The entire track gets used - outside to apex to outside in a perfect arc. That allows them to carry more entry speed and especially more exit speed.

 

[Johnnypenso]

yea i think the main reason why i struggle so much in AC, that its driving style is the opposite of GT

I jumped straight from Gran Turismo 6 into Assetto Corsa and I posted on this many times before, but the transition was a jarring one for me. Gran Turismo, when driving at the limit, teaches you many bad habits that don't work either in real cars or in most Sims. It took me a full two weeks of driving before I started to feel comfortable and was able to put down some competitive laps. Since then, which was about 2 years ago, I've gained another second or so and still have a couple of seconds of improvement to go, which I will probably never find.

 

[SpaceBreed]

It's also ok to be six seconds behind the pace, someone has to do it.

 

[BrandonW77]

It's also ok to be six seconds behind the pace, someone has to do it.

I will challenge you for Backmarker Champion any day!!! BRING IT!!

 

[bleeder]

I will challenge you for Backmarker Champion any day!!! BRING IT!!

The eternal battle for last place is what keeps me going

 

[BrandonW77]

The eternal battle for last place is what keeps me going

I've made my entire sim racing career on it!

 

[bleeder]

I've made my entire sim racing career on it!

I've found it takes a lot more skill to finish last but one instead of a simple podium or even victory.

 

[Fredzy]

I still have a long way to go to even get close to that consistency aliens possess, as they do manage to be on the pace within a few laps like @Johnnypenso says. I guess we fall in that 'lesser gods' category

Consistency is the name of the game. I've accepted that I can't be fast and consistent without a ton of practice with a certain car/track combo, and then I can never quite hit Alien fast. Like Dhalism mentioned, I can see exactly where I lose the time, I just can't execute. So I can have peace with it.

Consistency alone usually puts you on the podium when dealing with open lobby, and that's fun. Which is all that matters.

A++

I jumped straight from Gran Turismo 6 into Assetto Corsa and I posted on this many times before, but the transition was a jarring one for me. Gran Turismo, when driving at the limit, teaches you many bad habits that don't work either in real cars or in most Sims. It took me a full two weeks of driving before I started to feel comfortable and was able to put down some competitive laps. Since then, which was about 2 years ago, I've gained another second or so and still have a couple of seconds of improvement to go, which I will probably never find.

You're describing me to a T. Except I've only got 3 or 4 solid sessions into the game, so I have a ways to go. I really hope GT Sport feels more like AC than GT6 so I don't get all mixed around in my experience with these kinds of things, you need to pick one to master, or you'll just be good at both. If the engines are different enough, I won't be able to play both games happily with any regularity.

 

[SpaceBreed]

I've made my entire sim racing career on it!

Then i am on the right path

 

[SpaceBreed]

I will challenge you for Backmarker Champion any day!!! BRING IT!!

Lol no you can take it, i won't have much to bring. It's all yours

 

[Johnnypenso]

You're describing me to a T. Except I've only got 3 or 4 solid sessions into the game, so I have a ways to go. I really hope GT Sport feels more like AC than GT6 so I don't get all mixed around in my experience with these kinds of things, you need to pick one to master, or you'll just be good at both. If the engines are different enough, I won't be able to play both games happily with any regularity.

My biggest fear when it comes to GT Sport is having to learn a whole new way of driving that is counter intuitive. They really need to work on how cars handle weight transfer, slip angles and how cars handle at the limits of grip, abs and traction control simulation and,of course, they need to get camber and ride height working properly, among other things. It is fine if they don't, it is their game after all, it just won't hold much appeal for me.

 

[mister dog]

@Fredzy that sounds an awful lot like me. If you're on PC you should join our backmarker championships in my sig

But once you reach the level where you can drive most cars properly then you need to tune to get that extra second. I have not reached that level yet, in my last online race I was 6 seconds off the pace of the leaders.

If someone is 6+ seconds off the pace it's mostly driving not tuning. Harsh but true.

I notice a similarity between those 2 posts

 

[BrandonW77]

I notice a similarity between those 2 posts

Clearly he's making fun of me, and here I thought Canadians were supposed to be friendly, eh!

 

[skazz]

I'd be very pleased to be only 6 seconds behind the aliens.... around the Nurburgring 24h layout

 

[BrandonW77]

I'd be very pleased to be only 6 seconds behind the aliens.... around the Nurburgring 24h layout

This was around Spa.

 

[Punknoodle]

This was around Spa.

Not enough Belgian Bier

 

[LeGeNd-1]

Well as you know maths is maths and formulas dont change, there is likely a lot of stuff that is shared between games but there are areas where those formulas cant be made, thats where you have to start coming up with things yourself bit like a PHD, go do something which no one has done before but sadly you arent called Dr Kunos at the end of it. Now that should help people to understand a bit as to why its hard to just throw data at a sim and expect it to just work.

Kunos went for the route of massively robust foundation so the higher layers which they add to is easier so things like additional assists or technology and then higher level stuff which us modders use etc etc. Apparently it supports flight as well.

As for those wondering why I know so much about it no im not an employee, i just ask questions. You will be surprised by how much you learn. We all love cars, we are on this forum a lot so there is chance we might like talking about them and those devs are same.

I really appreciate philosophical discussions of physics like these. Makes you wonder what is the limit of Kunos' engine. Cars, flight, ships...space? The possibilities are endless. If they manage to nail the basic properties of their virtual "world" right, they can basically create an alternate universe in a computer. Now I don't know about you, but that's both an amazing and scary thought at the same time.

If you haven't already, read this interesting thought experiment by Elon Musk (http://motherboard.vice.com/read/elon-musk-simulated-universe-hypothesis). Basically he's saying that we are all probably living in a computer simulation, but we just don't notice it because everything feels so real. If you look at the gap from Pong to AC with VR, what's not to say 50 years in the future we will all be hooked up virtually online and forget our existence in our current reality?

When you get to that level you don't need thousands of laps, a few will do. In AC, as in real life, understanding the limits of car, using the whole track and being smooth is the generally the key to speed. In RSR you can see how many laps were run to attain that best lap and what mode they were run in. Many of the records are set in just a few laps.

Actually we can't really tell how many laps they practice a particular combo. For all we know they could have done thousands of laps, exited the game and came back a while later and got the best time in 10 laps.

Generally aliens get up to speed quickly, but if the competition is tight (like in GT Academy for example), they also need to slave away for hundreds if not thousands of laps to get the ultimate laptime. It's the same for us mere mortals. The hardwork is equally hard, but just the end results are different

 

[BrandonW77]

they can basically create an alternate universe in a computer. Now I don't know about you, but that's both an amazing and scary thought at the same time.

All hail Skynet!!

 

[AlexSWE]

I´m holding both my thumbs for the 911 king.

 

[Dhalism]

So i was diddling with setups and i was wondering if there are any flowcharts for AC, or maybe even for something like iracing that are similar to this

I figured out what effect all the settings in AC have on handling by now but i'm still not sure what order to do them in.

 

[JvM]

Front toe on that chart is pretty much opposite of what I have ever learned or read anywhere. Ie. front toe out should shrpen turn in response.. => less stable in straight line.

 

[Scheer]

Front toe on that chart is pretty much opposite of what I have ever learned or read anywhere. Ie. front toe out should shrpen turn in response.. => less stable in straight line.

No, IRL I reduced the sharpness of turn in by reducing the toe. If you think about it, more toe means that your outside wheel is turned more than it would otherwise be. Once you shift weight to it, it has more influence than the inside wheel.

 

[JvM]

The effects with toe (in this case, very initial turn in) mainly happen before major weightshifts.

Couple sources I quicky came by:

http://en.intraxracing.nl/techniek/camber,-caster,-toe-intoe-out/

Steering response will be improved with toe-out.
Straight line stability will be improved with toe-in.

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/techpage.jsp?techid=4

Increased toe-out will typically result in reduced understeer, helping free up the car, especially during initial turn-in while entering a corner.