***Forza 6-wish list***

I'd love to see some of the old point to point/Touge tracks from I think FM1 and 2, or at least some new ones, in addition to some more real life tracks that we don't normally see. Some of the smaller US tracks like VIR or Barber MSP.

I'd also like the Abarth 500 to be based on the US model but that's just being biased. :D
 
I would like to see Rally di Positano return from FM3, especially in the spaghetti like full layout.
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That it comes out on playstation 4 had a 360 for a few months and played forza 1 to death more at game
 
My young bro gave me aloan of it just don't like the system I think it's more for kids but forza is a great game
Meh, you don't spend that much time in the menus anyway

(Wayyyy too busy playing forza)

A wish I totally forgot but is more important than any car I could want:

T10, will you please model double clutches properly?
 
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Wait... WHAT?

Is there a source to confirm this?

This came about with regards to Monza, because on Monza's website it stated the track was closed for a few days in 2013 with Microsoft's name in the schedule list for those days. So it is highly possible Monza could be in FM6, and potentially laser scanned.

If I can find the information on it again, I will post it up. This is why people expected it to be in FM5. There was also some confusion over Tsukuba also, as T10 posted a picture of the real track up shortly after FM5 was announced I believe. Obviously though, it wasnt in FM5.

I see a few people going on about night racing, weather, and more tire smoke. I would just like to point out that these are expensive effects to system resources, and can tank a games frame rate. Unless T10 can implement them in their motorsport series without sacrificing a solid 60fps, they will not add them. They have gone on record saying this multiple times over the years. I too would like them added as well, but I also feel I need to ask you to keep your excitement about those aspects in check. Just because FH2 has day/night and weather, doesn't mean FM6 will. Lets not forget that FH2 is running at 30fps, which affords the devs more headroom with the graphics.
 
This came about with regards to Monza, because on Monza's website it stated the track was closed for a few days in 2013 with Microsoft's name in the schedule list for those days. So it is highly possible Monza could be in FM6, and potentially laser scanned.

If I can find the information on it again, I will post it up. This is why people expected it to be in FM5. There was also some confusion over Tsukuba also, as T10 posted a picture of the real track up shortly after FM5 was announced I believe. Obviously though, it wasnt in FM5.

I see a few people going on about night racing, weather, and more tire smoke. I would just like to point out that these are expensive effects to system resources, and can tank a games frame rate. Unless T10 can implement them in their motorsport series without sacrificing a solid 60fps, they will not add them. They have gone on record saying this multiple times over the years. I too would like them added as well, but I also feel I need to ask you to keep your excitement about those aspects in check. Just because FH2 has day/night and weather, doesn't mean FM6 will. Lets not forget that FH2 is running at 30fps, which affords the devs more headroom with the graphics.

For what it's worth I think realistic tire smoke is a little more important than the orange peel effect or something in a similar capacity. Why make the visuals so pretty that you can't even have decent smoke effects? FM4's smoke effects are far better... yes, that's actually embarrassing to admit.
 
For what it's worth I think realistic tire smoke is a little more important than the orange peel effect or something in a similar capacity. Why make the visuals so pretty that you can't even have decent smoke effects? FM4's smoke effects are far better... yes, that's actually embarrassing to admit.

The orange peel effect on a cars paint wont do much in terms of a graphical sense, as it is just a material based texture. So once it is loaded up, it wont be using much of the system resources.

Tire smoke on the other hand, that is often done with a texture applied to a particle effect emitter. The same as the dust when one drives off the tarmac. Particle effects are a massive resource hog, and they will have an "and/or" instance applied to them to call them into the visuals or not. So this takes CPU resources to call them in, and both CPU/GPU resources to render them. They can get quite intensive, especially in a real time render situation as in a video game environment. Even the reflections/refractions in the cars paint itself will have more of an effect on the CPU and GPU then the orange peel effect

Look at it this way. I could model a car in the same detail T10 do, give it a paint material with orange peel. But have the reflections turned off in my render settings. I could render that up in say 20 minutes with a basic scene and lighting, say a corner of a race track. This could be using say 50% of my total CPU and/or 10% of my GPU (if I have GPU rendering turned on)
Then I could add on the reflections/refractions of the car paint, and this could see the render time increase to 40 minutes+. usually with an increase to the resources used, say like 65%CPU and/or 15% GPU. Add in HDR to it all, could see the render times increase a further 5+ minutes.
Then say I make the car look like it is drifting around the corner in question. So I would add a particle emitter, and add a suitable material based texture to it. And then I would go about using frames from say 0 to 100, to find what I perceive as the perfect point for the particle based tire smoke. Render that up, and you could then see the render time increase a further 30+ minutes, with 90+ CPU usage, and/or 30+GPU usage. (GPU is often used less when messing with a 3d application for rendering)

Obviously the timings I am using are hypothetical, but you should be able to see my point. Going from a very basic scene, to one with much better lighting. with reflections and HDR, and tire smoke. You could see your render times triple and more. Something at the very basic level which rendered up in 20 minutes, could take hours once all the effects are applied.

Obviously the renderer built into Forza (and other games), is a real time based one. The effects are called into existence by the games code, and are turned off by the games code. This has to happen very quickly as well. But the things such as the textures are preloaded in a game. Things like particle emitters though, these are only called into the game when needed.

The best way to prove this point, would be to load up FM5 (or FM4 if you still dont have FM5/X1). And then just sit in one spot on the track spinning the tires. After a few seconds, you will notice the frames have definitely gone below 60FPS. Even with the smoke effects not to your liking, they are still having an effect on what the system can do. So imagine what would happen to FM6 if T10 suddenly added night racing with a basic form of volumetric based lighting for the car lights, better tire smoke and dirt effects. And then on top of that, add rain into the mix. If they are not careful in their implementations, FM6 would be a locked 30FPS game at the least (think driveclub). Or will be an unlocked 60FPS game, where the FPS could tank as soon as you try to race in the rain, and at night.

You also have to remember that on the track in forza, the physics are always running as well. and this is using the CPU all the time for the calculations needed to make them run. So around half the total CPU power of the X1 (or 360 for FM4) will be used solely by the physics alone while on track.

This is why T10 have not added these things in the motorsport series yet (baring pacific shipyards in FM1 for night racing, and the reason they have not done it again since FM1). Unless they can add all those things without tanking the framerate, they will not do it. And for this reason, I am not going to get hyped up over those effects just because FH2 has them. I will wait till T10 say if we have those things or not. If they have added night and/or weather this time around for FM6, they will show it off at E3. As it would be the biggest selling point for FM6 by far.
 
Yes, I see all your points, clear as daylight. :D

And I enjoyed reading through that precise and detailed explanation. 👍

Honestly speaking, I could never ever in my wildest thoughts envision playing a F.Motorsport game running at anything less than a locked 60 fps. The game physics demand that. And that is one reason why the experience is so realistic and immersive.

I think back to the Virtua Racing days when Sega started coming up with the promising prospect of making most of their arcade games run at a locked 60 fps.

It is sad to see how consoles, in order to churn out pretty-looking visuals, have so settle for 30 fps in most games.

Another thing I'm bummed about is the X1 not being powerful enough for T10 to unleash their full engineering talent. These guys can make amazing smoke effects in their games, I know it... but that would probably mean (and I'm being realistic here) the frames dipping down to at least 20 fps. Unacceptable.

Wish the smoke effects weren't so abysmal compared to Horizon 2 or even FM4. It isn't very encouraging to see a game that looks so jaw droppingly good have worse than last-gen particle effects.

MS should have made the console way more powerful than it is. I think they focused too much on making it a media hub rather than a console for gaming purists. That's why the PS4 seems like a very attractive investment.

Despite all these gripes, I might get X1 JUST for Forza. Yes, I love cars and racing that much. I've generally lost interest in gaming, but driving sims always whet the appetite and provide a nice escape. :cool:
 
I wonder if they're finally going to work on exhaust upgrades showing up on cars. Seven Forza games by now (including both the Horizon titles) and still the upgrades are not visible on cars. I find it utterly silly for my Camaro SS Chevelle cranking out around 800 HP with those pansy-looking water-hose type exhaust pipes sticking out the back. :lol:

That and proper wheel animation/shifting animation should not be impossible by the time FM6 comes out.

Whatchu fellas think?
 
http://www.mcvpacific.com/news/read/xbox-australia-extends-partnership-with-djr/0144825
DJR Team Penske will continue their partnership with Xbox Australia for the 2015 V8 Supercars Championship.

Following their partnership at last year's Sydney 500, where returning driver Marcus Ambrose raced as a wild card, the new look DJR Team Penske will roll out on the track in the same livery for the 2015 season.

Xbox will be featured on Ambrose’s car at every event this year as an associate sponsor, kicking off this weekend.

Jeremy Hinton, Xbox Business Lead, said, “This year is truly exciting for us – a continuation of our ongoing partnership with the V8 Supercars, an innovative partnership with Ford and Forza Motorsport 6 and now with Marcos Ambrose and the DJR Team Penske team. There’s never been a better time to be a motorsport fan with Xbox in Australia.”

DJR Team Penske Managing Director Ryan Story added, “It is fantastic to have Xbox on board for the season.”

“Although the Sydney event in 2014 was a one off opportunity, the Xbox team were very committed to doing everything possible to ensure the partnership was a success. They understood that we were there to learn, and having them back this year allows us to build on that momentum.”

marcos-ambrose.png
 
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I think it's ridiculous how we keep making the same excuses for 10 years now for having no night/weather. GT and many other games managed to implement them for the last 2 generations. But a company with 500 people working on a game somehow can't? I call BS.
 
I think it's ridiculous how we keep making the same excuses for 10 years now for having no night/weather. GT and many other games managed to implement them for the last 2 generations. But a company with 500 people working on a game somehow can't? I call BS.
Last Gen consoles were to weak for day/weather at rock solid 60FPS all the time and development time was the issue for Forza 5, if you ask me. I read on the internet, that some really believe the xbox one wouldn't be powerful enough for those features and i can't agree with them. Didn't Dan say FM5 wasn't the right time or something along the lines? FM6 has to be the right time. No more excuses or explanations. 👍

By the way: Turn 10 has about 250 developer. Is your number counting outsourcing, because mine is not? :confused:
 
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I think it's ridiculous how we keep making the same excuses for 10 years now for having no night/weather. GT and many other games managed to implement them for the last 2 generations. But a company with 500 people working on a game somehow can't? I call BS.

It's not BS or excuses. FM could introduce GT style night and weather but would also inherit GT's dippy frame rate. I'd refer you to a post made a couple of pages ago on this thread:

I see a few people going on about night racing, weather, and more tire smoke. I would just like to point out that these are expensive effects to system resources, and can tank a games frame rate. Unless T10 can implement them in their motorsport series without sacrificing a solid 60fps, they will not add them. They have gone on record saying this multiple times over the years. I too would like them added as well, but I also feel I need to ask you to keep your excitement about those aspects in check. Just because FH2 has day/night and weather, doesn't mean FM6 will. Lets not forget that FH2 is running at 30fps, which affords the devs more headroom with the graphics.
All the developers in the world can't cure this if it's a system spec issue.
 
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What would be so very useful is if we could cap the framerate on Forza 5 for a trial. Of course, we can do
this on PC sims with various softwares

If we could try F5 at 30fps to see if we could tolerate it, that'd be very helpful. The difference between 30
and 60fps is noticeable on the PC sims I play

I suppose it boils down to whether you want 60fps or day/night and varying weather, because I don't think
we're getting both on this gen. Not at 1080p
 
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You could see Horizon 2 as that trial, the difference is noticeable. FM6 would suck at 30 fps.

What if in the next gen (xbox two?) now Forza outputs to 4k, 60 fps locked and yet again there is no weather or day/night racing because the system is already stressed trying to keep up with 4k res?

Would you guys prefer 4k in next gen or having weather, night racing, dynamic lighting, etc at 1080p, 60fps locked?

Edit:typo
 
It's not BS or excuses. FM could introduce GT style night and weather but would also inherit GT's dippy frame rate. I'd refer you to a post made a couple of pages ago on this thread:

All the developers in the world can't cure this if it's a system spec issue.
I'd say it more of a lack of talent/attention on their part. FH2 introduced weather system, but it looks less impressive than GT5, and that's a 2010 game. Not to mention that somehow PD managed to have close to 1080p resolution (in fact it's about the same as the majority of games on xbox one), 16 cars on tracks with higher detailed models and lods than FM5, night, weather, a much more sophisticated lighting and shaders, volumetric smoke with shadowing. Sure it's not a stable 60 fps experience, but it's also a 2006 machine with tacked on crappy GPU and 512 megs of RAM/VRAM. There's really no excuse for a 2012 machine not being able to achieve higher graphical fidelity.
 
You can do all that on your TV guys, it's called image settings menu.

I'm specifically talking about the photo mode color and saturation settings, that actually lets you change the look of the game. No TV has those settings. You can adjust all you want from your TV but nothing makes as BIG of a difference as "in game" settings.
 
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