Forza 8 news got me nervous?

[ShawnPhillips]

Gosh, I would LOVE an Assetto Corsa driving model in a game like Forza. Why wouldn't anyone?

Assetto Corsa is not good to drive on a controller. And I don't want to feel like I have to turn on the assist just to make it drivable after playing with no TSC, STM, or ABS in FM for the last decade. I certainly am not as hardcore into racing games as I was 10 years ago, so Forza's balances of accessibility to it's driving model keeps me playing even when I don't feel like taking the time to set up my wheel. Especially since currently I don't have a setup that makes my wheel comfortable to use.

Sure I'd like a bit more realism to Forza physics (the near non-existent simulation of Hybrid/KERS/DRS systems is my biggest Gripe with Forza's driving model), but not at the expense of the casual play experience. when I just feel like plopping down in my chair, grabbing my controller, and doing a few races.

 

[Wolfe]

And those "way too many games" need Forza's brand of graphics, variety and well, to some degree, car sound. A small handful of sounds are well done in Forza and these sims often ignore that.

Gosh, I would LOVE an Assetto Corsa driving model in a game like Forza. Why wouldn't anyone? There are always assists and aids to dumb down the driving model for those who prefer an arcade experience.

I agree. There aren't "way too many games" that are hardcore sims with Forza's spread of roadcars, including cult favorites; many, many cars that will apparently never appear in any "serious" hardcore racing sim like the ones @TheOE listed. There are zero modern hardcore sims that let you drive cars like a Subaru BRAT, 360, SVX, or even the Legacy B4 2.0GT.

I've been over in the Project CARS camp since giving up on Forza, after FM6 and FH3 demonstrated the stagnation of the franchise, but with Project CARS 3 Slightly Mad Studios still has not even added one WRX STI.

Until there's anything worth buying a console for on the PS5, Turn 10 has a window to convince me to switch back to Xbox for the next generation, with a renewed commitment to realism and improving handling combined with the sort of content for which Forza is known and loved. I'm pretty much back on the fence until then. My PS4 has been great but Sony has not exactly secured my appreciation over the last several years.

Assetto Corsa is not good to drive on a controller. And I don't want to feel like I have to turn on the assist just to make it drivable after playing with no TSC, STM, or ABS in FM for the last decade.

AC is just terrible with the analog stick. Even PCARS2 is way better, in my humble opinion.

The problem is AC's analog stick steering, not its physics model.

 

[maximax]

I truely love to play AC with analog stick (aids off) when I am away from my steering wheel setup. Although pCARS2 with stick is quite fine I always prefered AC over it.

Didn't quite liked Forza 6 Apex on pad, prefered much more the feeling from GT Sport. Hoping Forza 8 will feel great on both pads and wheels!

 

[MarleyMoo]

Assetto Corsa is not good to drive on a controller. And I don't want to feel like I have to turn on the assist just to make it drivable after playing with no TSC, STM, or ABS in FM for the last decade.

Hold up a sec... By turning off all of TCS, STM, ABS, you have not in fact turned off all assists. As long as you're playing with gamepad in Forza, the gamepad assist is always on which makes sure your input is smooth and the max stick deflection is max front lateral grip, and never more. You can tell because the steering angle is never ever 1:1 to your stick deflection.

That is simulation steering. If you use normal steering, there's another layer of (quite ingenious) assist that dynamically alters the car's rotational inertia to suppress fishtailing tank slappers.

So yeah, by simply using the gamepad you have turned on assists which are unique to Forza that makes every car drivable, and drive very similarly.

 

[theknyte]

So yeah, by simply using the gamepad you have turned on assists which are unique to Forza that makes every car drivable, and drive very similarly.

I have to agree. When I switched from gamepad to wheel in FM7, all the cars started to show unique characteristics, and some that I used to love driving became almost uncontrollable, until I relearned them on the wheel.

 

[StuWarner]

All I ask for is a career mode that expands with every update, just how Real Racing 3 does it on mobile, otherwise cars come out that can’t be used anywhere in career mode

 

[GBalao888]

All I ask for is a career mode that expands with every update, just how Real Racing 3 does it on mobile, otherwise cars come out that can’t be used anywhere in career mode

GT Sport also does something like this, by adding new career events and/or playlists to reflect on the new cars and tracks.

 

[Zeitoss]

Assetto Corsa is not good to drive on a controller. And I don't want to feel like I have to turn on the assist just to make it drivable after playing with no TSC, STM, or ABS in FM for the last decade. I certainly am not as hardcore into racing games as I was 10 years ago, so Forza's balances of accessibility to it's driving model keeps me playing even when I don't feel like taking the time to set up my wheel. Especially since currently I don't have a setup that makes my wheel comfortable to use.

Sure I'd like a bit more realism to Forza physics (the near non-existent simulation of Hybrid/KERS/DRS systems is my biggest Gripe with Forza's driving model), but not at the expense of the casual play experience. when I just feel like plopping down in my chair, grabbing my controller, and doing a few races.

Well, to be fair Assetto Corsa can be great with a controller, it is playable, it allows to drive to the edge, and it gives some good simulation vibes even with the controller.

Having said that, I agree with you.
Even though I remain a voracious lover of mototorsport and racing games, I don't have the time and energies to be into hardcore sim like I was 10 years ago.

Still, I would really love to find a game which can go deep into the real motorsport culture, remaining accessible and enjoyable to both wheel and controller users.

Forza, in these regards, is not far from being there.
T10 should definitely improve the physics of tyres and suspensions (and indeed they are working on them) adding this layer of interest to the car physics.
The cars currently behave a bit too "flat", missing a lot of reactions with the tarmac and level differences.

And they should focus more on the motorsport culture (qualifying, custom championships, race weekends, etc etc).

Let's see if they nail all of this with the new Forza.

 

[GBalao888]

Well, to be fair Assetto Corsa can be great with a controller, it is playable, it allows to drive to the edge, and it gives some good simulation vibes even with the controller.

Having said that, I agree with you.
Even though I remain a voracious lover of motorsport and racing games, I don't have the time and energies to be into hardcore sim like I was 10 years ago.

Still, I would really love to find a game which can go deep into the real motorsport culture, remaining accessible and enjoyable to both wheel and controller users.

Forza, in these regards, is not far from being there.
T10 should definitely improve the physics of tyres and suspensions (and indeed they are working on them) adding this layer of interest to the car physics.
The cars currently behave a bit too "flat", missing a lot of reactions with the tarmac and level differences.

And they should focus more on the motorsport culture (qualifying, custom championships, race weekends, etc etc).

Let's see if they nail all of this with the new Forza.

And don't forget the massive car list as well with more than possibly 800-1,000+ cars. The more realistic physics and new, motorsport-inspired game modes are sure to make driving these cars a whole lot more fun than previous Forza games, be it race cars, exotic cars, sports cars, classic cars, everyday cars, SUV's, trucks, rally/off-road cars and even the weird and wacky ones.

 

[o000o]

And don't forget the massive car list as well with more than possibly 800-1,000+ cars. The more realistic physics and new, motorsport-inspired game modes are sure to make driving these cars a whole lot more fun than previous Forza games, be it race cars, exotic cars, sports cars, classic cars, everyday cars, SUV's, trucks, rally/off-road cars and even the weird and wacky ones.

Not all cars within 800-1000 are motorsport related though?

 

[Zeitoss]

And don't forget the massive car list as well with more than possibly 800-1,000+ cars. The more realistic physics and new, motorsport-inspired game modes are sure to make driving these cars a whole lot more fun than previous Forza games, be it race cars, exotic cars, sports cars, classic cars, everyday cars, SUV's, trucks, rally/off-road cars and even the weird and wacky ones.

I am honestly not a fan of having a massive amount of cars, especially considering that many of them are not related to motorsport.

Personally, I would prefer 200-300 cars, well reproduced (graphics and physics wise).

 

[ctdc67]

I am honestly not a fan of having a massive amount of cars, especially considering that many of them are not related to motorsport.

Personally, I would prefer 200-300 cars, well reproduced (graphics and physics wise).

I am not a big fan of economy cars and van type vehicles in the game. But having a small variety of nonsport vehicles can be an interesting play.

 

[ShawnPhillips]

especially considering that many of them are not related to motorsport

Those cars are exactly why I love Forza. Lets me have fun racing things that would otherwise not be considered as a racing vehicle.
I serenely hope Gran Turismo 7 brings back some of the weird and wacky cars of the older games. One of my fondest memories in GT5 was a heated battle at the Nurburgring racing a Toyota Prius vs a Honda Insight with a friend.

 

[r_outsider]

If you really do a deep dive into the history of some of the cars you see and kind of scratch your head and wonder why they'd be in a racing game, you'll discover a lot of them really have a place there, and that's awesome. I've spent more time reading up on a lot of the oddballs than I care to think about, some of them turn out to have really cool stories. And then there's the Chelsea tractors, ruining everything of course...

They keep making the right noises, we'll see what they pull off. There's a lot of pent up angst now in the Xbox racing community, they have a real chance here. Hope they don't blow it.

 

[MarleyMoo]

Those cars are exactly why I love Forza. Lets me have fun racing things that would otherwise not be considered as a racing vehicle.
I serenely hope Gran Turismo 7 brings back some of the weird and wacky cars of the older games. One of my fondest memories in GT5 was a heated battle at the Nurburgring racing a Toyota Prius vs a Honda Insight with a friend.

And also why I like GT as well. It's just a lot of fun to do things you don't normally do, like drive a puny road car, which you might even own in real life, around the Ring, because why not? Even Top Gear puts their celebrities in some crappy family sedan. In this way games like Forza and GT are great sandboxes, and there's no need to limit ourselves to what other people consider race-able.

 

[GBalao888]

Those cars are exactly why I love Forza. Lets me have fun racing things that would otherwise not be considered as a racing vehicle.
I serenely hope Gran Turismo 7 brings back some of the weird and wacky cars of the older games. One of my fondest memories in GT5 was a heated battle at the Nurburgring racing a Toyota Prius vs a Honda Insight with a friend.

It's proof that any car, no matter how serious or strange, can be raced, for as long as you have the guts to really race it. Gran Turismo is also no stranger to this as well, especially their older games.

No matter how motorsport-focused the gameplay modes and mechanics are, we should always remember that Forza is all about the powerful love of the almighty automobile itself, as it's the cars that play an important role in building Forza's reputation.

I'm in it for the more realistic physics, as well as the newer and improved motorsport-inspired game modes and mechanics, but the massive amount of cars should stay and have new ones added. The richness of motorsport itself would not be complete without all these amazing cars we've had over the years, and might be like another Motorsport 5, or worse, the Project CARS series.

 

[o000o]

Those cars are exactly why I love Forza. Lets me have fun racing things that would otherwise not be considered as a racing vehicle.
I serenely hope Gran Turismo 7 brings back some of the weird and wacky cars of the older games. One of my fondest memories in GT5 was a heated battle at the Nurburgring racing a Toyota Prius vs a Honda Insight with a friend.

So yeah, the fact is car count is important, at least for series like GT and Forza (though we only see Horizon for huge car count in casual games, but that makes Horizon very high regarded). Their point is about automobile appreciation. Don't block the suggestion of normally good feature (many cars) just because some of the negative that may occur (ex: duplicates).

 

[YoungRhombus]

The car count has always been the main draw of Forza to me. I always like it when they add cars that I'm not familiar with, and I've learned a lot about the automotive world from playing Forza. Sure, not all cars may seem appropriate for a motorsport game at first, but I don't think there is a single car in Forza that has ever been insignificant to car culture and automotive history. Some cars are more widely recognized than others, but there's lots of fun in being able to race obscure cars. If we get rid of all these obscure and oddball cars, then I feel like it will become too similar to Project Cars or GT Sport. If I wanted to play a game like PCars or GT Sport, then I'd play them and not Forza.

That being said, that doesn't let the developers off the hook when it comes to fixing problems such as inaccurate engine sounds, modelling inaccuracies, and other missing features. These issues are old news at this point and have been discussed over and over again, so I won't go into them here. However, with the extra development time and such, I have faith that Forza can stay ahead of the competition. Chris Esaki has said that Forza's longtime fans will love this game, and I really hope he's right.

 

[Kano Manel]

If you want a Hardcore Sim then there are plenty of options, Asseto Corsa, iRacing rFactor, ect. Forza has a nice spot as an entry level sim that I'd rather it not lose. As Forza has a level of accessibility that lets me use it to introduce my non car guy friends to racing games that those other games cant deliver.

Nicely put. However, only one of those alternatives that you mention are available on Xbox One. Also the new Asseto Corsa (Competizione). Which is ok'ish, but rFactor 2 simulation is a generation ahead (with graphics that are a generation behind). And Competizione's use of the new Unreal engine was a mistake (after a year they are still fixing grafic bugs and the performance and looks of the game is still 'not there')(but Kunos is releasing dlc's). Automobolista 2 seems like an interesting game (but also feels a lot like is a PCars 2 dlc of sorts). That is why I droped computer gaming, it's becoming pointless, studios abuse the MVP concept and charge you for products that are actually not finished.

The only game that got it right (more or less), in my modest opinion, is Project Cars 2. The career is interesting, the racing is challenging, and the graphics are about right.

All that said, I have played 2 hours (yesterday night) of Forza Motorsport so far. I like it. It is similar to GT SPort in some aspects, but is better in some others. I particularly like how it drives. It has some nice details that I never saw in any of the Gran Turismo (for instance, the way the stock gearbox behaves is very well crafted, kind of realistic).

I just bought an Xbox One X, I'm happy to see a better'ish 'Need for Speed' and a better'ish Gran Turismo. Makes the Xbox a more interesting choice. I can't wait for the weekend to squeeze FM7... and Horizon... and Breakpoint... I'm going to need a dairy

 

[Frank McGank]

Assetto Corsa is not good to drive on a controller. And I don't want to feel like I have to turn on the assist just to make it drivable after playing with no TSC, STM, or ABS in FM for the last decade. I certainly am not as hardcore into racing games as I was 10 years ago, so Forza's balances of accessibility to it's driving model keeps me playing even when I don't feel like taking the time to set up my wheel. Especially since currently I don't have a setup that makes my wheel comfortable to use.

Sure I'd like a bit more realism to Forza physics (the near non-existent simulation of Hybrid/KERS/DRS systems is my biggest Gripe with Forza's driving model), but not at the expense of the casual play experience. when I just feel like plopping down in my chair, grabbing my controller, and doing a few races.

It’s not so much AC’s physics that make gamepad implementation suck, it’s that they did essentially no optimisation for gamepad input. The game sort of.. thinks you’re using a wheel and pedal setup even when playing on a pad. Because an analogue stick and triggers will never have the precision of a wheel and pedals, the game interprets movement of the pad inputs as 1:1 with a wheel and pedal setup. You move the stick 10% to the right (about the minimum you can move such a tiny input mechanism), the game interprets it as if you cranked a wheel 10% of its rotation axis. Which is a massive amount of input at anything more than carpark speeds. They’d need to make some sort of nonlinearity feature for gamepad users. Forza and GT do this, and that’s why they’re playable with a controller.

 

[ImaRobot]

It’s not so much AC’s physics that make gamepad implementation suck, it’s that they did essentially no optimisation for gamepad input. The game sort of.. thinks you’re using a wheel and pedal setup even when playing on a pad. Because an analogue stick and triggers will never have the precision of a wheel and pedals, the game interprets movement of the pad inputs as 1:1 with a wheel and pedal setup. You move the stick 10% to the right (about the minimum you can move such a tiny input mechanism), the game interprets it as if you cranked a wheel 10% of its rotation axis. Which is a massive amount of input at anything more than carpark speeds. They’d need to make some sort of nonlinearity feature for gamepad users. Forza and GT do this, and that’s why they’re playable with a controller.

Yeah, Forza and GT add in steering-input dampers for anything that's not a wheel, that's why those two are considered the most accessible "sim" on the market.

Alternatively, you can also make Forza have an input similar to that too by switching it to Simulation steering.

 

[ctdc67]

Nicely put. However, only one of those alternatives that you mention are available on Xbox One. Also the new Asseto Corsa (Competizione). Which is ok'ish, but rFactor 2 simulation is a generation ahead (with graphics that are a generation behind). And Competizione's use of the new Unreal engine was a mistake (after a year they are still fixing grafic bugs and the performance and looks of the game is still 'not there')(but Kunos is releasing dlc's). Automobolista 2 seems like an interesting game (but also feels a lot like is a PCars 2 dlc of sorts). That is why I droped computer gaming, it's becoming pointless, studios abuse the MVP concept and charge you for products that are actually not finished.

The only game that got it right (more or less), in my modest opinion, is Project Cars 2. The career is interesting, the racing is challenging, and the graphics are about right.

All that said, I have played 2 hours (yesterday night) of Forza Motorsport so far. I like it. It is similar to GT SPort in some aspects, but is better in some others. I particularly like how it drives. It has some nice details that I never saw in any of the Gran Turismo (for instance, the way the stock gearbox behaves is very well crafted, kind of realistic).

I just bought an Xbox One X, I'm happy to see a better'ish 'Need for Speed' and a better'ish Gran Turismo. Makes the Xbox a more interesting choice. I can't wait for the weekend to squeeze FM7... and Horizon... and Breakpoint... I'm going to need a dairy

PCars 2 is the game to play if you just bought a Xbox One X. It looks amazing. Forza 7 is a close 2nd...

 

[AudiMan2011]

FM update on Forza Monthly right now

 

[GBalao888]

From what I heard, this is what Chris Esaki said (notes I took down):

• He still mentions the same things, quote on quote, "taking what has made Forza great over the last 15 years and pairing it with new game concepts" and the community/connection aspect of the game
• He still calls it "new Forza Motorsport" (no "8", no other subtitle)
• Based on the feedback from the surveys he mentions that he conducted research on them by running weekly play-tests from throughout a wide array of Xbox game studios to further polish the game
• He mentioned that the physics and track dynamics have received an overhaul
• He also mentions that the competitive aspect like car balancing, public lobbies and Forza race regulations have also been addressed
• People in the so-called Forza panel can get access to an early prototype build of the game soon

 

[Nacho Libre]

Really nothing to show for... I put FM release hopefully in 2022.

 

[TokoTurismo]

I knew it wasn't going to be much, but the wait is kinda starting to take its toll now. Whatever that "Forza Penal" thing is, I will like to jump on board.

At least we know public lobbies have been addressed. But I want to know more.

 

[AudiMan2011]

The Forza Panel thing is likely related to this

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/thre...edback-to-help-guide-game-development.397948/

 

[Nacho Libre]

I applied twice, never heard from them.

 

[sirjim73]

I applied twice, never heard from them.

Same here

 

[strela]

Didn't expect much from the stream, so I'm not really disappointed. That early build however it's pretty good news, imo. I would be perfectly fine with a game that comes out like ACC or GTS did. Smaller content at the beginning with long lasting support. Anyway we have to wait for E3 for anything of substantial.