Forza Motorsport General Discussion Thread

[PJTierney]

Something I noticed in the demo video they showed this week, the start of the race had the same countdown setup as Forza Horizon 5. In other words, there was no rev meter displayed before you start moving.

Hopefully that’s just a sign of work-in-progress stuff but getting the right revs off the line is an important racing skill to master and I’m surprised the game seems to be hinting at ignoring it.

 

[PJTierney]

i Really hope they put Eagle Rock Speedway, we need more ovals on the game specially if they will bring at least the Buick GNX

It’s a little odd they’ve essentially dropped Homestead Miami Speedway for a new fictional oval, but that may be a licensing thing.

 

[PJTierney]

One thing from the official car list I don't understand is in the early images and trailers both the Cadillac and Acura DPi's are shown but they are not listed. (yet I guess?)

They were initially listed in January but then “pulled back” later on. Could be for one of two reasons:

Licensing deals fell through.
Content being held back for a DLC pack or Car Pass.

I’m inclined to believe it’s the latter as you’d typically never be allowed to show a car without having its model and livery approved, and the screenshots themselves also approved by the OEMs.

 

[skazz]

For some cars there was also the option that they appeared in FH5 first rather than making their debut in FM2023.
I get the distinct impression that when FM2023 was delayed various licensing agreements were affected and T10/PG decided to devote more time to new-to-Forza models entering FH5 in the intervening months before FM2023 release.

 

[sirjim73]

As RolexGTP said, the car list is temporary, it's only what we know for now; the game has yet to come out and they have promised about 500 cars, which should be about the same as what GT7 will have when FM releases. I'm not sure exactly how many tracks GT7 has (I've seen 63 thrown around, can someone confirm if that's accurate) so that's the only thing that seems likely FM will have a lot less of.

GT7 has 35 locations which is a better analogy (assuming FM8 has 20 locations at launch). 63 distinct layouts in total (excluding minor variants) sounds about right when you consider Dragon Trail has 2 tracks, Nurburgring also has Nordschleife, Tokyo has 4,653 different tracks (joke - it just feels like it), the new Grand Valley has 2 layouts etc.

But then FM8 will have more than 20 layouts assuming Silverstone has multiple layouts, we know about the historic Laguna Sega layout etc.

I will definitely enjoy FM8 and play it a huge amount , I've no doubt.

My main concern is not about the game itself really, it's more about why it has taken SIX years.

If you took that to the extreme analogy, FH6 will launch at the end of 2027! I doubt it will be that long for FH6, but these massive gaps used to be for GT games only (and GT used to be lambasted for it).

But that seems to be the norm now for most games that aren't just annual "reskins". Somehow developers must find a way to reduce these lead times, not only for our benefit but I believe for their financial survival too.

 

[skazz]

They already quoted 20 locations and 100+ layouts. Which is still a lot less than FM7 which had 32 locations and 200+ layouts:

Forza Motorsport 7: Confirmed Track List

This is part of a series of threads to help display and organise the information and discussions about Forza Motorsport 7 ahead of its release. The full list of threads can be found here: Forza Motorsport 7: What we Know Forza Motorsport 7: Confirmed Car List Forza Motorsport 7: News &...

www.gtplanet.net

 

[UKMikey]

They already quoted 20 locations and 100+ layouts. Which is still a lot less than FM7 which had 32 locations and 200+ layouts:

Forza Motorsport 7: Confirmed Track List

This is part of a series of threads to help display and organise the information and discussions about Forza Motorsport 7 ahead of its release. The full list of threads can be found here: Forza Motorsport 7: What we Know Forza Motorsport 7: Confirmed Car List Forza Motorsport 7: News &...

www.gtplanet.net

Esaki has at least paid lip service to the idea of adding new tracks after launch. They've given us no real reason to doubt them at this point.

 

[nukleabomb]

They already quoted 20 locations and 100+ layouts. Which is still a lot less than FM7 which had 32 locations and 200+ layouts:

Forza Motorsport 7: Confirmed Track List

This is part of a series of threads to help display and organise the information and discussions about Forza Motorsport 7 ahead of its release. The full list of threads can be found here: Forza Motorsport 7: What we Know Forza Motorsport 7: Confirmed Car List Forza Motorsport 7: News &...

www.gtplanet.net

I hope they have several tracks already in the works so that they can up those numbers quickly.
It is one of the few things that directly affect longevity of the game in career, free play, private multiplayer as well as competitive multiplayer.

 

[Kelpy D]

View attachment 1265725

Is that a widebody LFA

LFA Forza Edition?

I'm honestly excited to see more classic race cars after the M1B being added in Motorsport. Hopefully, these leaked cars from the past could end up making it to the game eventually:

• 1966 Lotus #22 35 Martin
• 1970 Matra-Simca #146 MS650
• 1990 Ford #20 Benetton B190
• 1954 Ferrari 500 TR
• 1966 Ford Lola T90
• 1994 Mercedes-Benz Penske PC23
• 1976 Tyrrell #3 P34
• 1988 Chevrolet Penske PC17

Plus many more open-wheels and prototypes from the 70s-90s.

 

[Confus]

I hope they have several tracks already in the works so that they can up those numbers quickly.
It is one of the few things that directly affect longevity of the game in career, free play, private multiplayer as well as competitive multiplayer.

I will be solely driving Mid-Ohio. I'm shocked it took this long for it to feature in a major title.

 

[GBalao888]

Finally preordered FM8 in the Premium edition. Now to start a countdown to October 5th. Can't wait to play the reason why I bought my Xbox Series X in the first place.

 

[ctdc67]

I am guessing FM will be in 4k 60fps and 1080p 120 fps. Has this been confirmed?

 

[nukleabomb]

I am guessing FM will be in 4k 60fps and 1080p 120 fps. Has this been confirmed?

So far, 4k60 for XSX and 1080p60 for XSS have been confirmed. No 120hz modes yet.

 

[Infinity448]

 

[Beezer215]

Well resolution scaling affects the entire image, whereas antialiasing is more targeted, so I assumed resolution scaling suffers a larger performance penalty. But I guess I'll check and see since I've never bothered trying it as the image has almost no jaggies with 100% and 8x MSAA in the first place.

Is there any visible benefit to using both resolution scaling and MSAA at the same time?

If you want to kill your FPS then that's a good way to do it.
I couldn't tell too much of a difference between 100, 105, 110 or 115. I left it on 105% and it looks fine and I got my smooth gameplay and FPS back. Wouldn't think it would be advantageous other than maybe for taking pictures.

It's hard for me to go against AMS2 because I'm biased but it has always looked wonderful. The kicker is the physics, FFB and niceties to back up all that pretty. I would think FM would get more polish before it comes out though.

 

[nukleabomb]

Posting this here, just to show the differences in rendering techniques. (Not for tribalism). Beware of music.



I'll be very happy to see a full digital foundry comparison between the 2 because it is very insightful.

Oh also, forza uses upscaling here. GT7 is native 4k on ps5, and checkerboard 1800p on ps4 pro. (Easiest give is looking at the speedometer digits ghosting or blurring out when they change) forza seems to have ditched msaa for taau or even fsr2.
Pretty cool that 2 completely designs and architecture look very similar at points.

 

[meganinja]

It’s a little odd they’ve essentially dropped Homestead Miami Speedway for a new fictional oval, but that may be a licensing thing.

Likely due the end of NASCAR exclusivity
Hopefully it means they will try bring Sunset Pennisula/Nissan Speedway and Sedona Raceway Park back

 

[AttackDickie]

Finally preordered FM8 in the Premium edition. Now to start a countdown to October 5th. Can't wait to play the reason why I bought my Xbox Series X in the first place.

I was going to do this the day of Forza Monthly. But do pre-orders work like Blu-rays on Amazon, guaranteed the cheapest price at launch? It may be unlikely, but pre-ordering the game so early (Premium Edition at that) and then seeing it at a discount sale price would hurt - a lot!

 

[meganinja]

Cadillac and Acura DPi's are shown but they are not listed. (yet I guess?)

Likely DLC or replaced by the new LMDh

The marketing with forza motorsport was that it would be built from the ground up, thats also why you see people conplain about some of car models becouse you then dont expect to see car models that are 2 gen behind, so those complaints are more than warrented if they going market it as game built from the ground up,

People dont know that cars can be ported to a engine to another as long they have the original 3D file?
It seems people never touched 3D Max or Blender

That car and track list are horrible. I’m hoping that there are more that just aren’t listed

They already quoted 20 locations and 100+ layouts.

There still 7 Tracks (1 new and 6 returning) and like 500 not listed cars yet
They will update when we get closer to October, they did that with the FH5 Car List as well

Esaki has at least paid lip service to the idea of adding new tracks after launch. They've given us no real reason to doubt them at this point.

Various Forzas add new tracks as times goes on, also update time will be more longer this time
Just keep in mind, FH4 had around 4 years of update and it looks that FH5 will have around 5 (if we consider that they will start on next Forza Horizon only when they finsh developing Fable, stated to come out only around 2025

Something I noticed in the demo video they showed this week, the start of the race had the same countdown setup as Forza Horizon 5. In other words, there was no rev meter displayed before you start moving.

Doesnt every FM was like that? at least I know they do the rev with countdown, but i dont know if the Rev Limters always shows up

I'll be very happy to see a full digital foundry comparison between the 2 because it is very insightful.

To be honest, i prefer ElAnalista than DF

Can't wait to play the reason why I bought my Xbox Series X in the first place.

Same bro... same

 

[FordGTGuy]

The lighting and environmental details are much better on Forza Motorsport.

The different track materials and interior materials in Forza Motorsport are more appropriately reflecting, diffusing, or absorbing light properly in comparison to AM2.

In AM2, all the light from the sun just seems like a general glow while in FM you can see the light absorbing and diffusing on the dashboard of the car. You can also see the road surface reflecting more strongly than the dull light absorbing concrete.

Everything in AM2 just glows the same off the lighting, no matter the material; it gives it a very flat look.

 

[McLaren]

Likely due the end of NASCAR exclusivity
Hopefully it means they will try bring Sunset Pennisula/Nissan Speedway and Sedona Raceway Park back

I’m not expecting it but I loved Sunset Infield so much back in the day before the likes of Daytona & Miami were added.

 

[skazz]

So I did a quick count:

GT7: 37 locations, 108 layouts, of which 18 real tracks and 19 fantasy tracks (might have miscounted?)
FM7: 32 locations, 120 layouts, of which 25 real tracks and 7 fantasy tracks.

If FM2023 has 20 locations at launch, I would expect only 4-5 fantasy tracks to match the previous offering. Unlike GT7 which has a significant focus on their own tracks.


Edit - source:

Gran Turismo 7 Master Track List

Gran Turismo 7 Master Track List Current location count: 39 Current variation count: 118 Notes: Track/location is from previous GT title other than GT Sport Track/location is new to GT series Americas [14 Locations, 36 Variations] Autodromo de Interlagos (1) Blue Moon Bay Speedway (6) Blue...

www.gtplanet.net

The Always-Up-To-Date Forza Motorsport 7 Track List

With Forza Motorsport 7 now available, we've got the full track list for Turn 10's latest racer. FM7 features the largest track selection in the franchise's history. The 32-strong lineup leans heavily on real-world locations, including the Nürburgring, Le Mans, and Suzuka. It also features fantas

www.gtplanet.net

 

[UKMikey]

I’m not expecting it but I loved Sunset Infield so much back in the day before the likes of Daytona & Miami were added.

I only started playing the franchise with 2 but every time I brought up the map of the Club layout its porcine shape reminded me of the Joni Mitchell lyric "Gonna see the folks I dig/I'll even kiss a Sunset pig/California, I'm coming home".

(I know the track was based in Florida, btw)

 

[PJTierney]

Doesnt every FM was like that? at least I know they do the rev with countdown, but i dont know if the Rev Limters always shows up

How it functioned is previous games is irrelevant here, I just find it odd considering how hard they’re pushing the “motorsport” aspect of this title that they ignore a core skill of racing.

 

[Terronium-12]

Well resolution scaling affects the entire image, whereas antialiasing is more targeted, so I assumed resolution scaling suffers a larger performance penalty. But I guess I'll check and see since I've never bothered trying it as the image has almost no jaggies with 100% and 8x MSAA in the first place.

Spatial AA, like SSAA heavily relies more on up and downsampling the image as opposed to running multiple passes of the same frame to smooth out jagged edges. Resolution/render scaling and SSAA are likely as cost prohibitive at the same settings, but render resolution is a bit more scalable since it has hard values (e.g. 25%, 50%, etc).

Is there any visible benefit to using both resolution scaling and MSAA at the same time?

That depends heavily on the in-game assets. If you're running a game at 4K at 200% render with 8x MSAA and that game doesn't have 4K, let alone 8K assets, no. Outside of a crisper image (because that will always be a benefit) there's no additional detail being resolved.

 

[Beebo]

Still quite sad we won't be seeing any 360 fantasy tracks return at launch (Aside from maple valley kind of?).

 

[Dak0ta]

To be honest, i prefer ElAnalista than DF

really? why? he has messed up resolutions in the past

 

[Ande3200]

Posting this here, just to show the differences in rendering techniques. (Not for tribalism). Beware of music.



I'll be very happy to see a full digital foundry comparison between the 2 because it is very insightful.

Oh also, forza uses upscaling here. GT7 is native 4k on ps5, and checkerboard 1800p on ps4 pro. (Easiest give is looking at the speedometer digits ghosting or blurring out when they change) forza seems to have ditched msaa for taau or even fsr2.
Pretty cool that 2 completely designs and architecture look very similar at points.

To early to say how the campare but will Watch digital foundry when he releases a camparsion, my guess is still that gt7 will have the advantage in car models overall and forza advantage with tracks and enviroments

 

[skazz]

Spatial AA, like SSAA heavily relies more on up and downsampling the image as opposed to running multiple passes of the same frame to smooth out jagged edges. Resolution/render scaling and SSAA are likely as cost prohibitive at the same settings, but render resolution is a bit more scalable since it has hard values (e.g. 25%, 50%, etc).



That depends heavily on the in-game assets. If you're running a game at 4K at 200% render with 8x MSAA and that game doesn't have 4K, let alone 8K assets, no. Outside of a crisper image (because that will always be a benefit) there's no additional detail being resolved.

Well I did some quick testing in FM7:

• 100% scaling, 8x MSAA: Baseline. Looks good but there are a few jaggies if you look closely
• 150% scaling, 8x MSAA: Uses roughly 50% more GPU power than baseline. Almost perfect, jaggies are really hard to find
• 200% scaling, 0x MSAA: Uses roughly 50% more GPU power than baseline. Markedly worse than 150%+8x, plenty of visible jaggies despite the very crisp image
• 200% scaling, 4x MSAA: Uses roughly 100% more GPU power than baseline. Very crisp, but slightly more jaggies than 150%+8x.
• 200% scaling, 8x MSAA: Didn't try this, since it would cause the image to drop below my fps limiter.

For me 150%+8x MSAA is pretty much perfect. Low power use, image quality is close to no jaggies and looks crisp.

 

[Populuxe]

I only started playing the franchise with 2 but every time I brought up the map of the Club layout its porcine shape reminded me of the Joni Mitchell lyric "Gonna see the folks I dig/I'll even kiss a Sunset pig/California, I'm coming home".

View attachment 1266038
(I know the track was based in Florida, btw)

Sedona was another Speedway I liked. The oval was fast but narrow. And it could be connected to the Sedona road course next to it for some extra long racing. I think losing long tracks like Sedona, the Camino Viejo de Monserrat complex, Rally di Positano, Benchmark High Speed Ring, Sidewinder Proving Grounds, and, yes, Fujimi Kaido, may be a big reason why FM5 and 6 felt like a step backwards, despite the much better visuals.