Four Hours: The Nürburgring 4Hr Companion & Competition

[Chakra]

@shem: "The therapy race".
Nice and unusuale race interpretation, maybeee ?? Same here, it is like getting lost in known and unknown places, every lap is the same route but no lap has the same route.
4 hrs on V-Nordschleife is more than relaxing, if you do not intend to be the winner.
That´s why I love Famines race reports (and all other too !).
Now I´ve managed with 440 LP (Lotus R) withhin the rules in this thread a 9:06 as average lap ( 1st after relaxing 4 hours). OK, no good time, let´s say bad. But I am living that race...no race wheel anymore, no shifting. And all adds on. Next will be the same car with 430.
It is a therapy race where I can touch my heart and all hearts, e.p. those who died at the Nürburgring.

 

[axletramp]

I decided a few weeks ago to start running these in order to learn the Nürburgring Nordschleife circuit as I had very little experience of it and Famine's reports sounded great.

I had a plan. Start with too much power and work your way down. First I ran the RX-7 TC (new DLC) which is nice and stable plus, more importantly, 593PP. I loved running this and it enabled me to learn every bend, straight and nuance the track had to offer. Needless to say I won by over 11 minutes, lapping everyone as a consequence. However, there were plenty of spins and gravel moments - the car looked like a banger racer at the end! Fastest lap was around 8:30.xx - come on, I was learning the circuit! Neither the GT1 Turbo or R8 LMS turned up.

So a couple of weeks ago I decided to run it again but with a lower PP car - stick to the plan! So I had a run through my garage and decided a 50PP drop to the G37 was the way to go. Great fun, far fewer mistakes, but still an easy win (for me) by 6 minutes, including tons of sandbagging on the last two laps. Fastest lap was around 8:40.xx. Still no GT1 Turbo or R8 LMS.

So we come to my latest run (yesterday) with another 50PP drop, as follows:

Car: Nissan Silvia spec-R AERO (S15) RM '02
HP: 278
PP: 492
Mods: None
Top Speed Setting: 199mph - big mistake as she never got over 160mph!
Tyres: RS
All aids off. ABS 1. DFGT wheel.

Grid:
1. AEM S2000
2. Nissan Option Stream Z '04
3. G37
4. CTR Yellowbird 87
5. Carbon R (R34) '04
6. S2000 GT1 '04
7. Me - Nissan Silvia spec-R AERO (S15) RM '02
8. HKS CT230R '08
9. Nismo 380RS Super Leggera
10. Art Morrison Corvette
11. IS-F Racing Concept '08
12. BNR 34 SKYLINE GTR V-spec N1

Lap 1 - 9:09.040
Have beer by my side and make a solid start, car feels very stable. Back end is very hard to break loose, if at all! Things looking good then. Third by turn four of the GP circuit but being left behind on straight line speed by the first two. It was clear quite early on that I was in trouble on the straights. Managed to catch and pass them to go first by Flugplatz. Ended lap 8 secs up. Worked out I lose about 6-8 secs on the main straight. Gulp!

Lap 2 - 9:09.043
Mr Metronome! 3 thousandths difference! Fluke more than skill I'm afraid. Pulled out 8 secs then lost it on the straight. 8 secs lead at the end.

Lap 3 - 9:00.xx
Nothing to report. Lead up to about 12 secs.

Lap 4 - 9:00.xx
Extended lead and feeling comfortable - I am surprised how well this sub-500PP car is going, especially in my hands!

Lap 5 - 9:04.xx
Nooo! Small off along the side of Klostertall costs me about 5 or 6 seconds. And it was going so well.

Lap 6 - 9:19.xx
Pit in. This car is so gentle on it's tyres (plus I haven't gone off to damage them) that I pit 1 lap later than my previous runs. No fuel needed either as she's only used about 7-8 litres per lap. Wow! 2nd place pits on the same lap. Gap was 23 secs, now it's 47. I realise that this is going to be an easy win... which probably explains why I relax a bit later on. Get another beer.

Lap 7 - 9:21.xx
Out lap. Nothing special.

Lap 8 - 8:55.xx
In the groove now!

Lap 9 - 8:53.xx
That was a quick one! Any hope of the rest of the field catching me are being dashed now. Starting to wish I'd cycled through for the GT1 Turbo or R8 LMS.

Lap 10 - 9:02.xx
Off on the grass at one of the easiest sections - Hatzenbach. I forgive myself and move on.

Lap 11 - 9:10.xx
Backmarkers appear, starting with a hugely wayward Art Morrison. Touch the grass at Pflanzgarten and lose about 15 secs. I just about forgive myself and move on.

Lap 12 - 9:22.xx
Pit in. Very low fuel, but tyres holding up. Take on 55 litres (6 laps worth) and new RS boots.

Lap 13 - 9:48.xx
Pit out. 2 hours gone, 2:03 ahead. Get new beer from fridge. 👍

Lap 14 - 9:30.xx
OK, that wasn't my fault! After negotiating a spinning fog machine of a Yellowbird at Brünnchen, I then encounter a meandering Nismo 380RS Super Leggera who side swipes me at 130mph and I pull a full 520° spin into the (sticky) barrier. 🤬 That was a fast lap too!

Lap 15 - 9:21.xx
Hello concentration, where are you?! Hatzenbach again - what's going on! Lose loads of time, yet my lead is up to 2'32. I guess the rest of the pack are having a few bad laps too.

Lap 16 - 9:09.xx
And again, just not so bad. At least my lap times are going in the right direction. My offs have damaged my tyres, but I must make it to lap 18 to keep my 6 lap schedule going. So I go steady to preserve them.

Lap 17 - 9:01.xx
A better lap without pushing. Tyres holding up.

Lap 18 - 9:18.xx
Pit in. Phew, front tyres almost gone. Another 55 litres of fuel. Lead down to 2:24 - not sure how. A couple of lapped cars un-lap themselves. What's that, a beer you say? Ahh, go on then.

Lap 19 - 9:50.xx
Pit out. Thank God for back markers. Some of them are quick and give me the chance to chase them down. Catch them in the corners and they catch me in the straights - oh such fun!

Lap 20 - 9:02.xx
Spectacular off at Metzgesfeld whilst attempting a massively ambitious backmarker overtake. Well come on, it was getting late and the alcohol fueled pit stops haven't helped.

Lap 21 - 8:51.xx
There it is, back in the saddle! Fastest lap comes from me just concentrating on good lines and keeping up the momentum - this car is not fast in a straight line - 132mph through Klostertal and 160 on the main straight.

Lap 22 - 8:59.xx
Backmarker chasing drops my lap time a bit - still, had fun with the Nissan Option Stream Z for a while.

Lap 23 - 9:03.xx
Nothing special, just keeping it steady now to the end. Lead up to just over 3 minutes.

Lap 24 - 9:22.xx
Pit in. Small grassy moment loses me about 8 seconds. Starting to work out if I need to start sandbagging or not. Decided on 20 litres of fuel and new tyres. I grab a whiskey to celebrate the fast approaching win.

Lap 25 - 9:38.xx
Pit out. Steady lap where I pass a couple of backmarkers - spinning Yellowbird thrown in for entertainment! Start lap 26 with 10:10 to go.

Lap 26 - 10:13.xx
I decide to go for it and sandbag at the end. Last bit of action: as I come flying down the main straight at 160mph I find the Nismo 380RS Super Leggera sideways and stationary in the braking zone. Full lock up and just managed to miss him. That woke me up!! Anyway cruised around the final chicane at about 30mph and floored it across the line 3 seconds past the 4 hours. Total time was 4:00:03.xx. Gap back to the HKS CT230R '08 in second place was 3:22. Lapped everyone up to 6th place (Carbon R (R34) '04)

Conclusion:
The Nissan Silvia spec-R AERO (S15) RM '02 was great fun for this but I would have liked a closer competition to keep me more committed for the full race. Next time I'll wait for the big two to show up or try with the 473PP MX-5 TC, which is my next target. I'm now really enjoying this circuit and challenge, amazing as a few months ago Nordschleife was one of my least favourite circuits. I can now even drive it in my head, which helps no end.

'Till the next time, AT out!

 

[Famine]

Grugh.

More testing, more power (up to 426PP now), 9'02 lap easily in practice, 9'24, 9'10, 9'12 in the race. Smegging thing. Well, time to try a different car.


Sorry I haven't update the OP recently - a 16 day old baby tends to distract one... But I'll do it shortly.

 

[W3H5]

I had a plan. Get new beer from fridge. 👍

Nice plan. I like the report too. That's how I should write mine, more concise and to the point.

More testing, more power

Still looking for an 02 RS? I've got one in my garage I'm not using if you want it.

 

[axletramp]

Sorry I haven't update the OP recently - a 16 day old baby tends to distract one... But I'll do it shortly.

Totally understand, you must be knackered.

Nice plan. I like the report too. That's how I should write mine, more concise and to the point.

Cheers. 👍 Enjoying these so much I've forgotten about the Seasonals. It's just getting to fit them in and I was lucky on the last one as my wife was away for the night with work.

 

[Famine]

Still looking for an 02 RS? I've got one in my garage I'm not using if you want it.

No, I did the 444PP race in one. I'm trying to get FWD down to 430PP now - the Focus may do the job, but I tend not to use the same car twice

 

[DixonFan]

2 and a bit hours in to my first attempt at this race. Wish I had found this thread first as I am waaay overdone on power (using Kaz's 24hr GTR with stage 2 turbo and racing soft, just to be safe). Mind you, I made the classic Nurburgring mistake of miscalculating fuel requirements, and ran out of gas just past Karussel, which lost me 4 minutes. The deficit lasted a few laps but am now well and truly back in the lead.

Like others here, I didn't really like the 'ring, too many corners that I could never get the hang of, but this event is brilliant for learning it. I'm now able to get to the correct side of the track for upcoming corners, and am no longer braking to a near standstill because I couldn't remember how tight the corner was...

Anyway, enough chit-chat, time to get back to it, for sure will be doing this one again but with a slightly less competitive car to make the race, er, more competitive!

 

[SuperCobraJet]

Sorry I haven't update the OP recently - a 16 day old baby tends to distract one... But I'll do it shortly.

Oh my! I should say so.

Congratulations are in order I presume.

Hope all is well with mum and the little tyke.

I can relate.
Its been just over 5 years since my daughter had triplets and came to live with us right afterwards for about a month.

It was quite an experience.
A real tag-team operation.
All my racing with GT4 at the time, ceased to exsist.

 

[HaylRayzor]

Sorry I haven't update the OP recently - a 16 day old baby tends to distract one...

Better you than me, er, I mean, Congratulations!

... and am no longer braking to a near standstill because I couldn't remember how tight the corner was...

Thats one way to do it I suppose... My philosophy when learning a track is to go as fast as I can and gradually slow down until I can actually stay on pavement through all the corners. It's rough on the fenders, but I get to experience parts of the track that most people never see...

 

[W3H5]

I learnt the track properly on GT4's 1 guided lap behind the Skyline pace car licence test. I hated it before then. It was on that test I realised not to view it as a circuit but as a set of country lanes that were unknown to me.

After taking this view on it I began to remember certain parts. The more I drove it the more I remembered until I had it all mapped and knew ever corner. It took weeks but it's now over 5 years I've been in love with the Green Hell.

 

[DixonFan]

Thats one way to do it I suppose... My philosophy when learning a track is to go as fast as I can and gradually slow down until I can actually stay on pavement through all the corners. It's rough on the fenders, but I get to experience parts of the track that most people never see...

Straight from the Gilles Villeneuve school of racing I should add the slow corners would normally come after bouncing off walls from taking corners too fast...

Finished the race last night, thought about sandbagging the last lap but the gap to the Audi in 2nd place was around the difference that I would have to sandbag. I was lowish on gas - certainly not enough to do another lap, so had to decide if I should slow down and cross the line just after 4 hours and hopefully before the Audi crossed the line (forcing another lap) or play it safe and pit. Needless to say I went for option 2, just as well as the Audi crossed the line 15 seconds before the 4 hour was up.

I really enjoyed that race (even though it wasn't that close), great circuit, great car. Fastest lap was an 8:05, consistency was appalling though, my lap times were all over the place.

Already thinking about the next time, and also need to be a little more Jenson and a little less Lewis to get more life out of the tyres.

 

[Loskey1]

Glad I found this thread, Im a big fan of this race. Currently running 6th in a standard BMW M3 CSL. I was running on sport soft tyres but just changed then to racing hards at the 1st pit stop. If I catch the leader to easily I will swap back to the sport softs

 

[axletramp]

OK, as my plan continues (see post #602) I have now run the MX-5 TC. Wow, this has probably been the best race I've ever run offline. My heart's pumping and I'm absolutely buzzing. I didn't know what was going to happen as I entered the final lap with 7'33 left on the clock. This is what happened:

Car: Mazda MX-5 Roadster TC
HP: 197
PP: 473
Mods: None
Top Speed Setting: 168mph
Tyres: RS
All aids off. ABS 1. DFGT wheel.

Grid:
1. Nissan Option Stream Z '04
2. BNR 34 SKYLINE GTR V-spec N1
3. IS-F Racing Concept '08
4. BNR 34 SKYLINE GTR V-spec N1
5. Carbon R (R34) '04
6. Gran Turismo Skyline GT-R '01
7. Me - Roadster TC
8. CTR Yellowbird
9. HKS CT230R '08
10. G37
11. Nismo 380RS Super Leggera
12. Skyline GT-R R-Tune (R34) '99

I chose not to go up against the GT1 Turbo or R8 LMS as I wanted a close race and I wouldn't stand a chance with only 197bhp.

Lap 1 - 9:08.xxx
Off we go and I'm straight to the back of the grid. Not to worry as the little MX-5 doesn't need much space to stop in and I'm 5th after the first corner. I soon discover that all I can do is hold on to the position I'm in as the opposition are considerably faster them me in a straight line. This car is also a little more wayward than my previous rides (RX-7 TC, G37 & Silvia RM) but that's probably because I'm having to push her more and I haven't made any adjustments to the setup. Clean enough lap leaves me just over 8 secs off the lead in 5th place at the end. Only 145mph on the main straight - yikes!

Lap 2 - 9:11.xxx
Pushing now to keep in touch. Car likes to understeer a little too much for my liking, but I work round it. A couple of small offs loose me about 5 secs. At the end I'm still 5th and 10 secs off the lead with 6th place dropping away slowly.

Lap 3 - 9:11.xxx
Keep pushing. One small grass moment. Still a safe 5th.

Lap 4 - 9:13.xxx
More pushing and trying to hold on to leaders. Small grass moment. Front tyres at about 70%, rears appear to be immortal with hardly any wear! Looking good for a 6 lap sequence. 13 secs off lead.

Lap 5 - 9:15.xxx
Pass the spinning Yellowbird (of course) and into 4th. This gives me hope that the guys in front will start to have tyre issues. My front end grip is dropping but another lap isn't a problem, so I keep it steady rather than going flat out. Take the lead as all those in front of me pit. Yay!

Lap 6 - 9:24.xx
Pit in. No pressure on me so I pull off a quick lap. Front tyres at about 40%, rears at 80%. No fuel needed as I have about 60% left! Don't you just love small capacity engines in endurance races.

Lap 7 - 9:37.xx
Pit out. Stay in the lead by about 20 secs. Good lap, in the zone now.

Lap 8 - 9:05.xx
Fast lap which as usual comes from nowhere. Feeling less apprehensive now.

Lap 9 - 9:09.xx
Small grassy moment at Brunnchen is the only thing to report. Holding gap to second. What I gain between Metzgesfeld and Bergwerk I lose at Angst Kurve and on the main straight.

Lap 10 - 9:12.xx
Hmm. The tyre wear issues that I expected 2nd and 3rd place to have are not appearing. This will be their in lap and I'm not shaking them. Worrying as my lead has dropped to 8 secs..

Lap 11 - 9:14.xx
Not my best lap, but OK. Lead up to just over 50 secs at the start. 2nd and 3rd are moving fast on new tyres and start to close the gap down.

Lap 12 - 9:21.xx
Pit in. 40secs ahead as I pit. Take on fresh tyres and 30 litres of fuel. Exit pit as 1st and 2nd fly past leaving me 8 secs behind in 3rd. Now I know who the opposition are - the Mine's twins!

Lap 13 - 9:38.xx
The chase is on. I now realise this is not going to be straight forward and I've got to fight for this. And the fight is against two identical Mine's Skylines who leave me for dead on every straight and appear to be completely unaffected by tyre wear. OK, let's go then!

Lap 14 - 9:08.xx
New tyres really help this little car. Keep it clean, keep it consistent - but the Mine's twins continue to open the gap and I'm getting harassed by the IS-F from behind.

Lap 15 - 9:09.xx
Same again. Just trying to keep the IS-F behind (who I'm not really racing for the win) while the twins keep going. Twins and IS-F pit.

Lap 16 - 9:13.xx
Twins exit about 9 secs behind me. I need to be perfect here to keep them away from me. Aaagh! FAIL! Pushing too hard I pull a 360 at Kleiner Karussell and end up 3rd. Not good as they disappear at an alarming rate down the main straight. 145mph v 190mph does not work!

Lap 17 - 9:21.xx
Bad to worse as I lose it again and drop a ton of time. Even the IS-F appears on the map.

Lap 18 - 9:22.xx
Pit in for tyres and another 30 litres. OK lap, not good enough though - I need more.

Lap 19 - 9:32.xx
Pit out about a minute behind the Twins but safe in 3rd. Really worried about how this is going now.

Lap 20 - 9:08.xx
Just keep going as quick as I can. Thinking about coming a couple of laps early on lap 22 so I can maximise my tyres. I could do with any advantage now! Twins pit and I split them as they exit the pit to go second. You could throw a blanket over the three of us.

Lap 21 - 9:09.xx
I end up third on the main straight. I'm sure these two are running faster now. Keeping in touch though. Fuel running low.

Lap 22 - 9:16.xx
Pit in. Tyres and my final 30 litres. This is where it gets really tricky. I know that the Twins are going to pit on lap 25 which will take about 1 minute. Therefore I need to stay within 1 minute to have a hope in hell of staying in front on the final lap... plus keep them there.

Lap 23 - 9:24.xx
Pit out. OK, no prisoners now. I have to hang it out there. If it goes wrong I'm so far ahead of 3rd I'll stay there. If it works... IF! I come out 54 seconds behind. Grandstand finish or what!

Lap 24 - 9:11.xx
Very fast through the twists but a couple of shaky moments on the edge of the grass mean an average lap. However, I maintain the gap at 54-55 seconds by the end.

Lap 25 - 9:08.xx
Aaargh! 145mph feels slower each lap. Decent lap and the little lady gripping through the corners for all her life. 54 secs becomes 52 becomes 50. Somewhere ahead the Twins have pitted.

Lap 26 - 9:09.xx
7:33 left on the the clock. As I accelerate down the start/finish straight i can't tell you how good it feels to see the Twins still in the pits. However, as I cross the line they pull out. FUUUUUUUUUU...... This is it, a straight race to the line against two cars who are going to eat me on the straights if I don't get away from them. As I negotiate the GP section I'm only 9.9 secs ahead. If I don't nail every corner, that's not enough time.

For the first time in a very long time my heart goes crazy and I'm full of adrenaline. Use the Force Luke! I absolutely nail everything to Aremburg - lead up to 11.5 secs. Hold it together, hold it together. The Twins are always quick here and it's 10 secs at Kallenhard. Brake late, nail every apex, power on early... up to 12 secs by Bergwerk.

From Bergwerk to Karussell the little MX-5 is never fast and my lead is cut to 7.8 secs. Now it's just me and the twisting section before the straight. Nail every one... lead back up to 11 secs as I exit Galgenkopf... praying! Nothing I can do now but keep my foot down. And there one of the Twins comes - where's the other one... who cares! Closer, closer, closer. I hang it out and don't brake until the final chicane - he's almost on me.

I floor it and now I know I've got it. I cross the line less than 3 seconds ahead after 4:02:30.xxx! That looks something like this:



That feels soooo good!

Conclusion:
Basically I made my job harder than it should have been. If I'd cut out some of the mistakes early on then the last lap wouldn't have been as tense. But boy, those Mine's Skylines were quick, even on worn tyres.

It feels good to have won this in a sub-200bhp car and I recommend my plan of starting with too much power, learning the circuit and working your way down. What now? I'm not sure. The FF challenge looks interesting or I might run the Silvia RM against the big two.

And the MX-5 TC? Well, not my favourite ride and does tend to understeer a bit too much especially on worn tyres. Buy hey, that's pretty picky. Let's give it up for her - what a legend!

 

[W3H5]

An MX-5 @ 197 hp. I wonder if that can be done with a non- TC Mazda.

My attempt today will be using.....er.....I don't know yet but the Silvia RM didn't require much skill for the win without the rabbits. Maybe I'll try an electric motored car.

Today's attempt.

CUSCO SUBARU ADVAN IMPREZA '03
311HP
1160KG
517HP
RH / MT / TCS0


Competition.
BNR SKYLINE GT-R V-SPEC N1 Base
FT565 Twin Turbo Audi TT
S2000 GT 1
400R
Stage II R34
Me
SKYLINE GT-R R-TUNE
FAIRLADY Z Z-TUNE
BNR SKYLINE GT-R N1 Base
Gran Turismo SKYLINE GT-R
Nismo 380RS Super Leggera

LAP1
From the start I'm passed and relegated to 9th but quickly dart up the inside of turn 1 to make 4th. I remain on the tail of the P1 Skyline for the whole lap as the lead TT puts 7 seconds on me.

LAP2
I move up into 3rd as the Skyline can't match the cornering abilities of the Impreza as we cross Hocheichen. The gap to the lead reaches 5 seconds but I claw it down to 2.1 by the time Bergwerk is in view. I hold the tail of the S2000 in front of me until I find a gap passed both it and the TT on Schwalbenschwans, or the mini carousel as I like to call it. I don't have the speed to hold the lead and get passed by them both on the start/finish line.

LAP3
At Hatzenbach, leaving the GP circuit I make a move into 1st place after the TT goes wide and allows the S2000 to get passed also. I keep close to a seconds lead over the S2000 for most of the lap, him pushing me to my limits to remain ahead. On the last straight he makes a move which I counter and we go bumper to bumper into the last corner where, having paused to make notes a few 100m before, I lose concentration in do a bit of lawn mowing dropping me 4 seconds behind.

LAP4
Around the GP section I make up 2 seconds at the cost of over exerting the tyres and am back on his case. I lack the space to make a pass until Brunnchen where he uses too much brake and I pull an evasive to get around him. I lead by 3.3 seconds until the S/F line where he gets by, I get a tow in his slipstream and cut him off at the first corner.

LAP5
It's clear that we are both in need of fresh tyres at this point. I ease of a bit and take the track a little less aggressively to avoid an off. By mid-track I have over 4 seconds advantage, up to 5 seconds as I come around the last corner and enter the pits for new rubber. The S2000 was too far away to tell if he pitted too.

Fastest lap so far - 8.55.713 on lap 2.

LAP6
I come out 25 seconds behind the S2000 who didn't pit with me. As I leave the pits I pass the TT getting new fuel and tyres. I didn't bother to add any fuel as I had still half a tank. I met with the S2000 at the carousel and passed easily. By the last corner the gap was 33 seconds from me to second place and growing.

LAP7
Half way around I book the gap at 56 seconds from me to 2nd place behind. A small off at Pflanzgarten sees me kick up some sand but only takes away a second or so from my now 1.03 lead. As I hit the last straight I turned on the HUD to try to calculate how long my fuel would last and when I tried to turn it off I hit the exit button. Annoyed is even close enough to cover how I feel. Such a good race too.

 

[axletramp]

An MX-5 @ 197 hp. I wonder if that can be done with a non- TC Mazda.

I don't know about the Mazda as Famine's already done that and I like to use cars no-one else has so far. But I do think it's about time I ran this in a production car - as stock as possible. I'll probably look for mid/low bhp, FR and RS to start with as going by the PP alone is inconsistent.

Good luck with the Impreza! 👍

 

[dr3w]

Hey Famine, since you are a family man, how do you find so much time to do the endurance race? I'm single and working and I only could do the endurance race on sunday where I have full day off, currently suspending 4hr nurburgring race, sat for 2 hrs and my ass feel sore already and my mind start wandering around and then suddenly it's bergwerk... keep telling myself concentrate concentrate lol

 

[axletramp]

If you're single, you've got no excuses. I work and have two kids so I have to plan ahead. Once a week I can manage to slip in a 4hr enduro - 7:30 to 11:30pm means it fits in nicely! No time for testing though, so I work out which car to use and just throw myself in.

BTW, I'd get a better seat if I were you...

 

[LouDilbert]

I decided to give this a try. I've been browsing this thread for a while now and have tried to give this race a go with lower and lower powered cars, but I typically aim too low and get discouraged. I won it easily with the FT565 twin turbo Audi TT a while ago, but didn't really record any other info (it was orange when I raced with it, but now it is painted white).

I picked up a 320i Touring Car '03 a bit ago and I thought it might be fun to try. What I immediately found is that this little car drives like it's on a rail. Even though it doesn't have much pep (I had to drop in the mid RPM Range Turbo Kit), I felt like I was cheating (after reading some of your previous posts). Anyway, I didn't want to waste 4 hours and finish mid pack, so I went with this setup:

BMW 320i Touring Car '03
280HP
1140kg
491PP

I was pretty ticked when I finished because it did not allow me to save a replay, perhaps because I used the postpone race option while in the pits. I do not have specific lap times, other than to say that on RM tires my fastest lap was a 9:02 and for the last two laps I panicked and put on RS tires and netted a 9:01. I would say the race took about 4:02 to 4:03 to complete, but I really don't have the data. I do remember finishing about 20 seconds ahead of the Audi TT, so looking at the average lap times I was probably doing 9:17s?

Here's what I remember:

I started the race and was able to edge my way to the front after the beginning 1/4 of the track. The car handled so well that I knew this was going to be fun. On the straight bits I had to jump in the TT's or GT-R's slipstream, which would boost my speed by about 20MPH.

Cornering was just so fun in this car. I spent every lap refining different turns and after doing this race about 3 times now I feel pretty comfortable at this speed (the F1 cars are a whole different thing all together).

I decided to go with a 6 lap pit strategy, and that used my front tires mostly to the rims and left me with exactly half a tank. Pitting at 6, 12, 18, and 24 seemed to work, skipping fuel on the first pit for the most part, then 1/2 in the middle stops, then just 1/4 the last stop.

I started late at night and noticed that I really got sloppy as I tired out. Finishing the next afternoon I was much fresher and did a better job.

My lap times would usually start around 9:05 on fresh tires and slip to about 9:25 after they wore down. It was pretty dramatic how the lap times suffered, but it was probably due to slipping off the track and letting the car settle, that scrubs a lot of speed.

This was the finishing order, but I think the CTR "Yellow Bird" cheated by finishing his 25th lap immediately after time ended:

1. 320i Touring Car '03 (me)
2. CTR "Yellow Bird" '87 (someone said this guy texts while he's driving... I agree)
3. FT565 twin turbo Audi TT
4. BNR34 SKYLINE GT-R N1 base '06
5. BNR34 SKYLINE GT-R V-spec N1 base '0...
6. Stage II R32
7. S2000
8. GRAN TURISMO SKYLINE GT-R '00
9. Skyline GR-R S-tune (R32) '00
10. Corvette '60
11. 400R '96
12. LANCER EVOLUTION VI '00

Part of the fun of this race was trying to time things so I hit the straight sections with the Audi TT and the GT-Rs, they would really help my laptimes :-) In the end I enjoyed being behind for most of the race and swapping the lead because of pit strategy, lots of fun. Perhaps the car is a bit too nice for this thread, maybe I'll look for another challenge.

Has anyone else ever driven this car? It's labeled as FR, but I tell you what, I would swear it's a FF the way it drives...

Thanks for the great thread, I hope to make it to the front post someday.

 

[axletramp]

Nice run. 👍 I'm thinking of trying the production M3 on RS and no mods next. It might need racing transmission, but we'll se how it goes.

I agree that the Yellowbird looks a little out of place there in 2nd. I've never seen it finish in the top half, for obvious reasons.

I try and push for a 6 lap pit sequence as much as I can - it works better with a lower bhp car. However, I've found that pitting on laps 6, 12, 18 and 22 maximises your tyres rather than on lap 24. That way you get the final two stints on unworn tyres.

 

[axletramp]

Mkay, ran a few laps testing the '07 M3 and, to cut a long story short, it's too quick. With full trans and lowered (fixed) suspension I was running low 8:40's on RS tyres. I stripped everything back to stock and still ran a 8:55.xxx on the first lap with room for improvement.

Back to the drawing board for a competitive showroom FR. Either that or running SS instead.

 

[W3H5]

It might be more of a race using sports tyres on the M3 rather than racing tyres.

 

[axletramp]

Yep, I agree. It's going to be my next plan but it was almost midnight and I was knackered by then. Either that or I might try the Esprit V8 on Sports.

That M3 is pretty good for a production model. Even stock it was very grippy and neutral. You have to be brutal to get the back end to step out... which is nice.

For a laugh I tried with a 470PP Spitfire. Oh dear, that's not a car designed for 200bhp - no rear end grip and unstable when breaking from speed.

 

[GOLDMAN911]

I found this race not very challenging, even whn using the Mitsubishi evolution...the AI is horrible, but it was fun making barbecue for my friends and taking turns behind the wheel with them

 

[axletramp]

You make this race what you want it to be. An Evo could indeed win quite easily - what state of tune/tyres? Have you tried a sub-200bhp car or using comfort/sports tyres?

 

[iainn]

I've been reading this thread for while and desperate to try this race, but I needed to learn the track better and find a car which would get me round in around 9 mins.

So, after much deliberation we have the Mazda RX-7 Spirit R Type A (FD) '02

This is a fairly heftily modded one which I found in my garage, I think it was tuned for one of the early seasonals. Anyway it's very stable when you put the power down especially out of corners and seemed ideal.

443 bhp
1051 kg
553 pp

Tyres RS

Going by some on this thread it's probably too much power, but I want to win my first time out in this race and I know that I'm not that good.

The Grid -
BNR34 Skyline GT-R
FT565 twin turbo Audi TT
S2000 GT1
Nismo 400R
Stage II R32
CR230R
RX-7 Spirit R
Skyline GT-R R-tune
Fairlady Z Z-tune(Z33)
BNR34 Skyline GT-R
GT Skyline GT-R
Nismo 380RS Super Leggera

Lap 1 – 9:23.764
A couple of stupid offs and a terrible lap, went from 1st to 7th,

Lap 2 – 8:49.827
better, but recovered to 5th

Lap 3 – 8:55.506
22s behind in 2nd place

Lap 4 – 9:02.832
Another couple of offs.

Lap5 – 9:30.514
Into the pits for news RS tyres and 40l fuel after rubbish lap with a couple of spins. Should definitely have pitted at end lap 4, but hey ho, will keep going. Now 50s behind and in 4th

Lap 6 – 9:33.160
Started this lap 1:30 down, but must have done the kessel run faster than han solo as gained 23 sec by the Karussel. Or maybe leader's tyres are gone.... under 30s down by the end, Take the lead as those in front have pitted.

Lap 7 – 8:58.555
30 sec ahead at end of the lap, a couple more of those and then pit....

Lap 8 – 8:54.464

Lap 9 - 9:01.908
Pit for RS tyres and 40l, passed and down to 4th

Lap 10 – 10:02.175
Catch 2nd and 3rd at end GP course. 20s behind by end of the lap though as made several silly mistakes and down to 3rd, up to 2nd over the line as the leader pits.

Lap 11 – 9:10.741
Some elementary mistakes again

Lap 12 – 9:01.588
Better, catch the S2000 and take the lead half way round. Leading by over 20s by the end of the lap, I guess his tyres are old.

Lap 13 – 9:13.501
Uneventful lap, tried to keep it on the track as tyre are getting old. In pits at the end this lap for RS and 30l fuel. Passed on the way out by Audi TT. 2 hour mark passed so does that mean a 26 lap race?

I think I'll need to do a 5 lap stint next and stop at the end of 18, then a 4 lap to leave 4 or 5 at the end.

Lap 14 – 9:38.876
More silly mistakes.... but did pass the TT for the lead.

Lap 15 – 9:10.170

Lap 16 – 9:03.644
Don't see anyone

Lap 17 – 9:00.632

Lap 18 – 9:14.373
Lead stretched out over a minute by the end as challenger's tyres getting bad I guess. That was even with me having a spin and not a great lap.

Suspended the race for a break and some food.

Resumed with pit stop, new RS and 40l

Lap 19 – 9:45.827
Uneventful

Lap 20 – 8:56.125
1 hour to go timer appears!

Lap 21 – 9:18.814
Was 1:40 up as others pit but a spin loses some time.

Lap 22 – 9:20.311
Spin again and then pit at end of lap with about 60 sec lead. RS and 35l

Lap 23 – 9:43.515
Chaser getting closer due to my mistakes, thought he was going to pit, but he doesn't! Surely he will next lap?

Lap 24 – 9:13.401

Lap 25 – 9:03.490
He doesn't pit at end lap 24 either, gap is 5 s at the complex, but that extends to 11 by the Karussel, manage to keep 10s gap to Dottinger Hohe. 1 more to go, less than 9 mins left as I cross the line.

Lap 26 – 9:22.xxx
Yay,he pits.... so does 3rd and 4th! 1:23 ahead at first checkpoint

Take it fairly easy as I don't want to make any mistakes and cross the line about 25 secs after the 4 hours for the win.

Audi was 2nd didn't get the rest and no replay option.

4m xp takes me from near the end of Level 34 to about of a third of the way into Level 36.

Wanted to get a pic of car as it must have been battered. Power now down to 427 so gave it an oil change.

Will definitely do this again with a lower powered car, but not for a while as that was tiring.

 

[daan]

So, after much deliberation we have the Mazda RX-7 Spirit R Type A (FD) '02

Why is your driver bloke admiring the bog standard (although driverless!) Golf instead of the RX7 he's stood standing beside?

Oh, and welcome to , and to this thread, iainn and Lou (and any other new guys I've missed.)

 

[iainn]

Why is your driver bloke admiring the bog standard (although driverless!) Golf instead of the RX7 he's stood standing beside?

I know, maybe that's what he really wants to drive for 4 hours, ungrateful git, and after me getting him a new suit and helmet as well!

 

[axletramp]

OK, ran some tests with the Esprit V8 '02 (478PP), completely stock on RS tyres. The only adjustment I made was a 6/4 brake balance shift to help the braking overstear.

Certainly quick enough on it's first lap, around the 8:55.xxx mark, but then the tyres start to go off dramatically. In my hands I'd be in the pits every 4th lap, which isn't quick enough here.

I want to run a stock prodution car below 500PP, so it's back to the M3 for now.

 

[W3H5]

I think the Lotus Elise Type 72 might be in with a chance on RS. I was using it yesterday for some arcade mode fun on other tracks and it certainly shifts. It's around the 400pp mark so there is plenty of room for tuning.

Might be worth a test run.

 

[axletramp]

That's a good call, although my plan is to run this with a sub-500PP production car without any tuning at all, just tyres and possibly adjusting the brake balance.

I expected the Esprit V8 to go well but they way it kills tyres really surprised me. I could easily get a sub-9 minute opening lap but from lap 2 onwards I was lucky to break 9:15.xx and lap 4 was like racing on ice! I thought about the NSX Type R, but that's already been run on this thread and I felt something other than a Japanese car was in order.

The M3 '07 on SS is looking the most likely now as on RS it was consistently below 9 secs on a 3 lap test run. Tyre wear indicated a 5 lap sequence. Won't be able to run it until next week though as I'm away with work for a few days.