Food Ethics (Poll)

[Pseudopod]

The point is that there might come a time where the only way the world can produce enough food all the inhabitants is by only growing GMO crops. Yes, to begin with it is for farmers to maximize their yields, but in the end, it is also going to be the only way to get the yields high enough for people not to starve to death.

If you at that point are insisting on eating non-GMO foods, you are actually being selfish. You would be paying people to grow less food than they could have been, in order for you to eat a product that has no proven benefits over higher yield foods, while at the same time limiting the food supply for others.

 

[Johnnypenso]

The point is that there might come a time where the only way the world can produce enough food all the inhabitants is by only growing GMO crops. Yes, to begin with it is for farmers to maximize their yields, but in the end, it is also going to be the only way to get the yields high enough for people not to starve to death.

If you at that point are insisting on eating non-GMO foods, you are actually being selfish. You would be paying people to grow less food than they could have been, in order for you to eat a product that has no proven benefits over higher yield foods, while at the same time limiting the food supply for others.

Any time I make any choice in my own self interest I'm being selfish so your point is moot. The marketplace will determine who gets what food and for what price. One could easily argue that by supporting my local farmers as I like to do, I'm putting consumer level sales revenue directly into their pockets and supporting smaller, local farms and making them sustainable. This keeps money in the community and helps to support local families instead of some nameless, faceless corporation I have zero connection to.

 

[Joey D]

I eat what I want, but I prefer stuff that's more natural than processed but that's just for health reasons. Plus natural stuff tastes better to me and doesn't make me feel sluggish. I suppose liquor and beer are processed, but I think it's unethical not to drink it because those grains laid down their life for the tastiness that is alcohol.

One thing that I do believe strongly in though is that if you hunt something you better be using all of the animal. I don't care what you hunt, but just don't shoot it, take a picture with it, and then toss it aside.

 

[Pseudopod]

Any time I make any choice in my own self interest I'm being selfish so your point is moot. The marketplace will determine who gets what food and for what price. One could easily argue that by supporting my local farmers as I like to do, I'm putting consumer level sales revenue directly into their pockets and supporting smaller, local farms and making them sustainable. This keeps money in the community and helps to support local families instead of some nameless, faceless corporation I have zero connection to.

Agricultural corporations care about your health in the same way as car manufacturers do. Deaths (or health issues) that can be linked to their products are really bad PR. Local isn't always the best anyway. Not all areas have the climate to grow crops as efficiently as other areas do. Apples from canada are unlikely to be as easy and efficient to grow as they are in california.

I'll take apples from spain over the expensive **** that they grow in my home country any day

Besides, there's nothing stopping your local growers from using GMOs either. There are actually several GMO suppliers to choose from, they don't have to go with monsanto seeds , and I bet small local farmers would benefit from greater yields from their limited fields at least as much as bigger farms would.

 

[Johnnypenso]

Agricultural corporations care about your health in the same way as car manufacturers do. Deaths (or health issues) that can be linked to their products are really bad PR. Local isn't always the best anyway. Not all areas have the climate to grow crops as efficiently as other areas do. Apples from canada are unlikely to be as easy and efficient to grow as they are in california.

I'll take apples from spain over the expensive **** that they grow in my home country any day

Besides, there's nothing stopping your local growers from using GMOs either. There are actually several GMO suppliers to choose from, they don't have to go with monsanto seeds , and I bet small local farmers would benefit from greater yields from their limited fields at least as much as bigger farms would.

And yet car companies have and continue to cover up defects that get people killed. I don't eat any of the foods that are commonly genetically modified. I don't eat corn (other than organic popping corn) or soy, any processed food ingredients made from either one, any kind of processed non-organic sugars, or packaged foods for the most part. I've visited the farming operation of the place I get my poultry, I've visited many local farmers and I know what they do and how they do it. I've done a lot of investigating on my own and now that I've found sources for or grocery store items I find acceptable. That's not to say everything I eat is perfect, I just think it's important to know what you're putting into your mouth and to get the broadest spectrum of vitamins, minerals and nutrients possible while still enjoying your food.

Again, your focus is on economics, which is not my focus and not necessarily the focus of some local farmers. There is a niche market for organic foods, foods from heritage seeds, or just locally grown produce in general that's not GMO. A local farmer growing a small crop doesn't have to maximize yield to maximize profit, he has to maximize total revenue. If he gets 100 organic bushels of X and can sell it at a premium $50 bushel that's better for him than selling 125 bushels of Monsanto GMO food at $40 or less. Less work, same money. Or they might do it simply because they have a passion for growing crops in a more natural way, without the use of pesticides, herbicides or artificial fertilizers.

 

[XoravaX]

In my country hormone or continuos antibiotics treatment is already banned, and GMO requires special procedure to pass and even GMO livestock-fed requires a special marking on products (I suppose it's EU law that requires those), so I pretty much won't eat those, with the exception of imported beef from South America. I'd have nothing against GMO products themselves (after all, it's just precise modification of genes), but I'm against hormone treatment and continuous antibiotics treatment (the latter causes antibiotics resistant bacteria to evolve). However I can still eat meat that has been treated with antibiotics as an animal, it's not that important.

I try to prefer natural ingredients and avoid artificial things such as trans fat acids.

Oh, and since EU law forbids patenting DNA, Monsanto and others don't have a foothold here. I think it's ridiculous that farmers couldn't take seed grain from their harvest. Should such laws be enacted here, I'd probably oppose GMO food.

 

[Keef]

I voted "other", partly because Danoff has no idea what he's talking about and partly because I typically avoid animal foods that look like what they used to be and/or have the consistency of my own boogers.

I'd be glad to eat a burger grown in a lab. Beef is beef whether we grew it or the cow grew it. Basically I don't give a crap. But I get really sad when people run over fuzzy cute animals on the street.

 

[FoolKiller]

I don't eat predatory mammals.

I'm curious. Why?

I typically avoid animal foods that look like what they used to be and/or have the consistency of my own boogers.

Are you talking about seafood in general?

My wife says she can't eat things when she can see what they used to be, but then she has no problem with chicken.

 

[Pseudopod]

I'm curious. Why?

I think they're cool. I only eat lame animals.

 

[FoolKiller]

I think they're cool. I only eat lame animals.

For some reason, I find this answer completely acceptable.

 

[MatskiMonk]

I think they're cool. I only eat lame animals.

I can think of an example that might make give you a more legitimate answer. Tuna vs. Salmon. Had to google the reason again because I couldn't remember it exactly, but...

"Although the sorts of tuna used for canning are not giant predators like Atlantic bluefin or bigeye, they are still "alpha" predators, consuming fish that have in turn consumed other fish or crustaceans further down the food chain. Skipjack, albacore, and the other "canning" tunas can thus become storehouses for toxins like mercury and other heavy metals when these substances "bio-accumulate" from one food-chain level to the next. Pinks, chums, and sockeyes, in contrast—the salmon most commonly used for canning—feed mostly on small crustaceans and even near-microscopic plankton. Their pinkish-orange flesh is in fact a direct result of the pigments from these crustaceans. These salmon are as high if not higher in omega-3 fatty acids as tuna and bear none of the toxic risks of tuna."

 

[Pseudopod]

What does that have to do with what I said?

I eat both tuna and salmon but I very much prefer salmon.

 

[Johnnypenso]

I can think of an example that might make give you a more legitimate answer. Tuna vs. Salmon. Had to google the reason again because I couldn't remember it exactly, but...

"Although the sorts of tuna used for canning are not giant predators like Atlantic bluefin or bigeye, they are still "alpha" predators, consuming fish that have in turn consumed other fish or crustaceans further down the food chain. Skipjack, albacore, and the other "canning" tunas can thus become storehouses for toxins like mercury and other heavy metals when these substances "bio-accumulate" from one food-chain level to the next. Pinks, chums, and sockeyes, in contrast—the salmon most commonly used for canning—feed mostly on small crustaceans and even near-microscopic plankton. Their pinkish-orange flesh is in fact a direct result of the pigments from these crustaceans. These salmon are as high if not higher in omega-3 fatty acids as tuna and bear none of the toxic risks of tuna."

This is why I stick to salmon, sardines, herring, fresh caught rainbow trout and small mouth bass etc.

 

[Keef]

Are you talking about seafood in general?

My wife says she can't eat things when she can see what they used to be, but then she has no problem with chicken.

But breasts, legs, wings et. al. don't look like an actual chicken. A Thanksgiving turkey is a different story - it's kinda gross looking. I slice pieces off which don't look like a turkey but I'm not too keen on the whole stuffing thing. I ain't about to scoop some cornmeal out of a dead carcass. The vast majority of seafood I eat is fish but I'd much rather not eat a filet with skin and a head. It's weird.

The separation of food and plate, I think, is one of the core reasons that so many people are okay with eating so much meat today. Steaks used to be a delicacy 50 years ago but now I'm sad if my breakfast doesn't have beef in it. The fact that so few people are involved with the butchering of their meat means they never really grasp how many animals we raise and kill for food. I will never butcher my own cow. Unless some situation arises where I actually have to survive, I'm simply not going to kill my own food if I don't have to, I don't really want to deal with something that looks like it used to be an actual creature which is now dead on my plate. But as long as somebody else is getting bloody for me I'm a-okay with slaughtering pigs. Oktoberfest ain't the same without sausage.

 

[MatskiMonk]

What does that have to do with what I said?

I eat both tuna and salmon but I very much prefer salmon.

Sorry, missed the fact that you said mammals, but it was an example of a good reason to avoid eating predators.

 

[FoolKiller]

But breasts, legs, wings et. al. don't look like an actual chicken. A Thanksgiving turkey is a different story - it's kinda gross looking. I slice pieces off which don't look like a turkey but I'm not too keen on the whole stuffing thing. I ain't about to scoop some cornmeal out of a dead carcass. The vast majority of seafood I eat is fish but I'd much rather not eat a filet with skin and a head. It's weird.

The separation of food and plate, I think, is one of the core reasons that so many people are okay with eating so much meat today. Steaks used to be a delicacy 50 years ago but now I'm sad if my breakfast doesn't have beef in it. The fact that so few people are involved with the butchering of their meat means they never really grasp how many animals we raise and kill for food. I will never butcher my own cow. Unless some situation arises where I actually have to survive, I'm simply not going to kill my own food if I don't have to, I don't really want to deal with something that looks like it used to be an actual creature which is now dead on my plate. But as long as somebody else is getting bloody for me I'm a-okay with slaughtering pigs. Oktoberfest ain't the same without sausage.

Where I prefer to buy my meat in the largest cuts possible and cut it myself. Whole rabbits and various forms of fowl have passed through my kitchen. To repeat something I once told my wife, "when you strip the flesh of an animal from its bones you learn a lot about its biology."

That was in reference to shredding the meat off a whole rabbit that I had boiled for rabbit and dumplings, but since then I have learned how to debone a bird while leaving it whole. Because of this I can now tell the difference between free range and corporate farm-raised chickens just by their bone structure. I prefer to cook it bone-in though, as that makes for more flavorful broth later. And as @Joey D mentioned using all of the animal if you hunt, I take that to an extreme. After making bone broth I dry the bones and grind them into flour to make my bread bone meal to add to my garden as fertilizer. Circle of life. Everything eats everything eventually.

 

[Lain]

Whatever's tasty, though I certainly wouldn't indulge in the consumption of endangered animals. And now that my metabolism is slowing, I might have to reduce my tasty intake.

 

[Pseudopod]

Sorry, missed the fact that you said mammals, but it was an example of a good reason to avoid eating predators.

don't really care, actually. Unless you eat tuna every day it's not really going to be a big health risk

 

[FoolKiller]

Sorry, missed the fact that you said mammals, but it was an example of a good reason to avoid eating predators.

Calamari. Predators. Short life spans. Three times the daily recommended HDL cholesterol. Mostly toxin free.

Predators with huge life spans and long maturity cycles will build up toxins, but a sustainable or farmed predator will not have the same issues.

 

[Keef]

Where I prefer to buy my meat in the largest cuts possible and cut it myself. Whole rabbits and various forms of fowl have passed through my kitchen. To repeat something I once told my wife, "when you strip the flesh of an animal from its bones you learn a lot about its biology."

That was in reference to shredding the meat off a whole rabbit that I had boiled for rabbit and dumplings, but since then I have learned how to debone a bird while leaving it whole. Because of this I can now tell the difference between free range and corporate farm-raised chickens just by their bone structure. I prefer to cook it bone-in though, as that makes for more flavorful broth later. And as @Joey D mentioned using all of the animal if you hunt, I take that to an extreme. After making bone broth I dry the bones and grind them into flour to make my bread bone meal to add to my garden as fertilizer. Circle of life. Everything eats everything eventually.

I made scrambled eggs once.

I'm lucky enough that three of my best friends are former butchers at a high-end grocery store so they've had tons of experience with different meats and cuts. If I need cooking advice I usually go to them but I don't cook much because, let's face it, I'm just an average full-time student on a good day. On bad days I can't even decide where to get carryout.

 

[Swagger897]

lol.... ethics.. what are those...

Yeah, endagered stuff that sends me paper, saying I have to pay them back with colored paper is a no-no... other than that if it walks, swims, flies, or grows, I'll eat it.

 

[wvmgmidget]

Mark 7:19 (NIV) For it doesn't go into his heart but into his stomach, and then out of his body." (In saying this, Jesus declared all foods "clean."). Thought this would be interesting to share.

 

[RC45]

So it comes down to what all animal rights people believe.

Protect it, it is cute etc.


Nobody cares about that endangered snail or whatever.

I think it comes down to the fact that man has bred dogs over millennia to be companion and work/hunt animals - and that the dogs now have an instinctive human/companion social tendency - this means that even when bred for food as they are in China these dogs are genetically predisposed to try seek out human companionship which in my mind adds a special kind of twisted **cked up dimentia to people that breed dogs to eat.

These animals actually have the bad luck to have been bred to trust humans socially - making their slaughter all the more absurd.

Cows and other food animals have not developed the same social companion instinct the dog has - not many cows, goats or pigs eat at the masters table, hunt at his side and sleep at the foot of his bed.

 

[Grand Prix]

Although pigs are excellent at hunting truffles apparently. Pigs have also aided humans in the extinction of several other species, like the Dodo. So maybe not as close as dogs and humans, but still.

Speaking of pigs, it is funny that many people have no problem eating them despite knowing that they are self-aware creatures like us, and very intelligent indeed. Myself included. It's hypocrisy, but I suppose if the animal is tasty enough, ethical concerns about eating intelligent animals can fly right out the window. Relations with extraterrestrials may turn sour quite quick if someone discovers they taste like bacon.

 

[LeMansAid]

It's mandatory to bring up human flesh in these types of discussions isn't it? Who among the "I'll eat whatever is tasty" would be up for some human meat from a consenting donor? Suicide or amputation being the means to that end.

A food ethics subtopic that interests me is volume of consumption. As someone who regularly eats only one meal per day, and sometimes none, I've come to realise how little food is actually needed. I think a lot of people probably have a far too high threshold for what's considered eating in excess. With the process of growing food to feed our food (crops for animals destined for slaughter), meat overeating must have quite the impact on our world.

I'm probably something like the tree hugger/eater that you've been expecting @Danoff. Organic, raw, seasonal, unprocessed, and meatless, are all focuses. The things that vegans eschew feature in my diet, but the sources are chosen very deliberately. That said, I don't care at all for maintaining some pure image, and don't treat these things in any way as rules. If I really want something non-organic, burnt to a crisp, out of season, processed, and meaty - I'll have it.

I think they're cool. I only eat lame animals.

Tigers with dodgy knees best beware then.

 

[Crash]

I guess I fall into the "I eat whatever" category.

I'm not very picky, and will eat whatever is tasty and that I want to eat. Though of course, it is all in moderation as I want to eat and maintain a fairly balanced and healthy diet as well.

The only strict rule for me is that I will not eat my own species.

 

[BobK]

Relations with extraterrestrials may turn sour quite quick if someone discovers they taste like bacon.

Or, conversely, if it turns out that we taste like their equivalent of bacon.

 

[Pseudopod]

It's mandatory to bring up human flesh in these types of discussions isn't it? Who among the "I'll eat whatever is tasty" would be up for some human meat from a consenting donor? Suicide or amputation being the means to that end.

I would, actually. From a consenting donor. If i had to amputate my own leg, I'd ask to have it saved for later. It would be an interesting experiment.

 

[ryzno]

It's mandatory to bring up human flesh in these types of discussions isn't it? Who among the "I'll eat whatever is tasty" would be up for some human meat from a consenting donor? Suicide or amputation being the means to that end.

How is it mandatory to bring up something illegal?
The only reason I voted "I'll eat whatever is tasty" is cause there is no option for, "I eat what I want to". And I do regardless of how it was grown, raised and definitely not religion.

I have stayed in very mixed ethnic areas. I've had the privilege of eating a wide variety of foods.
Cow brain and tongue and liver tacos. Jerk Ox tail. Curry dishes(an ex would took me out, to this day I still don't know what kind of curry it was.) And even chitterlings. And obviously, gator chili, deer, lamb.

Now back to your cannibal view. The only time I would ever think of eating human meat would be in a life or death situation. eg. Your stuck in a frozen tundra and you run out of food and your friend dies. Then and only then, do I find it acceptable. I also feel the same way about dog meat.

 

[MatskiMonk]

Speaking of pigs, it is funny that many people have no problem eating them despite knowing that they are self-aware creatures like us, and very intelligent indeed. Myself included. It's hypocrisy, but I suppose if the animal is tasty enough, ethical concerns about eating intelligent animals can fly right out the window. Relations with extraterrestrials may turn sour quite quick if someone discovers they taste like bacon.

Might be even worse if ET likes the way we taste.