**CLOSED** See the new thread: Michelin Pilot GS Sprint Challenge presented by SnailFinished

[IforceV8]

You have to kepp in consideration overall performance. While fast car on straight is 14 mph faster, it could very well suffer in the braking zones and corners, negating that advantage.

Remember the DP vs LMP2 battles in post merger IMSA? Dominated by the faster DP's most of the time because they could bury the P2's on a restart and on the straights.

The aero numbers and parts required (changes to standard spec as listed):
A.M. 40/340 (added front split 140/340)
BMW 140/340
ZL1 100/350 (removed rear diffuser otherwise its 200/450)
Ford 80/300
650S 100/300
AMG 60/310 (small rear wing only) 60/360 big wing 60/260 big wing no diffuser
400Z 130/330
Cayman 80/340 (removed rear diffuser otherwise its 180/440)
Supra 140/340

The M4 and Supra have the same aero but the Supra is 11 mph faster at the top end and 5 mph in the 1000k run.

I borrowed the high speed GR4 BOP from the Spa daily sport race and cleaned it up slightly.

All of these cars will run within 2 mph of each other at the top end and 1-2 mph on a short (1000k) acceleration run. None of these are stock weight and all have power adders and/or restrictors. All cars are 200/300 aero

Vantage 8.96 P/W
M4 8.36
Corvette 9.16
GT Citroen 9.10
Viper 9.00
458 8.95
Mustang 8.78
NSX 8.87
Genesis 8.49
F-Type 8.73
RC-F 8.72
650S 8.45
SLS AMG 8.90
Cayman 8.91
Supra 8.99


Sort out those aero parts issues and let me know what your running and I will do some laps at a couple of different tracks.

 

[llNovall]

Remember the DP vs LMP2 battles in post merger IMSA? Dominated by the faster DP's most of the time because they could bury the P2's on a restart and on the straights.

The aero numbers and parts required (changes to standard spec as listed):
A.M. 40/340 (added front split 140/340)
BMW 140/340
ZL1 100/350 (removed rear diffuser otherwise its 200/450)
Ford 80/300
650S 100/300
AMG 60/310 (small rear wing only) 60/360 big wing 60/260 big wing no diffuser
400Z 130/330
Cayman 80/340 (removed rear diffuser otherwise its 180/440)
Supra 140/340

The M4 and Supra have the same aero but the Supra is 11 mph faster at the top end and 5 mph in the 1000k run.

I borrowed the high speed GR4 BOP from the Spa daily sport race and cleaned it up slightly.

All of these cars will run within 2 mph of each other at the top end and 1-2 mph on a short (1000k) acceleration run. None of these are stock weight and all have power adders and/or restrictors. All cars are 200/300 aero

Vantage 8.96 P/W
M4 8.36
Corvette 9.16
GT Citroen 9.10
Viper 9.00
458 8.95
Mustang 8.78
NSX 8.87
Genesis 8.49
F-Type 8.73
RC-F 8.72
650S 8.45
SLS AMG 8.90
Cayman 8.91
Supra 8.99


Sort out those aero parts issues and let me know what your running and I will do some laps at a couple of different tracks.

Keep in mind iforce, we need to be careful not to equalize all cars based solely on acceleration and top speed capabilities, but rather overall performance. A Porsche Cayman or Camaro ZL1 with the same accel and top speed will crush other cars that are not as capable in the corners or the braking zones. Thats why lap times across an entire track is most important...it accounts for all aspect. A car that carries better acceleration/top speed tends to suffer to some degree in the corners, and those deficicient on power make up for in the technical sections. And, once we find parity across the varying cars, then we time trial the drivers and account for skillset in the driver BoPnto bring the field very vlose in overall lap times. It does take time to nail down, but once achieved, we'll get some great racing out of it. Definitely glad to have the help in testing and running laps, so thank you for that and the input.


On that note:
I made some updates to the numbers.
I added the front splitter to all eligible cars. I set the front and rear downforce at 50% (mid waynon slider) for both on all cars....running all race upgrade options at their default race upgrade default settings. From there, i backed the weight and horsepower of all cars to 646pp. (Yes, i know the pp system is flawed...but figured if all cars are set at default with df set equally across all, it just might create parity) I have yet to run laps with these new numbers, but hopeful that it will bring the grouping closer. Will be working on hotlapping next week, as I need to get some practice in for our ACC event at Zolder in the Porsche. See below for updated numbers for testing.

Spoiler: Car Spec Sheets

 

[CodeRedR51]

I like the lower power figures. 👍

 

[IforceV8]

I've updated the specs as close as possible although the PP numbers do not match on a few.I took weight out a few cars and added ballast back and some of the torque numbers do not match but the HP/Lbs do. I tried the stock setup on the Supra and was 1.4 sec slower than my own setup so I will continue to use my setups. I'm also adjusting the top speed on the gearing to optimize peak HP and top speed.

First runs in the Supra was +.4 from the previous time at Monza and 2 mph faster at the speed trap. I didnt give you the trap speed data from the first session because typing with a controller is not ideal. 170-162 mph top to bottom recorded at the arrow marker for the first chicane.

I can screenshot the leader board again once I have finished at a track. Do you want the testing data in the thread or a PM?

 

[llNovall]

I've updated the specs as close as possible although the PP numbers do not match on a few.I took weight out a few cars and added ballast back and some of the torque numbers do not match but the HP/Lbs do. I tried the stock setup on the Supra and was 1.4 sec slower than my own setup so I will continue to use my setups. I'm also adjusting the top speed on the gearing to optimize peak HP and top speed.

First runs in the Supra was +.4 from the previous time at Monza and 2 mph faster at the speed trap. I didnt give you the trap speed data from the first session because typing with a controller is not ideal. 170-162 mph top to bottom recorded at the arrow marker for the first chicane.

I can screenshot the leader board again once I have finished at a track. Do you want the testing data in the thread or a PM?

Either is fine. Transparency is a good thing when testing for parity.

 

[IforceV8]

First round of laps done at Monza. I am more focused on getting a quali type lap than just setting a time but several of these cars need some serious wrenching to get a lap time. Push/oversteer seems to be the main issue with a few, the SLS was a push/push some more but I think I have it dialed in now. The Shelby has a banana in its tailpipe, it reminds me of the '84 International crane truck V8 gasser we used to have that would lose speed on a flat road. It needs 30hp dialed back into it.

The 400Z or whatever they call it is a great drift car but tries to kill me on every lap, it needs more rear wing. The Cayman has a weird aero imbalance that really shows up around Curva Grande, it has too much rear aero. Also unlike some of the other cars exiting Parabolica it will just push straight off the track instead snap oversteering.

The 650S is excellent but maybe a bit heavy?

Supra

The benchmark for all others

 

[CodeRedR51]

I'll have to share my Z tune as I find it a bit understeery. I also use the high rpm turbo and limit it back down to shift the powerband and limit power oversteer. Also have it set to use 6 speeds only.

 

[IforceV8]

Understeer is needed. I will look at the turbo to see how its equipped.

 

[CodeRedR51]

Should add I use the ECU to limit power, as using the power limiter increases low range torque and increases power oversteer.

Edit: I can get you the gear settings if you want, but if Nissan gives the actual numbers in November I will change them to match anyway so the current setting might not be relevant.

 

[IforceV8]

Going back to the stock turbo seemed to make a big difference. My car is stroked out to 3071 so it already has more torque.

Monza (no Chicane) results TT mode 1x/1x/real

Supra RZ 1:43.978 (26.414) (38.806) (38.758) 172 mph trap speed
Nissan Z 1:44.015 (26.420) (39.064) (38.531) 171 mph
Cayman 1:44.396 (26.630) (39.205) (38.561) 167 mph
BMW M4 1:44.443 (26.575) (39.085) (38.738) 168 mph
MC 650S 1:44.721 (27.059) (39.139) (38.523) 167 mph
AMG GT-S 1:45.103 (27.170) (39.074) (38.859) 165 mph
Vantage 1:45.345 (27.255) (39.123) (38.967) 164 mph
GT350R 1:45.781 (27.892) (39.170) (38.676) 161 mph
Chev ZL1 1:45.963 (27.509) (39.481) (38.561) 163 mph

 

[CodeRedR51]

Did a bunch of laps tonight and I think I've finally figured out the Z. Got a setup I'm very happy with. At least at Maggiore, who knows if it'll work anywhere else. Car is very consistent and good on tires.

And, new livery.

 

[IforceV8]

Update 1.25 seems to improved overall grip in particular push/oversteer. I ran a couple of cars and ran better on my 2nd lap in each car, new times in bold.

 

[CodeRedR51]

I switched to the medium turbo, added the racing intercooler and at 418hp took another 3.5 tenths off my time at Maggiore. Car feels great.

 

[IforceV8]

I scored a Call of Duty edition PS5 from playstation direct and upgraded to the PS5 version of GT7. The biggest difference I have noticed is the PS5 controller is much better than the PS4. The steering feel is much more analog and more precise.

I'm going to do some laps at Nurburgring GP which should be a good track to test low speed grip w/o top speed being such a factor.

 

[Xradkins]

I want to join in and I'm watching this develop. I will continue with my Supra ( like I used before) if that is possible. I can help with testing if you are running a test in the evenings (PST). The Mustang test on Sunday was good, and it was great to see a few familiar names!

 

[llNovall]

Just dropping in fellas. Been busy with life and other things atm. If/when we start organizing for this series. I will need some dedicated volunteers to keep the wheels turning when I'm not around, and to assist in the day to day duties to make it work. Part of the reason I stepped away, is it did start to feel like a chore with little return. When I do dive in, it will be at a much more relaxed capacity which will require others attention and commitment. Anyone interested who can committ to nearly 6 months of racing and be pretty consistent on attendance, please post so that I know what we're working with. Glad to see you fellas doing testing, and do look forward to catching up soon.

On another note, how have the GT7 lobbies progressed. And has anyone had the chance to test a known all ps5 user lobby? Hoping this title comes around.

 

[socalnatv]

I’m definitely going to participate in this series again once it comes back.

This was the only organized racing I was doing, besides the Porsche series, and I enjoyed the Michelin series much more.

 

[Harry Rowley]

Just dropping in fellas. Been busy with life and other things atm. If/when we start organizing for this series. I will need some dedicated volunteers to keep the wheels turning when I'm not around, and to assist in the day to day duties to make it work. Part of the reason I stepped away, is it did start to feel like a chore with little return. When I do dive in, it will be at a much more relaxed capacity which will require others attention and commitment. Anyone interested who can committ to nearly 6 months of racing and be pretty consistent on attendance, please post so that I know what we're working with. Glad to see you fellas doing testing, and do look forward to catching up soon.

On another note, how have the GT7 lobbies progressed. And has anyone had the chance to test a known all ps5 user lobby? Hoping this title comes around.

A few of us have been spinning fun laps with the gt4 cars. One of us is using a PS4. We see rarely any glitches as of late. This weekends spin session was without glitches, yet we found problems when entering track from the pits. Weird delays. The experience we see with glitches come from a select few drivers, and those drivers were known for effecting rooms, and if we pick up this series again. It would be interesting to see how PD has progressed.
Keen to say though, some of the cars are giving very close racing in spec settings amongst a close group of drivers.

 

[CodeRedR51]

I'm down to help with testing, not sure I will be able to do much more for a bit as I am moving in a few weeks. Between that and trying to get my car back on the road, I don't fire up the PS5 much at the moment. But when I do, I typically just tweak the livery on the Z and do some laps. I'm still trying to get access to the gear ratios on the real Z GT4, but have been told that they are not final and currently "confidential" but they will share when finalized. Also hearing rumors of a sim racing league using the Z GT4 but I do not know which game will be used...

 

[llNovall]

To all friends and drivers,
Happy Thanksgiving to everyone. Hope everyone is doing well.

I happened to see an update dropped today affording qualifying and other features in the multiplayer. Haven't been on in a while personally, but I would ask if those still testing and racing regularly to please report the new functionality, and if there have been anybonline stability improvements to date. Keep me posted.

Time away has been very good for me personally. I do look forward to returning at some capacity down the road, but not sure to what degree. I will keep peeking in as GT7 develops further to a point I feel its ripe for our racing style.

Until then, hope everyone stays safe and has a Happy Thanksgiving weekend.

Take care,
Chris
II-NOVA-II

 

[CodeRedR51]

Would anyone be interested in a different GT4 series in the mean time? Don't want to steal any thunder from Nova here but it sounds like it might be a while until we're back up and running and I'm itching to create a GT4 series that uses a different format. (Open tuning with minimum weight and minimum lap time) Want to see how it goes when we prioritize matching real life GT4 lap times versus using real life specs. Could act as a test series to prove server stability.

@llNovall if I'm stepping on some toes here let me know and I'll remove this.

 

[llNovall]

Would anyone be interested in a different GT4 series in the mean time? Don't want to steal any thunder from Nova here but it sounds like it might be a while until we're back up and running and I'm itching to create a GT4 series that uses a different format. (Open tuning with minimum weight and minimum lap time) Want to see how it goes when we prioritize matching real life GT4 lap times versus using real life specs. Could act as a test series to prove server stability.

@llNovall if I'm stepping on some toes here let me know and I'll remove this.

Absolutely in no way are you overstepping. Glad you're interested in moving the process along and willing to organize a series to help facilitate. Feel free to utilize this thread, or feel free to create a new thread and tag those who were addressed here. Hoping to see something form up. I'll be peeking from the sidelines, but feel free to take the reigns.

 

[CodeRedR51]

Absolutely in no way are you overstepping. Glad you're interested in moving the process along and willing to organize a series to help facilitate. Feel free to utilize this thread, or feel free to create a new thread and tag those who were addressed here. Hoping to see something form up. I'll be peeking from the sidelines, but feel free to take the reigns.

Appreciate it. I'll likely run with GT4 America branding but will utilize reference lap times from both series. I'll get a new thread up soon. I'm actually moving next weekend so I'd say to look for it sometime in December. 👍

 

[IforceV8]

Appreciate it. I'll likely run with GT4 America branding but will utilize reference lap times from both series. I'll get a new thread up soon. I'm actually moving next weekend so I'd say to look for it sometime in December. 👍

That's going to be a short list because the only track they share and is available in GT7 is the Glen. Target time for both series is 1:54 Q -1:55 race lap.

I've been playing around with some GR4 cars and have a list of 14 cars that I have finished a 1st round of BOP testing with. The specs are based on the cars from the daily sport races with some power and parts added by me. Of this group of 14 there should be at least 8 really good race cars. If you are interested in the specs let me know.

 

[CodeRedR51]

That's going to be a short list because the only track they share and is available in GT7 is the Glen. Target time for both series is 1:54 Q -1:55 race lap.

I've been playing around with some GR4 cars and have a list of 14 cars that I have finished a 1st round of BOP testing with. The specs are based on the cars from the daily sport races with some power and parts added by me. Of this group of 14 there should be at least 8 really good race cars. If you are interested in the specs let me know.

I'm just going to use lap times from the Pilot Cup series. With the cars tuned to match the times at Road Atlanta, they also match the times at Watkins Glen, but fall short at Laguna and Daytona. The beauty of a minimum lap time series though, is that people are free to adjust the car to meet that time but not exceed it.

We'll do those 4 circuits plus a couple random fantasy tracks which might end up being Maggiore and something else. Yes its not technically located in the US but its a fantasy track so it can be wherever we say it is. 😏

 

[IforceV8]

There is data available for GT4 Europe and GT4 Asia which raced at Barcelona, Spa, Suzuka, and Fuji in 2022. I think the BOP between the SRO and IMSA cars are close to the same with tires being the main difference.

I'm watching GT4 America from the Glen 2022 on YouTube right now and they showed 154.1 mph trap speed for the BMW, Porsche, and Toyota. looking at the IMSA timing I'm not seeing any trap speed data for some reason.

Fast guys in slow cars and slow guys in fast cars, sounds like reverse grid BTCC.

 

[CodeRedR51]

There is data available for GT4 Europe and GT4 Asia which raced at Barcelona, Spa, Suzuka, and Fuji in 2022. I think the BOP between the SRO and IMSA cars are close to the same with tires being the main difference.

I'm watching GT4 America from the Glen 2022 on YouTube right now and they showed 154.1 mph trap speed for the BMW, Porsche, and Toyota. looking at the IMSA timing I'm not seeing any trap speed data for some reason.

Fast guys in slow cars and slow guys in fast cars, sounds like reverse grid BTCC.

Other than weight I am ignoring specs because I am trying to match the real life lap times, which at Road Atlanta and Watkins Glen requires the cars to be around 350-360hp. And since I am going with GT4 America branding, kind of limited in real life circuit choice unfortunately. We need COTA.

 

[IforceV8]

Results from Nurburgring GP test session. Top speed recorded at the pavement change near the braking point at the last chicane.

MC 650S TS (146 mph) 2:03.967
Cayman GT4 (145) 2:04.090
Nissan Z (147) 2:04.395
GT350R (144) 2:04.566
Supra RZ (147) 2:04.703
Camaro ZL1 (144) 2:04.995
V8 Vantage (145) 2:05.095
AMG-GT S (144) 2:05.207
BMW M4 (146) 2:05.444

Not having the ability to adjust the aero is the reason the M4 drives like a bus. I loosened the car up some trying for more front end but made it push/loose instead. The cars at the top of the list have the most front end grip.

I'm 3/4 of the way done with my GR4 runs and the 10 cars tested so far are .9 sec apart 1-10. Best time so far with that group is 2:05.345.

 

[Valex]

Just dropping in fellas. Been busy with life and other things atm. If/when we start organizing for this series. I will need some dedicated volunteers to keep the wheels turning when I'm not around, and to assist in the day to day duties to make it work. Part of the reason I stepped away, is it did start to feel like a chore with little return. When I do dive in, it will be at a much more relaxed capacity which will require others attention and commitment. Anyone interested who can committ to nearly 6 months of racing and be pretty consistent on attendance, please post so that I know what we're working with. Glad to see you fellas doing testing, and do look forward to catching up soon.

On another note, how have the GT7 lobbies progressed. And has anyone had the chance to test a known all ps5 user lobby? Hoping this title comes around.

Hey nova good to see you again its been a while, hope you are doing good.
On regards to this new season, im here to help if you need anything like testing cars and all that stuff so just message me if you need anything that i could help with and ill do my best, hopefully we all can get things up and running to get racing again. Doubt i would be able to host a race for example, because well im from the other part of the world and also my internet sometimes dies out of nowhere, so except that im here to help if needed. Lets get racing!

 

[llNovall]

Popping in to say hi fellas. Hope everyone is well. I have jumped on ACC and GT7 here and there to keep up to date on progress. ACC seems to have gotten better, but still has its weaknesses.

GT7....oh GT7. Physics imo feel much better. Definitely going the right direction. And the added features that have been promised are welcome. Road Atlanta and Watkins Glen...great additions. Would be a nice North American track roster if we can ever get aomething going. On that note, I did jump in some online lobbies....still jittery crap. I refuse to fire up another series season until this is addressed. Fingers are again crossed and wishing that the next update tonight might help the issue. But you know what they say..." wish in one hand and $#!+ in the other". Guess we'll have to wait and see, and if not, guess I'll keep wishing.

Take care everyone.

Chris
II-NOVA-II