COVID-19/Coronavirus Information and Support Thread (see OP for useful links)

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We really do live in crazy times, first time I’ve heard after a tv program has been on, the phrase; “filming took place before current government guidelines” ...madness
 
andrea


The captain of that navy ship tested positive.
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The “Like” is for the story about Balsonaro. That’s quite the development.

The news about Cpt Crozier testing positive for Covid-19 is very sad news.

Reports now indicate that 155 of the Roosevelt’s crew have tested positive, although none of them have required hospitalization. The ship is currently docked in Guam. I’ve read that some 1200 crew have been moved off the ship and are living ashore, and Cpt Crozier is now in quarantine in Guam.

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/www.cnb...eportedly-tests-positive-for-coronavirus.html


It’s quite a confusing situation, with plenty of blame to be shared. It’s believed the virus spread to the ship after a 5 day stay in Da Nang, starting March 5. Visits to foreign ports require approval from the US state department, which should have been aware of the threat posed by COVID-19 by March 5 (using the Diamond Princess cruise ship, which set sail Jan 20 before the virus broke out on-board, as an example). Additionally, US carrier commanders operate with quite a large degree of autonomy, so the decision to allow crew ashore starting March 5 ultimately lies with Captain Crozier, who also should have been aware of the threat posed by the virus.

The Secretary of the Navy has insisted that the decision to relieve Cpt Crozier was his, and his alone, with no pressure or influence coming from the White House.

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/asiatim...rrier-should-never-have-been-sent-to-vietnam/


This is a good article that touches on how confusing the whole situation is. Many many questions need to be answered.

https://www.defenseone.com/politics...ls-question-captains-abrupt-dismissal/164363/


I imagine the Navy is now scrambling to send another carrier to the region to replace the Roosevelt, which is basically inoperable at this point. I also wonder if the Royal Navy sending one of their carriers to the region has anything to do with this, or if it’s just coincidence.
 
twitcher
The Secretary of the Navy has insisted that the decision to relieve Cpt Crozier was his, and his alone, with no pressure or influence coming from the White House.
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I’m sure that both parties have been discussing what his options are, including his return to leadership, and it’s not as if the Navy has an endless stockpile for CV captains.
 
DesertPenguin
And there in lies the problem of what you define as nonsense.
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People craft comfortable echo chambers and surround themselves with people with whom they share views, and these views get repeated over and over, creating the false sense that they are correct, and then when a view that doesn't conform to theirs is encountered, it's deemed incorrect because it isn't what they're so accustomed to seeing.

Even scarier is the dynamic breeds more extreme views because people within the group may not necessarily approve of everything being espoused, that which they do approve of makes the pill easier to swallow. People then get desensitized to the extreme.

It didn't begin with the social media age, but it's certainly snowballed.
 
twitcher
I imagine the Navy is now scrambling to send another carrier to the region to replace the Roosevelt, which is basically inoperable at this point. I also wonder if the Royal Navy sending one of their carriers to the region has anything to do with this, or if it’s just coincidence.
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Which carrier is that? The Royal Navy doesn't have any operational carriers at mo
 
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andrea
Which carrier is that? The Royal Navy doesn't have any operational carriers at mo
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If true it will be the Queen Elizabeth as she was on trials in early 2020 and is due to enter full service this year. It may well be that she was headed in that direction for her next sea trials anyway. No doubt they will have planned trials in different areas as they ramp up her capability.

Personally, I think she still gets around pretty well considering she's 93...

In other news, Boris Johnson has been admitted to hospital for precautionary tests as he is still not recovered after 10 days. That's in marked contrast to Matt Hancock (the health secretary) who improved within the "normal" 7 days.

Whatever you think of him personally or his politics, hopefully it's nothing too serious, just a sensible precaution. Like anyone else, he also has family and friends who are probably going to be a bit worried about the news (including a pregnant fiancee) and, for all their benefit, as well as ours, I wish him a speedy recovery 👍

EDIT - I was not aware of his fiancee being positive and wish her and her child well also.

I do consider personally that saying someone "deserves" getting a potentially killer virus and being admitted to hospital is rather crass, whatever you feel about the individual personally. I have not agreed with him on a number of actions/inactions relating to coronavirus on it's own (excluding other political differences) but that doesn't mean I wish him physical harm.
 
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andrea
Which carrier is that? The Royal Navy doesn't have any operational carriers at mo
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They have two, the HMS Queen Elizabeth, and the HMS Prince of Wales.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queen_Elizabeth-class_aircraft_carrier

I was sure that I read somewhere that the Queen Elizabeth was in or headed to the South China Sea. After some searching, turns out it was here that I read it, but that was in early January.
TenEightyOne
Montrose and Defender were already in the area having performed escorts during the latter part of 2019, they're redeploying into the Straits. Neither of our aircraft carriers are in the region, I think Queen Elizabeth is in the South China sea while Prince Charles is still parked at Portsmouth having its ears trimmed.
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I thought I remembered reading a tweet from the Royal Navy about it, but I can’t find it now. Maybe I dreamed it :lol:

I don’t know where she is currently, if she’s still somewhere in the Pacific or Indian Oceans, or if she’s returned home.
 
twitcher
They have two, the HMS Queen Elizabeth, and the HMS Prince of Wales.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queen_Elizabeth-class_aircraft_carrier

I was sure that I read somewhere that the Queen Elizabeth was in or headed to the South China Sea. After some searching, turns out it was here that I read it, but that was in early January.

I thought I remembered reading a tweet from the Royal Navy about it, but I can’t find it now. Maybe I dreamed it :lol:

I don’t know where she is currently, if she’s still somewhere in the Pacific or Indian Oceans, or if she’s returned home.
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Neither of them are operational.

HMS Queen Elizabeth is still on readiness training until 2021.
HMS Price of Wales isn't ready till like 2023.

And they don't have enough planes for them yet either in any case.
 
Shocker:

Source: https://www.npr.org/2020/04/05/8276...ware-of-possible-coronavirus-threat-for-years

Report: Pentagon Knew Of Possible Coronavirus Threat For Years

The Pentagon was aware of the likelihood of a pandemic brought on by a novel coronavirus years ago, predicting with startling accuracy shortages of masks, hospital beds and ventilators that could occur in an outbreak, according to a 2017 internal document reported by The Nation.

The 103-page document — which the magazine describes as an update to an earlier Defense Department pandemic influenza response plan — cites a novel respiratory illness as the "most likely and significant threat" in a pandemic situation.

The documents also warns that shortages of masks and ventilators would have a "significant impact on the availability of the global workforce."

"The intelligence community and the military were well aware of what could, and unfortunately, did happen" said Nation reporter Ken Klippenstein in an interview with NPR's All Things Considered.

Klippenstein reports that he obtained the document from a Pentagon official who requested anonymity. Klippenstein says the Pentagon has not responded to his requests for comment on the story.

Klippenstein told All Things Considered that within intelligence circles, a coronavirus has been viewed as a likely threat going back at least five years. And while President Trump has said the current COVID-19 pandemic "came out of nowhere," Klippenstein says it is "inconceivable that the White House did not receive this," referencing information contained in the 2017 Pentagon report.

Klippenstein adds," The threat of a highly transmissible pathogenic virus that targets the respiratory system, this was appreciated for at least the last 10 years."

The "USNORTHCOM Branch Plan 3560: Pandemic Influenza and Infectious Disease Response," as the document is titled, mentions past coronavirus outbreaks, including the MERS outbreak. The document notes that coronvavirus infections are also quite common worldwide.

Though unclassified, the Pentagon plan is an internal document intended to foresee the causes of and potentials hurdles to arise in a pandemic situation. It outlines scenarios that may arise during a global outbreak and options for how the military might respond. Within the document are also references to classified materials that could provide additional support to its conclusions.

The report's conclusions have foreshadowed many of the concerns currently being voiced by both elected officials and medical professionals over hospitals beds and medical equipment.
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andrea
Shocker:

Source: https://www.npr.org/2020/04/05/8276...ware-of-possible-coronavirus-threat-for-years
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I would argue it's not rocket science to assume that studies were made for such an eventuality after SARS1 and MERS occurring in a short time scale. I imagine the Pentagon report is not alone. In some ways, I would be more alarmed if there wasn't one.

The conclusions of that report (if this is valid, which it appears to be) are scarily accurate.

However, it's easy for hindsight to have an effect here. I would like to know what probability the report gave for such a virus to appear. You might argue, now, that there should have been more ventilators etc. But if the report suggested the likelihood of such a virus was very small, then would that have been the correct approach?

If governments geared up for every possible contagion/conflict issue/threat funds would be redirected from elsewhere.

There is a significant ongoing debate about how much should be spent on identifying meteors/asteroids (other 80s arcade games are available) that are a risk to earth as they might be planet killers, for example.

What I do wonder, however, is if this report has been made available to all in senior positions when this virus was identified as potentially serious? If not, then someone is clearly at fault for not doing so. If it has, and it wasnt taken seriously enough, that's a different issue.
 
Tornado
Wal-Mart changing their policies this weekend to limit the amount of people in the store at once, instead forcing them to stand packed together outside in a line, isn't quite the most clueless COVID-19 corporate feel good change I've seen.





But it is close.
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You have to blame the packed together fools outside.
 
Yeh, no-one 'deserves' the virus.

Unfortunately Johnson has said a couple of foolish things... though it is not clear in what context he 'shook hands with everybody' at a hospital including those infected with coronavirus. Shaking hands with gloves on is still safe, though clearly the social distancing bit (which wasn't a public policy at the time) would be a potential/likely issue. It's also unlikely to be literally true - he may have shaken hands with everyone he was introduced to, but its pretty unlikely that he spent much more time with infected people than the average care worker does in 10 minutes.

That said, I do believe that some others do deserve something - Bolsonaro, Trump and anyone who thinks that using the word 'hoax' in relation to the outbreak is an appropriate thing to say. These people deserve sanction, and though I would also say that they do not deserve the catch the virus, it would at the very least be somewhat poetic justice.

Johnson, on the other hand, has been clear enough about the risks of the virus in his public statements. His personal behaviour is also somewhat different given that he is the Prime Minister and is expected to turn up at places like hospitals and show some solidarity with those working and being treated there. There's actually no evidence whatsoever that his visit(s) to any hospitals caused his illness, and hence I wouldn't be so quick to denounce his behaviour as irresponsible or stupid.
 
UKMikey
In the UK queueing spaces outside supermarkets are marked on the ground with tape to help people stand 2m away from each other. Don't know what Wal-Mart are doing.
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They are doing that here. The Home Depot we've been going to has 'X's taped on the floor of where people should stand in line...doesn't mean people are following it though.
For poops and giggles I pull my tape measure I keep on my side out to 6ft and lock it in and spin around and tell people "get back!". You should see some of the reactions lol.
 
UKMikey
In the UK queueing spaces outside supermarkets are marked on the ground with tape to help people stand 2m away from each other. Don't know what Wal-Mart are doing.
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StayhomeStaysafe

Yeah, people have to do the distancing themselves, doesn't matter where we are. It's common sense. When I need supplies and head out to get them if I saw such crowding I would have to try again at a different time. I have that luxury where I live and because I'm not working (my wife has health issues and would likely die from this virus). Others have to get supplies in the limited time they have to get them and I have to feel badly for them if they encounter such crowds. Seeing any crowds seems like people lining up for a death squad in my opinion.

It's not a corporate issue unless people make it so.
 
Danoff
http://91-divoc.com/pages/covid-visualization/

I'm not really seeing tapering off in any of the US states, and some of them have as much as a 20 day head start (depending on how you measure it) compared to CO. Doesn't bode well for how long we have to keep this up.
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What do you mean by 'tapering off'? The general trend in the US looks very like it is tapering off to me, though clearly some states are better than others.

If anything, I'm surprised at how quickly the growth rate of new cases in the US is dropping. The US lockdown is working at least as well as the UK if not better, which does bode well for how long the current restrictions might last.
 
Hmm, I wonder why Johnson is in hospital.

Since he needs oxygen, and is therefore not admitted purely for tests, it's likely he's not maintaining oxygen saturations which could be the beginnings of a pneumonia. As this can deteriorate quickly perhaps his doctor wanted to pre-empt any possible complication as early as they could.
 
Touring Mars
What do you mean by 'tapering off'? The general trend in the US looks very like it is tapering off to me, though clearly some states are better than others.

If anything, I'm surprised at how quickly the growth rate of new cases in the US is dropping. The US lockdown is working at least as well as the UK if not better, which does bode well for how long the current restrictions might last.
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You mean that in some of the logarithmic curves some of the states (and the US in general) is not keeping the initial pace of growth? I guess by tapering off I meant that I'm looking for a peak, some kind of indication that somewhere in the US the end of the strictest lockdown measures is in sight. I don't see it, even in Washington, which is many days ahead of me.

I'm not sure that this demonstrates functioning social distancing. I mean social distancing measures are almost certainly working, but we'd need to compare against a control group that didn't enact such measures and see marked improvement, and even then, we'd need to see enough comparisons to be sure it was social distancing. I'm comfortable claiming that it's reducing cases just because we know how it works, but I don't think the US curves demonstrate that it is.

Edit:

Maybe South Korea is that test. How on earth... they seem to have achieved "containment" or not quite but close and held it for quite a long time. I don't know how that's possible, especially with the US turning itself into a coronavirus factory. You'd think we'd have exported that back over there by now, but they've got strict international measures. South Korea is kindof an astonishing case. Maybe that's all of their new cases, people coming out of international quarantine with it.
 
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