FM Vs GT - Discussion Thread (read the first post before you post)
- Thread starter Scaff
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Yes.
Because such piss obvious features as the ability to control replays and the ability to save car tunes, both things which had been present in the series since GT3 and had been in other games for years before that, should never have been neglected in the first place.
The game talks up the tuning aspect, and despite being the first full game with standard storage options, you cannot save any tunes whatsoever. The game talks up Photomode, but actually getting a photo in a replay basically comes down to luck because you have no ability outside of reflexes to get the photo you want unless you restart the replay from the beginning. Even if GT3 and GT4 didn't have this stuff to hold over GT5's head, it is still ridiculous that either thing is missing; because this is 2010 and it isn't as if either of these things are bold new concepts.
Crap like that is exactly why GT5 is so constantly referred to as being two steps forward and one step back (and variations on that theme).
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Odd..because when I drive, this is the view I get:
I see my left mirror, rear view mirror wheel, a pillars, wipers, top of ip and hood.
I see my left mirror, rear view mirror wheel, a pillars, wipers, top of ip and hood.
vandaliser
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The ring on FM4 is just unrealistic. Apart from the track looking wider than usual, the elevation changes look off to me. That shiny cartoony look is also still present.
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How did everyone get the full game already to know how the Ring is?
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- Vaxxtx
- Vaxxtx
Good question.
shintastic48
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- shiny48
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Don't feel like keeping what I replied to going any further.
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shintastic48
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That F10 video better be an AI. cause that driving was pretty poor.
I've never driven the Nordschleife in person. But the Forza model of it seems narrow enough. Just I feel like the radius of the corners is all off. Maybe that's just me, or maybe that's just the perspective I got.
I've never driven the Nordschleife in person. But the Forza model of it seems narrow enough. Just I feel like the radius of the corners is all off. Maybe that's just me, or maybe that's just the perspective I got.
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- 713
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Loving the F1 on the 24h Nurb layout.. (The sun is crap and the audio is wet, but DANG!!!)
I saw a description of GT5 in the FM4 eurogamer review, 'flawed genius'.. and video's like that show the genius..
End of the day, if watching replays is what stop's you 'leaving' the game (Not sure why you need to leave the game, there are no monogamy laws about games
) then obviously stick with it, but it doesn't do much for me (In the same way, Autovista in FM isn't a compelling feature for me)..
I saw a description of GT5 in the FM4 eurogamer review, 'flawed genius'.. and video's like that show the genius..
End of the day, if watching replays is what stop's you 'leaving' the game (Not sure why you need to leave the game, there are no monogamy laws about games
) then obviously stick with it, but it doesn't do much for me (In the same way, Autovista in FM isn't a compelling feature for me)..
- 4,004
- Croatia
OK, I will now write few things which will be lost in this thread in about few pages but nevermind, I love my scribomanicism during morning coffee.
Nurburgring Nordchleife in Forza series is not inaccurate because of Turn10, but because of Bizzare Creations. However, it is 100% Turn10's blame that they didn't took any time to actually fix the inaccuracies for their *simulation* game.
As many probably do not know, Turn10 is using Nurburgring track-model created by Bizzare Creations for their Project Gotham series. Bizzare created the original mesh for their PGR2 and premiered the actual circuit on the consoles. Contrary to usual belief it was PGR2 that initially introduced The Green Hell to console public in 2003, to be followed by Polyphony Digital's much more accurate representation initially shown in promotional-disc for BMW Series 1, months prior to GT4 release (that same model will be used in GT4).
Usual collaboration among Microsoft Games studios since gave Turn10 an easy way to introduce Nordschelife in Forza Motorsport 2. When you take side-by-side replays of PGR2 and FM2 Nordschelife you will easily see it is the exact same model.
Bizzare intentionally opted to make Nurburgring wider, less sloped and easier to drive because of overall logic of their Gotham series in order to make core of their gameplay mechanic more accessible. Problem is that Turn10 actually just took the mesh and designed the visual around it, without correction of the original mesh. And through all these years, they're just reusing that same mesh all-over-again. Nordschleife model in Forza 4 in 2011 is still the same basic model used in Project Gotham 2 in 2003.
I am really disappointed because of it. You can call me elitist, bash on me or whatever, but I really can't understand why they insist to continue that questionable praxis for last 5 years. What is even more ridiculous is they really have the budget size of mountain and they pay 3 outsourced-companies to model the tracks for them (Rabcat and Acme are doing only cars).
And as I have already said elsewhere, it it really beyond my comprehension that Turn10 travelled all the way to Switzerland - and the main track-design guy was also there - in order to took assets and design the Bernese Alps track, which is 100% fictional track. But they didn't travel few hundred kilometres more to neighbouring Germany in order to take assets and correct the Nurburgring Nordschelife.
And in this same universe, Takuro Eika and his 3 (three) members of track team did one of the best virtualization when actual track-model is concerned for Konami's Enthusia Professional Racing in 2005 with budget probably laughable compared to one available to Turn 10.
I don't know, I really think that they simply do not care. After all this years and all time I've spent playing Forza games, I really think they simply just don't give a F.
EDITED: And to be 100% clear and avoid possible misinterpretations - some changes to the Bizzare mesh have been done through the past, mostly related to the width, but the track configuration - lateral and elevation - have remained almost the same since 2003.
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Lain
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Yeah, it's pretty sad that Enthusia still has a better Nurburgring than Forza.
And before everyone gets all "how did you get the full game?" on me, I'm just basing this off the fact that, so far, it appears to be the same as it was in Forza 3.
But now that I know their mesh came from PGR2, it all makes sense.
And before everyone gets all "how did you get the full game?" on me, I'm just basing this off the fact that, so far, it appears to be the same as it was in Forza 3.
But now that I know their mesh came from PGR2, it all makes sense.
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- spagetti69
Didn't know it was based of PGR. That would make sense.
The PGR was even wider though to my memory. Like a runway.
If that's the case T10 must have narrowed it a bit.
I'm going from memory.
The PGR was even wider though to my memory. Like a runway.
If that's the case T10 must have narrowed it a bit.
I'm going from memory.
shintastic48
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- shiny48
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Thinking about it, there is a plausible, simple answer, priorities..
Since they produce a game every 2 years, it's been clear that they massively struggle to get new tracks modelled in that time.. we've had only a handful of new tracks each time, and this time, they've even had to drop a track or two.. I'm confident in saying, track wise, they are resource limited massively..
So, whilst they could have re-visited the NS etc (Who knows, maybe they have), any work done on that track would have meant 1 less new track being added to the game.. And for a game struggling with track count, 2+2 most probably = new tracks have a higher priority then re-visting old tracks..
I wouldn't underestimate the work involved either, I'd imagine it's as much or more work then modelling a small track from scratch, because to fix the nurb, they'd need some good geometric/gps data and all the photo assets..
You like to claim people 'bash' you over these things, but to my mind, it's obvious why Silverstone/NS and others are left as-was, and I can't fathom how any sensible person can come to the conclusion that T10 don't give a F, when if they gave us no new tracks, that would be seen as a massive issue
And for all we know, they could be working on a new NS in the background, your rationale seems to be based on your own negative assumptions.. We do know for instance that 2 tracks at least are being worked on but wheren't finished in time, or planned for DLC/Next game.. (BadNed has let this slip)..
I personally still don't understand why there isn't a company that laser scans all the tracks in the world, does 3DS models (or whatever) and provides all the image assets etc, and sells these to all the games companies, so everyone gets higher quality tracks much easier.. This way we'd have a lot more tracks in GT/FM etc..
Maybe we need to set up such a business..
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shintastic48
Doesn't make sense to me. PD are also using previous assets.
shintastic48
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- shiny48
They do? I figured Kaz was so "Ignorant" that he wouldn't use anything from any other games. In all seriousness though. What game could he take from? Every other racing game on PS3 is garbo compared to GT.
MagpieRacer
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Previous assets, as in GT4 car models etc.
shintastic48
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So that's an invalid argument then. Because i'm sure that T10 uses stuff from FM3.
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GT4 tracks, etc.. pretty much this.
Borrowing itself is really not a problem, non-altering the obviously inaccurate asset is, that is why I said I think they just do not care.
I can presume that some track modeller could correct the overall mesh-asset in 2-days work only by looking at Youtube videos and comparing it to asset-output.
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- spagetti69
shintastic48
Maybe it is an invalid argument.
People have claimed it uses assets from pervious gen too.
As for other games being rubbish on PS3.
Dirt 3 is ranked higher than GT on metacritic. Not that I personally agree with that. That's just the general reviews.
Don't think Codies would let them borrow anything though.
Access to track data could be got from studio Liverpool. Aren't they a former Sony studio?
shintastic48
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- shiny48
Yeah, they made Formula 1 Championship Edition. But what tracks would they borrow from that? If you look at the renderings of Suzuka, Indy, and Monaco they are completely different. I think Dirt 3 can't really be related to GT5 or FM. I mean maybe the rally aspect of GT5 but Dirt 3 (haven't played only played original) Is mainly off road/rally. So it's sort of a different spectrum in my opinion.
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Well, one of the accusations that you could level at the Forza series as a standalone is that they are still using some of the models (and tracks) from previous games, complete with innaccuracies.
However in this thread when it is being compared with a game where more than half the content is ported from not only an earlier game, but a previous generation game, it does seem slightly like splitting hairs.
Add to that Forza only has a two year turn around for a new game, rather than the 5 years or so that we had for GT5, and I think in this particular thread it's a bit nitpicky trying to nail Forza for reusing models.
However in this thread when it is being compared with a game where more than half the content is ported from not only an earlier game, but a previous generation game, it does seem slightly like splitting hairs.
Add to that Forza only has a two year turn around for a new game, rather than the 5 years or so that we had for GT5, and I think in this particular thread it's a bit nitpicky trying to nail Forza for reusing models.
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Well, here comes the punchline, be prepared
Apparently, both Dhruva Interactive and GlassEgg, the main studios that are providing almost all of the worldwide track-assets for Forza series are also a main studios that provides track-data for Codemasters recent F1 games and Dirt series
But it has to be noted how genius Dhruva work allowed us for magic of Project Gotham cities, because they made many of them.
Just for the sake of conversation
shintastic48
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- shiny48
Well, here comes the punchline, be prepared
Apparently, both Dhruva Interactive and GlassEgg, the main studios that are providing almost all of the worldwide track-assets for Forza series are also a main studios that provides track-data for Codemasters recent F1 games and Dirt series
But it has to be noted how genius Dhruva work allowed us for magic of Project Gotham cities, because they made many of them.
Just for the sake of conversation
That's really interesting to hear. I wonder how much work Forza actually does then
At least GT seems to get most of there stuff from themselves.Similar threads
