Education system

[dxm8975]

Interesting. I know here in North America there is no difference towards failing kids and kids who excel. They teach the same same stuff and just tell you to study more. I am taking a new online course now in psychology and it's literally just read a book and they give you a quiz each week. No teaching at all. I could of just bought the book and read it myself and been just as qualified as anyone who takes the course. It's just a money grab to get people to not only buy the $100 book, but also pay for the expensive course to get a piece of paper saying you did it.

I do think diet may also have a roll. In North America all of our food is complete ****. Everything is filled with sugar and salt. It is very tough to get snacks and healthy lunches for kids that do no contain crazy amounts of unnecessary chemicals and food coloring. Everywhere in the world has similar foods thanks to places like McDonald's, but places like Japan are more fish based. Fresh fish and rice is a million times better than candy bars and chips.

That's terrible man, all the students can answer the question of a certain problem asked by their teacher if the answer is taken note in the textbook or notebook the students routinely use during their classes beforehand. Teachers lack the sense of understanding that alerting to students to study more doesn't necessarily dispose students to get concentrated on their study, but vice versa.(discouraging them to do their work for feeling always obliged to do it, and it being difficult to measure up what to do to earn credits for the next grade)

I did know the main diet of American people was based on snacks and meats which are both oleaginous and quite bad for their health, but do they serve such foods even as lunch in schools? Eating fastfoods at daily meals at younger age can be a cause of life-style related disease later developing an adult disease when they get elder, and especially in countries such as America, where people's lives are dependent on cars as a means of movement instead of their own feet, a shortage of exercise can become another cause of getting fat, as well as unwillingness of going a near place where is only within a range of a stone's throw.

 

[jcm]

Nort Ammerycaz edukaton izz god.


Actually, it's insanely boring because most teachers are terrible at their jobs. There are teachers who do a good job, my guitar teacher and my english teacher. My guitar teacher's job is easy as I chose his class and I'm going to enjoy it regardless of how good he teaches us.

My english teacher's job isn't as easy. I (and most I know) don't enjoy english. We find it boring and pointless (were fluent in speaking and are grammer is fairly good). He however, does a great job teaching us, because he actually spends the class teaching us. He doesn't give any homework, yet he manages to make us understand everything in our curriculum. Who would've thought that was possible!

 

[shmogt]

That's terrible man, all the students can answer the question of a certain problem asked by their teacher if the answer is taken note in the textbook or notebook the students routinely use during their classes beforehand. Teachers lack the sense of understanding that alerting to students to study more doesn't necessarily dispose students to get concentrated on their study, but vice versa.(discouraging them to do their work for feeling always obliged to do it, and it being difficult to measure up what to do to earn credits for the next grade)

I did know the main diet of American people was based on snacks and meats which are both oleaginous and quite bad for their health, but do they serve such foods even as lunch in schools? Eating fastfoods at daily meals at younger age can be a cause of life-style related disease later developing an adult disease when they get elder, and especially in countries such as America, where people's lives are dependent on cars as a means of movement instead of their own feet, a shortage of exercise can become another cause of getting fat, as well as unwillingness of going a near place where is only within a range of a stone's throw.

Seriously north American diet and life style is the worst possible thing you could ever do. Eat literally candy and high sugar and salt foods all day with very very minimal movement. Most jobs are just sitting in chairs all day and schools barely have a gym program. All the extra stuff like sports and art always get the budget cuts. I think in US sports like football may be more popular tho and not get cut.

Sitting all day in chairs for your job I would say is the number one problem. I saw a few studies that said if you sit for more than 6hrs a day in a computer chair your risk of type 2 diabetics goes up by 60%. As soon as you sit down your body starts burning only half the calories it normally would since you are not using the largest muscles in your body being the legs. It slows down insulin response and increases fat stores. Even with exercise it will have a drastic effect on your life.

I personally can vouch for how awful it is for your health as I am forced to sit a lot. It causes your hip flexors to become too tight and your ass muscles too weak which will result in your hips to be misaligned. This will cause your body to go forward putting a lot of stress on your lower back and leaning even more forward to use the keyboard and mouse cause your shoulders to round. This horrible lifestyle mixed with the awful process foods they sell everywhere will result in a million health problems down the road. Biggest health problems in north America are lower back pain and obesity ironically lol.

Nort Ammerycaz edukaton izz god.

Actually, it's insanely boring because most teachers are terrible at their jobs. There are teachers who do a good job, my guitar teacher and my english teacher. My guitar teacher's job is easy as I chose his class and I'm going to enjoy it regardless of how good he teaches us.

My english teacher's job isn't as easy. I (and most I know) don't enjoy english. We find it boring and pointless (were fluent in speaking and are grammer is fairly good). He however, does a great job teaching us, because he actually spends the class teaching us. He doesn't give any homework, yet he manages to make us understand everything in our curriculum. Who would've thought that was possible!

Lol every time I mention teachers someone gets pissed. Well here we go. I agree a lot are great and a lot are just terrible. I think it's more on who the school boards hire and their firing policy that's so out of wack. I once had an English teach who's second language was English. I remember thinking how stupid it was being taught English by a teacher with an accent. Telling me how to pronounce things properly and couldn't even say the words themselves. Nothing against the teacher or other with accents, she was alright, but teaching English? Like who's decision to give them the job was that.

 

[Joel]

My opinion is that teachers with long term experience have too much job security. There's a lot of teachers I've had who are in their mid 40's and they just go though the motions because they know just ten more years for their pension.

 

[Jubby]

Actually, it's insanely boring because most teachers are terrible at their jobs. There are teachers who do a good job, my guitar teacher and my english teacher. My guitar teacher's job is easy as I chose his class and I'm going to enjoy it regardless of how good he teaches us.

My english teacher's job isn't as easy. I (and most I know) don't enjoy english. We find it boring and pointless (were fluent in speaking and are grammer is fairly good). He however, does a great job teaching us, because he actually spends the class teaching us. He doesn't give any homework, yet he manages to make us understand everything in our curriculum. Who would've thought that was possible!

I think it's less of the teachers, more of the overall system (yes, including the teachers, in part).

Having gone through the education process fully, I look back years ago, and see the "boredom" you speak of. Part of that, which makes the teacher's job that much harder, is that children in the last 20-30 years are encouraged to find easy, fun things to do(see: sitting in front of the TV, video games, etc.). Notice I don't say discouraged against that. If a child from a very young age is conditioned to like or enjoy the "hard" things, and find "fun" in challenges, then school will be successful. This makes the teachers' jobs easier and they'd seem "better".

Speaking only of the US, as I have little knowledge of school systems abroad, It's unfortunate that children in secondary schools are not conditioned to the real world. If a student doesn't want to do the assignment, and the teacher has tried their best... it's the teacher's fault and very little blame is placed on the individual(aside from the F or incomplete... etc.). The teacher is told to keep trying, even if they're already 'blue in the face'. Compare that to real employment; if an employee doesn't want to do the job... they're fired. Now, I realize we cannot "fire" a student. Since secondary schools seem to be training teens to be prepared for post-secondary schools, (and they don't do a good enough job of that, honestly) the students never truly get the idea of how the real world works until their in it. I see this portion everyday in my workplace. I wish they'd change that. The previous is not a "knock" on teachers, it's the system as a whole including administration as a whole. This would certainly change the unemployment rate in America (at least in part).

 

[dxm8975]

Seriously north American diet and life style is the worst possible thing you could ever do. Eat literally candy and high sugar and salt foods all day with very very minimal movement. Most jobs are just sitting in chairs all day and schools barely have a gym program. All the extra stuff like sports and art always get the budget cuts. I think in US sports like football may be more popular tho and not get cut.

Sitting all day in chairs for your job I would say is the number one problem. I saw a few studies that said if you sit for more than 6hrs a day in a computer chair your risk of type 2 diabetics goes up by 60%. As soon as you sit down your body starts burning only half the calories it normally would since you are not using the largest muscles in your body being the legs. It slows down insulin response and increases fat stores. Even with exercise it will have a drastic effect on your life.

I personally can vouch for how awful it is for your health as I am forced to sit a lot. It causes your hip flexors to become too tight and your ass muscles too weak which will result in your hips to be misaligned. This will cause your body to go forward putting a lot of stress on your lower back and leaning even more forward to use the keyboard and mouse cause your shoulders to round. This horrible lifestyle mixed with the awful process foods they sell everywhere will result in a million health problems down the road. Biggest health problems in north America are lower back pain and obesity ironically lol.

Really? If so American(or Canadian) people are further deprived of their few chances of burning off fat in their loosen stomach, for all the case they're passive in getting to a near spot even inside their house... In Japan we're still provided with occasions of exercise through classes of physical education(shortly P.E.) even with the similarity in style of teaching, for aim of preventing the students from becoming stout and making them understand the joy of moving their body parts in schoolyard or gymnasium, awaking their dormant brain after hours-studying too. Their schoolwork-centered policy can not only make the school life a monotonous moment for students with full of repetition of studying, but also get the primary idea of American education that "They both cherish their opportunity of learning and time off their work" collapsed.

Yes, it should also be counted as one of the biggest problems in lives of American people, but sitting on a chair to use the internet is not the single factor of growing their internal health problems even further. I suppose, going to take a nap after their refreshments is also a point that ought to be mended as it can also increase the risk of coming down with diabetes and some other serious illnesses(if he/she is already suffering them, the condition gets worsening), which stems from less consumption of calories and sugar for want of exercise.

Also, putting a lot of burden or stress on your back can lead people to have humpbacks which might hinder growth of stature, coupled with having bad eyesight as a consequence of staring at the screen for hours if they regularly use the internet, as well as clump of flexor muscles on your hip, gets more complicated combined with dietary problems as you said. Therefore, if we come to settle this grave matter lying in our lifestyle, it will require strenuous efforts and time since it has to lead back to reform of our basic problematic lifestyle on behalf of involvement of various factors in various fields.

 

[shmogt]

Really? If so American(or Canadian) people are further deprived of their few chances of burning off fat in their loosen stomach, for all the case they're passive in getting to a near spot even inside their house... In Japan we're still provided with occasions of exercise through classes of physical education(shortly P.E.) even with the similarity in style of teaching, for aim of preventing the students from becoming stout and making them understand the joy of moving their body parts in schoolyard or gymnasium, awaking their dormant brain after hours-studying too. Their schoolwork-centered policy can not only make the school life a monotonous moment for students with full of repetition of studying, but also get the primary idea of American education that "They both cherish their opportunity of learning and time off their work" collapsed.

Yes, it should also be counted as one of the biggest problems in lives of American people, but sitting on a chair to use the internet is not the single factor of growing their internal health problems even further. I suppose, going to take a nap after their refreshments is also a point that ought to be mended as it can also increase the risk of coming down with diabetes and some other serious illnesses(if he/she is already suffering them, the condition gets worsening), which stems from less consumption of calories and sugar for want of exercise.

Also, putting a lot of burden or stress on your back can lead people to have humpbacks which might hinder growth of stature, coupled with having bad eyesight as a consequence of staring at the screen for hours if they regularly use the internet, as well as clump of flexor muscles on your hip, gets more complicated combined with dietary problems as you said. Therefore, if we come to settle this grave matter lying in our lifestyle, it will require strenuous efforts and time since it has to lead back to reform of our basic problematic lifestyle on behalf of involvement of various factors in various fields.

We do have P.E. classes, but they are stupid because it's pretty much dodgeball or useless games. It should be like all classes where they actually teach you about how the body works when doing certain movements. That way they would teach kids that sitting for long periods of time can lead to some seriously negative effects. Not only that, but it would show kids what exercises to do to recover from long periods of sitting. Proper nutrition lessons should also be added to this class.

Basics about nutrition and correct body movements are pretty easy to teach too. It would be a lot of fun since you can tell the kids something and they can than go out and try it to notice the difference. Not only that, but the overall population would be so knowledgeable about their bodies and theoretically lower the obesity rate.

These are just more problems I have with the current education system.

 

[Pupik]

For all that's wrong, I think you're making a of assumptions. Everyone, with the exception of those that have serious mental and physical disabilities, can do a great job in school and perform at their best. There's other social and financial barriers that also come into play, but I think that's a little beyond the scope of this thread; the excuses of temptation and diet aren't solely to blame (weak reasons, personally), although kids are going to perform at a level in which their parents involve them in their education.

Who really cares what some standardized test says about our education system, anyhow? America is not moribund, lying rigid in state, as it still offers many opportunities, creates technology, new service industries, is still at the forefront of medical breakthroughs, leads in entertainment, et cetera...

 

[shmogt]

For all that's wrong, I think you're making a of assumptions. Everyone, with the exception of those that have serious mental and physical disabilities, can do a great job in school and perform at their best. There's other social and financial barriers that also come into play, but I think that's a little beyond the scope of this thread; the excuses of temptation and diet aren't solely to blame (weak reasons, personally), although kids are going to perform at a level in which their parents involve them in their education.

Who really cares what some standardized test says about our education system, anyhow? America is not moribund, lying rigid in state, as it still offers many opportunities, creates technology, new service industries, is still at the forefront of medical breakthroughs, leads in entertainment, et cetera...

Who said diet was solely to blame? I know I only said just another problem. If you don't think being morbidly obese has an effect of children and how they learn in school you have got to be crazy. Just the surface level of being super fat and made fun of by other kids would make it tougher to concentrate in schools.

That attitude is why nothing gets changed. People say "Oh it's not that bad" than do nothing. You should be pushing the limits and always striving for success. America is in an insane amount of debt, has half the job opportunities it used to, it's only serious exports are cars, and ya I guess it has Hollywood movies and films still as the leader. Although they are trying to **** it up will bills like the SOPA one that only benefits them and screws over millions. All of these problems are happening now. That's including all the people who got great education when America was the leader years and years ago. What's going to happen in the future when all those people retire and your just left with the kids who got current education. Sure some will just be naturally smart and make mind blowing things, but super high quality education would give many other kids a chance to really think and push their ideas to the max. America isn't at the top of the world anymore in anything and it's shocking to me that they don't want to get back.

 

[Pupik]

Who said diet was solely to blame? I know I only said just another problem. If you don't think being morbidly obese has an effect of children and how they learn in school you have got to be crazy. Just the surface level of being super fat and made fun of by other kids would make it tougher to concentrate in schools.

So by your logic, everything in the universe is the cause of America's bad grades, so I suppose no further discussion is necessary...

I needs a Canajian Edumacation to fully understamb wear UR coming frond, you wins.

 

[shmogt]

So by your logic, everything in the universe is the cause of America's bad grades, so I suppose no further discussion is necessary...

I needs a Canajian Edumacation to fully understamb wear UR coming frond, you wins.

lol yes and no. No obviously because there are so many other countries and people in the world that America could literally be destroyed and it wouldn't matter, people would still think of great things etc. However yes because America has so much potential that they are capable of achieving more that would help the entire world.

I started this thread to see what others thoughts are where they live, how it's different, what could be changed etc. Education in North America and America especially is not necessarily bad the way it is now. I just don't feel it is even close to what it should be. North America has everything you could possibly want. Only in North America can poor people be fat from the crazy abundance of cheap food we have and the easy access to whatever their heart desires. So many other countries do not have the extreme wealth North America has for it's people and yet the education isn't number 1 or close to it on a world standpoint. It just doesn't make sense.

Children you are sending to school to train them to be able to think of new technologies and be able to take what they learn in school and share it/add to it later in life. Why is America more focused on putting more money into the army than into education? By investing into education you are investing into the army since kids will think of new things which the army can than use. Education is the foundation of everything. You can't think or try something new if you don't know what has already been done.

It just doesn't make sense to me that education isn't a big priority. It's not about learning what we know than sending that person to work for a big company, it's about learning what we know and having the kids go out and start those big companies. Educating someone to be a worker is easy, but educating them to be the person who hires the workers is tough. I just feel that America has so much potential and is always trying to be the best in everything than they should strive for the best education too.

 

[dautolover]

I don't think teaching theory is the majority of the problem. The majority of the problem lies, especially in the US, in the home structure. Some of this is society based. As outlined by this:



My view in a nutshell: Education starts and ends at the home. Learning starts at the child's home at a very young age. When the young child is becoming to be self-sufficient, they can be passed to a professional to learn. What is being taught needs to be reinforced at home.

This isn't what is happening. Potential reasons:
Some parents don't start at an early age.
Some parents don't help a child become self-sufficient.
Some parents don't reinforce what is being taught in school.
Some teachers see the breakdown in the return on their teaching, and don't try as hard.
Some children aren't as proficient. This becomes cyclical with the next generation.

I realize that many people point to testing. Standardized testing seems pointless. Sure, they give comparable numbers. Look at localities and countries. Their success or failure is the ultimate test of education.

I respectfully say that this is bull...

First off, you guys have to realize that education is a system. You keep that system working by conducting maintenance (money, programs, teachers, books). Like any system, if one part goes wrong, the integrity of the system begins to fail. At the same time, the education system is but one part of an immense system, which functions according to other systems.

The people that go through that system are institutionalized into a world that needs a particular workforce to help steer the entire system. This is what happened in the Cold War... money was thrown to bolster college education, particularly in California. Ever wonder why the UC system (a public school) ranks high among the expensive private schools? It's because of the money it received from the State and from the Federal government.

Where has the funding gone? Well, it's no longer there... or at least in the same way it has before. I go to UCLA... the Regents have continuously raised tuition fees because the state of CA decided to de-fund the school system. This has also been the case for K-12. My brother, who's 12, goes to a weakly funded school... so underfunded that he has gone through 2-3 teachers in the entire school year, as the school attempted to shuffle the kids around to compensate for laid off teachers.

In high school, I remember not going to class for an entire week, as the school managed to place me in a class. Just so happened that all classes were overcrowded, and there was no more room for me (and several other students who spent their fifth period at the cafeteria playing their GameBoys or PSPs).

Maybe it's my upbringing, but I have no recollection of something that worked in these schools. Sure, there were good, supportive teachers out there. But they were not enough to make up for a severely impacted school system, because their presence was simply made moot by the lack of money. Good teachers were often fired or sent to other schools. After school programs... very few.

In terms of family... I don't think that made a difference. Through a combination of environment and class, my community fared poorly in terms of education. Let's start with class. In my neighborhood, most people were working-class. You know the working class mentality: work hard, get money, and have your kid go to school to have a better life. Well, that wasn't always the case. Despite parents' desires to have their children succeed, many worked too hard... couldn't be there at conferences, PTA meetings, etc. Some kids understood that, and they managed to make it to college. Others weren't as understanding, and dropped out.

Then there's the environment. Implicit here (or at least in my community) is the presence of another system: the prison system. Alongside the educational system is the prison system, which in CA receives more tax money than schools. Police is consistently targeting "at risk youth" and the justice system is sending them off the prisons. Not to mention the presence of gangs, and a bunch of other bad influences. No community gatherings, whatsoever--work, remember?

Which brings me full circle. It's a system! But how is that system functioning now? In a time where we needed to get more educated people to compete against the Soviets, our educational system was phenomenal... the envy of Europe. But with a restructured economy, the needs of this country have changed. A college degree doesn't get you the same income as before, and this is because the needs of this country don't necessitate the funding of schools, or at least in the same way as before. Which is why you can't look at education and say "oh, it's the parents!" or "oh, it's the teachers." Education is but one part of this thing we call "the state." As the prison system changes gear, it grates alongside the educational system, moving it accordingly. The law, the market, the economy, the population, its demographics (shaped not only by birth rates, but by immigration)... all of these function alongside everything else. You want to know what's wrong with our education? Step back, and look at the entire picture. Don't consider this a problem of individual choice or individual character, cause it doesn't account for much, at least anymore. To not realize this is to still believe in the existence of the mythological American Dream. I say mythological, because it has always been a myth... the conditions were merely different.

 

[1241Penguin]

As far as I'm aware, the learning standards in North America (or at least Canada) is at least 2 grades lower than the international standard. So if you are learning how to divide in Grade 6 (or 6th Grade as the Americans call it), you are already 2 years behind.

The education that I am receiving at the moment is extremely dumbed-down. You can't just "know," for example, that 5 yards = 15 feet, you need to show it step-by-step:

5yd x (3ft/1yd) = 15 feet.

It's pretty irritating.

 

[Jubby]

I respectfully say that this is bull...

First off, you guys have to realize that education is a system. You keep that system working by conducting maintenance (money, programs, teachers, books). Like any system, if one part goes wrong, the integrity of the system begins to fail. At the same time, the education system is but one part of an immense system, which functions according to other systems.

The people that go through that system are institutionalized into a world that needs a particular workforce to help steer the entire system. This is what happened in the Cold War... money was thrown to bolster college education, particularly in California. Ever wonder why the UC system (a public school) ranks high among the expensive private schools? It's because of the money it received from the State and from the Federal government.

Where has the funding gone? Well, it's no longer there... or at least in the same way it has before. I go to UCLA... the Regents have continuously raised tuition fees because the state of CA decided to de-fund the school system. This has also been the case for K-12. My brother, who's 12, goes to a weakly funded school... so underfunded that he has gone through 2-3 teachers in the entire school year, as the school attempted to shuffle the kids around to compensate for laid off teachers.

In high school, I remember not going to class for an entire week, as the school managed to place me in a class. Just so happened that all classes were overcrowded, and there was no more room for me (and several other students who spent their fifth period at the cafeteria playing their GameBoys or PSPs).

Maybe it's my upbringing, but I have no recollection of something that worked in these schools. Sure, there were good, supportive teachers out there. But they were not enough to make up for a severely impacted school system, because their presence was simply made moot by the lack of money. Good teachers were often fired or sent to other schools. After school programs... very few.

In terms of family... I don't think that made a difference. Through a combination of environment and class, my community fared poorly in terms of education. Let's start with class. In my neighborhood, most people were working-class. You know the working class mentality: work hard, get money, and have your kid go to school to have a better life. Well, that wasn't always the case. Despite parents' desires to have their children succeed, many worked too hard... couldn't be there at conferences, PTA meetings, etc. Some kids understood that, and they managed to make it to college. Others weren't as understanding, and dropped out.

Then there's the environment. Implicit here (or at least in my community) is the presence of another system: the prison system. Alongside the educational system is the prison system, which in CA receives more tax money than schools. Police is consistently targeting "at risk youth" and the justice system is sending them off the prisons. Not to mention the presence of gangs, and a bunch of other bad influences. No community gatherings, whatsoever--work, remember?

Which brings me full circle. It's a system! But how is that system functioning now? In a time where we needed to get more educated people to compete against the Soviets, our educational system was phenomenal... the envy of Europe. But with a restructured economy, the needs of this country have changed. A college degree doesn't get you the same income as before, and this is because the needs of this country don't necessitate the funding of schools, or at least in the same way as before. Which is why you can't look at education and say "oh, it's the parents!" or "oh, it's the teachers." Education is but one part of this thing we call "the state." As the prison system changes gear, it grates alongside the educational system, moving it accordingly. The law, the market, the economy, the population, its demographics (shaped not only by birth rates, but by immigration)... all of these function alongside everything else. You want to know what's wrong with our education? Step back, and look at the entire picture. Don't consider this a problem of individual choice or individual character, cause it doesn't account for much, at least anymore. To not realize this is to still believe in the existence of the mythological American Dream. I say mythological, because it has always been a myth... the conditions were merely different.

I completely agree with most of what your writing. So much that I won't bother pointing out what I don't, aside from making one point.
You're right, it's not "the teachers" or "the parents". In order for a child to be successful, they need both. For any child to be successful, they need both... but it's important to see what matters most. A child's home is their foundation. A child (usually) cares more about what their parent says, or what they do. Yes, if a child has an excellent home and doesn't get a good education from the "system", then we know where the problem lies. If a child doesn't have a good home, it makes their education harder.

 

[shmogt]

It's one of those chicken or the egg situations. You can't have great parents to teach their kids if the parents didn't have great school to teach them when growing up. That's why kids in the ghetto don't care since all their parents dropped out and don't care. Now like you said it's even worse because having a college degree means nothing since barely anyone is hiring. Most of my friends who didn't go to college are doing way better since they had more years to work **** jobs and move up in pay at them.

I think if they really put education as the top priority it could go back to that American dream mentality. Where you can get a education and really make something of yourself.

 

[Joel]

It's one of those chicken or the egg situations. You can't have great parents to teach their kids if the parents didn't have great school to teach them when growing up.

Not true at all. Both my parents went to schools that were definitely not great. My mom's high school was mediocre, and my dad's was a crap school out in the middle of nowhere. Neither of my parents had a lot of support from their parents growing up, particularly my dad. As long as he didn't fail, his parents didn't care.

Fast forward to me being in school, and my parents are great, and highly supportive. It's not about the school they went to, but their character as people.

 

[Dapper]

A CBS overview-

Khan explaining why traditional schools suck and why his approach is successful-

http://www.khanacademy.org/

 

[shmogt]

A CBS overview-

Khan explaining why traditional schools suck and why his approach is successful-

http://www.khanacademy.org/

Damn it took me so long to notice these in here, but this was taken from another special I saw before which gave me the idea to make this thread. He is using technology to help kids learn and it seems like an idea that would be very easy to incorporate into all schools.

 

[Crispy]

I feel Sal Khan is a great way to educate. Hell I learned the majority of what I know about space from Khan Academy. Much easier listening to someone explain "Drakes Theory" rather than read it on wikipedia, where things are overcomplicated.

One thing I found interesting. I think it was Denmark, but they have free schools, and pay kids to go to college. Thought this was pretty interesting.

 

[shmogt]

I feel Sal Khan is a great way to educate. Hell I learned the majority of what I know about space from Khan Academy. Much easier listening to someone explain "Drakes Theory" rather than read it on wikipedia, where things are overcomplicated.

One thing I found interesting. I think it was Denmark, but they have free schools, and pay kids to go to college. Thought this was pretty interesting.

Yes I find the same thing. A lot easier when someone just tells you rather than having to research not knowing if your getting all the facts etc.

A few places in the world have free education and from what I have heard its working pretty well. Only thing is nothing is actually free in life so tax on things would have to go up a lot to be able to pay for all this education.

 

[Keef]

 

[prisonermonkeys]

So by your logic, everything in the universe is the cause of America's bad grades, so I suppose no further discussion is necessary...

I suggest going back and reading over the first few pages of this discussion. You'll see he's pretty consistent in that he has no idea what he's talking about. I'm a trained teacher, and I directed him to the works of various educational theorists so that he might gain an understanding of the concepts he is promoting. He never bothered to, because he didn't see the need for it. It took him three pages to work out that I'm not even American to begin with.

Reading back over some of his more-recent posts, I can see nothing has changed:

shmogt

You can't have great parents to teach their kids if the parents didn't have great school to teach them when growing up. That's why kids in the ghetto don't care since all their parents dropped out and don't care.

It's not a case of "caring" or "not caring". It's a question of values. If the student doesn't value education, then they will not respond to it. And it's taken on a case-by-case value; to state that all "kids in the ghetto don't care" is a massive generalisation.

shmogt

He is using technology to help kids learn and it seems like an idea that would be very easy to incorporate into all schools.

You evidently seem to think that soemthing like this can simply be introduced into the classroom and everyone will instantly take to it and marks will improve. That's not how it works at all. First, the school needs to find the money to pay for the program. Then all the teachers need to be trained in the proper use of the system to the point where they can do it without assistance. Then it needs to be steadily phased into the classroom. Then it needs to be constantly monitored to make sure it is working, and if it is not working, then the school has to go back and exmaine why this is the case and find a solution, which then needs to be monitored again to make sure it works.

It's a case of changing the culture of the school, and it's not something that is simply done. At a guess, I'd say a project like that one would take at least eighteen months - probably more like two years - to fully integrate, from the time it is first introduced to the time when it takes over completely.

 

[Omnis]

Damn it took me so long to notice these in here, but this was taken from another special I saw before which gave me the idea to make this thread. He is using technology to help kids learn and it seems like an idea that would be very easy to incorporate into all schools.

You're missing the point. What Sal does has obsolesced schools.

All schools should be private, small institutions spontaneously founded in places of most convenience for the families they serve. There's no reason a school couldn't be a few offices or a floor within a busy office building, for example. And children should be able to work when they're not studying. Let them help clean the place for a lunch stipend at the very least.

The little details are things that the market works out. Prison-style educational institutions are not serving the children best.

I think this has been posted before, but whatever:



I remember complaining about her dress and her not staying in her light, but, you know, whatever.

 

[shmogt]

I suggest going back and reading over the first few pages of this discussion. You'll see he's pretty consistent in that he has no idea what he's talking about. I'm a trained teacher, and I directed him to the works of various educational theorists so that he might gain an understanding of the concepts he is promoting. He never bothered to, because he didn't see the need for it. It took him three pages to work out that I'm not even American to begin with.

Reading back over some of his more-recent posts, I can see nothing has changed:

It's not a case of "caring" or "not caring". It's a question of values. If the student doesn't value education, then they will not respond to it. And it's taken on a case-by-case value; to state that all "kids in the ghetto don't care" is a massive generalisation.

You evidently seem to think that soemthing like this can simply be introduced into the classroom and everyone will instantly take to it and marks will improve. That's not how it works at all. First, the school needs to find the money to pay for the program. Then all the teachers need to be trained in the proper use of the system to the point where they can do it without assistance. Then it needs to be steadily phased into the classroom. Then it needs to be constantly monitored to make sure it is working, and if it is not working, then the school has to go back and exmaine why this is the case and find a solution, which then needs to be monitored again to make sure it works.

It's a case of changing the culture of the school, and it's not something that is simply done. At a guess, I'd say a project like that one would take at least eighteen months - probably more like two years - to fully integrate, from the time it is first introduced to the time when it takes over completely.

Oh god you again. I'm looking at it from a students perspective and you are looking at it from a teachers perspective. The kids are ready for a greater challenge and can do more. Current schooling is sit at a desk and read a book than later on repeat the data for a test. What is that really teaching kids if they are not thinking for themselves. Assignments and hands on things are the way to go. That's the only way to truly see if someone understands something. I remember I took so many test and never studied once since I knew I could just guess my way through. My test marks would come back and I always did much better than what I actually knew about the subject. My sister who is still in school and has a 97% average overall says she does the exact same thing. This amplified by the majority of students doing the same thing of knowing much less and guessing to achieve higher marks would make all the test results invalid and totally skew any educational testing of students.

Implementing more technology into the class rooms and getting everyone to understand it is easy. Everyone knows how to use computers and most of the best programmers out there are just randoms 16yr old kids. It's all these old ideas of how people learn and not giving kids enough credit that is holding everything back. In the real world if you have a problem or can possibly improve on your current situation you simply look at all the research and start doing testing to decide whether or not to make a change. If the testing seems positive you make a change and progress. In the school systems here it doesn't even get to small testing groups. Everyone is too busy fighting on what is the best option to try. A brand new cell phone with all new technologies comes out every month and yet the school system is stuck in the dark ages. It's time to embrace what the rest of the world is doing and step your game up. The US still uses imperial system like seriously WTF move on with life and realize that is not the way to go and make a change.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Oh god you again. I'm looking at it from a students perspective and you are looking at it from a teachers perspective.

That doesn't invalidate all my arguments and re-validate all of yours. At best, your ideas are driven by an idealism that is so far removed from feasibility that it is impossible. At worst, you're just ignorant.

The kids are ready for a greater challenge and can do more.

By your own admission - earlier in this thread - you were judging your entire nation's education system based solely on your experiences in a single town, which is a massive generalisation.

Current schooling is sit at a desk and read a book than later on repeat the data for a test. What is that really teaching kids if they are not thinking for themselves. Assignments and hands on things are the way to go. That's the only way to truly see if someone understands something. I remember I took so many test and never studied once since I knew I could just guess my way through. My test marks would come back and I always did much better than what I actually knew about the subject. My sister who is still in school and has a 97% average overall says she does the exact same thing.

This just proves your ignorance. You have this ideal in your head that says "this is the way things should be", you have limited yourself to your own expeiences and said "this is the way things currently are. Let's say you went to school in Miami - how are your experiences in any way representative of the experiences of students in Seattle? Or if you were in New York, how could you speak for students in San Diego?

You're demonstrating an extreme degree of ignorance. Put simply, you have no idea what you're talking about, and every time someone points this out, your standard m.o. is to attack that person, thinking that if you can discredit them once, you will discredit all of their ideas forever. If you actually cared about this subject as much as you like to think you do, you would have read everything you could find by Vygotsky and Piaget as soon as someone directed you to them. But here we are, six months later, and your understanding of the subject clearly hasn't increased in the slightest.

I think this post really summarises you best:

Ok this may not be the best advice, but it depends which way you look at it. Here are a couple tips on how to make tough assignments easier.

If you have a big essay that has to be a certain number of pages and just can't find anymore to write here is what you do. Go to find and change and type . In the find and replace with . But set the replaced one to one size larger font. Bam assignment done. The tiny little periods are all over the place but super unnoticeable at one size larger. Trust me you will add at least an extra page by doing this.

Another tip of you didn't finish an assignment is make an assignment in word or wherever and call it the name of the assignment and save. Than open it with a text editor to view the code. Delete a random few parts. Than email that assignment to the teach and this will buy you a few more days to work on it since the teacher won't know the file is corrupt until they open it. Obviously a few days later they will email you saying there is some error and you email back your new done assignment with a small apology saying your not sure why it didn't work. If you couldn't of guessed already this tip only works if the teachers ask for email assignments rather than printed ones.

For someone who seems to think that students are ready to make leaps and bounds in education, you've taken quite a bit of time advising other forum members on how to do the bare minimum on their assignments. Am I the only one who thinks that's a little backwards?

PS - We teachers weren't born yesterday. It would take all of five minutes to work out how someone did what you've described in the above post.

 

[shmogt]

I'm coming from students perspective and you the teachers. Didn't say either one was more right just that our views are different and we will never agree. Even with a new system people will try to find a way to exploit it by some sort of elaborate cheating system like I explained. Can't hate on the kids for trying.

I don't think you have mentioned once in here, but is your stance it is perfect the way it is and not to touch it or are you slightly agreeing with me in that it could be better?

 

[Liquid]

I'm coming from students perspective and you the teachers. Didn't say either one was more right just that our views are different and we will never agree.

Teachers were students once, y'know. They have the benefit of knowing how it works from both sides, and their opinions are much more valid than those of students.

 

[arora]

Most of the teachers I encountered raised 2 kids had, well little to no experience outside their institutional environment, so I'd say that 'benefit of knowing' is less then you think. Sure the opinions of a kid might not mean much but some real world experience sure does.

 

[Dotini]

In many school districts I'm guessing that there are terrible funding problems, stuffed classrooms and too great a variety of motivations and aptitudes amongst many students to allow the best possible education the teacher could deliver.

So to my idea of fundamental reforms:

1 - Provide traditional universal education only to those who really want it and are willing to apply themselves to it. This will be about 50%.

2 - To the remainder, offer training in agriculture, animal husbandry, shop skills and the manual trades. Again, only for those who earnestly want it.

Respectfully submitted,
Steve

 

[lbsf1]

Education needs skilled good teachers, from what I have seen of teachers I doubt that a teacher can be taught to be a good teacher they have to naturally be one, even some who copy other good teachers styles don't work because then its not natural. They key to me of good education is getting these naturally good teachers in to the job.

I have thrived at subjects that I don't like because of good teachers and struggled with subjects I have a passion in because of bad teachers.

I'm going to have a little rant now about a certain teacher, however she is so annoying that I just want to get this out.

She is my english teacher who took over when my previous teacher left to go travelling at christmas. She has to most monotonous boring voice, every lesson is the same read piece of poetry and then answer exam question on it. She sometimes gives and essay as homework then we bring it in on the day she says and then tells us all to peer assess each others work, she never marks anything, including all of these exam questions that we do in class. She then has a rant at us on how we are all going to do badly in the exam because we arn't putting effort in with homework.

I got a f in my coursework (2 hour essay on Romeo and Juliet), she speaks to me about resitting it and I say that I would need my overall language mark to make a decision because if I had a good mark in language then I could afford to not resit because I had lots of other revision to do which this would impact with. I never got that mark and when I queried why I just got bounced around the english department. Then 2 days after the deadline for coursework to be handed to the examining body she asked if I had made my descision on resiting.

This is how a teacher alienates a class of students who are good at english however most of them have little passion for it, and the analysis of poems and shakespeare will be of no use to in the future, and the students in our class our intelligent to know that and to think that their time and effort would be better spent on other subjects. Our new teacher has a real struggle at comprehending why people may think that english isn't the most important subject of all. On the other hand our previous teacher while a little weird at times actually made and effort and spiced lessons up, thus people made an effort.

Our class which is the best students in the year is getting lower marks then most of the other class's just because of the teacher, not because of effort or ability however just on teacher alone. Hence why I believe that a teacher makes all the difference, a student not caring about a subject isn't just down to the student a brilliant teacher is sometimes able to make a student like this care about the subject.