Fanatec CSW/CSR Elite Modders Thread *UPDATE February 2014*

  • Thread starter eKretz
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presidente001
Have you any idea of ​​when will be ready? I just disassemble everything now and saw that the lower motor is faulty. It is much weaker than the other and is burning smell. I really need another motor. I think that toasted!!

Would you tell me the complete specifications of the stock motor then I can search anything here. I searched datasheet RS-555 24v but not found. I can easily get a pair of new motors of the logitech G27. Do these motors would be good? It would be an interesting alternative? Here in this forum at the end of the page are the motors specifications

https://www.lfsforum.net/showthread.php?t=66336
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The motor in your link is not the same as the motor in the CSW and Elite. The CSW/Elite motor is a Mabuchi RS555PH-22130. I have been unable to find them outside of Fanatec warranty. If you know anyone who races radio controlled cars and has a commutator lathe they might be able to take your motor apart and turn the commutator. This ought to fix the problem. RacerXX has apparently had some success doing a repeat water break-in on his motors to get them working better again, but I tried this on 2 separate motors with no success.

The motors I am having made will hopefully be ready in the next couple months, we are still working on prototypes now and making tweaks to find the best mix.
 
presidente001
I just disassemble everything now and saw that the lower motor is faulty. It is much weaker than the other and is burning smell. I really need another motor. I think that toasted!!
Click to expand...


So the smell you were asking about is coming from one of the motor, not the belt as you thought originally?

Just a quick note about the water break in, I have found out that it will increase the motor performance, but most likely at the expense of the motor life expectancy. See source below. I am no expert, but wanted anyone to be aware of all angles.
eKretz, what his your electric motor manufacturer recommending on that aspect?

water break in
 
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Cote Dazur
So the smell you were asking about is coming from one of the motor, not the belt as you thought originally?

Just a quick note about the water break in, I have found out that it will increase the motor performance, but most likely at the expense of the motor life expectancy. See source below. I am no expert, but wanted anyone to be aware of all angles.
eKretz, what his your electric motor manufacturer recommending on that aspect?

water break in
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Like RXX said, it doesn't really have any drawbacks on the motors used in these wheels. The application in your link is a completely different motor with very high amperage draw compared to these FanaBuchis. There is a much higher risk of damage with higher amperage when you run them in water if something goes wrong (electricity conducts where it shouldn't), and again, it's a very good idea to use distilled or reverse osmosis filtered water to do the water break-in, you basically avoid any chance of damage that way. The hard (and they are very hard, I've had 'em apart) brushes and sealed cans on these motors make the water break-in a no-brainer for me.

The motor guys I have talked to pretty much universally suggest water break-ins for sealed can, non-serviceable motors like these. They always have hard brushes to try to lengthen motor life. When you get into high-performance removable endbell motors, then things start to change.
 
Thank you Racer and eKretz for your answer, what youre saying makes sense, thank you for helping the less technical member of the group.:)
 
eKretz
RacerXX has had some good success with using copper tubing wrapped around his motor cans and running water through to cool his motors, I might suggest this approach to you if you want to make some better improvement to your cooling.
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RacerXX
I got rid of that long ago, found a much better way which is quite novel and simple. However for an easy sure-thing cooling most can do, water filled copper is simple and cheap to implement.
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presidente001
Do you have pictures to show us? I was very interested to see the result! THX !!!
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+1

Something I rarely do, but I'm sure I and presidente001 are not alone in wanting to see this, among other things that have been done. Unless of course it's a secret in which case I understand.
 
eKretz
The original motors run at 24V. You should be able to get pretty much any motors you want if you order using the Internet. The main things to look out for are that the motors run on 24VDC, pull about the same stall amperage as stock motors (about 2.5A each for 5 total, or you'll need a different power supply) and that they run a similar RPM as the stock motors (right around 4200 RPM at 24VDC). If possible, get a torque spec before ordering or you won't know if the motors are stronger or weaker than stock. I'm not sure the burning smell is coming from the belt. It's much more likely coming from the motors.

If you want to wait a while, I have a guy working on making some motors that should be just about as good as it will get for a drop-in motor.
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Quite hard to find such motors - if you try not to find Bühler Motors.. Can you recommend any other manufacturer? Bühlers are REALLY hard to get by here..

What do you think about one of the following Paps motors?
http://www.ebmpapst.com/de/products/motors/bci-motors/BCI_motors_detail.php?pID=142249
http://www.ebmpapst.com/de/products/motors/vdc-motors/VDC_motors_detail.php?pID=142217
http://www.ebmpapst.com/de/products/motors/eci-motors/ECI_motors_detail.php?pID=179967
http://www.ebmpapst.com/de/products/motors/bci-motors/BCI_motors_detail.php?pID=142249

I'm not really sure about their specs though. (as in "I don't know if the 2.5A are the stall amperage..)
 
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Carson79
Hi guys, could I use this to do a water break in of my old motors to see if it revives them?
http://www.maplin.co.uk/dc-3-12v-3a-compact-bench-power-supply-96963
Or to just break in a new motor pack.
Thanks
Click to expand...

Yup, that is just a smaller version of what I'm using. You should probably wait and talk to RXX before pulling the trigger on it though, he has had some good luck bringing some stock motors back to life, so you should maybe see if he will recommend a procedure to help you out. I'm not sure what voltage he was running so you might want to find out before buying that power supply in case you need something with a little more power.
 
Thanks Eric, I'll wait. No rush at the min. I don't like the smell of these recently replaced motors. If they get worse I'll be emailing for replacements that I'd like to break in to see if it helps.
 
Sorry to hear that. I always hated when I started feeling something funny with my wheels when I had stock motors. Fanatec like to keep repeating that they just had a bad batch of motors, but it still seems like people who have had their motors replaced with supposedly "new batch" motors are having failures too. I had a pair fail right before I switched to my mod motors. The Bühlers are still going strong with many hours on them and having been overheated many times as well. The stock motors are without doubt a weak point.
 
Well to be fair since I turned down the FFB in game to 7 and adjusted my on wheel settings it seems fine.
But I'm of the opinion I should be able to use the full range of settings without failure lol.
I don't believe it was just one bad batch my wheel was bought last October I think and I'm nearly in double figures for replacement/repairs.
I've been looking for the Bühlers with no joy, but I'll keep looking. I think I could manage taking the old motor pack apart and replacing the motors lol Maybe
 
I agree, if the settings are there then they should be usable. Don't forget that the Bühler motors aren't going to just bolt in; you'd need to have the motor frames and pulleys machined to fit, as well as a better power supply. Probably better to just wait for the motors my motor guy is working on.
 
Ah, and there was me thinking I would just swap the old motors for the new lol.
I might still try to revive this old motor pack with a water break in at some point.
 
Hi All.

After a motor kit replacement at Fanatec, my CSW base developed a bad case of FFB fade.

Hurry up with your Motorkit Replacement, eKretz. 👍

I first tried to reverse the Fan, but that didn't eliminate the problem. It made it better, tho. Could drive 5 min longer before FFB fade step 2.

When I took the motor assembly out, I first noticed that the temp sensor was placed behind the bottom motor. :ouch:
When I removed the bolt the hold the Cooling fins in place, Most of the simply dropped off cause of bad fit and almost no thermal paste :ouch:
When I removed the metal sleeves on the motors, there where no thermal paste on them. :ouch:

Thermal paste on the sleeves, fins adjusted for better fit and Thermal paste on.
Temp sensor relocated between the motors. Extra 80 mm fan mounted on left side to improve airflow. In on left out on right side.

Haven't had a FFB fade yet. Ran iRacing for 2h yesterday, with the BMW wheel and For set to 150. 👍
Not sure it even does FFB fade step 1 anymore.

Shocking to discover how badly and cheap the motor assembly are on such a expensive wheel. German engineering! Yeah right. :dunce:
 
Haha, no kidding! But you must admit that most of the rest of the wheel holds up quite well and is very solid. The German engineered tagline fits very well everywhere except for the motors. And those are Japanese engineered, but China made. I almost wonder if the Chinese maker took any shortcuts that the Japanese engineers wouldn't approve of?

I have found that iRacing is easier on my wheel's motors than any other sim for some reason.
 
eKretz
Haha, no kidding! But you must admit that most of the rest of the wheel holds up quite well and is very solid. The German engineered tagline fits very well everywhere except for the motors. And those are Japanese engineered, but China made. I almost wonder if the Chinese maker took any shortcuts that the Japanese engineers wouldn't approve of?

I have found that iRacing is easier on my wheel's motors than any other sim for some reason.
Click to expand...

Jep, I agree. It is only the motor assembly/quality that are sub-standard, but what about Fanatec quality control? How can they accept such poor enginerring for the rest of their wheel. :confused:
Nothing wrong with the rest of the base. :)

The FFB in iRacing are weak, compared to pCars or RF2. That's the reason i run iRacing with For set to 150. :crazy:
 
Have you adjusted your FFB level in iRacing? It seems like that is a better place to make adjustments, when I checked linearity after adjusting the FOR setting on my wheel it showed some weird things and a lot of non-linear response.
 
eKretz
Have you adjusted your FFB level in iRacing? It seems like that is a better place to make adjustments, when I checked linearity after adjusting the FOR setting on my wheel it showed some weird things and a lot of non-linear response.
Click to expand...

FFB setting in iRacing is set to 40. Min forces set to 10 and I still want more FFB. :dopey:

SHOW ME THE MOTORS!!!
 
MarkoSteinetti
Quite hard to find such motors - if you try not to find Bühler Motors.. Can you recommend any other manufacturer? Bühlers are REALLY hard to get by here..

What do you think about one of the following Paps motors?
http://www.ebmpapst.com/de/products/motors/bci-motors/BCI_motors_detail.php?pID=142249
http://www.ebmpapst.com/de/products/motors/vdc-motors/VDC_motors_detail.php?pID=142217
http://www.ebmpapst.com/de/products/motors/eci-motors/ECI_motors_detail.php?pID=179967
http://www.ebmpapst.com/de/products/motors/bci-motors/BCI_motors_detail.php?pID=142249

I'm not really sure about their specs though. (as in "I don't know if the 2.5A are the stall amperage..)
Click to expand...

Marko, sorry, I overlooked your post. First things first, your first and last link are the same motor. That motor looks like it might be a feasible replacement specifications-wise, but you'd need to contact that company to make sure or try them out yourself. It might be a tight fit at 63mm diameter.

The second link looks pretty incompatible, as it is brushless and runs at 48V, and the third is also a brushless motor, which again won't work.

Edit: actually, I took a second look at the motor in your first link and it won't work if I have correct recollection of German: Anlaufstrom - 17,5A. Stall current of 17.5 amps. That's way too much for a stock power supply, which can only put out 5 amps to both motors.
 
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presidente001
and what about this one:

http://produto.mercadolivre.com.br/...e-continua-dc-12v-24v-arduino-robotica-im-_JM

Is a good deal? What you think?
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If "Corrente de Bloqueia" means stall current then those should work. However, I'd like to draw your attention to the rated torque spec: 200g•cm. this is a bit less than 2N•cm. The Bühlers are rated at 6N•cm. I'm not sure what the stock Mabuchi motors are rated at, as I have been unable to find a datasheet for them and haven't bothered to take measurements.
 
eKretz
If "Corrente de Bloqueia" means stall current then those should work. However, I'd like to draw your attention to the rated torque spec: 200g•cm. this is a bit less than 2N•cm. The Bühlers are rated at 6N•cm. I'm not sure what the stock Mabuchi motors are rated at, as I have been unable to find a datasheet for them and haven't bothered to take measurements.
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Well, I'm thinking of buying them at least to replace the motor that is bad while I wait for better motors. I think I'll try them.
 
Before you do, you might want to check shaft diameter and nose pilot diameter, as well as mounting bolt size and spacing. If you have the capability to do your own machine work this is trivial, but if not, it's something else to consider.
 
eKretz
Before you do, you might want to check shaft diameter and nose pilot diameter, as well as mounting bolt size and spacing. If you have the capability to do your own machine work this is trivial, but if not, it's something else to consider.
Click to expand...

Yes, yes, I have tools to make adjustments if necessary. Sometimes I usually do good adaptations, kkkkkk. But I believe that the measures are the same. When I get home I will confirm.
 
eKretz
Edit: actually, I took a second look at the motor in your first link and it won't work if I have correct recollection of German: Anlaufstrom - 17,4A. Stall current of 17.4 amps. That's way too much for a stock power supply, which can only put out 5 amps to both motors.
Click to expand...

Anlaufstrom = Start-up Current. :)

On the hyperlinks to the right, Datenblatt = Specifications. :P

Motor.JPG
 
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Yes, that's right...anlaufen=begin. Oops. Oh well, start-up current is equal to or lower than stall current, so it won't work either way. Yup, already found the Datenblatt, that's where I got the 17.5A figure.
 
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