Do you believe in God?

  • Thread starter Patrik
  • 24,484 comments
  • 1,124,158 views

Do you believe in god?

  • Of course, without him nothing would exist!

    Votes: 624 30.6%
  • Maybe.

    Votes: 368 18.0%
  • No way!

    Votes: 1,051 51.5%

  • Total voters
    2,042
I think the idea of a Christian thread or, a religion thread has been denied by the staff as the argument goes; religion and god go hand in hand. I happen to disagree with that notion and would welcome a strictly Jewish thread as well.

Maybe I should not have said christian first but it's been discussed before, mainly all religion in one thread and anything else god in another. Oh well.
What kinda bothers me is the fact that there is only one thread addressing specific religion and its the Islam Thread. On the most positive outcome, the unfortunate current events makes it justified, to learn more about it. However theres also the negatives which, as you may expect, some prejudices, unfortunate implications, etc.

On the Christian Topic, there is one but "disguised" as other titles. Not sure what is it specifically. All i know is mostly by @KSaiyu
 
The thing people that believe in God should be asking themselves is, can the orthodox beliefs/religions really be true? My understanding of it right now is that the scriptures are twisted/edited to suit the origination/groups/powers at play so to speak.

Take the Christian faith for example, we have Old Testament and New Testament and they are fundamentally different. In Old The Deity that is described as the creator God is very jealous/vengeful/wrathful but in The New Testament the Father of Jesus is all about forgiving. How come it is like that, when in scriptures God himself stated that he was never changing only his creation would change.

So for me it is a bit interesting that believers in God sticks to scriptures/books that only are accepted by their religious leaders. If you want to find/understand God maybe you should try to read something else than the bible for once or listen to a different opinion with open eyes.
 
A belief in a "God" does not require an acceptance of any scriptures at all. this thread does seem to revolve around debating the written word though.

That's because the thread title is "God" rather than "A God"... so the obvious presumption is that the thread discusses the Abrahamic god rather than general deities filed under "other".
 
Yepp, I am talking about the Abrahamic God and how "square" usually the believers in the Abrahamic God are. My priest says this, my fellow church parishioner says this and that.The orthodox scriptures are full of gaps and contradictions. If people want to study about that God perhaps they should read scriptures that are not considered orthodox to get the whole picture, if there is one. Now, of course a belief in a higher power aka God does not need any scriptures as it is more like personal opinion but a Christian/Jew/Muslim probably should read all there is about his God. Lets make a small example, a scientist/astro physician that skips let say the speed of light constant/gravitational constant in his calculations then his picture of the whole will be wrong.

But I am no better than anyone in this subject because all my bible studies are only youtube clips/online books where the contradictions are pointed out and where explanations are given that sound actually very convincing. Like that Jehova/Yhwh is actually and a bad guy and a mistake born from an Aeon called Sofia and that Jesus came here to show us a way back to the source ala matrix style. Who needs sci-fi/fantasy movies when there is youtube,old scriptures and people with way to much time on their hands :P
 
It's three gods in one. To some people it makes sense.

Just as much as sense as the Mind/Body/Soul trinity.
Which again to some 'people' doesn't make sense. :)

That's because the thread title is "God" rather than "A God"... so the obvious presumption is that the thread discusses the Abrahamic god rather than general deities filed under "other".

The title says 'god' (some male) not God. There is a difference to some minds.

The last time I brought this up I was called an 'arse'. I'm still poring over dictionaries over that label in the context of questioning the definition of the entity that Patrik created whose existence we must be believe/not believe in.
 
I'm not sure where. Can you furnish me with a quote on that?

A quick google and I found the subject talked about a few places, I'm pretty sure a mod chimed in but I didn't see it. Like I said "I think". Anyway I'm not sure how it would change this thread even if other religion threads were created.

Just as much as sense as the Mind/Body/Soul trinity.
Which again to some 'people' doesn't make sense. :)

That is exactly what is meant by 'man was created in God's image' to some of us Christians 👍
 
Yepp, I am talking about the Abrahamic God and how "square" usually the believers in the Abrahamic God are. My priest says this, my fellow church parishioner says this and that.The orthodox scriptures are full of gaps and contradictions. If people want to study about that God perhaps they should read scriptures that are not considered orthodox to get the whole picture, if there is one. Now, of course a belief in a higher power aka God does not need any scriptures as it is more like personal opinion but a Christian/Jew/Muslim probably should read all there is about his God. Lets make a small example, a scientist/astro physician that skips let say the speed of light constant/gravitational constant in his calculations then his picture of the whole will be wrong.

But I am no better than anyone in this subject because all my bible studies are only youtube clips/online books where the contradictions are pointed out and where explanations are given that sound actually very convincing. Like that Jehova/Yhwh is actually and a bad guy and a mistake born from an Aeon called Sofia and that Jesus came here to show us a way back to the source ala matrix style. Who needs sci-fi/fantasy movies when there is youtube,old scriptures and people with way to much time on their hands :P

God did what was required in the OT, to uphold His covenant with the Jews, and to maintain the plan for the human birth of the Son, as a ransom for the world, for those who require salvation for sins.
If one doesn't accept that sin is a cancer, then they won't worry about calling the Doctor.

If those wicked and evil tribes actually did destroy the Jews, there would be no salvation. Off course people who accept they got here by pure chance and coincidence, will probably also say the Jews were lucky or were saved by pure chance...hehehe. Facts are facts.

Hence why, Mark Twain tells it like it is. The Jews conquered and beat all, while their enemies withered away.
Off course Mark didn't have to tell us what was already written. That God will accomplish His plan with Israel, whether the rest like it or not, or "choose" to believe it or not, using their perfectly good free will.
A few million standing the test of time. Incredible miracle as far as I'm concerned. Their land blooming as promised 3000 years ago.

The Orthodox Jew may reject the suffering Messiah in Isaiah 53, but are still under the covenant.
Muslims are deceived into thinking they serve the same God, yet their founder muhammed, chose one god named allah, out of 359 gods during the time of Pagan worship. It was the Qurashi tribe if I'm not mistaken.
 
DCP
God did what was required in the OT, to uphold His covenant with the Jews, and to maintain the plan for the human birth of the Son, as a ransom for the world, for those who require salvation for sins.
If one doesn't accept that sin is a cancer, then they won't worry about calling the Doctor.

If those wicked and evil tribes actually did destroy the Jews, there would be no salvation. Off course people who accept they got here by pure chance and coincidence, will probably also say the Jews were lucky or were saved by pure chance...hehehe. Facts are facts.
What facts?


DCP
Hence why, Mark Twain tells it like it is. The Jews conquered and beat all, while their enemies withered away.
Off course Mark didn't have to tell us what was already written. That God will accomplish His plan with Israel, whether the rest like it or not, or "choose" to believe it or not, using their perfectly good free will.
A few million standing the test of time. Incredible miracle as far as I'm concerned. Their land blooming as promised 3000 years ago.
The concept of self for-filling prophecies has been discussed here countless times.

DCP
The Orthodox Jew may reject the suffering Messiah in Isaiah 53, but are still under the covenant.
Muslims are deceived into thinking they serve the same God, yet their founder muhammed, chose one god named allah, out of 359 gods during the time of Pagan worship. It was the Qurashi tribe if I'm not mistaken.
Allah is simply the Arabic word for God, Christian Arabs refer to the Christian God as Allah.

As such you ramble makes no sense at all.
 
DCP
The Orthodox Jew may reject the suffering Messiah in Isaiah 53, but are still under the covenant.
Muslims are deceived into thinking they serve the same God, yet their founder muhammed, chose one god named allah, out of 359 gods during the time of Pagan worship. It was the Qurashi tribe if I'm not mistaken.

Thanks for telling that my god is all lies. I told also that Christianity also like that......wait.

Have some perspective. Not just yours.

Also I dont like formalism in Religion like people seems to practice when comes to religion (Yelling everyone to pray and worship, etc but their everyday behavior is bad).
 
Thanks for telling that my god is all lies. I told also that Christianity also like that......wait.

Have some perspective. Not just yours.

Also I dont like formalism in Religion like people seems to practice when comes to religion (Yelling everyone to pray and worship, etc but their everyday behavior is bad).

Then you'll realize that none of us are perfect, and sin everyday through thought and deed, hence the need for a Saviour.
Christians acknowledge and understand this, hence why we have a relationship with our God. We don't offer sacrifices and offerings to please Him. We thank Him for all we have, and for all He has done for us, in a world that's full of sin and wickedness.

Your god doesn't have to be all lies. You can decide that for yourself through your free will. Does your god love you or is a father to you? You might say he is, but his unchanging word says he is not. is he wrong, or are you committing shirk?

What you must realize, is that he is not the God of the bible, or the gods of the Romans or Hindu's etc. Allah is unique to Islams founding father, Muhammed.
 
DCP
Muslims are deceived into thinking they serve the same God, yet their founder muhammed, chose one god named allah, out of 359 gods during the time of Pagan worship. It was the Qurashi tribe if I'm not mistaken.
No more than French speaking Christians are being deceived by using the French word for god (dieu) instead of the English word.
 
No more than French speaking Christians are being deceived by using the French word for god (dieu) instead of the English word.
I regularly do service work at Hotel Dieu Hospital. Have I been working at Hotel God all this time thinking I was working at Hotel 2?
 
I regularly do service work at Hotel Dieu Hospital. Have I been working at Hotel God all this time thinking I was working at Hotel 2?

You were also working for Hotel Apollo/Jah/Allah. I have heard of serving 'God' let alone a god but this is taking servitude to multi-divine heights, Johnny.
 
You were also working for Hotel Apollo/Jah/Allah. I have heard of serving 'God' let alone a god but this is taking servitude to multi-divine heights, Johnny.
The French word for Allah et al is dieu?
 
The French word for Allah et al is dieu?

Thank you for your patience. I caught your (obviously tongue-in-cheek) question earlier but while my spirit was willing my flesh was tied up. So let's dissect it together; you know I have great regard for the razor-like mind you have.

Yes, "et al' is where it becomes tricky and we will not only be involved in slicing graphemes but in having to accept that someone screaming "Yahweh Rocks!" or "God iz da Man!" is no different to screaming "Allahu Akbar!"

The word for 'Allah' in French is 'Allah'. Not allah or dieu or Dieu but 'Allah'. A specific entity with specific aretalogy. Same with Bouddha. Or Jehovah. (Pardon my lack of a proper French accent, Inglis is my ancestral wiring.)

But let's leave the aretology and cultural colouring aside aside for the moment and focus on the phenomenon that many individuals who voted 'no way' in the poll in the OP (deliberately rigged to present false information as genuine, but quite apparent in its agenda to many others) and regard the word 'god' and 'God' - or Allah and allah and jehovah and . . . yes, Apollo the Greek's god - in the context of proper nouns.
(We can go further into 'proper names' if you wish, later, but that would be linguistic surgery that would shed blood, sweat and tears.)

Jehovah and Allah to the French is not Dieu - the proper name. Allah is Allah and Jehovah is Jehovah and God is Dieu. Not dieu (that's Apollo. Who is also Apollo.)
'Dieu' written in lowercase is a common noun, Dieu is a proper noun.
Some would sweep this all quickly under the mat since it actually requires thought.

For those of us unclear on the issue I will draw on a dictionary entry - fairly standard among all dictionaries :

"Common and proper nouns
In linguistics, proper nouns, common nouns and mass nouns are three distinct subclasses of nouns. Common nouns refer to a class of individual entities, whereas proper nouns name a unique referent, and mass nouns refer to non-individual referents. In English syntax they can fulfill the same functions, but proper nouns behave differently in that, like mass nouns, they cannot take the determiners "the" or "a" - this is a consequence of the fact that since they denote a unique referent they cannot be indefinite, and they do not have a plural form except in special cases where they are used as common nouns.
"

This lead us to reading these lines quite differently:

Apollo is God
Apollo is the God
Apollo is a God
Appolo is the god.
Apollo is a god
Allah is God
Allah is a god
God is a god
God is not a god
The god was God
Waiting for God
Good god!
Allah be praised!
Jehovah be damned!
God is great!
The gods must be crazy.
God is Love

......... and obviously translating these words can also lead to many a synaptic mixup with the resulting concepts as diverse as the individuals reading them. Add pro-nouns and it gets even more specific with capitalisation.

Let's look at the OP again with all this in mind as we try to answer the poll:

god2_zpsamlodk72.jpg


'no way' (sic) can mean belief in a whole different 'god' to the one so skillfully portrayed in the OP - because disbelief in one god (or God) doesn't necessarily mean disbelief in every god (or portrayal of God.)

As I mentioned we will examine Patrik's aretalogy later (is he 'Christian'? which god is he referring to? 'he' must be still around under another 'name') so that we can rectify the confusion in here between fundamentalists and active atheists about who 'god' or (God) really is or shouldn't be, hopefully at the same time undisturbed by them as we try to uncover this masterful bit of trolling that was set up in the OP (so fiercely guarded by some) to cause strife and instigate the loss of members.
 
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obviously translating these words can also lead to many a synaptic mixup with the resulting concepts as diverse as the individuals reading them.

You lost me there. Do you mean syntactic?

Your point about the capitalisation of the OP is good one though, but, given the lack of capitalisation, I'd take further issue with the reader's god not being expressed as female instead of male. Or neither, for that matter.
 
Beautifully put @photonrider

Although Christianity, Judaism, and Muslin believe in "God", they all disagree with each other's ideologically because all three believe in a different Messiah. For Christians it's Jesus, for Muslims it's Muhammad, and for Jews he's yet to come. It doesn't make sense to bunch these 3 religions together and assume they're the same.

There needs to be a clear definition as to which God or god people are referring to (whether by capitalization or distinguishing by religion) in order for this conversation to move forward. I think a lot of the arguments get a bit heated because neither side is talking about the same god
 
they all disagree with each other's ideologically because all three believe in a different Messiah. For Christians it's Jesus, for Muslims it's Muhammad, and for Jews he's yet to come.

Christians argue that they and jews share the same messiah, that's part of the problem.

It doesn't make sense to bunch these 3 religions together and assume they're the same.

Is anybody doing that? You can't even do that within the subsects of those religions. They have the same god though and refer heavily to the same regional legends and traditions.

There needs to be a clear definition as to which God or god people are referring to (whether by capitalization or distinguishing by religion) in order for this conversation to move forward.

Bollocks. 648 pages say you're wrong. The discussion is as much about how people understand the question in the OP from their personal belief perspective.
 
Although Christianity, Judaism, and Muslin believe in "God", they all disagree with each other's ideologically because all three believe in a different Messiah. For Christians it's Jesus, for Muslims it's Muhammad, and for Jews he's yet to come.

Not quite. Like Christianity, Islam views Jesus as The Messiah; they hold that Muhammad was a prophet.
 
Christians argue that they and jews share the same messiah, that's part of the problem.

You have a source for that? It's the first time I'm hearing Jews and Christians believe in same Messiah. Jews don't believe Jesus Christ is their messiah, end of story.
Is anybody doing that? You can't even do that within the subsects of those religions. They have the same god though and refer heavily to the same regional legends and traditions.

Again you're assuming they have the same beliefs but as I mentioned before they do not. As far as I know all three religions believe the "Messiah" will come on "judgement day" and take "the faithful ones" to "heaven". How can these religions be the same when one thinks the messiah came and died on the cross, the other accended to heaven, and the other hasn't even arrived yet?

Bollocks. 648 pages say you're wrong. The discussion is as much about how people understand the question in the OP from their personal belief perspective.

Fine, go on and discuss religion without distinguishing between God, god, Allah, Yahweh, dieu, or Apollo. Makes perfect sense...
 

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