Give us better sounds - PLEASE !!

[Dude27]

I'm very afraid when I see how Polyphony still record sounds the old way for their next game (Hyundai news pictures on GTplanet): Today sound designers knows that sounds need more respect to properly render the depth of car sounds for each department: inside, outside & trackside-wise.

This is the new way to record proper sounds:

 

[Dude27]

The 5% pcars "trailer" is not OFFICIAl but done by a fan of the serie.

 

[ANFD]

You guys complaining of "car sounds" have it good. At least you can hear your car From Chase View, I can't hear my car at all whenever I'm within half mile of another car. As I draw up to the rear of another car I can just barely hear my cars sound just slowly mute itself completely away. I hear cars coming up from behind and check my rear view ... nothing there. So I look at the map and see the car behind me about 3 corners back. I can hear the car going into turn one at Fuji louder than my own car as I'm coming onto the straightaway. I have to constantly look down for the rev limiter because I can't tell when to shift by ear anymore. Ever since the last update, they've destroyed the sound in the game completely. I can't figure for the life of me why they have let this go as long as they have 👎👎👎

 

[Griffith500]

I'm very afraid when I see how Polyphony still record sounds the old way for their next game (Hyundai news pictures on GTplanet): Today sound designers knows that sounds need more respect to properly render the depth of car sounds for each department: inside, outside & trackside-wise.

This is the new way to record proper sounds:

www.youtube.com/watch?v=6A9olcof-qg

Yes, but, with the probable exception of interior, only as references. The sounds you actually use in-game should come from the closest, flattest, cleanest recording, and you add the colour required by the given situation on the fly.

And that's hardly a new way to record. Is it the best way? Probably not much in it between that and a rolling road, especially a proper one. Plus, it didn't actually translate that well into the game in question in the end. I guess there's more to it than just recording...

The 5% pcars "trailer" is not OFFICIAl but done by a fan of the serie.

Right, but it's still a good listening exercise if GT5's trailers fooled you, because it has dubbing and in-game sounds side-by-side.


@ANFD: What dynamic range setting are you using? If yo uuse one of the "internal" views (i.e. "bumper" or cockpit), the problem is much reduced already. Using better / less dynamic range compression can make a small but possibly useful difference, too.

 

[ANFD]

.@ANFD: What dynamic range setting are you using? If yo uuse one of the "internal" views (i.e. "bumper" or cockpit), the problem is much reduced already. Using better / less dynamic range compression can make a small but possibly useful difference, too.

I always use chase view because I have better visibilty (to better avoid contact) racing online exclusively as I do. The audio setting in the game shows "Linear PCM 2Ch 48 KHz" and the other adjustable setting is set to "Living Room". I've tried all the different adjustments in the game with no improvement. Do you mean sound settings in the Main PS3 XMB set up menu ?

 

[Griffith500]

I always use chase view because I have better visibilty (to better avoid contact) racing online exclusively as I do. The audio setting in the game shows "Linear PCM 2Ch 48 KHz" and the other adjustable setting is set to "Living Room". I've tried all the different adjustments in the game with no improvement. Do you mean sound settings in the Main PS3 XMB set up menu ?

Changing "Living Room" to "Small Theatre" instead makes a small difference. If you have an audio receiver with a built-in compressor (/ level control, or other such name) it might be preferable to turn that on instead and set GT5 to Large Theatre. This is because a dedicated hardware compressor is always going to out-perform (quality, response etc.) a basic software job in a computer game.

I don't think changing things in the XMB will help, unfortunately.

 

[Raitziger]

If you have an audio receiver with a built-in compressor (/ level control, or other such name).

E.g Dolby volume, Audessey dynamic volume, etc.

 

[Eager Snake]

The game does a really good job in the sound field, but the way it reproduces the sounds of the cars is a completely different story.
I have a Sony HT and the game sounds awesome in some aspects, but I have to try some other games yet.
As I said before, I modified the "sound field" in my HT to get better results, and indeed, it worked. I was able to hear more notes of the engine, but I lost some other aspects in the process.

If the source isn't right, we can't do much sadly, I think.

 

[Ridox2JZGTE]

With my audio setup, I usually use DTS surround sound, set large theatre, disable music, set sound volume at 120 in game, then set my AVR at -20 dB, enjoy the rumble that rock the house just don't crash, the loud thud will give you heart attack ..

 

[Raitziger]

just don't crash, the loud thud will give you heart attack ..

Hahhahh

 

[Eager Snake]

With my audio setup, I usually use DTS surround sound, set large theatre, disable music, set sound volume at 120 in game, then set my AVR at -20 dB, enjoy the rumble that rock the house just don't crash, the loud thud will give you heart attack ..

Hahaha, totally

 

[mikecustom]

Hey Guys I managed to boost the doppler effect just by messing around with my TV's own EQ, Idle sounds beastly, and in general all cars sound a bit more meaty, still wrong but a huge improvement, The mazda 787b now sounds real on the replays, it sounds incredibly loud and on the fly bys it creates a deafening effect, Like this


I did the test by parking myself at the same point with a fiat 500 and made my friend to fly by me and then saved the replay, set the camera on me and just hear

I'm not talking about high volume levels, I'm talking about hearing it when it's really far away and over other cars, I'm not sure what I did with my TV, lol, but I think all I did was to give it more Bass and Voice and leaving Treble a bit down, It also makes the tranny whine a lot more silent, and it does the same tranny thing for Shift 2, however Shift's doppler effect is crap and Battlefield 3 sounds like, well... like you are there.

Of course GT5 still needs accurate sounds but at least I can tolerate it's sounds at last

Oh and the music, it sounds like normal background music when in 3rd person view, but when in Interior view it sounds like the radio or stereo of the car you're in, EPIC.

With race cars, I just turn music off

 

[dr_slump]

You simply set certain frequencies louder than others.

 

[Griffith500]

It's been said many times that GT's sound output is generally incompatible with typical TV speakers. Special EQ adjustment (i.e. for GT5 only) is probably necessary as a result, but if you have hardware capable of bass reproduction it's not usually necessary, outside of a universal EQ tweak for all media (which everyone should do anyway).

Of course, that doesn't excuse the missing details and the poor attribution of samples. I'd like to see Sony / PD take steps to make the sounds more palatable on lower-level hardware, whilst preserving the crisp quality (aside from the mp3 samples...) for those with anything even just one rung up from that (and above) on the "hardware ladder", so to say. E.g. include a phantom bass option and maybe even a light "overdrive" (adaptive distortion effect) option for when your speakers can't deliver the volume and dynamic range required for your listening environment.

Speaking of dynamic range, they have the ability to adjust every source's volume in-engine. They should be able to switch between sound source attenuation profiles on the fly so that we can choose the audio balance that works best on the dynamic range we have available for listening (a combination of speaker volume, speaker "quality" - specifically dynamic response, and listening environment - i.e. background noise.)
This would obviate the need for the primitive level limiter they're using and would get rid of the masking issues by dynamically scaling sound sources relative to each other in the game, rather than the entire output stream as one. It also means they could still retain the fantastic open range of the Large Theatre setting (something I'm yet to hear in any other game, except maybe ARMA).

 

[Ridox2JZGTE]

Battlefield Bad Company 2 have a fantastic dynamic range with War Tapes setting and DTS output, crank it up, enjoy the gun fire and explosion like no other.

 

[Griffith500]

Actually that's a good example of what I'm talking about. The "War Tapes" mode seems to pull all the ambient and otherwise "quiet" sounds up closer to the volume of the guns etc. so it sounds "better" / more active on low dynamic range hardware (or with low volumes / high background noise). It also has more of a kick in the bass department, so that's good for those that care.

The "Hi-Fi" (i.e. High Fidelity) mode retains the dynamic range of sound sources at it's wider setting, and is perfect for high-volume gaming or using headphones (although the output is still slightly compressed). It's also generally far crisper (hence ideal for high volumes), so less "muddy", and the bass is more naturally balanced.

 

[Madertus]

As the title says - give us better car sounds alongside with better car choice.

When you PD think about putting Nissan Skyline in the game, you don't put in 36 of them. I know there were 3 or 4 generations, one model of each is ENOUGH. Seriously, separate models for colors Midnight Purple II and III?

 

[Ridox2JZGTE]

I did not have any distortion in high volume when playing BFBC2 using war tapes, I set my AVR with flat setting, meaning no input manipulation, a straight through DTS, I do have volume up to -30 or 25 dB, pretty loud, the gun fire from G3 sounds almost like it was fired in real life, and the tank/helicopter sounds just right in relation to other sounds ( foot step, voices, ). Speakers and AVR quality do have major role here, I treed Hifi setting when I first start playing the game, it did not have the immersion of war tapes, and the sound at high volume was like playing loud music. By the way, I have Mordaunt Short Carnival speakers set, complete with the Carnival 9 Sub and Harman Kardon AVR.

 

[Griffith500]

I did not have any distortion in high volume when playing BFBC2 using war tapes, I set my AVR with flat setting, meaning no input manipulation, a straight through DTS, I do have volume up to -30 or 25 dB, pretty loud, the gun fire from G3 sounds almost like it was fired in real life, and the tank/helicopter sounds just right in relation to other sounds ( foot step, voices, ). Speakers and AVR quality do have major role here, I treed Hifi setting when I first start playing the game, it did not have the immersion of war tapes, and the sound at high volume was like playing loud music. By the way, I have Mordaunt Short Carnival speakers set, complete with the Carnival 9 Sub and Harman Kardon AVR.

I find the general volume boost with the War Tapes setting to be fatiguing when not shooting anything or hearing stuff blow up. I prefer the dynamic range of the Hi Fi setting, because you get that believable contrast, and my ears and brain do the "acclimatising" between the contrasts.

I use headphones, though, so playback volume isn't an issue for me - I could go a lot higher (effectively) than I'd probably dare with a speaker system, and I don't actually have to turn them up that loud (so they'd damage my ears) because they have good isolation from background noise.

Of course, you miss that full-body experience that the War Tapes mode tries to replace. I'd probably use it more if I didn't use headphones.


All of this is why PD should do something similar for GT - the dynamic range settings are a start, and a step in the right direction to letting players get the most out of the sounds.

 

[Eager Snake]

Speaking of this, any recommendation to tweak ours HT?
I have pretty goods results so far, but it would interesting if any of you have modified your settings to be able to get better results.

The only thing I have made is change the different settings that my HT has, meaning that I set the 3 differentes versions of the Sony Digital Cinema Sound EX. (DCS). In some cases the engines notes sounds more clear, more like GRRRR ahahaha...

 

[Ridox2JZGTE]

Speaking of this, any recommendation to tweak ours HT?
I have pretty goods results so far, but it would interesting if any of you have modified your settings to be able to get better results.

The only thing I have made is change the different settings that my HT has, meaning that I set the 3 differentes versions of the Sony Digital Cinema Sound EX. (DCS). In some cases the engines notes sounds more clear, more like GRRRR ahahaha...

With stereo source, Harman Kardon AVR that I have sounds a lot fuller with Dolby 3 Stereo or DTS 6 Neo 3 Channel Movie Mode. But for games, these sound post processing only works well with certain titles, for GT5, I used DTS 5.1 with no changes at all, set in game to Large Theater.

Setting the correct speaker size in AVR setup also important, I have mine set as Large speakers, with SUB output = LFE+LR. Crossover setting also have to be correct for the speakers in use, otherwise there will be certain frequencies missing from the output.

 

[Eager Snake]

I have a Sony DDWG700 and it sounds awesome.
I use from time to time the Digital Cinema Sound EX. (DCS), those settings gave me the posibility to add some reverb and depth to the sounds.
They recreate (A being the Cary Grant sound stage for dialogue, B being the Kim Novak sound stage for action movies, C being the Entertainment scoring stage for music, which is pretty interesting indeed.
It feels weird at the very beginning, but the sound DOES actually bounces differently.
The settings in GT5 are set in Large Theater and DTS 5.1.

Also, in other cases, I have changed another settings in the HT, representing in this cases differents types of rooms for music. Hall, Jazz Club and Live Concert.
It reproduces the acoustic of a classical concert hall, the acoustic of a Jazz Club and the acoustic of a classical concert hall of 300 seats respectively.
It sounds, again, weird when you read the description, but they have a really good result depending of the type of movie or concert or whatever you're watching.
Those settings with GT5 helps the game's sound a lot.

By the way, your receiver, decodified only Dolby TrueHD but not DTS-HD Master Audio or I'm dreaming?

 

[Scribbles71]

Do you fools know anything about the complications of making realistic sounds? Of course they sound digitised, they are! Would half of you even recognise a more realistic sound? it's not as simple as recording real sounds and then looping them and there will always be a loss in quality as sounds get edited and tweaked. I'd love to know what games you guys think that PD should emulate that actually have realistic car sounds.

Heard the engine sounds on Forza4 and 3? They are incredibly good compared to GTx, unfortunately.
Why can't the best driving sim game, give us the best engine sounds? You'll notice that not much has changed with the engine sound since GT3.

 

[Ridox2JZGTE]

I have a Sony DDWG700 and it sounds awesome.
I use from time to time the Digital Cinema Sound EX. (DCS), those settings gave me the posibility to add some reverb and depth to the sounds.
They recreate (A being the Cary Grant sound stage for dialogue, B being the Kim Novak sound stage for action movies, C being the Entertainment scoring stage for music, which is pretty interesting indeed.
It feels weird at the very beginning, but the sound DOES actually bounces differently.
The settings in GT5 are set in Large Theater and DTS 5.1.

Also, in other cases, I have changed another settings in the HT, representing in this cases differents types of rooms for music. Hall, Jazz Club and Live Concert.
It reproduces the acoustic of a classical concert hall, the acoustic of a Jazz Club and the acoustic of a classical concert hall of 300 seats respectively.
It sounds, again, weird when you read the description, but they have a really good result depending of the type of movie or concert or whatever you're watching.
Those settings with GT5 helps the game's sound a lot.

By the way, your receiver, decodified only Dolby TrueHD but not DTS-HD Master Audio or I'm dreaming?

It's an old Harman Kardon AVR from the pre HDMI era, so just basic DTS and Dolby Digital, with surround sound sources, I almost never use any provided sound post processing, they tend to alter the sound greatly. When I listen to music like Jazz, classical, rock or even trance, I always set to stereo flat. I did use Dolby 3 Stereo, Logic 7 or DTS 6 NEO for old stereo movies or old music that sounded bad for today's standard.

 

[Madertus]

^ +1 👍

I heard PD recorded the sounds in dyno.
Does it mean they prepared a special dyno for pepper mincers exclusively?

tree'd

 

[repsolcbr1000r]

The horrendous car sounds in GT5 are why I now play Shift 2

 

[Slash]

The Cougar does NOT sound like a vacuum....that pissed me off.

 

[mikecustom]

The horrendous car sounds in GT5 are why I now play Shift 2

Believe it or not, if you find the right set-up for it, it becomes a great racing game, Sounds are definitely better in Shift 2 than in GT5 but still not what we are looking for, which is Realistic sounds, Still, I'd take hollywood sounds over GT sounds any day.

 

[disneyland5]

The horrendous car sounds in GT5 are why I now play Shift 2

Same here. I gave up on this game a while ago because it just doesnt sound right. I can honestly say that Burnout Paradise cars sound way better than this. Im serious. I also lost interest in this because it got really boring. Hopefully they get it right next time. I really want to play Forza instead but I dont have the money to buy an Xbox so now im stuck with this.

 

[Madertus]

Yeah but in Shift 2 all cars sound as if they had a racing gearbox. They still sound quite good and properly loud.

Nice game generally.