FM Vs GT - Discussion Thread (read the first post before you post)

[NA]

Yeah, some sections are more off than others. ^That section being one of the worst offenders.

 

[prymet1me]

Why are you all arguing about track width in FM3....didnt T10 say the track was wider?

 

[Luminis]

They did. And they also said (I think) that it wasn't just upscaled by x% in general, but that individual sections were widened as they saw fit.

 

[Fredde_swe]

The Ring in FM3 is really bad, and it looks like they use the same Ring in FM4

 

[Bogie 19th]

I haven't seen the full ring in FM4, so I can't comment. Next week I can though.

 

[NA]

Why are you all arguing about track width in FM3....didnt T10 say the track was wider?

They did. And they also said (I think) that it wasn't just upscaled by x% in general, but that individual sections were widened as they saw fit.

Yeah, pretty much what I was getting at, but that is of course going to lead to discussions about which ones are what. Hey, if it passes the time until release for some people.......

 

[prymet1me]

They did. And they also said (I think) that it wasn't just upscaled by x% in general, but that individual sections were widened as they saw fit.

I also think they did....they will keep bickering about FM3 however. All of the video links and etc none of them found the word from T10 about it.

And yes I am too lazy to do it.

 

[phil-t]

Each to their own, I've done countless laps in many games, I've yet to have anything other then a good experience on it..

Or do people's brains actually prevent enjoyment if something isn't quite right? And how does that work when I haven't seen a perfect rendition in any game.. Or is that as long as it's worse then another game, your brain is ok to enjoy the more correct one, even if that game isn't iRacing laser scanned perfection?

And yeah.. we need some crap to discuss until next week!

 

[Luminis]

Well, let them have at it, in my opinion. I mean, I'm a pretty big 'Ring nut myself, so I'm as annoyed by this as anyone can probably be. But, after all, it's just one track that's not accurate. And since it was done for a reason, on purpose... Well, I don't agree with the decision, but I can at least grasp the concept behind it.

Somewhat. And I can enjoy it for what it is. I just don't consider it as an accurate rendition of the 'Ring. More like a fantasy track.

To me, this was probably the biggest issue with FM3, alongside the AWD dominance. And if something like that is the biggest issue to me, I think that's saying a lot...

 

[Bogie 19th]

I would rather have a wider ring than a cardboard PSP cockpit

Too soon?

 

[JDMKING13]

Forget about the width problem whats up with the bumps anybody know if they fixed that?

 

[phil-t]

Forget about the width problem whats up with the bumps anybody know if they fixed that?

They said they'd tweak stuff.. I'll wait and see, they might have..

Just looking at this replay of the Nurb GP, they've clearly upped the effect of bumps on the cars..

http://www.taxigamer.com/forza-motorsport-4/replay/nurburgring-gp-with-a-toyota-gt-one/716

 

[prymet1me]

Well, let them have at it, in my opinion. I mean, I'm a pretty big 'Ring nut myself, so I'm as annoyed by this as anyone can probably be. But, after all, it's just one track that's not accurate. And since it was done for a reason, on purpose... Well, I don't agree with the decision, but I can at least grasp the concept behind it.

Somewhat. And I can enjoy it for what it is. I just don't consider it as an accurate rendition of the 'Ring. More like a fantasy track.

To me, this was probably the biggest issue with FM3, alongside the AWD dominance. And if something like that is the biggest issue to me, I think that's saying a lot...

I will toast to the AWD dominance, I didnt care about leaderboards or racing online for the most part but the PI for AWD was messed up.

 

[chromatic9]

Wow you seriously just dont get it. Look above at the pics I posted.

So when you drive you are telling me you dont see any of your car at all? You dont see the gauges,the windshield, your hands, the dash, the hood or anything else. You magically only see the everything in front of your vehicle?? If you answered yes to any of this then you have clearly never driven in your life, or even rode as a passenger in a car. Or maybe you are blind. Because everyone else in the world sees the interior of their car while driving. Period. If you argue with this you are extremly ignorant to say the least.

Did you play GT5 at all? 800 of the cars had NO interior view aka cockpit view. You could not even pick interior view as an option. Now we have an interior view to pick from in all 1,000 cars in GT5. That is a MASSIVE improvement if you are a person that drives with the inside view. Thats what killed the GT5 standard cars the most. So this is great news.

You cant simulate racing if you are sitting on the hood. Despite what you might think, hood view or bumper cam view does not simulate real life racing.
hood view

bumper view

No man, Bumper cam view is not on the bumper, its just unfortunately called that

If you have a wheel then your own wheel and hands plus the windscreen view is best. When you're sat driving and looking forward, you see a bit of the hood, top of the steering wheel, slight bit of the dashboard. Rendering these in a game looks quite poor and pretty pointless so you get a more complete dashboard and steering wheel, sat right back, its a graphic effect. Only way to simulate driving view is to have many screens rendered separately so when you look down and away from the road you see the wheel and dashboard.

I have a wheel, I don't want to see this

Another problem for many is the wheel animation stops very short while you're still turning and it looks bloody ridiculous.

 

[Luminis]

I will toast to the AWD dominance, I didnt care about leaderboards or racing online for the most part but the PI for AWD was messed up.

Well... Same here, actually. I never really got into that. However, just the thought of my cars not being as good as they coould be if I didn't threw the AWD swap and the Forza aero at them was annoying.

 

[VXR]

That GT5 interior shot sums up why I don't like cockpit view; I can't see that much of my side window as I drive, but I can certainly see the pillar on the other side of the screen in my periphery. Until they have the sense to use point-of-focus with headtracking, then it's simply too bogus for me.

 

[shirakawaa]

That GT5 interior shot sums up why I don't like cockpit view; I can't see that much of my side window as I drive, but I can certainly see the pillar on the other side of the screen in my periphery. Until they have the sense to use point-of-focus with headtracking, then it's simply too bogus for me.

You can adjust the cockpit viewing angle in GT5. The "zoom" setting seems more natural to me.

 

[Fredde_swe]

Each to their own, I've done countless laps in many games, I've yet to have anything other then a good experience on it..

Or do people's brains actually prevent enjoyment if something isn't quite right? And how does that work when I haven't seen a perfect rendition in any game.. Or is that as long as it's worse then another game, your brain is ok to enjoy the more correct one, even if that game isn't iRacing laser scanned perfection?

And yeah.. we need some crap to discuss until next week!

Isn't quite right? It's not accurate at all.

I love hot lapping the Ring and I have spent countless of hours doing it in GT5 and other games. The reason why I enjoy it is because the challenge. The combination of tight corners, blind corners, elevation changes, fast sectors and the bumpiness makes the track awsome. Every lap is a challenge if you are pushing your car to the limit.


By making the track easier you also remove the challenge which makes the track boring.

 

[Bogie 19th]

It must still be a challenge because real life, Forza and GT ring times of the same car are all usually within a second of each other. If it was that easy and that far off, then of course you would be many seconds ahead in Forza. But that isn't the case.

While a turn might be wider, most of us all take the turn in the same spot (fastest spot) and ignore the extra foot or whatever.

 

[Luminis]

By making the track easier you also remove the challenge which makes the track boring.

It's easier for racing. As in, passing opponents and such. It's still not very easy to get good, clean, consistent laps on it. Purely due to its size.

But I agree, it's easier than it should be. It's not the Green Hell, really.

However, speaking about challenges... Fujimi Kaido, now, that is a challenging track to be fast on.

 

[Bogie 19th]

Oh man....Kaido and I do not get along. Probably because of my excessive use of the track trying to get that damn drifting achievement. The Ring is walk in the park compared to Fujimi.

 

[Luminis]

That's why I like it so much. Even a realistic version of the 'Ring is child's play compared to that Took me quite some timme to learn that track somewhat. And I still haven't mastered it, after all that time... It's hard enough to memorize every corner.

Gonna give it another try in FM4 👍

 

[Bogie 19th]

I will race you on Kaido if you give me a 10 minute head start

 

[Fredde_swe]

It's easier for racing. As in, passing opponents and such. It's still not very easy to get good, clean, consistent laps on it. Purely due to its size.

But I agree, it's easier than it should be. It's not the Green Hell, really.

However, speaking about challenges... Fujimi Kaido, now, that is a challenging track to be fast on.

I think Fujimi Kaido is really fun when I'm drifitng but for norma racing and time trial Haven't found the flow yet.

It's the same thing with Rally di Positor and Amalfi. Great tracks for slower cars though.

 

[Luminis]

I will race you on Kaido if you give me a 10 minute head start

Well, a D-Class car does it in nine and a half minutes, you won't need that much of an advantage, trust me

I guess I'll take my sweet time to get somewhat good on it again myself. New physics, new cars... Gotta build another 'Touge Special' first (and import that crappy decal of mine. It may look horrible, but I'm attached to it ), as well.

I think Fujimi Kaido is really fun when I'm drifitng but for norma racing and time trial Haven't found the flow yet.

It's the same thing with Rally di Positor and Amalfi. Great tracks for slower cars though.

Yeah, it's pretty hard to get a proper flow there. If you mess a corner up, you won't hit the next one correctly either, so one mistake can take the flow away completely. I mean, I always liked it better than Amalfi and Positano, simply because it seemed faster than them. It's hard to describe, but when you get into it a bit, it feels a lot more suited to fast driving than Positano and Amalfi, I think. They always seemed like they were made to keep your speed down.

Kaido, on the other hand, allows you to go fast, if you can. I don't know whether that even makes sense... I guess it always just struck a nicer balance between technical corners, nasty suprises and fast driving than any other course.

Ahem, on topic: I think it's obcious which game has the better fantasy tracks, in my eyes.

 

[prymet1me]

Give me 25 minute head start on both of you and u have a challenge!

 

[Luminis]

I guess there'll be some sort of Fujimi Kaido Rivals Mode. I mean, it's the perfect track for that stuff 👍

Maybe I just want to stand a chance against you fast folks somewhere

 

[zr1chris]

I guess there'll be some sort of Fujimi Kaido Rivals Mode. I mean, it's the perfect track for that stuff 👍

Maybe I just want to stand a chance against you fast folks somewhere

I'm thinking there will be a drift event for rivals mode on that track. And if not then there should be.

 

[Vaxxtx]

I will toast to the AWD dominance, I didnt care about leaderboards or racing online for the most part but the PI for AWD was messed up.

Same here. Never messed with the "leaderboard" cars in online. Just had fun with the cars I liked, and it felt awesome winning against a pro using an 04 Civic vs my Javelin in C class.

No man, Bumper cam view is not on the bumper, its just unfortunately called that


If you have a wheel then your own wheel and hands plus the windscreen view is best. When you're sat driving and looking forward, you see a bit of the hood, top of the steering wheel, slight bit of the dashboard. Rendering these in a game looks quite poor and pretty pointless so you get a more complete dashboard and steering wheel, sat right back, its a graphic effect. Only way to simulate driving view is to have many screens rendered separately so when you look down and away from the road you see the wheel and dashboard.

I have a wheel, I don't want to see this

Another problem for many is the wheel animation stops very short while you're still turning and it looks bloody ridiculous.

Bumper cam still far from realistic. Unless you are wonder woman in your invisible car. Its pathetic they did that. Hood cam would have been better than bumper or the new carboard view. At least its a bit more passable.

I totally agree on the hand animations, its bad in GT5 AND FM. Shift2 was the only game that got it right. Set your wheel to 900? You get hand animations for 900. Set it to 360? You get 360 animations.

 

[tribolik]

No man, Bumper cam view is not on the bumper, its just unfortunately called that

If you have a wheel then your own wheel and hands plus the windscreen view is best. When you're sat driving and looking forward, you see a bit of the hood, top of the steering wheel, slight bit of the dashboard. Rendering these in a game looks quite poor and pretty pointless so you get a more complete dashboard and steering wheel, sat right back, its a graphic effect. Only way to simulate driving view is to have many screens rendered separately so when you look down and away from the road you see the wheel and dashboard.

I have a wheel, I don't want to see this

Another problem for many is the wheel animation stops very short while you're still turning and it looks bloody ridiculous.

Well I think this is the only thing GT5 does better... I kind of like the so called bumper view that is infact the view from the head of the driver without the car... because thats the close thing from real life when driving a car... I only see the wheel and dash if I look inside... and the hands in forza are really off IMO... almost like is only driving with thumbs... but I realy dont like cockpit views unless you can take out the wheel and get the FOV really close to the window...

Other than that I think Forza 4 might infact be the better game. (except for the ring)