Formula 1 Heineken Grande Prémio De Portugal 2020Formula 1 

  • Thread starter Jimlaad43
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Objectively Lewis crushed it today, the elephant in the room is racism is prevalent in general society, and regardless of whether this is subconscious or not it is reflected the public votes...
Lewis not winning DOTD has nothing to do with racism, it's just there are too many people millitantly bored with him winning and won't vote for him. Plus, a Lewis win doesn't seem like an "exceptional performance" which most other winners of the award have done.
 
HAM and BOT are expected to win every race. For them to get DOTD they're going to have to do something exceptional, not just overtake each other and run away with it. Ok they both had to pass a McLaren this time, but hardly difficult.

It's just the nature of votes like that, always going to be easier for a driver at the back to shine than for a frontrunner to stand out over what is expected of them.
 
Objectively Lewis crushed it today, the elephant in the room is racism is prevalent in general society, and regardless of whether this is subconscious or not it is reflected the public votes...

Hamilton started 1st and finished 1st. Perez started 5th, was last at the end of lap 1 then finished 7th. That's why he got DOTD. Hamilton has won DOTD plenty of other times.
 
whether this is subconscious or not it is reflected the public votes...

I like to think that I speak up against unconscious bias as much as any of the other left-identified members of this forum... but I can't agree with that. There are many other credible reasons including the merits of the driver who did win and a healthy does of Hamilton-fatigue. Both unrelated to race.
 
Hamilton doesn't help himself with his "I'm struggling lol watch this performance" stuff. It's so transparent.

...as if being voted DOTD actually matters.
 
My phone has reminded me that he broke the win record on the same day he wrapped up title no. 3. A bit of useless info for you there.
 
I'm watching the highlights of this race on C4. It's the first F1 race I've seen in a while. Very nice track. F1 needs more of these. I'd start watching what was my favourite sport again with less of the usual Herman monstrosities.
 
I like to think that I speak up against unconscious bias as much as any of the other left-identified members of this forum... but I can't agree with that. There are many other credible reasons including the merits of the driver who did win and a healthy does of Hamilton-fatigue. Both unrelated to race.

Lewis not winning DOTD has nothing to do with racism, it's just there are too many people millitantly bored with him winning and won't vote for him. Plus, a Lewis win doesn't seem like an "exceptional performance" which most other winners of the award have done.

On merit Lewis drove the best today 25seconds in front of his team mate and now the most successful driver ever with 92 wins a truly phenomenal achievement. You can call Hamilton fatigue all you want but racism does exist and this vote is a prime example of unconscious bias in the public. There is no reason for not giving credit were it is due other than bias. What is going on at the moment is not a battle over overt racism but the more insidious type that is prevalent in society. You may not have experienced this yourself or hold this attitude, but to deny it happens is just as bad.
 
On merit Lewis drove the best today 25seconds in front of his team mate and now the most successful driver ever with 92 wins a truly phenomenal achievement. You can call Hamilton fatigue all you want but racism does exist and this vote is a prime example of unconscious bias in the public. There is no reason for not giving credit were it is due other than bias. What is going on at the moment is not a battle over overt racism but the more insidious type that is prevalent in society. You may not have experienced this yourself or hold this attitude, but to deny it happens is just as bad.
Is he serious ?
 
racism does exist and this vote is a prime example of unconscious bias in the public.
If Hamilton had won DOTD and I was in here claiming it was because of an unconscious bias in the public against Mexican people, would you take me seriously?
 
Quite enjoyable race and quali. Looking forward to Imola, the silver lining of the virus is going to these type of tracks.

Fantastic achievement by Lewis and did it in style on a tricky never raced at circuit.

Gasly has been looking pretty punchy lately, I wonder if he can get Albon's seat and not wilt again.

Puts into context with Hamilton's double penalty recently this is quite interesting... actual collision and dangerous driving this time too. Nothing like a darker skin tone to increase the vigilance of the stewards it seems. It is very arbitrary how penalties are doled out when interpretation and (in Ferrari's case) money comes into the equation...

Nah. It was an obvious penalty. Did you notice he was the only doing practice starts? Drivers coming into contact is full of subjectivity and completely different to a technical penalty. We've seen many incidents involving and not involving Lewis chalked up to no punishment, to claim the stewards gave the pens because of skin colour is silly.

Kimi recently went over a pit line and got a penalty, not because of his skin colour.

When Lewis was penalized for entering a closed pit lane, it had nothing to do with skin colour, it was becasue the pit lane was closed.

When you do prohibited practice starts, whatever your skin colour you will get penalized for them. It was actually dangerous as drivers are accelerating out and Lewis is stationary around the corner. Different layouts have different rules. Lewis even sensed it may be wrong and asked the team.
 
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Not really, the aero rules are changing but not the engines that much. They’ll be mildly simplified, but still are hy-kers turbo V6s. Basically dead in the water, to translate.

I....don't see how this is bad? The PUs aren't the end-all-be-all like they were during the 2014 and 2015 seasons. If they were, Williams would be a lot higher than they are currently, and McLaren wouldn't be stating that they're expecting to lose a little pace next year. With the obvious exception of Ferrari, I'd say that all of the PUs are currently pretty equal, and overall car design, especially aero, has been the biggest factor both this year and in the last couple years.

If the current PU gap stays consistent (or gets even smaller), then the 2022 aero regs will matter a lot more, since teams won't really be able to rely as much on their PUs to fix the deficit in their aero performance (yes, I realize this has the potential to backfire as well). Now, I don't realistically expect Mercedes to build a poor car with the new regs, but since everyone is drawing from a blank canvas, it means that there's greater potential for one of the other teams to close the overall gap. The caps on both the overall budget and wind tunnel time have the potential to help the smaller teams as well.

The bulk of the engine development costs goes to the hybrid systems which is why they’re so expensive, which is why no new engine supplier wants to join even for 2022. They screwed the pooch by trying to appease the big OEMs like Mercedes and Renault. It’s the exact same mistake they’ve been making since the 90s. “Let’s push all the garagistas out and pander to OEMs. Wait, why have all the non-works teams left and the costs skyrocketed? We need to pander to the OEMs to make sure they don’t leave as well!”

I do agree that the engines are prohibitively expensive for pretty much no reason, but I also don't want to see engine manufacturers enter the sport and have no pace, either. When Honda first entered, it was an absolutely miserable affair, and it took 3 years and a complete change in team before they started looking even remotely competitive (I also remember hearing that Honda wasn't keen in hearing feedback from McLaren at the time, either). The last "garagista" we had was Cosworth, and they were absolutely miserable for their entire time as an engine supplier, and that was no fun to watch, either.

Now, I do think that the FIA can (and should) do more in the future to help entice potential new engine suppliers, as well as do more to help them be competitive faster. But, I also kinda get why they "pander" to the OEMs, because the OEMs for the most part have the resources to build PUs that are competitive, and have overall less risk of hurting the on-track product.

There were originally plans to completely overhaul the engine regs, but Mercedes [and to an extent Renault] campaigned hard for them to stay as similar as possible to the current ones.

Pretty much every team on the grid has been guilty of arguing against proposals that potentially go against their interests, with Ferrari being the most well-known actor. IIRC, when the Hybrid Formula was first being developed, the FIA was pretty keen on adopting a 4-Banger engine formula, but Ferrari threatened to pull out if they did, hence the current V6 regulations. I don't see how this specifically makes Mercedes the bad guys, or takes the blame off the other teams for not matching up, especially since everyone else has had the same PU rulebook for 6 years now.
 
The first 6 laps were absolutely amazing. IMO in an ideal world that's how every lap of every race should be. Then the Mercs switched on their tyres and poof, we're back to status quo.

Less Tilkedromes, more Ricardo Penadromes please.

What a tease by McLaren at the start.

Both Ferraris in the points, superb job by Charles.

Great drive by Gasly!

Albon beat by Kimi and lapped by Max. I think his seat is gone after this season unless as someone else said, he wins the next race with both Mercs. still in it.

Edit: Kimi's first lap was art.


Kimi's rallying experience really helps here. While other drivers are tip toeing trying to find grip, he just has a natural instinctive feel for it. Ditto with Sainz (he did a promo vid for Renault with his dad and Webber/DC a while back and he seems pretty handy on dirt as well).
 
Kimi's rallying experience really helps here. While other drivers are tip toeing trying to find grip, he just has a natural instinctive feel for it. Ditto with Sainz (he did a promo vid for Renault with his dad and Webber/DC a while back and he seems pretty handy on dirt as well).
You know, I started to ponder if the Finn's knack for rallying was the reason he was so good, but wasn't sure til' I saw an article this morning citing Sainz crediting his rally experience as well. You have it spot on.
 
I genuinely struggle to understand how Leclerc is able to get results in that thing...
 
Like Max, Lando got quite sweary at Lance.

Compare and contrast Lando's comments on the slowing down lap with Max's to the press earlier in the weekend.

 
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