I'm another Gran turismo fan who's thinking 360, because of a two year wait for GT5. Sigh, what a drought...
Anyway, as to the thread title, I think Forza might finally show up on the radar because of the market awareness the 360 is finally beginning to show, thanks to a massive ad deluge M$ is forcing on us. But is Gran Turismo in trouble? I hardly think so. A little over 1 million Forza sales worldwide after a year and a half to GT4's 8 million for a supposedly more advanced MS game, on a definitely more superior MS console. I do expect Forza 2 to sell well, but only in relation to other 360 games. Like it or not, the racing gamer around the world still thinks of Gran Turismo as THE racing series.
You do have to consider where both series are coming from to speculate where they're headed. With Gran Turismo, I'm amazed that Kaz was able to accomplish what he has on the truly primitive PS1 in GT1 and 2. Even though the graphics in GT2 were just awful, the physics were tangible, and the car list was staggering. And race modification gave almost every car a whole new identity, making every car exciting to own and drive all over again.
Every Gran Turismo had a certain flavor. Some bemoan certain aspects of the physics, like the loss of donuts in GT4, but I think that's silly to complain about. I never found a donut useful in winning a race.
But for the fans, you found a familiar handling flavor tuned as well as the PS2 would allow with its now anemic performance. And even with the duplicate vehicles, you still had around 600 cars to choose from, even if the list included some odd entries like the ultra compacts and antiques from the very origin of auto history.
Forza draws on this legacy to give us their take on a car game based on everything from enthusiast competitions to serious professional racing. Even as they throw water balloons at Polyphony and their accomplishments, the similarity is undeniable, it's simply a GT wannabe from Microsoft. The car list is much smaller, the track list is as well, but what they do give us is very well delivered, Nurburgring aside, and a good variety. The physics is different but similar with its own flaws, and gameplay is focused on a more western view of only asphalt racing, though with some NFS elements like the point to point races. The bots are frankly horrible, vicious beasts which wouldn't be allowed to race anywhere except the Arab League or North Korea.
But they did bring a few interesting things to the table, like the dynamic racing guideline and the trainable drivatar which I've had a lot of fun with. But what really keeps me coming back to Forza is the modification area. The ability to not just use performance parts but aerodynamic body kits and a comprehensive paint shop to create race cars is unbelievably cool. It's what should have been in GT4, though I'm sure the memory requirements would be outrageous. As Kent has said before, Forza gives a hint of an answer to what Polyphony can do for GT5 to satisfy those complaining about "all those duplicate cars." Hide them in the Tuner Village, or give us the ability to create them with performance upgrades. The Forza game itself is unbelievably short, and I beat it completely in two months, to the day, while after a year with GT4 I still haven't touched the endurance races (GAH!), so there's still plenty to do. However, the game I keep coming back to is Forza, as I'm totally addicted to creating race cars. I anticipate filling the game up with lots of variations of beloved cars from Skylines to Ferraris, each with its own distinctive paint job to go with a virtual race driver.
Even though Forza 2 is headed to the much more powerful 360, other than a new more powerful physics engine, the improvements look to be marginal. In fact some don't look very promising. Damage in FM1 was very basic, being the equivalent to mild damage in a PC sim, and this looks to be continued in Forza 2. The car list is slightly larger, but includes some exciting supercars like a few Lamborghinis and more Ferraris. The modifications look to be much more comprehensive though, as you can supposedly modify every car now, so I'm hopeful that we'll be able to create our own GTS Class race cars rather than use the stock models as in most games. The mod section is showing a number of decals from established performance companies AWOL from Forza like K&N, Accel and NISMO, so the modders and decal freaks like me should have a lot more fun in store for them. The paint shop is rumored to be much more powerful and flexible while being easier, and I'm counting on there being FONTS this time, as well as national flags. The bots are supposed to be civil now while still being competitive, although the drivatar training sounds to be scaled back quite a bit, sadly. The gameplay is rumored to be reworked to make the offline play as cool as the already proven and tweaked online system. But what clearly shouts that Forza 2 wants to be the next Gran Turismo is the inclusion of Photo Mode. This all bodes well for Forza 2 to make a decent splash, enough so that PC gamers and GT fans disappointed over the lack of a new Gran Turismo (like me) will give this game a serious look. I'm so ravenously addicted to creating race cars that I'll probably get a 360 and FM2 with a wireless wheel to go.
Will this threaten Polyphony's position in the race gaming world? Slightly. The sales figures for the 360 aren't much better than the XBox it replaced, so I expect Forza 2 to do only better its predecessor a little, though the identity is being established on the market so I could be surprised, especially if people flock to it like me, hungry for a next gen GT-like game.
But that's the thing. Forza's claim to fame is giving a few things Gran Turismo is just shy of to race addicts, things like easy drifting, supercar collecting, online play and race modding. Even the game progression structure and reward system is nearly identical. It's always trying to be "Gran Turismo but different" or "Gran Turismo but better," which is a recipe for a lukewarm reception from the market, as Forza's sales indicate. It is a good game, with its own quirks and issues, but trying to be the same but different has hardly ever been a recipe for success. It inevitably reminds us that the real deal is forthcoming.
I believe Gran Turismo 5 will be the true next gen racer. From everything Kaz has been saying and showing us, GT5 will be a monumental game. What will be available, who knows, but grabbing the Ferrari license sems to be just the start of the tidal wave of coolness. Being able to create an online community looks to be a no brainer, and developing for the immensely capable multicore PS3, almost anything is possible, like the rumored dynamic weather and day to night progression in real time. Kaz has said that whatever had been done in the past, and what we want that fit in with his vision for Gran Turismo will be there for us, so it's hard not to drool with anticipation. Preliminary physics and graphic work on GT HD looks amazing, and it can only be uphill from there, especially with two more years (or more) of development time.
More than likely, I'll get Forza 2 and a 360 when it ships, but the game I'm really looking forward to, the series I love, is Gran Turismo. It's my racing home. Forza is merely an extended vacation.
I started with the ZX Spectrum (I vaguely remember a ZX81, but I was about 3 at the time), going through various iterations of it, then onto Amigas and finally Playstations. We're the reason why 80s "retro" gaming is big - we're the money in the market and we remember these games from our youth.
