Forza

[Jedi2016]

There's plenty of fanboyism going on here, and not all of it's GT4-related. Seems there's quite a few folks who are convinced that Forza is the superior game, and won't budge from that stance. In which case, there's certainly nothing I can do to change their minds.

Forza has nothing it has to "prove" to me.. Even if I did own an Xbox (which I don't), I could simply buy both. I'm not in a position to "choose" one game over another if they both interest me. Enthusia is a good example.. if it's a good game in it's own right, I'll buy it. I'm not going to base that decision on whether or not it's "better than GT4", and I'm not going to limit myself to one or the other, as the Forza fanboys seem to be doing. Forza may well be a good game, but are you really going to pass over GT4 to get it? Or will you get both?

I'll simply wait and let the reviews speak for themselves. We'll let the professionals decide which is better, eh? How about an average review-comparison, once both games are released? (Gamespot+IGN+EGM+OPM/OXM)/4. And see which has the higher score.

 

[CAMAROBOY69]

Since were comparing games how will Forza compare to Enthusia Professional Racing? Is that a closer comparison? I personally think it looks a lot better than Forza.

 

[Dev_Zero]

First of, WHO, WHO says that all RACING SIMS, have to be realistic?

Simulation

sim·u·la·tion (smy-lshn)
n.

-Close resemblance or imitation, as of one symptom or disease by another.
-Assumption of a false appearance.
-Reproduction or representation, as of a potential situation or in experimental testing.

In this case, close resemblance or imitation of cars. Cars are a real life product. So simulation in this case equals realism.

 

[McLaren]

Ok, I get that. But I don't think that means people should hate Forza just because it can't offer REAL LIFE graphics. There hasn't been a Xbox game I've seen yet, that looks anything like GT4.

I've played and its like a step-up from PGR2 which is a good thing b/c PGR2 was awesome on its graphics. After playing a part of Forza for myself, I like it! 👍

 

[Dev_Zero]

Mclaren, that is very true. But I personally think the cars look unreal because of the "plastic" effect. Although people deny it's existence, it's clearly there. The cars' paint looks matte, whereas with GT it clearly has a shiny coat.
Games where this is most noticable are Ninja Gaiden and Vice City.

 

[McLaren]

I know. I haven't really seen an reflection for myself yet. So I guess until the Full thing is out, it may never be there.

 

[code_kev]

Seems there's quite a few folks who are convinced that Forza is the superior game, and won't budge from that stance.

I said neither was better . It just does stuff that GT games should have...but the Gt fanboys like to pretend that it's a PGR2 expansion with rice

So far it and Halo2 look like games that push the Xbox's power to the max.

Well Halo 2 certainly does, looks like a pc game in places

and I'm not going to limit myself to one or the other, as the Forza fanboys seem to be doing.

I hope that wasn't aimed at me, because I've said 3 BILLION times I'll end up getting both

Mclaren, that is very true. But I personally think the cars look unreal because of the "plastic" effect. Although people deny it's existence, it's clearly there.

PGR2 is funny. AT times it looks absolutly stunning, amazing reflections, and insane levels of detail on the tracks etc. Then at other times, when using certain cars the reflections are there...they are just so light that it looks like the cars are made from painted wood. The Ferraris in PGR2 are imo better looking then anything in GT4, they are fantastic...shame alot of the cars in the game don't seem to follow that standard. The track side detail in that game is also FANTASTIC, even the water ripples

Games where this is most noticable are Ninja Gaiden and Vice City.

Well NG looks really REALLY nice, I do agree that the lighting is abit flat, but thats down to the devs. Vice city on the xbox has real time reflections on the cars, so they look nice and metalic.

From a technology standpoint, I'd say forzas graphics are better, it's more detailed, sharper, better textures, higher poly cars blah blah blah blah, but PD have this fantastic knack of using realistic looking textures, and getting the lighting just right, so that as long as your not too close, it looks really damn good.

 

[erahk64]

I know. I haven't really seen an reflection for myself yet. So I guess until the Full thing is out, it may never be there.

The IGN videos of a demo build and videos from E3 has reflections on the cars.
If the OXM demo doesn't have reflections,
maybe it's even older than the E3 demo which was only 40 % complete.

They will also do a lot of polishing and tuning according to a Gamespot video interview last month.

 

[Jay]

I hope that wasn't aimed at me, because I've said 3 BILLION times I'll end up getting both

Thats doesnt prove anything, for example someone could be a Half life 2 fanboy, but still buy Doom 3 and enjoy it.

 

[code_kev]

A halflife 2 fanboy would play doom 3, and try NOT to enjoy it on purpose (if for some reason they had a grudge against it), they play with a closed mind. I see forza and Gt4 as games, couldn't give a crap who made them, or what it's on. Oh care to give examples of me being a fanboy? btw saying that a feature of GT4 looks crap doesn't count I want some GOOD solid examples ie "i think forza will be better because playstation 2s suck". And no, that quote doesnt count.

 

[Jay]

A halflife 2 fanboy would play doom 3, and try NOT to enjoy it on purpose (if for some reason they had a grudge against it), they play with a closed mind. I see forza and Gt4 as games, couldn't give a crap who made them, or what it's on. Oh care to give examples of me being a fanboy?

True, and even if the HL2 fanboy did enjoy D3, they would try to convince themselfs and others that D3 is crap.

Oh care to give examples of me being a fanboy?

I never said you were a fanboy.

 

[code_kev]

Ahh all is forgiven

*whispers* i though HL2 owned doom 3

 

[Jay]

Ahh all is forgiven

*whispers* i though HL2 owned doom 3

*whispers* agreed

Im curious how D3 will turnout on Xbox?

 

[code_kev]

Should be ok, just look at riddick. What I wonder is HOW THE HELL will they do half life 2 for the xbox! Doom 3 wont be too hard as all the locations are small, but half life 2s are massive and wide open at times....and then theres the ultra complex physics...good look to the devs doing it, they need it

 

[Cheshyrkat]

Well I got the demo. If anything its a GT alternative, nothing more. It feels alot like Sega GT 2k2 though the cars dont feel as heavy. Physics(no assists) are good, easily on par with GT3 or Prologue. I havent played enough of the BMW demo to really compare but feel that demo is beyond both GT3 and Prologue. GT does conveys a better sense of weight to the cars.
Graphically its not all that. Technically speaking its doing more, its just not as convincing as GT. Reflections across the cars really chop but the self shadowing is something I wish GT had. The track look really nice but the car models are only so-so. Its also at 30fps. Not a huge deal but it really buged me in PGR2 and it does here to. IMO I would much rather cut a couple of effects to get the framerate up. Certainly not a deal breaker by anymeans just isnt as smooth as I preffer. If RSC2 can look as good as it does at 60fps I think this game should to.
Sounds are better then in GT though the demo is buggy in that department when changing views. The Scooby, Ferrari, Porsche all sound like they should.
Damage looks nice though nothing spectacular by any means in this demo. Doesnt effect peformance but its visually satisfying. The sparks are kinda overdone and I hope that gets toned down.
My only real gripe about the demo is the sensitivity in the buttons. I just wish I could scale back the sensitivity of the controlls. Takes very little input to get a big reaction like locking the breaks or pulling hard while steering. The controls are just overly sensitive but thats something that can be easily fixed in the final game.
Overall I am sort of underwhelmed. Im sure its mostly due to the extremely limited nature of the demo and also being that its really just more of the same cars and track Ive seen in countless videos and pics. Im still looking forward the final game. Its certainly looking to be the game I bought an Xbox for.

 

[TheSquidd]

Should be ok, just look at riddick. What I wonder is HOW THE HELL will they do half life 2 for the xbox! Doom 3 wont be too hard as all the locations are small, but half life 2s are massive and wide open at times....and then theres the ultra complex physics...good look to the devs doing it, they need it

Actually if you notice the HL2 open areas are quite low poly, HL2 in general is low poly, the games engine is based on advanced texturing (which it does a great job of) so all XBOX would need to do is have specular mapping, reflective water, and bump mapping to accurately display HL2

 

[McLaren]

I don't know how you were driving, but I think the damage is great. And another cool thing I found tonight in the demo.

In real life, if a race car, say a Toyota GT-ONE gets too close to the back of another car and taps it just right it can cause a negative effect. Same is done Forza. Even a ram right into the back can cause you and the other car to start fishtailing off the track. A great little thing I noticed not in GT3.

And like he said, the Porsche and Ferrari sound like they should.
The damage DOES affect drviving. Smash the bumper and you should notice the car does not get as much speed as it did before. Even scraping the wall will leave a black streak on your car.

I am NOT a Forza fanboy though. I will BUY both along with Enthusia and GTR when it comes on the Xbox.

 

[kinigitt]

Actually if you notice the HL2 open areas are quite low poly, HL2 in general is low poly, the games engine is based on advanced texturing (which it does a great job of) so all XBOX would need to do is have specular mapping, reflective water, and bump mapping to accurately display HL2

HL2 is an incredibly complex game, and the environments are by no means "low poly". Just look at the trees and buildings.

Actually, I'd bet that HL2 has a higher poly count on screen than doom 3. If you turn the effects off in doom 3, everything becomes almost crudely blocky. The character models look so good because of the awesome lighting and normal mapping, like halo2 and Riddick. If you look closely, those 2 games have ridiculously low poly counts on the character models, but look brilliant because of the effects the artists use.

Kind of like GT4. Texturing and lighting, combined with animation and camera tricks, make the replays almost look real sometimes. Forza has a ****load more polygons per car, much more advanced particle effects, bloom lighting, self shadowing, real time reflections (that GT4 now has, to a lesser extent) and hi-res textures... but it simply doesn't look as good. A good art team is crucial to a game's graphical prowess.

 

[tiptopcream]

Forza Motorsport - It's not very good is it...

Framerate, sound, AI, handling, sense of speed range between POOR and AVERAGE. It's not even the best Xbox racer judging by the demo.

 

[kinigitt]

Forza Motorsport - It's not very good is it...

Framerate, sound, AI, handling, sense of speed range between POOR and AVERAGE. It's not even the best Xbox racer judging by the demo.

have you played it?

impressions please

 

[Hajaz]

ive played it...
imo the look of gt4 is better, but forza has proper anti aliasing, making it easier on the eyes.
the framerate is a bit lowish in the demo, but i did hear that this build is rather old.

it really shines in the physics/ai department tho. ive seen the ai do some mad things trying to overtake other ai cars. the handling is alot less forgiving then gt4's (demo).
also when an opponent bumps into you you actually have to struggle to regain control of your car, something GT doesnt have either.

my guess is forza will be a far less accesible game to most gamers. it takes alot of time to get the hang of. it is more sim like then gt imo

 

[kinigitt]

ive played it...
imo the look of gt4 is better, but forza has proper anti aliasing, making it easier on the eyes.
the framerate is a bit lowish in the demo, but i did hear that this build is rather old.

it really shines in the physics/ai department tho. ive seen the ai do some mad things trying to overtake other ai cars. the handling is alot less forgiving then gt4's (demo).
also when an opponent bumps into you you actually have to struggle to regain control of your car, something GT doesnt have either.

my guess is forza will be a far less accesible game to most gamers. it takes alot of time to get the hang of. it is more sim like then gt imo

brilliant. That's good news.

 

[kinigitt]

Forza Motorsport - It's not very good is it...

Framerate, sound, AI, handling, sense of speed range between POOR and AVERAGE. It's not even the best Xbox racer judging by the demo.

have you played it? or are you just another hater?

please don't hate.

 

[code_kev]

Sounds like a hater to me.

 

[tiptopcream]

have you played it? or are you just another hater?

please don't hate.

I have the demo and nothing in it as impressed me. The first thing that hits you is the god awful framerate, it's down right shocking. It's not even a solid 30fps with four cars on track. 👎 I haven't seen anything good of the AI, they don't defend their position from you, they're slow and they'll even stop right behind you if you stop on track and start to bump you. I'll put some videos up in a bit.

 

[cobragt]

I played the demo aswell and it's good. The handling is better than gt3's and almost on par with gt4p. I want to play the latest gt4 demo, I'm sure that blows the forza demo out of the water in physics. But what I didn't like in forza is, the car powerslide like the ones in pgr2.

 

[kinigitt]

I played the demo aswell and it's good. The handling is better than gt3's and almost on par with gt4p. I want to play the latest gt4 demo, I'm sure that blows the forza demo out of the water in physics. But what I didn't like in forza is, the car powerslide like the ones in pgr2.

I thought you would try to throw salt on it and hiss if you saw the demo in person.

Powerslide like PGR2? Elaborate.

 

[code_kev]

Heh I find the powersliding comment hard to believe

 

[cobragt]

Have you ever tried powersliding in pgr2? It feels the same in forza. And driving a P2 ferrari was easy, should it be easy?

 

[code_kev]

Well Cobra, driving a 500 bhp nissan in GTp is also easy

And yes I used to powerslide like a whore in PGR2.