Fidel Castro Dead

killerjimbag
Would you like to elaborate on what,if anything, the Cuban education system has done that has benefitted it's country?
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If you believe that well-educated citizens benefit your country then the anwer is "lots". There's a good UNESCO report on the country's education too, I'll look for a link later.

Dhalism
Lets see if that can sustained in post-Fidel Cuba.
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Surely the last decade has effectively been post-Fidel Cuba?
 
Interludes' response was on point. Cuba's government isn't in any immediate danger of collapsing into strife or being overthrown or even really changing much at all now that the Castro is dead since a Castro is still in power and has been running things much the same for 8 years now.
 
Imari
I find it shocking how many people are openly glorifying in the death of another human being.

Hell, on the scale of worldwide atrocities he's not even particularly far up the list of horrendous dictators. It's funny how media perception makes all the difference to people's reactions. Castro is a "bad guy", says the news, so we should all be happy that he's dead.

Sickening. It's days like this I'm sorry I'm part of the human race.
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I didn't shed any tears over Kim Jong Il, Chairman Mao, Idi Amin, Leonid Brezhnev or Saddam Hussein either, all of whom have died in my lifetime. Personally I don't know anyone that has either. The list of people I'm glad are dead is pretty long. Kind of makes me glad I'm part of the human race.
 
Imari
I find it shocking how many people are openly glorifying in the death of another human being.

Hell, on the scale of worldwide atrocities he's not even particularly far up the list of horrendous dictators. It's funny how media perception makes all the difference to people's reactions. Castro is a "bad guy", says the news, so we should all be happy that he's dead.

Sickening. It's days like this I'm sorry I'm part of the human race.
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Agreed.

In no way do you have to like the guy, but doesn't cheering for a person's death make you a poor human, the very thing he was accused of being, the reason millions despise him?

It makes us no better than him IMO.
 
I Disagree, he died of old age.

But the people that died under him where murdered.

If he was Murdered fair enough that Is bad, but you can not come and say oh your just as bad as a Murderer by cheering his natural death.
 
GranTurismo guy
Agreed.

In no way do you have to like the guy, but doesn't cheering for a person's death make you a poor human, the very thing he was accused of being, the reason millions despise him?

It makes us no better than him IMO.
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Really, so a guy that did what I already stated, in this thread to other humans is on par with a person that smiles at his death or says good riddance? That is the most asinine thing I think I've seen yet on the forum. I've never once tried to take away the rights of my fellow human, the simple concept of human rights and all being equal to them is something I will always believe in. And a reason I take history and politics serious. To be said to be as bad as a guy who murdered, impoverished, stole, drove people out of their homeland and on and on, is inane in any form of logical thought. Especially just because someone isn't willing to mourn or acknowledge any peace to the death of said person...just wow.

This conversation is nearly on the level of those who debate for and against the death penalty.
 
LMSCorvetteGT2
Really, so a guy that did what I already stated, in this thread to other humans is on par with a person that smiles at his death or says good riddance? That is the most asinine thing I think I've seen yet on the forum. I've never once tried to take away the rights of my fellow human, the simple concept of human rights and all being equal to them is something I will always believe in. And a reason I take history and politics serious. To be said to be as bad as a guy who murdered, impoverished, stole, drove people out of their homeland and on and on, is inane in any form of logical thought. Especially just because someone isn't willing to mourn or acknowledge any peace to the death of said person...just wow.

This conversation is nearly on the level of those who debate for and against the death penalty.
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Tit for tat. "I can say horrible stuff about someone because they were horrible first".

You're misunderstanding me. I am aware that most of users on this site, and the people outside of it, probably have not been responsible for millions of deaths. My comparison is not to the murder count, but the thought. People are very happy someone has died. That is cruel, regardless of the nature of the person. And it's not like the guy was still a threat to mankind up to his death either. At that point, he was just an old man with an evil history in his past. He posed no additional danger to anyone should he have not died two days ago. Maybe you think him being dead is justice? I'm sure it will really change the lives of those he affected.

If he died by assassination during his rule, that would be a reason to celebrate. But that would be for the people saved from his tyranny, him dying in itself would not be ultimate achievement.

As it is his death brought nothing positive. Unless your idea of positive is an old man that committed irreversible evils that no longer can and is no longer a threat is dead. Sounds like pretty poor humanity to me.
 
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TenEightyOne
If you believe that well-educated citizens benefit your country then the anwer is "lots". There's a good UNESCO report on the country's education too, I'll look for a link later.

Yes my country invented insulin,the telephone,

Surely the last decade has effectively been post-Fidel Cuba?
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TenEightyOne
If you believe that well-educated citizens benefit your country then the anwer is "lots". There's a good UNESCO report on the country's education too, I'll look for a link later.



Surely the last decade has effectively been post-Fidel Cuba?
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Yeah we invented these things.
https://www.timetoast.com/timelines/top-canadian-inventions

Here is Cuba'so great inventions to mankind.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Cuban_inventions
 
GranTurismo guy
Tit for tat. "I can say horrible stuff about someone because they were horrible first".
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Sure if you want to leave it to a remark that is tossed at school kids fighting, that's all you. When we're talking about people who destroy the human rights and freedom of others...you might actually want to show up with something more. And finally it's not even the same, if I or anyone else did even a sliver of what Castro had and said what we did, then I could understand your sentiment, but since that's not the case it's just asinine rhetoric.

You're misunderstanding me. I am aware that probably of users on this site, and the people outside of it, have not been responsible for millions of deaths. My comparison is not to the murder count, but the thought. People are very happy someone has died. That is cruel, regardless of the nature of the person. And it's not like the guy was still a threat to mankind up to his death either. At that point, he was just an old man with an evil history in his past. He posed no additional danger to anyone should he have not died two days ago. Maybe you think him being dead is justice? I'm sure this will really change the lives of those he affected.
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The thought isn't what people are cheering, it's the fact that he was a dictator that destroyed lives in various ways, and now he's gone. A blight on humanity is forever gone and people can be glad, either those who directly suffered or those who saw it as I've drawn out.

If he died by assassination during his rule, that would be a reason to celebrate. But surely that would be for the people saved from his tyranny, him dying in itself would not be ultimate achievement.
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Sure it would

As it is his death brought nothing positive. Unless your idea of positive is an old man that committed irreversible evils that no longer can and is no longer a threat is dead. Sounds like pretty poor humanity to me.
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It brought closure to those who's families suffered under him and overall to humanity. Seems positive to me, with any one who has done just as bad of things and then ceases to exist.
 
Tornado
Was Fidel Castro a race car all along?
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Umm what? No, in the context of this thread he is a subject you should be able to discuss without yet again resorting to slighting the people you are disgreeing with. See also: All other threads. That's how adults discuss things, or at least the majority of other adults in these forums. There's no need for the constant personal attacks and pissant little comments, which seem only to be an attempt to belittle people, as well as disgree with them.

I see it very infrequently from other people but on a regular basis from you, so I was just requesting you try to discuss things more maturely, and be less aggressive. Why you don't ever seem to be reprimanded for it is beyond me, but that's up to the admins of course.
 
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killerjimbag
There is no closure,when your children drowned fleeing your country. Think about it!
Sorry should be addressed to LMS.
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Not sure why it should be addressed to me, and what the point of it would. While it may not ever be something people can let go of, they can be glad that the individual is gone. Would it have been nice if he'd gone the way of Bin Laden? Sure. However, the point does stand that people are clearly finding closure in it, especially after videos and interviews have been posted of Cubans showing it. @GranTurismo guy take what you will from this.
 
LMSCorvetteGT2
they can be glad that the individual is gone.
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This is way more to fault with human emotion than humans individually, but that's happiness from a petty feeling of revenge. Which is why I am skeptical that deaths of responsible parties does anything to help victims anyway.
 
GranTurismo guy
This is way more to fault with human emotion than humans individually, but that's happiness from a petty feeling of revenge. Which is why I am skeptical that deaths of responsible parties does anything to help victims anyway.
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That's your personal view, I'm arguing the overall sentiment of people being glad. There is nothing wrong with it, if you personally feel that people shouldn't be happy based on what you see is a revenge like mentality that's something else. It may never change the event but people can find some comfort out of it.
 
LMSCorvetteGT2
That's your personal view, I'm arguing the overall sentiment of people being glad. There is nothing wrong with it, if you personally feel that people shouldn't be happy based on what you see is a revenge like mentality that's something else. It may never change the event but people can find some comfort out of it.
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If they can I'm with you. But, as I questioned before, do they?
 
Tyger
Umm what? No, in the context of this thread he is a subject you should be able to discuss without yet again resorting to slighting the people you are disgreeing with.
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The entire first two pages of this thread was people throwing digs at each other, including a couple of F bombs thrown around. The moderation staff then stepped in and gave warnings. So imagine my surprise when twelve hours have passed and the discussion has resumed that only then do you decide to wander in and single out a specific post to grace us all with a lecture on proper posting behavior.


Hence the comment.

Tyger
That's how adults discuss things, or at least the majority of other adults in these forums.
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I wouldn't think most adults would choose to publicly vent out their frustrations about losing internet arguments in the automotive subforum by derailing a discussion in the politics subforum because you don't like a member.

Tyger
Why you don't ever seem to be reprimanded for it is beyond me, but that's up to the admins of course.
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If it bothers you so much, feel perfectly free to report posts instead of having a public whine fest.




Anything else? Something on topic, perhaps?
 
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GranTurismo guy
It's not something I expect you to know. That wasn't my intention.
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Okay I'll ask again, what is the point of repeated asking? I've already demonstrated that the rejoice of many Cubans in Little Havana is proof of some sort of closure, be it direct, cultural, or glad for human kind who is to say but clearly it's real and warranted based on the individual in question.
 
LMSCorvetteGT2
Okay I'll ask again, what is the point of repeated asking? I've already demonstrated that the rejoice of many Cubans in Little Havana is proof of some sort of closure, be it direct, cultural, or glad for human kind who is to say but clearly it's real and warranted based on the individual in question.
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You've said multiple times that you believe that closure can be achieved by people through Castro's death. I questioned if that's truly so because I am skeptical of it, and because it's something that isn't certain and universal with people. I wasn't expecting a definitive answer.
 
GranTurismo guy
You've said multiple times that you believe that closure can be achieved by people through Castro's death. I questioned if that's truly so because I am skeptical of it, and because it's something that isn't certain and universal with people. I wasn't expecting a definitive answer.
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Okay then I see the context you were trying to achieve just a question in general not direct, that's fine I understand and apologize for pressing you further. And will just hark back to what I said, you personally believe it isn't so or proven, I agree it isn't proven but is a viable explanation and use what is currently going on in Cuban communities as proof.
 
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Tornado
The entire first two pages of this thread was people throwing digs at each other, including a couple of F bombs thrown around. The moderation staff then stepped in and gave warnings. So imagine my surprise when twelve hours have passed and the discussion has resumed that only then do you decide to wander in and single out a specific post to grace us all with a lecture on proper posting behavior.
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Inaccurate, on a number of levels. I saw a couple of users calling each other out over perceived ignorance which then fizzled out. Then you "waded in" with a typically personal comment aimed at one person, when it could have been a mildly amusing offhand remark if it was aimed at Castro/Guevara T-shirt wearers in general, rather than directly at another user who is entitled to their opinion as much as anyone else. That's the difference, every time.

I responded a couple of pages in because that's when I read the thread. I believe that is within the rules? I'm not aware of some sort of restriction on when one can respond to earlier comments, particularly when it was made only around a day ago.

And "grace us all with a lecture"? Not at all, merely a couple of lines requesting you stop making nasty, personal belittling remarks and insults aimed at other users in otherwise mature discussions. These aren't video games where you feel the need to score some sort of takedown. Have some respect for other people, please.
 
Rage Racer
To be honest, I'm not a communist or a leftist or something, but the man deserves respect IMO. He was a symbol of an era. People in his country adored him (not all, though). Despite of being threatened by CIA repeatedly, he stood against a superpower close by and kept his country independent. Strong man who lived a strong life.
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Are we talking about Castro or one of those wild North Korean leaders? Seem to be a repeating pattern among these kind of leaders.
 
Tyger
Inaccurate, on a number of levels. I saw a couple of users calling each other out over perceived ignorance which then fizzled out. Then you "waded in" with a typically personal comment aimed at one person, when it could have been a mildly amusing offhand remark if it was aimed at Castro/Guevara T-shirt wearers in general, rather than directly at another user who is entitled to their opinion as much as anyone else. That's the difference, every time.

I responded a couple of pages in because that's when I read the thread. I believe that is within the rules? I'm not aware of some sort of restriction on when one can respond to earlier comments, particularly when it was made only around a day ago.

And "grace us all with a lecture"? Not at all, merely a couple of lines requesting you stop making nasty, personal belittling remarks and insults aimed at other users in otherwise mature discussions. These aren't video games where you feel the need to score some sort of takedown. Have some respect for other people, please.
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So that's a "no", then.
 
Dhalism
So why not address the main point of my post or what killerjimbag said.
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I have. killerjimbag asked what good has come out of a communist country; I pointed out that their healthcare system is one of the best in the world.
 
prisonermonkeys
I pointed out that their healthcare system is one of the best in the world.
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Is it though? It seems like there's a bunch of conflicting evidence regarding that. There doctors may or may not be good, but Cuba exports many of them to various other countries in exchange of money and goods. Cuban doctors are also limited in the amount of information they can get from the Western world, which includes research and other peer reviewed studies which doesn't help.

From everything I've read their primary care is pretty good, but as far as specialists go they are lagging behind. Their advance treatments and surgical services aren't exactly state-of-the-art either.

Here's a first hand account of someone who actually went to a Cuban hospital: https://panampost.com/belen-marty/2...tals-that-castro-doesnt-want-tourists-to-see/
 
GranTurismo guy
You've said multiple times that you believe that closure can be achieved by people through Castro's death. I questioned if that's truly so because I am skeptical of it, and because it's something that isn't certain and universal with people. I wasn't expecting a definitive answer.
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Yes, many people get closure from death. I've had conversations with many people who have had family members raped and murdered and nearly all of them expressed relief and comfort as well as finally feeling closure after the person who did it has either been executed or killed.

As far as those celebrating the death of someone being as bad as the person who actually committed those crimes, that is a completely ridiculous statement to make. I often celebrate death because I often deal with some of the most vile human beings in society. If you ever come across the body of a brutally beaten and battered child maybe you'll have a better understanding. The world is far better off without the kind of people that will do that and I have no problem with the fact that it brightens my day when I hear someone like that is no longer with us. If you think that makes me as bad as the person who committed a crime like that, I'd say you're crazy.
 

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