GLI is garbage... trading it in about 3 weeks...

[JCE]

I wonder if Socom is even reading this topic anymore.

Socom what say you?!

 

[Azuremen]

It's gotta be because Mini is a BMW. So really it's a point against all German cars for being a thousand times more expensive to maintain than any other country's offerings. Does anyone know WHY German cars are so overpriced for everything? Does it have to do with WW2?

They aren't. Now get over it. Unless you do all your shopping at a dealership. Which was Joey's problem, from what I recall. But I'd hardly call Joey an enthusiast anyhow.

 

[Pupik]

It's probably because most mechanics that don't work for Mini don't want to go near a Mini for any type multi-thousand dollar repair, unless it's wheels and tires.

I think it's probably the same hit-head-against-wall scenario you'd get if you brought a 2005 BMW 5-series in for a transmission replacement at the local AAMCO. The mechanic would point you to the nearest BMW dealer and walk away from a potential comeback nightmare.

 

[JCE]

Joey, was your Cooper S an auto or manual? If you had the 6spd manual then you have the same transmission as I do on my SVT (Getrag 285) and my cost to get it replaced at the local Ford house is only $3,000. How could BMW charge you $10,000?

If it was the automatic then I got nothing.

 

[Cale]

Joey, was your Cooper S an auto or manual? If you had the 6spd manual then you have the same transmission as I do on my SVT (Getrag 285) and my cost to get it replaced at the local Ford house is only $3,000. How could BMW charge you $10,000?

If it was the automatic then I got nothing.

It was a normal Cooper, and pretty sure an auto.

 

[McLaren]

Joey, was your Cooper S an auto or manual? If you had the 6spd manual then you have the same transmission as I do on my SVT (Getrag 285) and my cost to get it replaced at the local Ford house is only $3,000. How could BMW charge you $10,000?

If it was the automatic then I got nothing.

It is an auto, iirc, & according to shop manual I've found, the reason the transmission costs so much to service is because Mini has to remove the entire transmission & replace it with a new one. There is no 1 or 2 little parts Mini replaces in the tranny. What baffles me, as I told Joey, is that while it's not a common problem, there's still enough cases reported of tranny failure to make me wonder why there isn't a recall.

 

[JCE]

It is an auto, iirc, & according to shop manual I've found, the reason the transmission costs so much to service is because Mini has to remove the entire transmission & replace it with a new one. There is no 1 or 2 little parts Mini replaces in the tranny. What baffles me, as I told Joey, is that while it's not a common problem, there's still enough cases reported of tranny failure to make me wonder why there isn't a recall.

True story, I have a shift bushing out and I have to have the whole transmission replaced because where it is located in the transmission so I believe it.

 

[Tornado]

They were pretty obviously bilking him on the estimate, though, considering how much they gave him for the car when he sold it.

 

[socomplayer2]

I'm pretty serious about this. Less than the S2000, comparable power, more room, lots of after market support, fairly straight forward to work on, etc.

Plus, torque is nice.

Ahhh, e36's are my favorite bmw body style. Unfortunately I need a newer car with a warranty. I am moving out on my own in august 1100 miles from home and I dont want to have to worry /:.

There's always one, and I hate to be that one, but how exactly can a 20 year old afford $20K for a car?

Its okay, well I leased my first car, which was a 2008 gti and it was a great car no real problems but the the mileage issue with the lease was annoying so I gave it back and financed the gli in march when the lease was up. I got financial help to finance the gli from my parents.

I dont want to sound like a typical kid whos parents give them money for a nice car but I am very fortunate and it was a gift because I am moving out on my own to florida and attending a new school totally at my own expense and they had no problem helping me get into a newer car with a warranty. So now that this car is s***ing the bed they told me to trade it in for something around the same value.

I do work and have a steady income so If there is a difference I am going to use it and try to break even. My parents put a good chunk down on the gli and I am paying monthly a low fee. My goal with the next car is something reliable, warranty and around the same price. I am moving to florida so I figured these two choices are fun and acceptable for south florida.

Hope that answers your question:tup:

Hey JCE, out of curiousity... Have you ever driven a 05-09 GT? On the road? On a track? I just want to know if you actually have a differing opinion and have resorted to petty name calling to try to get ahead... or if you just read some specs and performance numbers from your computer and like to pretend to know what you're talking about 💡

OT:

2005 Audi S4? Those things have nearly 350hp and 4WD, they'll also have great build quality.

You could even get a sweet Avant...

Also...

C5 Corvette...

Seen a Pontaic G8 for about 21K...

2004 Z4...

as said before, M3

Etc... Those are just a few. You can find hundreds of really great 80's and 90's Japanese and German cars.

I would love an s4 or a m3 but they are hard to find within the price range with low miles. Also my friend had a b6 s4 and it pooped itself like my gli so I am straying away from them.

I wonder if Socom is even reading this topic anymore.

Socom what say you?!

I am here I just don't frequent the forum like I used too lol.

 

[eSZee]

The mean income in Britain last year (if the figures I looked at were correct) were about the same as the cost of a new GTI, (23K GBP) in the US, it was double, ~50k USD.

The average household income, 2 people, was around $31k in the US while it was $25k in England from what I found.

 

[Eunos_Cosmo]

This is extremely far off topic, sorry

US: http://www.davemanuel.com/median-household-income.php

UK: http://www.statistics.gov.uk/pdfdir/ashe1210.pdf

Both are gross figures as far as I can tell. Economics isn't really my thing though

 

[mafia_boy]

The RX-8 is the hipster of the car world. It isn't good at anything really, but everyone says no one understands it because its a Rotary. Buying a car because it has a different and arguably inferior motor is terrible justification.

It's only inferior in that only one company is developing it. If more companies came to the rotor party then it may be different, but none of the other motor manufacturers want to spend the money and time on R&D for their own version of it and instead are going green, doing hybrids or alternative fuels. I agree that it's "arguably" inferior because both camps (piston & rotor) will say that their motor is the stronger one for various reasons from power/litre, boost capabilities, etc.

Warranties are nice to have, really give you a care free owning experience. If something breaks you just go to the dealer and it gets repaired without a ton of money coming out of your pocket. If I would have had an extended warranty on my Cooper, I wouldn't have needed to buy a new car because the $10,000 transmission repair bill.

$10k for a stock Cooper gearbox, WTF?? Were they making the replacement gearbox out of sterling silver?? You could've gotten a fully built custom gearbox from Quaife, Modena, Albins, Pfitzner or any of the other gearbox makers for around that 10k, with ratios customised for your car!!

It's when motor companies try to jack you with quotes like this makes me glad I buy and drive around POS's!!

 

[fitftw]

It's when motor companies try to jack you with quotes like this makes me glad I buy and drive around POS's!!

This is exactly the point I was trying to make but I come across in a much more negative way towards people. $10,000 for a gearbox is nonsense. I can buy an entire Mini Cooper for about that.

Found one actually, $10,900 8x,xxx miles local in NJ http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/05-M...4653121?pt=US_Cars_Trucks&hash=item5644fd8641

I'd never buy one, but I'm just saying, there's no way a trans is $10,000. I'd tell the shop to do filthy things.

$2,200 for a rebuilt Getrag 5spd http://new.minimania.com/InvDetail.cfm?item=NMD1014&googlebase

 

[motortrend]

I had read in some forum that some of those german gearboxes could not be opened and fixed part by part so they had to be shipped off to Germany and either get it fixed or get a completely new one. I am not sure at all of this so I may be wrong. That said, 10K does seem overly expensive. Something like maybe 5K could be but 10? No way.

 

[Eric.]

I remember someone posting a story on 8thCivic about a friend who blew up his Si (the friend's Si, not the one posting the story) downshifting to 2nd instead of 4th from 81mph. The computer registered something like 11,600rpm. 2nd is only good for about 53mph (stock 8300rpm fuel cut).

I recall it being somewhere close to $10,000 for the dealer to put in a new engine and to have a warranty on that engine. New K20Z3s were around $6-7k IIRC, so that, labor, warranty, some gouging. Not impossible.

 

[McLaren]

I had read in some forum that some of those german gearboxes could not be opened and fixed part by part so they had to be shipped off to Germany and either get it fixed or get a completely new one. I am not sure at all of this so I may be wrong. That said, 10K does seem overly expensive. Something like maybe 5K could be but 10? No way.

Thank goodness there is one person who knows the facts....

 

[fitftw]

looks like you missed my post where I posted a rebuilt trans for a Mini Cooper for just over $2,000.

 

[McLaren]

looks like you missed my post where I posted a rebuilt trans for a Mini Cooper for just over $2,000.

Looks like you missed the part where it is rebuilt. Let's just also go ahead & ignore the cost of labor & other parts required when the transmission gets replaced.

Just cut the loss & stop posting on this subject. You continuously show you have no clue about German cars.

 

[fitftw]

the other parts? You mean the rear main seal? That's the only part you should change out unless the clutch itself is also bad. Why pay someone $1,000+ for labor when you can do it yourself over a weekend if it's your first time? Do you enjoy lighting $1,000 on fire? Are you that rich? Well then congratulations.

 

[Joey D]

I had a 2007 Cooper, non-S, with a 6-speed automatic. The transmission itself wasn't $10,000, the whole estimate was about that. This included labour, parts and delivery fees.

It's probably because most mechanics that don't work for Mini don't want to go near a Mini for any type multi-thousand dollar repair, unless it's wheels and tires.

This, a thousand times this. It's just because MINI's are so specialised, most mechanics don't know how to work on them nor want to take the risk of botching a very expensive part and end up eating it. My point was though, a warranty would have saved my ass in all of this. I totally agree I shouldn't have needed a warranty to bail me out but apparently MINI can't be bothered to make a car with a decent transmission in it.

I would also like to point since MINI's are way more specialised then BMW's, I'm sure if you had a 3-series you could take it to any foreign auto mechanic and they would know how to work on it. So while MINI's may have been unreliable and expensive, it doesn't affect European cars at...especially Geraman cars since a Cooper isn't German anyway.

I'd never buy one, but I'm just saying, there's no way a trans is $10,000. I'd tell the shop to do filthy things.

$2,200 for a rebuilt Getrag 5spd http://new.minimania.com/InvDetail.cfm?item=NMD1014&googlebase

You appear to be speaking about things you don't have the correct information on. Six-speed automatic transmission's in R56 MINI Coopers do in fact run $10,000 for parts and installation. You can get a used one for about $7,000 with parts and installation, but why would you ever buy a used transmission from a car known to have transmission problems? I know you'll probably say I should have taken it elsewhere besides the dealer or did the work myself, and to that I would answer you can't take a MINI anywhere but the dealer. Trust me, I tried several places in the area to see about getting a fix that would be cheaper, but obviously I wasn't successful. As for doing it myself? Ya that wouldn't happen ever.

And the transmission you posted isn't even from the car I owned. It was the previous generation's manual transmission. Even then, that's $2,200 + $400 core for a rebuilt gearbox...not to mention shipping.

===

The only reason for continuously bring this up is to drive home the point that it's not that European cars are not necessarily expensive to own, nor are they all unreliable. It's just so happens that one speciality brand has some issues with it. It is also to drive home the point that when considering speciality type cars, or even newer cars in general, a warranty is never a bad idea. It can save you thousands in the end.

 

[McLaren]

the other parts? You mean the rear main seal? That's the only part you should change out unless the clutch itself is also bad. Why pay someone $1,000+ for labor when you can do it yourself over a weekend if it's your first time? Do you enjoy lighting $1,000 on fire? Are you that rich? Well then congratulations.

Not sure you would even begin to know what needs fixing considering you didn't understand why the transmission was so much money to begin with.

And why bother attempting to fix a transmission you have no experience with when you can pay someone else to do it right the first time instead of possibly making it worse. Esp. on a Mini of all cars to start working on.

And I love this, "I'm cheap" argument you keep throwing out there. We get it, you can't afford a $20K+ car. For those of us who can, yeah, I will "burn $1,000" on letting someone else fix it; that's why they are there. Even more so when the work done is under warranty & I hardly pay a cent out of pocket.

Edit* Just as I thought, you didn't once Joey explained the correct transmission in his car.

 

[mafia_boy]

I had a 2007 Cooper, non-S, with a 6-speed automatic. The transmission itself wasn't $10,000, the whole estimate was about that. This included labour, parts and delivery fees.

Well that's a bit different then. If it was 10k just for gearbox then my previous comment would've stood and still going WTF.....regardless of whether the stock gearbox can or can't be opened, the fact is that you can get a brand new properly prepped (either synchro-meshed or not) gearbox (with bellhousing to match) from any of the places I mentioned for that 10k figure or even less.

 

[McLaren]

Well that's a bit different then. If it was 10k just for gearbox then my previous comment would've stood and still going WTF.....regardless of whether the stock gearbox can or can't be opened, the fact is that you can get a brand new properly prepped (either synchro-meshed or not) gearbox (with bellhousing to match) from any of the places I mentioned for that 10k figure or even less.

And what happens if they encounter a problem? Mini won't touch it & Joey will be paying big bucks.

All 4 of those companies you listed don't even typically build gearboxes for a car like a base Cooper. Albins & Pfitzner doesn't even offer Mini service, and all 4 of them make it pretty apparent they build their transmissions for high performance applicants. Quaife doesn't even seem to offer anything for a BMW Mini besides a near $800 LSD for the Cooper S.

I'd love to see Joey ask for a quote on a custom-built transmission for a Cooper that sees 12,000+ miles a year from a company that normally builds transmissions listed as off-road use.

 

[Rotary Junkie]

BMW is pretty strict about warranties, so I'd rather let them do the services such as oil changes & what not for free, than attempt them myself & risk losing the warranty altogether.

That's all well and good... But how does it invalidate my point that a warranty shouldn't need to be a "saving grace"?

No, I don't think so. I quite like my BMW & if you read above, you'll see why I prefer the warranty.

BMW wants to make it difficult to do routine maintenance yourself, then yep, they can do it themselves at their cost.

I've read the above and I'm still entirely missing your point. Or you've entirely missed mine. A warranty becomes a "saving grace" when a car has a major failure within the time frame said warranty is valid. That major failure should not happen. It can and does happen rather often but I'd say with most vehicles failure rates are low enough that it's not a significant risk.

Those where owners consistently need that warranty should be avoided, no?

 

[Luminis]

Those where owners consistently need that warranty should be avoided, no?

True. But that doesn't mean that a warranty is a bad idea, even though the car in question has a reputation as being reliable. If you're going to put a lot of miles on it, it's better to be safe than sorry, right?

 

[mafia_boy]

And what happens if they encounter a problem? Mini won't touch it & Joey will be paying big bucks.

But, that was if Joey was paying for the stock box himself. We know he isn't but hypotheticals can always pop up.

All 4 of those companies you listed don't even typically build gearboxes for a car like a base Cooper. Albins & Pfitzner doesn't even offer Mini service, and all 4 of them make it pretty apparent they build their transmissions for high performance applicants. Quaife doesn't even seem to offer anything for a BMW Mini besides a near $800 LSD for the Cooper S.

Bzzzz. WRONG!! One of my old car club buddies got Modena to custom build a dogbox for his 1.6L Daihatsu Charade because the gearbox he had in (from a Feroza!) was topping out at only 140km/h!! Cost = $9k. After gearbox installation, he drove it as a DD for nearly 2 years with no problems whatsoever, the only thing he worried about was defects from the police incase they heard the dogbox whine.

I'd love to see Joey ask for a quote on a custom-built transmission for a Cooper that sees 12,000+ miles a year from a company that normally builds transmissions listed as off-road use.

That's the key word, NORMALLY........not ALWAYS!! They will make any gearbox you want for what use you want so long as you give them the specs you need. Hell, if Modena did a Charade, why the 🤬 won't they do a Cooper??

 

[Eunos_Cosmo]

Things we've learned from this thread:

E36 M3 has torque -- kräftig Deutschland, Fick Ja!
RX-8 does not
Don't buy a Mini Cooper -- Ever -- Nein Deutschland!!!! Schnell!!
Miata is the best car ever
SVT Focus is still relevant (?)
Vtak FTMFW as usual

 

[alex10798]

Don't buy a Mini Cooper with an automatic -- Ever --

[*DISCLAIMER* the cost of the manual transmission is from what I've learned from google]

Fixed. The automatics in Mini Coopers are notorious for being very expensive when they break.

And they WILL break. The manuals are a lot cheaper, and last longer.($1,000-2,000. that's cheaper than $6,000-10,000)

 

[McLaren]

That's all well and good... But how does it invalidate my point that a warranty shouldn't need to be a "saving grace"?

I've read the above and I'm still entirely missing your point. Or you've entirely missed mine.

You have misunderstood me. It's a "saving grace" bc for a car that typically requires expensive labor fees for routine maintenance, I don't have to worry about paying such fees.

Doing routine work on a new BMW is more complicated than it should be bc of all the crap in the engine bay. And if I didn't have a warranty, I'd be paying quite a bit for the dealer to deal with that stuff. But since I do, the warranty has saved me from rediculous fees.

I don't expect any of you to understand it either. None of you seem to have ever dealt with such cars & the dealers.

That's the key word, NORMALLY........not ALWAYS!! They will make any gearbox you want for what use you want so long as you give them the specs you need. Hell, if Modena did a Charade, why the 🤬 won't they do a Cooper??

That's funny bc the key word in my post was TYPICALLY.

It cost him $9k for a Daihatsu? Yeah, that's not a far cry from the dealer charging Joey $10K for a OEM one.

I bet the $9K tranny also won't include all the labor fees that Joey was quoted, will it?

 

[mafia_boy]

Actually it did include labour. 👍