Ford planning LeMans Return + Ford GT revival

[GTboyz]

Well techincally that late 90's era of GT1 was GT (however treated as LMP1 aka the top class). You had to have a roadcar version to race and there was a Toyota TS020 road car. Just as the Panoz Esperante GTR had a road car variant, the Mclaren F1 GTR's (the Long Tail by then), and the Porsche 911 GT1's, Mercede CK-LM, and Nissan R390 GT1.

Well maybe the Ford GT fall in this category ? Did they even confirm that the GT will race in GTE class ?

 

[Crash]

LMGTP/GT1 class doesn't exist anymore; current closest class is LMP1.

Ford has never said that they are racing in Le Mans or that the new Ford GT will even be raced. Both are nothing more than speculations.

 

[YSSMAN]

Well maybe the Ford GT fall in this category ? Did they even confirm that the GT will race in GTE class ?

Well, I'd try to consider the following:

• A GT3 entry wouldn't be much more than the vehicle as shown in concept form with some aero bits and sticky tires... Doesn't bring a lot of glory to the car from a manufacturer-backed effort perspective... But... It wouldn't surprise me to see private efforts do something like this
• A GTE entry would have them locking heads with the C7.R, 911 RSR, Ferrari 458/488, Lamborghini Huracan... and more... Would bode well for advertising, testing, and is a class that can compete worldwide on the same level of performance... Saving Ford millions in the process of development, while still (probably) not deviating much from the vehicle as shown in concept form (aero, tires, blah blah blah)
• A LMP2/DP entry makes sense, at least to me. After all, the car is carrying the winning powertrain from the DP cars, and given the adaptability of the chassis to custom bodywork, a DP car with Ford GT bits (ala the Corvette DPs) makes a hell of a lot of sense. But, the DP cars are supposed to be falling by the wayside for an all-new LMP2 class that is based on global standards, and that will more than likely deviate extensively from the way that the DP cars work now. I don't see Ford wanting to invest that kind of money in a chassis that will probably not be around in three years.
• A LMP1 entry doesn't make a lot of sense to me... Not even in the slightest. While absolutely there is a lot of glory to be obtained here, the reality is that the LMP1 cars bare so little resemblance to the road vehicles that they might share a name with (Nissan GT-R thingamadoo), I can't see it being a marketing win for Ford. The Audis are dominant, the Toyotas are gaining ground, Porsche still has a lot to prove... What will Ford bring to the table exactly? And how will a DP-based powertrain fair when these cars are made to go on MPG... Not outright speed/performance. That's not what the Ford GT is about.

Realistically, its a split between GT3 and GTE for me. A GT3 program makes a ton of sense simply because the ease of access is so great. The car will be able to compete all around the world where it will be sold, and while Ford may not exactly back a team, privateers can use the platform to take down nearly every single car that it will compete against - Porsche, McLaren, Corvette, Viper, and most importantly, Ferrari.

...But, all the glory is in GTE. And there are factory-backed teams in GTE. AND the GTE class is global, both in TUDOR, as well as in FIA WEC. As far as prominence goes, beating a factory-backed Corvette, 911, Vantage, Z4, or the "factory" 458s... That's a lot of glory for Ford, not just in North America, but globally. They wouldn't need to adapt the car too much, what they learn can be applied directly to the road model, and in the end it really is a case of race on Sunday, sell on Monday.

 

[GTboyz]

I see... Reading your post, it hit me how GT3 or GTE is perfect for the new GT. All the competitors are in that category.

 

[FoRiZon]

Oh my, it's going to sound amazing

Its sound like a typical Audi LMP's in GT6.

 

[GranTurismo guy]

Its sound like a typical Audi LMP's in GT6.

It really doesn't

 

[SuperCobraJet]

LMGTP/GT1 class doesn't exist anymore; current closest class is LMP1.

Ford has never said that they are racing in Le Mans or that the new Ford GT will even be raced. Both are nothing more than speculations.

Yes, it is speculation, but it is anything but wild, based on:

Ford is now one of the largest and most profitable global car companies, with the emphasis on global.
24 hrs. of Lemans is probably the most globally prestigious car race there is.
A few years ago they announced their intentions to concentrate their racing efforts on NASCAR and also teamed with Michael Shank racing to win the 50th running of the 24 hrs. of Daytona in a LMP car with the eco boost V-6.
They won this years 24hr. Daytona with the LMP eco boost V-6 and Chip Ganassi.
They would have won last year with Chip if they had not been screwed by IMSA right before the race with a rules change.
Ford just completed their huge state of the art racing R & D facility in North Carolina.
According to reports there is only one other facility with some of the tech they have there, and it's in F1.
It even has it's own wind tunnel.
Now, the new Ford GT is unveiled.
Winning at Lemans on the 50th anniversary of the GT40's accomplishments is a mighty big carrot.
Considering all their moves, I think the odds are pretty darn good Ford is planning to go for it.

 

[alonsof1fan91]

Too bad that they'll get beaten by Audi and Porsche.

 

[R5]

Too bad that they'll get beaten by Audi and Porsche.

Well duh. An LMP is faster than a GTE car.

 

[SuperCobraJet]

Well duh. An LMP is faster than a GTE car.

I am not convinced it won't be an LMP car.

And of course Audi and Porsche would probably be heavily favored, just as Ferrari was back in the mid sixties.
All the more glory and prestige for winning, as was the case in 1966, 67, 68, and 69 by the Ford GT40.
I would love to see Ford do it again.

 

[R5]

I am not convinced it won't be an LMP car.

And of course Audi and Porsche would probably be heavily favored, just as Ferrari was back in the mid sixties.
All the more glory and prestige for winning, as was the case in 1966, 67, 68, and 69 by the Ford GT40.
I would love to see Ford do it again.

I highly doubt an LMP1 car, maybe an LMP3 but I guess that's the limit I can realistically think up.

 

[CodeRedR51]

 

[Legro]

I highly doubt an LMP1 car, maybe an LMP3 but I guess that's the limit I can realistically think up.

LMP3 wouldn't make much sense, you can't enter to WEC with LMP3 car and making car only for ELMS isn't really worth it.

 

[R5]

LMP3 wouldn't make much sense, you can't enter to WEC with LMP3 car and making car only for ELMS isn't really worth it.

They're introducing it to WEC soon.

 

[Legro]

They're introducing it to WEC soon.

Source?

That link doesn't say anything about WEC.

 

[R5]

Source?

That link doesn't say anything about WEC.

ACO govern WEC, no?

 

[Legro]

ACO govern WEC, no?

With FIA, yes. They also organise European Le Mans Series, in which LMP3 is going to be used.

 

[R5]

With FIA, yes. They also organise European Le Mans Series, in which LMP3 is going to be used.

So it is. Misunderstanding on my part.

I guess I'll fix this

I highly doubt an LMP1 car, GTE-Pro is the most likely class when looking realistically.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Yes, it is speculation, but it is anything but wild, based on:

Ford is now one of the largest and most profitable global car companies, with the emphasis on global.
24 hrs. of Lemans is probably the most globally prestigious car race there is.
A few years ago they announced their intentions to concentrate their racing efforts on NASCAR and also teamed with Michael Shank racing to win the 50th running of the 24 hrs. of Daytona in a LMP car with the eco boost V-6.
They won this years 24hr. Daytona with the LMP eco boost V-6 and Chip Ganassi.
They would have won last year with Chip if they had not been screwed by IMSA right before the race with a rules change.
Ford just completed their huge state of the art racing R & D facility in North Carolina.
According to reports there is only one other facility with some of the tech they have there, and it's in F1.
It even has it's own wind tunnel.
Now, the new Ford GT is unveiled.
Winning at Lemans on the 50th anniversary of the GT40's accomplishments is a mighty big carrot.
Considering all their moves, I think the odds are pretty darn good Ford is planning to go for it.

It wasn't an LMP1 car for one, and the only thing you have right is the fact that if they are to come back in 2016 it's due to the connotation of the 50th anniversary of winning the race. Facts you should have used are that Multimatic (not the R&D facility that could be used of a multitude of things) has been in close talks with the ACO/FIA on the new GTE rules that are set to come out. This could work in favor of Ford, to run such a car. Secondly, the car itself is a halo car during a time that Ford really doesn't need one considering all the other performance products they have that are suitable enough. This car is a class above the Z06 or Viper and is a full blown racer which makes it more likely to be converted over then just a track like super car that will be short lived.

Especially considering no one was really asking for a GT return and when rumors started of a possible GT return it was based around the idea of it racing in a factory effort, not like that of the last millennium GT.

 

[SuperCobraJet]

It wasn't an LMP1 car for one, and the only thing you have right is the fact that if they are to come back in 2016 it's due to the connotation of the 50th anniversary of winning the race. Facts you should have used are that Multimatic (not the R&D facility that could be used of a multitude of things) has been in close talks with the ACO/FIA on the new GTE rules that are set to come out. This could work in favor of Ford, to run such a car. Secondly, the car itself is a halo car during a time that Ford really doesn't need one considering all the other performance products they have that are suitable enough. This car is a class above the Z06 or Viper and is a full blown racer which makes it more likely to be converted over then just a track like super car that will be short lived.

Especially considering no one was really asking for a GT return and when rumors started of a possible GT return it was based around the idea of it racing in a factory effort, not like that of the last millennium GT.

The important factor is not that it wasn't an LMP1, but the fact they are already winning 24hr. races with a prototype class race car.

The GTE class is certainly a possibility as well.
But the Mustang, already being fielded by Multimatic, seems to be the natural fit there.

Contrar, they need a GT40 car to maximise the significance of the original accomplishment.
The last effort was all factory backed and lead by Carrol Shelby.
Shelby had a open check book and all of Ford's resources from the deuce to make it happen.
My money is on the Ganassi connection this time around, but you can bet all of the factory effort will be behind it.

The only thing that may be wrong is the, a little late to the party factor.
But then again if they could win the 2016, 17, 18, or 19, it still commemorates a 50th anniversary win.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

The important factor is not that it wasn't an LMP1, but the fact they are already winning 24hr. races with a prototype class race car.

DP is as far from LMP1 as DTM is from GT3. So either way no it's not a great factor. If you were to say that they can possibly win in an ACO allowed engine config that will last 24hrs sure that makes sense, but they don't have nor have shown a working knowledge of the chassis cause they haven't used anything close to an LMP1 as my analogy hints at.

The GTE class is certainly a possibility as well.
But the Mustang, already being fielded by Multimatic, seems to be the natural fit there.

No it's not, at least not any where near GTE.

Contrar, they need a GT40 car to maximise the significance of the original accomplishment.
The last effort was all factory backed and lead by Carrol Shelby.
Shelby had a open check book and all of Ford's resources from the deuce to make it happen.
My money is on the Ganassi connection this time around, but you can bet all of the factory effort will be behind it.

Why? What Le Mans experience does Chip have? Why put it to him when he has a full schedule with 3 other series? There are others, I would say Penske but he's even more busy, yet actually has knowledge and understanding of what it takes to perform on the Le Mans level.

The only thing that may be wrong is the, a little late to the party factor.
But then again if they could win the 2016, 17, 18, or 19, it still commemorates a 50th anniversary win.

Sure if you want to stretch the true definition of the original win and the era it started which seems to be the point of the 16 entry if it does happen.

 

[Northstar]

I think Wayne Taylor Racing would be a good fit if a GTE effort does happen. Wayne has experience at Le Mans himself and has shown an interest in returning, plus both Ricky and Jordan have raced there. Granted he does have a long relationship with GM, but stranger things have happened in the racing world.

 

[SuperCobraJet]

DP is as far from LMP1 as DTM is from GT3. So either way no it's not a great factor. If you were to say that they can possibly win in an ACO allowed engine config that will last 24hrs sure that makes sense, but they don't have nor have shown a working knowledge of the chassis cause they haven't used anything close to an LMP1 as my analogy hints at.

Maybe not, but they had to trial the the eco boost V6 somewhere for 24 hrs.
Can you think of a better place to do it?

No it's not, at least not any where near GTE.

This one is yet to be determined, and as said is a possibility.

Why? What Le Mans experience does Chip have? Why put it to him when he has a full schedule with 3 other series? There are others, I would say Penske but he's even more busy, yet actually has knowledge and understanding of what it takes to perform on the Le Mans level.

Three good reasons.
First, Chip has plenty of 24hr race experience and a first class stable of drivers, even though granted it is not of the Lemans variety.
Second, I don't believe Chip could pass up a good chance to put that feather in his cap.
There is not another race in the world that could bring him that level of honor and prestige.
Not to mention that makes it an all US of A effort.
Now that is dependant on Ford convincing him, they are all out commited to winning and have the resources to do so.
Thats what the last three years in IMSA are all about, as well as the new racing dev facility.
Third is also a biggie for Ford.
The opportunity to woo Ganassi into their NASCAR fold.
Penske's season last year with Ford certainly didn't hurt those chances any.
Ford already has Penske in their camp.

Sure if you want to stretch the true definition of the original win and the era it started which seems to be the point of the 16 entry if it does happen.

No doubt, yes the 2016 race would be the biggest win of the four possibilities.
But considering the odds, the fortunes of racing, and the fact Ford hasn't competed there in so long, winning any of the four would still be a great accomplishment.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Maybe not, but they had to trial the the eco boost V6 somewhere for 24 hrs.
Can you think of a better place to do it?

Which is what I said.


This one is yet to be determined, and as said is a possibility.

Three good reasons.
First, Chip has plenty of 24hr race experience and a first class stable of drivers, even though granted it is not of the Lemans variety.
Second, I don't believe Chip could pass up a good chance to put that feather in his cap.
There is not another race in the world that could bring him that level of honor and prestige.
Not to mention that makes it an all US of A effort.
Now that is dependant on Ford convincing him, they are all out commited to winning and have the resources to do so.
Thats what the last three years in IMSA are all about, as well as the new racing dev facility.
Third is also a biggie for Ford.
The opportunity to woo Ganassi into their NASCAR fold.
Penske's season last year with Ford certainly didn't hurt those chances any.
Ford already has Penske in their camp.

It's quite a different endeavor, if it was that easy then Corvette Racing should have won last year at Daytona on their first time back in more that 10 years...for example. In this case a race is a race is a race isn't so.

For your second point what proof do you have that this has been their goal? Cause I think you'd save us all quite the time showing us so many of us can decided some international effort is in the works.

It's not really a biggie for Ford, they have a top notch team that has proven a secure bet at fighting for a title, and even if they added Chip, it's not the car so much the team working on it. But this has been fully covered in the NASCAR thread.

No doubt, yes the 2016 race would be the biggest win of the four possibilities.
But considering the odds, the fortunes of racing, and the fact Ford hasn't competed there in so long, winning any of the four would still be a great accomplishment.

Sure but that wasn't the debate. Anyways, we will see what they do since for now they're tight lipped on it.

 

[SuperCobraJet]

It's quite a different endeavor, if it was that easy then Corvette Racing should have won last year at Daytona on their first time back in more that 10 years...for example. In this case a race is a race is a race isn't so.

The word "easy" rarely applies anywhere in racing.
It was anything but easy 50yrs ago and it will be even more so now.

For your second point what proof do you have that this has been their goal? Cause I think you'd save us all quite the time showing us so many of us can decided some international effort is in the works.

Proof?
My first post admits it is speculative.

It's not really a biggie for Ford, they have a top notch team that has proven a secure bet at fighting for a title, and even if they added Chip, it's not the car so much the team working on it. But this has been fully covered in the NASCAR thread.

I don't think Ford is going to be content with that this time around.
If they are moving to increase their presence and dominance in NASCAR, which they as much as stated a few years ago, then Chip's association is the best and an excellent addition to that end.
I'll have to check that out in the NASCAR thread.

Sure but that wasn't the debate. Anyways, we will see what they do since for now they're tight lipped on it.

Yes it will be interesting to see how it shapes up over the coming months.
All I'm saying is at this juncture in time, the unveiling of a new FordGT with eco boost V6 power is more than just a coincidence, and the landscape seems to indicate the best possibility for a Lemans effort points in the Ganassi direction.

 

[Northstar]

then Chip's association is the best and an excellent addition to that end.

Why would Ford want another mid-pack team?

and the landscape seems to indicate the best possibility for a Lemans effort points in the Ganassi direction.

There is also quite a bit going against it as well.

Ford may not want a person associated with Chevrolet running their international racing effort. I know he has some factory support from them right now, but things get more complicated at the international level. This same thing can be said about Penske as he is pretty much responsible for Chevrolet returning to Indy.

Plus there is the issue of him being stretched thin as it is, there certainly could be concern about his priorities if he takes on a high profile project. This is why I think a team like WTR or Highcroft* would be a better fit as both have experience and could put 100% of their focus on the project if it does happen.

*I'm not even sure if they are around still, them working with Ford could explain their silence since they left the Delta Wing project though.

 

[CodeRedR51]

Silver anyone? More here.

 

[Niku Driver HC]

Ah, the comments on that site are the perfect tool... to lose a few bits of I.Q.

Seriously, people are still raging over the fact that this car won't be a "OMG 'MURICA V8 POWAH BRO" vehicle, why do they do that? It has an Ecoboost V6. Ford won't change that engine because a chosen few whine about it. End of story.

Also, the silver is good, but I really want to see this in black, can you imagine?

 

[Eunos_Cosmo]

In my opinion, they have done a masterful job of balancing elegance with extreme.

 

[SuperCobraJet]

Why would Ford want another mid-pack team?

Simple.
Out of what there is left to choose from, again Chip is the best of the lot.
And again as said it provides a possible avenue of 24hr racing experience for a Lemans run.
Not to mention their partnering in IMSA is already paying off.

There is also quite a bit going against it as well.

Ford may not want a person associated with Chevrolet running their international racing effort. I know he has some factory support from them right now, but things get more complicated at the international level. This same thing can be said about Penske as he is pretty much responsible for Chevrolet returning to Indy.

All of that is a Motorsport game of best interest that goes around and around all the time.
Especially with two top dogs like Penske and Ganassi.
Although I'm willing to admit it may not work unless Ganassi goes for the whole enchilada and partners with Ford on the Cup side too.
Obviously Chevy took notice of Chip's Ford connection in IMSA , and partnered Ganassi with Hendrick support last year, improving his Cup program considerably.
We shall see.

Plus there is the issue of him being stretched thin as it is, there certainly could be concern about his priorities if he takes on a high profile project. This is why I think a team like WTR or Highcroft* would be a better fit as both have experience and could put 100% of their focus on the project if it does happen.

*I'm not even sure if they are around still, them working with Ford could explain their silence since they left the Delta Wing project though.

That is a possibility as well.
We don't know what kind of offers or negotiations good be in the works and who all maybe involved in them.
I think considering all the factors involved in a 24hr Leman's run next year, Ganassi is probably not the only iron Ford has in the fire.
It is possible the Ganassi connection is strictly for IMSA and potentially NASCAR.
Or maybe more.