FITT - Federation of International Tuners and Test-Drivers

[Pete05]

Instead of Bathurst, maybe Silverstone International, short but interesting to run.

V8 ( limit to 1990-present ) CS tire, 500PP max - no supercharger upgrades allowed - Silverstone International
6 cylinders ( limit to 1980-2000 ) CM tire, 480PP max - turbo allowed - Fuji Speedway F or Nurburgring GP/D
4 cylinders ( limit to 1950-1970 ) CH tire, 390PP max - turbo allowed - Rome or Motegi East/West

Just my recommendation.

Yeah this is a totally different concept to what I had planned.
I'm looking for closer gaps between the classes. More power + less grip, less power + more grip.

 

[DolHaus]

That's the idea I want to refine.

At Bathurst in the 60's, 1966 to be precise, the Mini Cooper S won because a V8 would eat it's tyres & brakes. Obviously the lighter the car, the softer rubber they could wear and therefore lap closer to a more powerful but heavier car.

You'd have to put a lot of thought into car selection, the David and Goliath thing is somewhat hard to do and tire wear is unreliable at best.

 

[Motor City Hami]

With the popularity of the last few FITT tuner challenges, we may want to limit the number of classes and tracks in the next one. @Otaliema 's challenge has three classes and six tracks. The testers might feel a bit of burnout after that one.

I was thinking this for the next one.
Two classes.
One track for each class.
Tuners can only join one class.

I love the idea of using classics. Where does 1967 and older put us? Is that early enough to rid the class of the Camaro and C3 Corvettes?

 

[Pete05]

With the popularity of the last few FITT tuner challenges, we may want to limit the number of classes and tracks in the next one. @Otaliema 's challenge has three classes and six tracks. The testers might feel a bit of burnout after that one.

I was thinking this for the next one.
Two classes.
One track for each class.
Tuners can only join one class.

I love the idea of using classics. Where does 1967 and older put us? Is that early enough to rid the class of the Camaro and C3 Corvettes?

What about 3 classes at the one track?
I was thinking of having an eligible cars list to choose from and, no C3 or Camaros available.

I had all this written down on paper but do you think I can find it now.....

 

[dad9699]

There is a FITT contest running at the moment, the sign up and tuning portion is over and we are currently in the test driving phase. If you would like to participate as a test driver to give lap times and feedback then I'm sure you are welcome.
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/thre...ing-commence-results-due-by-june-18th.308790/
They are always posted in the tuning forum, keep an eye out for the FITT name in the title threads.

The next contest hasn't been thought up yet but if you keep an eye on this thread then you will know when the next one is happening. 👍

Thank you very much hope to be testing next time

 

[DolHaus]

With the popularity of the last few FITT tuner challenges, we may want to limit the number of classes and tracks in the next one. @Otaliema 's challenge has three classes and six tracks. The testers might feel a bit of burnout after that one.

I was thinking this for the next one.
Two classes.
One track for each class.
Tuners can only join one class.

I love the idea of using classics. Where does 1967 and older put us? Is that early enough to rid the class of the Camaro and C3 Corvettes?

Yeah good thinking, could probably do with a more simplified event after the more complicated recent events.
I didn't notice any bogey cars (faster than they should be) pre '67, I have a feeling the 300 SL might be a bit quick but I've not driven it in 6.

Thank you very much hope to be testing next time

No worries. You can sign up as a tester in the current contest if you want, I think there is still 10 days left to get it done. Only the tuning section of the contest is closed, always room for more testers.


I have an idea for another contest but I think I'll save it for a while and work out the finer details as I would like to throw a random element of balancing in similar to what @Otaliema has done in the current one.

 

[Otaliema]

With the popularity of the last few FITT tuner challenges, we may want to limit the number of classes and tracks in the next one. @Otaliema 's challenge has three classes and six tracks. The testers might feel a bit of burnout after that one.

That did cross my mind as I was testing for this challenge. That's the reason the tracks are all around about a minute lap time to keep driving time down. I do agree though a shorter challenge next would be a good idea.

Yeah good thinking, could probably do with a more simplified event after the more complicated recent events.

👍 Agreed

I have an idea for another contest but I think I'll save it for a while and work out the finer details as I would like to throw a random element of balancing in similar to what @Otaliema has done in the current one.

Finding a balancing element is harder than it sounds, finding a track right level of weather (if thats the choice) etc takes allot of testing. As grip level changes depending on just about everything in the game.

A david and golith battle would be interesting but the balancing element in that Tire/brake wear is not a viable option right now except for online which makes testing harder to do. Changing the tires to harder compounds for more powerful cars would help balance but would be a stress on the testers so a shorter track would be a major boost to that one. Also one thing is that with no brake and tire wear out in arcade mode the track would have to be a short techincal track to give the smaller car a fighting chance.

 

[Bowtie-muscle]

Please keep in mind what PD does. Most of those classic cars are modeled with correct bias-ply tires, but occasionally they will throw radial tires on the model giving an advantage in handling.

 

[Pete05]

@Otaliema
@Bowtie-muscle

I agree with you guys. I'd love to do the David v Goliath thing but it's proving a lot harder than handing out a tyre/grip level.

 

[brian wolf]

How about a senna tribute competition? F3 at Brands Indy 80`s and 97t at cote d`azur?

 

[Otaliema]

How about a senna tribute competition? F3 at Brands Indy 80`s and 97t at cote d`azur?

Tunning the cars better than what they are at now would be very very hard. could be fun tho.

@Otaliema
@Bowtie-muscle

I agree with you guys. I'd love to do the David v Goliath thing but it's proving a lot harder than handing out a tyre/grip level.

Keep at it. I planned most of the STi vs Evo challenge for 6 weeks before I proposed it. And still revamped it after the initial proposal, and over the next 4 weeks working with @Motor City Hami and @DigitalBaka

 

[DolHaus]

Quick question for the Americans - Do you guys do hill climb events? (Sprint style events involving narrow twisty tracks) If so, what are the best/most popular home grown cars? (American only, no imports)
As an example, over here in blighty we use FFs such as the original Mini or FR roadsters such as the Triumph Spitfire, in Japan the popular choices would be Levin AE86's or first gen Civics (touge cars). what would be the american equivalent? (both modern and classics)

 

[Otaliema]

Quick question for the Americans - Do you guys do hill climb events? (Sprint style events involving narrow twisty tracks) If so, what are the best/most popular home grown cars? (American only, no imports)
As an example, over here in blighty we use FFs such as the original Mini or FR roadsters such as the Triumph Spitfire, in Japan the popular choices would be Levin AE86's or first gen Civics (touge cars). what would be the american equivalent? (both modern and classics)

We do them not sure what are the most popular tho one of the big ones is the pikes peak hill climb can look that one up see what's used there.

 

[DolHaus]

We do them not sure what are the most popular tho one of the big ones is the pikes peak hill climb can look that one up see what's used there.

I imagined you would, sort of an entry level motor sport across the world (Except for Holland perhaps, they don't have hills lol). I thought of Pikes Peak but I've never really understood what kind of race it is (rally/tarmac/pro/amateur etc), should probably do some research and see who runs what cars there.

 

[Otaliema]

I imagined you would, sort of an entry level motor sport across the world (Except for Holland perhaps, they don't have hills lol). I thought of Pikes Peak but I've never really understood what kind of race it is (rally/tarmac/pro/amateur etc), should probably do some research and see who runs what cars there.

To answer your question about pikes peak it's all of the above. from weekend warrior to factory sponsored drivers. they are in the process of paving the road to the summit so it's 3/4 tarmac with the top 1/4 being dirt still.

 

[DolHaus]

To answer your question about pikes peak it's all of the above. from weekend warrior to factory sponsored drivers. they are in the process of paving the road to the summit so it's 3/4 tarmac with the top 1/4 being dirt still.

Ahh gotcha, seen some footage from it but never watched an event, not really a fan of watching time attack things, much prefer a race.

 

[Woodski_427]

@Otaliema
@Bowtie-muscle
I agree with you guys. I'd love to do the David v Goliath thing but it's proving a lot harder than handing out a tyre/grip level.

I'd had a similar idea to this, but have never looked into it seriously. I was struck when I saw a Goodwood Revival race with historic (British) Touring Cars - there was a great battle between a Jag and a Mini. However, the race was easily won by a big V8 Galaxy or Falcon.

Anyway, just to throw in my 2 pence, I think there is potential in this. Although as others have pointed out, the right track and a lot of testing will be necessary.

I like to use small, low powered cars a lot, and as I'm sure you know low weight has a high level of 'weighting' in the PP calculation that doesn't translate to the track. I think it is likely that to keep things even, you won't be able to use a single PP level; you could have two pp levels (eg small cars at 430, large cars at 400), or two sets of weight/power limits. The more open the track, and the longer the straights, the wider the performance difference will need to be.

You could use this with your tyre grade differential idea, so you have closer performance limits and maybe use one tyre grade difference which would be less frustrating to test.

 

[Otaliema]

Ahh gotcha, seen some footage from it but never watched an event, not really a fan of watching time attack things, much prefer a race.

You should check out outlaw racing. small cars with giant wings (like the size of the car) dirt track doing 80-100+mph around. It's a controlled drift race with 20 cars at the same time.
I used to watch F1 but thats nothing more than a TT with 20 cars anymore it's near impossible to pass now in F1 due to car design restrictions. I know it's for safety but seriously 90% of the races the race finishes with the top 5 in the same spots.

 

[DolHaus]

You should check out outlaw racing. small cars with giant wings (like the size of the car) dirt track doing 80-100+mph around. It's a controlled drift race with 20 cars at the same time.
I used to watch F1 but thats nothing more than a TT with 20 cars anymore it's near impossible to pass now in F1 due to car design restrictions. I know it's for safety but seriously 90% of the races the race finishes with the top 5 in the same spots.

Yeah I've seen those Outlaw things, they look crazy, do they race them on dirt tracks or ovals?
I hear you with the F1, I hoped it would get better this season with the reduced downforce and turbos but its been just as dull as the last 5yrs. Overtaking only happens in straight lines and pit stops, far too focused on the tactics and technology side of racing. I'll still watch it because its on TV and occasionally you get some real excitement but most of the time its just on in the background. Much rather watch the touring cars take lumps out each other in a real battle for position, no other popular motorsport allows drivers to start in last and have a chance of finishing first.

 

[Otaliema]

Yeah I've seen those Outlaw things, they look crazy, do they race them on dirt tracks or ovals?
I hear you with the F1, I hoped it would get better this season with the reduced downforce and turbos but its been just as dull as the last 5yrs. Overtaking only happens in straight lines and pit stops, far too focused on the tactics and technology side of racing. I'll still watch it because its on TV and occasionally you get some real excitement but most of the time its just on in the background. Much rather watch the touring cars take lumps out each other in a real battle for position, no other popular motorsport allows drivers to start in last and have a chance of finishing first.

Well that can happen with NASCAR but not often.
Outlaw race on dirt ovals most if the time. Its a common amateur race type as well round here where I live. Get a old beat up wagon or sedan slap a roll cage on it and some dirt tires and go!

Has F3 stepped up lately? Last tome I watched a season it was about as bad as F1.

 

[Pete05]

I'd had a similar idea to this, but have never looked into it seriously. I was struck when I saw a Goodwood Revival race with historic (British) Touring Cars - there was a great battle between a Jag and a Mini. However, the race was easily won by a big V8 Galaxy or Falcon.

Anyway, just to throw in my 2 pence, I think there is potential in this. Although as others have pointed out, the right track and a lot of testing will be necessary.

I like to use small, low powered cars a lot, and as I'm sure you know low weight has a high level of 'weighting' in the PP calculation that doesn't translate to the track. I think it is likely that to keep things even, you won't be able to use a single PP level; you could have two pp levels (eg small cars at 430, large cars at 400), or two sets of weight/power limits. The more open the track, and the longer the straights, the wider the performance difference will need to be.

You could use this with your tyre grade differential idea, so you have closer performance limits and maybe use one tyre grade difference which would be less frustrating to test.

I've discovered that for this to work, the PP thing gets thrown out the window
A formula similar to power to weight ratios, tyres and careful selection of circuits is the only way I can see it being a success.

Lots of numbers to crunch

The races I think you're referring to at Goodwood are the St.Mary's Trophy. Fantastic vision & wonderful variety. Remember variety?

 

[Otaliema]

I've discovered that for this to work, the PP thing gets thrown out the window
A formula similar to power to weight ratios, tyres and careful selection of circuits is the only way I can see it being a success.

Lots of numbers to crunch

The races I think you're referring to at Goodwood are the St.Mary's Trophy. Fantastic vision & wonderful variety. Remember variety?

I think specing the cars will be the best option. Tuning to PtWR is unnatural and hard to do I tried with the rally cross class in the current challenge.

Need to find a weight and power for the cars that result on similar lap times for both groups. But also don't set it up so one set is gimped bad and the other has to max out.

 

[Pete05]

I think specing the cars will be the best option. Tuning to PtWR is unnatural and hard to do I tried with the rally cross class in the current challenge.

Need to find a weight and power for the cars that result on similar lap times for both groups. But also don't set it up so one set is gimped bad and the other has to max out.

You've done an excellent job with the current challenge. Kudos

I know I said PP is out the window but to use those numbers as an example, I'm thinking the lower the number, the more freedoms.
It's proving very difficult to find a balance between 4,6 & V8.
Compare Lotus Elan to BMW 507 for example

 

[Bowtie-muscle]

You've done an excellent job with the current challenge. Kudos

I know I said PP is out the window but to use those numbers as an example, I'm thinking the lower the number, the more freedoms.
It's proving very difficult to find a balance between 4,6 & V8.
Compare Lotus Elan to BMW 507 for example

It is not easy setting things up, can get frustrating too. Keep at it.

 

[Pete05]

It is not easy setting things up, can get frustrating too. Keep at it.

Thanks for the support 👍

Not easy when you battle perfectionism & OCD

 

[Ronald6]

Veyron vs Caterham? Mu. Mu ha. Muhahahahahhaaaaaa!

 

[Pete05]

Veyron vs Caterham? Mu. Mu ha. Muhahahahahhaaaaaa!

That comparison at Ascari would be interesting

 

[Ronald6]

That comparison at Ascari would be interesting

Hmmmm, working on it now. I need to buy a Veyron...

 

[DigitalBaka]

A David/Goliath thought without reading the others very carefully...

Pick a target high performance car, such as a GTR, ZR1, etc. and set a time stock/untuned. Then tune a lower level car to match the lap time as close as possible without being too high or low.

 

[Vylkrie]

/
what is the number of the room thats open 24/7?